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Post by ThatGuy on Aug 24, 2017 20:56:12 GMT
I'd be all for it if the point is to secretly (don't announce it!) head for Crisis on Infinite Earths. Now if the ultimate point was to translate that storyline as the DC version of the Infinity War then let's do it. If they are doing it to be, as ArArArchStanton says, "lazy" and not bother to keep track of things with no real goal, then nah.
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Post by ArArArchStanton on Aug 24, 2017 20:59:39 GMT
I'd be all for it if the point is to secretly (don't announce it!) head for Crisis on Infinite Earths. Now if the ultimate point was to translate that storyline as the DC version of the Infinity War then let's do it. If they are doing it to be, as ArArArchStanton says, "lazy" and not bother to keep track of things with no real goal, then nah. I'd just like the point out that Crisis on Infinite Earth's is just a glorified retcon. It's really amusing that it's DC's most famous crossover, but that's all it is, is a retcon done to correct the mistake of not having these characters exist together in the first place.
But looking at what they have, they've shown no signs of that level of forethought. Remember when BVS was actually MOS2 and then it was MOS2 with just a little bit of Batman, and there was no set up at all for any of this. SS basically contributed nothing to any overall narrative, so whatever the point there was. WW, while good, didn't really accomplish anything in the same way that First Avenger established the Tesseract, Hydra, Shield, the Winter Soldier, etc.
I'm just not convinced that they are sitting in a room somewhere saying, "let's make all these disconnected films that have nothing to do with each other and then one of the characters will tear open reality so they can all play together in a way that makes any sense".
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Post by ThatGuy on Aug 24, 2017 21:08:16 GMT
I'd be all for it if the point is to secretly (don't announce it!) head for Crisis on Infinite Earths. Now if the ultimate point was to translate that storyline as the DC version of the Infinity War then let's do it. If they are doing it to be, as ArArArchStanton says, "lazy" and not bother to keep track of things with no real goal, then nah. I'd just like the point out that Crisis on Infinite Earth's is just a glorified retcon. It's really amusing that it's DC's most famous crossover, but that's all it is, is a retcon done to correct the mistake of not having these characters exist together in the first place. Yeah, the same characters. They had Golden Age characters still going (with no sliding timescale) along side younger Silver Age versions, but in different universes. It was a way to get rid of the multiverse. Which is ironic because they just brought it back and used it for more reboots.
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Post by ThatGuy on Aug 24, 2017 21:14:35 GMT
I'd be all for it if the point is to secretly (don't announce it!) head for Crisis on Infinite Earths. Now if the ultimate point was to translate that storyline as the DC version of the Infinity War then let's do it. If they are doing it to be, as ArArArchStanton says, "lazy" and not bother to keep track of things with no real goal, then nah. But looking at what they have, they've shown no signs of that level of forethought. Remember when BVS was actually MOS2 and then it was MOS2 with just a little bit of Batman, and there was no set up at all for any of this. SS basically contributed nothing to any overall narrative, so whatever the point there was. WW, while good, didn't really accomplish anything in the same way that First Avenger established the Tesseract, Hydra, Shield, the Winter Soldier, etc.
I'm just not convinced that they are sitting in a room somewhere saying, "let's make all these disconnected films that have nothing to do with each other and then one of the characters will tear open reality so they can all play together in a way that makes any sense".
That's because the DCEU is created by fan reaction. BvS is what happens when you try to apologize to the fans who were loud about what was wrong with the previous movie. With the 2nd movie they should have just kept going forward. They are doing it again with Justice League. That's an apology for BvS with making it more lighthearted and adding more humor and color (and that was before Whedon). They aren't. They are kinda doing it the X-men way of thinking about the next movie when the previous one is done. Only DC is gauging the fans.
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Post by sdrew13163 on Aug 24, 2017 22:19:45 GMT
It's cool, but also not possible in the film medium.
We're talking about at least 60 movies just to set up multiple universes and give us each story in each world. That can happen with a long comic book run, but it can't work with movies.
No cinematic universe will be good 60 movies in. Hell, there will probably never be any cinematic universes that even make it to 60 movies.
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Post by Hauntedknight87 on Aug 25, 2017 0:07:25 GMT
Man this topic is getting spicy! Not sure if I agree with the "it's lazy!!!" argument, but I agree that this is no easy task and it shouldn't be rushed. But I still think it would be awesome if done right, I mean archy, you complained about the cw shows like arrow not being part of the DCEU, but with the multiverse it could be! You just highlighted the problem.
They are literally telling you that they don't care about keeping the shows or even some films in continuity, and they think you'll be happy with that as long as they say the word "multiverse".
And here you saying that you accept their lack of effort, I assume because you think as long as they do some sort of reality displacement once or twice, that you'll let them off the hook for not giving a shit the rest of the time.
It's cheap, and you're letting them get away with it.
I will still give it a shot. It would be no different if marvel announced a multiverse with Fox's X-MEN and the fantastic four. If I could get a entertaining film out of it, why the hell not? If it sucks hard, I skip the others. It's no skin off my back. I don't get why it's so controversial to support a new idea for the genre.
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Post by ArArArchStanton on Aug 25, 2017 2:01:20 GMT
You just highlighted the problem.
They are literally telling you that they don't care about keeping the shows or even some films in continuity, and they think you'll be happy with that as long as they say the word "multiverse".
And here you saying that you accept their lack of effort, I assume because you think as long as they do some sort of reality displacement once or twice, that you'll let them off the hook for not giving a shit the rest of the time.
It's cheap, and you're letting them get away with it.
I will still give it a shot. It would be no different if marvel announced a multiverse with Fox's X-MEN and the fantastic four. If I could get a entertaining film out of it, why the hell not? If it sucks hard, I skip the others. It's no skin off my back. I don't get why it's so controversial to support a new idea for the genre. It's a lot different. Marvel already has an extremely well established and rich universe, and Fox has a decently established one. DC has a half burned down t-pee and they want to make some films that have nothing to do with anything else, while expecting you to buy the excuse that it's actually connected in a multiverse.
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Post by DC-Fan on Aug 25, 2017 2:57:26 GMT
There's a lot of potential for this concept. It might confused the general audience at first, but with the right team behind it, it could work. So I for one welcome it. Plus it'll be different compared to marvel. Yes, a cinematic multiverse is very ambitious and would be more interesting than MCU, which isn't even a real universe since they don't have the X-Men and Fantastic Four in it.
BTW, for people who say they don't or won't understand the concept of a multiverse, have you ever seen Star Trek?
The original series has an episode titled "Mirror, Mirror" in which Kirk, Scotty, McCoy, and Uhura are accidentally transported to a alternative universe where the Federation uses force to conquer weaker planets. Kirk is ordered by that universe's Starfleet to destroy a planet if the planet didn't give them some crystals that the Federation wanted. Kirk, Scotty, McCoy, and Uhura have to figure out how to get back to their own universe without destroying the planet and without getting found out by that universe's Spock, who is suspicious of them.
That was a good episode, but I guess people who say they don't or wont understand the concept of a multiverse wouldn't understand that episode since that was basically dealing with a multiverse. The concept of a multiverse really isn't that hard to understand.
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Post by thenewnexus on Aug 25, 2017 3:12:50 GMT
This woukd of Happened with justice league if it was made years ago we had suos returns and Batman Begins.
I can support this these upcoming films can learn from the mistakes Dceu made. Marvel should do this too there is a lotcthey should correct too
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Post by Hauntedknight87 on Aug 26, 2017 12:19:59 GMT
There's a lot of potential for this concept. It might confused the general audience at first, but with the right team behind it, it could work. So I for one welcome it. Plus it'll be different compared to marvel. Yes, a cinematic multiverse is very ambitious and would be more interesting than MCU, which isn't even a real universe since they don't have the X-Men and Fantastic Four in it.
BTW, for people who say they don't or won't understand the concept of a multiverse, have you ever seen Star Trek?
The original series has an episode titled "Mirror, Mirror" in which Kirk, Scotty, McCoy, and Uhura are accidentally transported to a alternative universe where the Federation uses force to conquer weaker planets. Kirk is ordered by that universe's Starfleet to destroy a planet if the planet didn't give them some crystals that the Federation wanted. Kirk, Scotty, McCoy, and Uhura have to figure out how to get back to their own universe without destroying the planet and without getting found out by that universe's Spock, who is suspicious of them.
That was a good episode, but I guess people who say they don't or wont understand the concept of a multiverse wouldn't understand that episode since that was basically dealing with a multiverse. The concept of a multiverse really isn't that hard to understand.
The MCU is a alternate universe known as "199999". It's part of the many alternate universe's in marvel universe, not sure why not having X-Men or Fantastic Four matters.
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Post by formersamhmd on Aug 26, 2017 13:42:26 GMT
There's a lot of potential for this concept. It might confused the general audience at first, but with the right team behind it, it could work. So I for one welcome it. Plus it'll be different compared to marvel. Yes, a cinematic multiverse is very ambitious and would be more interesting than MCU, which isn't even a real universe since they don't have the X-Men and Fantastic Four in it. It is a real universe, because they're putting effort into building up other neglected characters instead of being lazy and sticking to the big guns the way DC does.
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Post by politicidal on Aug 26, 2017 14:27:52 GMT
I agree to a degree. It's not a bad idea in of itself. Honestly, it'd be an ideal solution to the DCEU's tonal inconsistency and other issues. However, the leadership at WB/DC need to decide what they want first. A reset of the DCEU or all these concurrent outside projects. They cannot and should not do both at once.
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Post by Deleted on Aug 26, 2017 14:45:44 GMT
In my opinion, we already have a cinematic multiverse. Donner's Superman, Burton's Batman, Nolan's Batman, and Snyder's Justice League all exist in separate universes, but they're all "canon" in their own respective realities. This multiverse hasn't been acknowledged yet, but maybe they can do that in the Flash movie.
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Post by DC-Fan on Aug 26, 2017 17:10:16 GMT
In my opinion, we already have a cinematic multiverse. Donner's Superman, Burton's Batman, Nolan's Batman, and Snyder's Justice League all exist in separate universes, but they're all "canon" in their own respective realities. This multiverse hasn't been acknowledged yet, but maybe they can do that in the Flash movie. Agreed. DC already has a multiverse and audiences have no trouble differentiating between the Donner's Superman and the DCEU Superman or Burton's Batman and the DCEU Batman. So audiences won't have any trouble differentiating between Scorsese's Joker and the DCEU Joker.
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Post by ThatGuy on Aug 27, 2017 0:40:04 GMT
Just thought of a cool way to denote a multiverse. When they do the DC flip thing or Justice League animated series thing at the beginning of the movie, put what Earth the movie belongs to. Say the DCEU that is going now is Earth-1, you put a 1 somewhere on there. Kinda like the X-men movies when the Fox logo comes up and the X stays behind when it fades to black.
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Post by gromel on Aug 27, 2017 1:56:04 GMT
Not me m8. I'm fairly critical of everything. Just not overly negative about anything also. Except with Force Awakens, and even then I don't try to stir up shit on the Star Wars boards because what's the point?
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Post by Hauntedknight87 on Sept 15, 2018 0:22:21 GMT
Formersam: DC doing a multiverse is lazy
Also Formersam: Disney making The Force Awakens a remake of A New Hope isn't lazy
lmao
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Post by lenlenlen1 on Sept 15, 2018 2:51:11 GMT
A cinematic Multiverse IS a great idea, IF that's what they're really doing. But we all know the truth is indecision is what they're really doing. Too bad.
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Post by Grabthar's Hammer on Sept 16, 2018 7:06:55 GMT
It's literally all I've ever wanted. I used to wish there were a Batman TV show but I knew it wouldn't happen because they want Batman for the movies. I thought that was ridiculous that we couldn't have more than one Batman.
I hope WB can make it work. It'd be awesome to have multiple versions of characters in live-action.
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Post by Lord Death Man on Sept 16, 2018 22:58:56 GMT
A multiverse might be too high concept for most casual viewers. Although, I admit that the Flash TV show is likely indoctrinating casuals into how it all works on a practical level.
That said, I think a multiverse would lower the overall stakes for serialized content and it would create odd silos between TV shows and movies. The only way it could truly work, and be successful, is if it were all leading to a 'Crisis' that had the ultimate stakes for every iteration of every character and every universe involved.
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