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Post by franktjmackey on Mar 2, 2017 7:21:10 GMT
That makes no sense and yes, you are in over your head. It's just amazing that in all this time, it all boils down to you trying to be insulting. I mean it's just hilarious that this is the best you've got other than pretending to be a confused fuck. But anyway, we know you're a troll. Cheers. I'm not confused at all and I'm not insulting you, I'm giving you an honest assessment: you are in over your head on this subject. You're ill-equipped to understand what you are saying and comprehend what you've asked for. A little knowledge is a dangerous thing.... you seem like a teen who read a book or article on atheism then runs to the Internet to debate "theists"... |
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Post by Deleted on Mar 2, 2017 8:15:36 GMT
One of the reasons I believe God exists is because I do not believe this universe could create itself.
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Post by Deleted on Mar 2, 2017 8:22:01 GMT
Scared of losing their faith, pure and simple. Many theists believe that life would be desolate and barren without their religion, so it is very important to protect their beliefs from any ideas which might cause their faith to wobble on its foundations.
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Post by The Herald Erjen on Mar 2, 2017 8:36:02 GMT
Scared of losing their faith, pure and simple. Many theists believe that life would be desolate and barren without their religion, so it is very important to protect their beliefs from any ideas which might cause their faith to wobble on its foundations. No, we just don't want to be reduced down to amoral swine, pure and simple. |
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Post by Deleted on Mar 2, 2017 8:40:47 GMT
Scared of losing their faith, pure and simple. Many theists believe that life would be desolate and barren without their religion, so it is very important to protect their beliefs from any ideas which might cause their faith to wobble on its foundations. No, we just don't want to be reduced down to amoral swine, pure and simple. Amoral would be a major step up for a lot of theists. |
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Post by The Herald Erjen on Mar 2, 2017 8:56:39 GMT
No, we just don't want to be reduced down to amoral swine, pure and simple. Amoral would be a major step up for a lot of theists. There's a lot more of us than there are of you, old boy. |
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Post by Deleted on Mar 2, 2017 11:51:42 GMT
No, it's dealing with an argument that DOES exist. Just because you may not use that argument, this doesn't mean that others don't. No it doesn't. You are making up appreciation for the universe as thinking that Christians think they are the center of the universe which is a ludicrous accusation. No, I am not making it up. It's an argument I have seen used often. If you think it's a ludicrous argument then you agree with me. |
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Post by CoolJGS☺ on Mar 2, 2017 12:01:27 GMT
No it doesn't. You are making up appreciation for the universe as thinking that Christians think they are the center of the universe which is a ludicrous accusation. No, I am not making it up. It's an argument I have seen used often. If you think it's a ludicrous argument then you agree with me. It's an argument you've seen used against Copernicus. |
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Post by Deleted on Mar 2, 2017 12:15:39 GMT
No, I wasn't around for that. I've seen it used plenty in the present day, though.
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Post by Deleted on Mar 2, 2017 12:19:04 GMT
Scared of losing their faith, pure and simple. Many theists believe that life would be desolate and barren without their religion, so it is very important to protect their beliefs from any ideas which might cause their faith to wobble on its foundations. No, we just don't want to be reduced down to amoral swine, pure and simple. So if you lost your religious beliefs, you would automatically become amoral swine? Interesting admission. Doesn't speak too highly of your character, really. |
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Post by The Herald Erjen on Mar 2, 2017 12:23:08 GMT
No, we just don't want to be reduced down to amoral swine, pure and simple. So if you lost your religious beliefs, you would automatically become amoral swine? Interesting admission. Doesn't speak too highly of your character, really. You are amoral swine. You have no character. You have nothing. |
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Post by Deleted on Mar 2, 2017 12:47:57 GMT
So if you lost your religious beliefs, you would automatically become amoral swine? Interesting admission. Doesn't speak too highly of your character, really. You are amoral swine. You have no character. You have nothing. Of course that's nonsense, but let's take it as true for the purposes of the discussion. What you actually said wasn't about me. You claimed that without religion YOU would be amoral swine. Is that really what you meant to say, Erjen? Are you such an awful person that without your religion you would be swine with no sense of morality? Is your religion the only thing that stops you raping little children? |
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Post by The Herald Erjen on Mar 2, 2017 12:53:55 GMT
You are amoral swine. You have no character. You have nothing. Of course that's nonsense, but let's take it as true for the purposes of the discussion. What you actually said wasn't about me. You claimed that without religion YOU would be amoral swine. Is that really what you meant to say, Erjen? Are you such an awful person that without your religion you would be swine with no sense of morality? Is your religion the only thing that stops you raping little children? What stops you from raping little children? |
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Post by Deleted on Mar 2, 2017 13:22:23 GMT
Of course that's nonsense, but let's take it as true for the purposes of the discussion. What you actually said wasn't about me. You claimed that without religion YOU would be amoral swine. Is that really what you meant to say, Erjen? Are you such an awful person that without your religion you would be swine with no sense of morality? Is your religion the only thing that stops you raping little children? What stops you from raping little children? Wow, the question was so hard that you had to ignore it completely and ask me one instead? So we've established that you're a coward. To answer your question : Several things stop me from raping little children, Erjen. Chief amongst them is the fact that I have no desire to do so, since I am not a pedophile. Like most humans - but apparently not you - I also have a sense of empathy, which would make it next to impossible for me to hurt defenceless and vulnerable people. Also - again apparently unlike you - I have a moral system which forbids me from inflicting physical harm on others unnecessarily. Whereas it seems that the only thing stopping you is "A powerful being told me I can't, and that if I do he'll punish me." Given that, I wonder which of us is actually the "amoral swine"? (Hint : It's you.) |
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Post by The Herald Erjen on Mar 2, 2017 13:29:27 GMT
What stops you from raping little children? Wow, the question was so hard that you had to ignore it completely and ask me one instead? So we've established that you're a coward. To answer your question : Several things stop me from raping little children, Erjen. Chief amongst them is the fact that I have no desire to do so, since I am not a pedophile. Like most humans - but apparently not you - I also have a sense of empathy, which would make it next to impossible for me to hurt defenceless and vulnerable people. Also - again apparently unlike you - I have a moral system which forbids me from inflicting physical harm on others unnecessarily. Whereas it seems that the only thing stopping you is "A powerful being told me I can't, and that if I do he'll punish me." Given that, I wonder which of us is actually the "amoral swine"? (Hint : It's you.) Really? How did a creature like you gain this empathy? Did you evolve with it? |
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Post by Deleted on Mar 2, 2017 13:32:01 GMT
Wow, the question was so hard that you had to ignore it completely and ask me one instead? So we've established that you're a coward. To answer your question : Several things stop me from raping little children, Erjen. Chief amongst them is the fact that I have no desire to do so, since I am not a pedophile. Like most humans - but apparently not you - I also have a sense of empathy, which would make it next to impossible for me to hurt defenceless and vulnerable people. Also - again apparently unlike you - I have a moral system which forbids me from inflicting physical harm on others unnecessarily. Whereas it seems that the only thing stopping you is "A powerful being told me I can't, and that if I do he'll punish me." Given that, I wonder which of us is actually the "amoral swine"? (Hint : It's you.) Really? How did a creature like you gain this empathy? Did you evolve with it? And once again, Erjen runs from the question. How ironic, in a thread called "Why Do Theists Reject Being Questioned", that Erjen the theist rejects questions put to him - whilst the atheist he's talking to answers his questions. The premise of the thread, proved! Thanks, Erjen! And because I am not a coward... yes, Erjen. Humans have empathy because we evolved it. Most likely, IMO, we evolved empathy because it encourages us to live and work together in groups as a social species, which is a tremendous survival advantage. |
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Post by The Herald Erjen on Mar 2, 2017 13:49:13 GMT
Really? How did a creature like you gain this empathy? Did you evolve with it? And once again, Erjen runs from the question. How ironic, in a thread called "Why Do Theists Reject Being Questioned", that Erjen the theist rejects questions put to him - whilst the atheist he's talking to answers his questions. The premise of the thread, proved! Thanks, Erjen! And because I am not a coward... yes, Erjen. Humans have empathy because we evolved it. Most likely, IMO, we evolved empathy because it encourages us to live and work together in groups as a social species, which is a tremendous survival advantage. Whatever you have to tell yourself, sociopath. |
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Post by Deleted on Mar 2, 2017 14:51:59 GMT
 So... in a thread about theists who reject being questioned, Erjen claims that this isn't true... and then proves the point by refusing to be questioned. Meanwhile Erjen is the one who refrains from doing terrible things ONLY because somebody bigger than him told him not to... although he's too cowardly to actually admit to this when it's pointed out to him. Whilst I'm the one who doesn't actually want to do terrible things, and in any case rejects such behaviour because I think it's ethically wrong. Erjen's response to all of this being pointed out to him is simply to hurl insults and have a little temper tantrum. And this makes ME the sociopath! Man, I've owned you about a thousand times in the past, mate, but never so completely and so easily.
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Post by chasallnut on Mar 2, 2017 15:19:55 GMT
So... in a thread about theists who reject being questioned, Erjen claims that this isn't true... and then proves the point by refusing to be questioned. Meanwhile Erjen is the one who refrains from doing terrible things ONLY because somebody bigger than him told him not to... although he's too cowardly to actually admit to this when it's pointed out to him. Whilst I'm the one who doesn't actually want to do terrible things, and in any case rejects such behaviour because I think it's ethically wrong. Erjen's response to all of this being pointed out to him is simply to hurl insults and have a little temper tantrum. And this makes ME the sociopath! Man, I've owned you about a thousand times in the past, mate, but never so completely and so easily. Meanwhile Erjen is the one who refrains from doing terrible things ONLY because somebody bigger than him told him not to... although he's too cowardly to actually admit to this when it's pointed out to him.
Whilst I'm the one who doesn't actually want to do terrible things, and in any case rejects such behaviour because I think it's ethically wrong.
This raises a good point though. I like to think that it is ME that has decided not to do horrible things and I believe that is the case, however I had a really good upbringing by my family that outlined and clearly taught what was acceptable behaviour and what wasn't. Ultimately the choice is mine but nurture surely plays a part, so in that instance someone bigger actually did tell me not to do it. You only have to see examples of families that exhibit anti social behaviour that has extended to the next generation to see the influence of being shown the "right things" is missing. But yes I agree with you.
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Post by Deleted on Mar 2, 2017 15:27:07 GMT
I think that depends on how you were raised.
For instance, say two families go to a restaurant. In each, a kid screams, makes noise, is rude to the staff, etc.
In family A, father says "You don't do that! If you behave that way, I'll spank you when we get home!"
In family B, father explains to the kid that what he's doing is wrong. He points out that the people are there to have a good time and being noisy ruins it for him. Maybe he says something like "When you're watching cartoons, you want people to be quiet so you can hear them, right? These people only want the same thing from you."
I think you could fairly say that approach A isn't likely to lead to a moral person, just one who is trained to do as he's told. B, however, is teaching a person to apply empathy and rationally consider the impact of his actions on others.
Obviously, I favour approach B.
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