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Post by Deleted on Oct 6, 2017 3:39:47 GMT
What crickets? The MCU's lineup has consistently been more successful than any of "the big boys" ever since the series picked up steam. I'm talking about my personal repertoire! "D-list superheroes who don't deserve their own films" is an old standard. ![;)](//storage.proboards.com/forum/images/smiley/wink.png) Okay.
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Post by sdrew13163 on Oct 6, 2017 4:06:34 GMT
I have no problem with humor being used. In fact, I welcome it. I just hate when moments that are supposed to be serious are ruined by a stupid joke or a dumb visual gag. I know there are a couple people point to in the MCU, but honestly none of those have bothered me and I think people make too much out of them. I actually like them. The dance of for instance I would actually call brilliant. The dance off ruined GotG for me. In my opinion, the gold standard for mixing humor and drama is Raimi's first two Spider-Man movies. They are both really funny, but ditch the humor when it gets serious. Even the entire Captain America trilogy did it really well. It's just one of those things to me that can actually ruin the entire movie if done poorly.
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Post by Deleted on Oct 6, 2017 4:15:57 GMT
I know there are a couple people point to in the MCU, but honestly none of those have bothered me and I think people make too much out of them. I actually like them. The dance of for instance I would actually call brilliant. The dance off ruined GotG for me. In my opinion, the gold standard for mixing humor and drama is Raimi's first two Spider-Man movies. They are both really funny, but ditch the humor when it gets serious. Even the entire Captain America trilogy did it really well. It's just one of those things to me that can actually ruin the entire movie if done poorly. There was no dance off, Quill just distracted Ronan for a moment with a baffling bit of spontaneity while Rocket and Drax fixed the gun. The scene is brilliant and hilarious. You're just being a stick in the mud because no one snapped Ronan's neck inside a church.
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Post by sdrew13163 on Oct 6, 2017 4:29:38 GMT
The dance off ruined GotG for me. In my opinion, the gold standard for mixing humor and drama is Raimi's first two Spider-Man movies. They are both really funny, but ditch the humor when it gets serious. Even the entire Captain America trilogy did it really well. It's just one of those things to me that can actually ruin the entire movie if done poorly. There was no dance off, Quill just distracted Ronan for a moment with a baffling bit of spontaneity while Rocket and Drax fixed the gun. The scene is brilliant and hilarious. You're just being a stick in the mud because no one snapped Ronan's neck inside a church. Okay, you're right, it wasn't a dance off. I still hated the scene. Like I said, it ruined the movie for me. You like humor whenever it can be used, I don't. That doesn't make me a stick in the mud. I also can't recall liking any neck-snapping scene in a church. Am I missing something?
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Post by Deleted on Oct 6, 2017 4:37:58 GMT
There was no dance off, Quill just distracted Ronan for a moment with a baffling bit of spontaneity while Rocket and Drax fixed the gun. The scene is brilliant and hilarious. You're just being a stick in the mud because no one snapped Ronan's neck inside a church. Okay, you're right, it wasn't a dance off. I still hated the scene. Like I said, it ruined the movie for me. You like humor whenever it can be used, I don't. That doesn't make me a stick in the mud. I also can't recall liking any neck-snapping scene in a church. Am I missing something? How so? What was Quill supposed to do, instead? Challenge Ronan to a fight? That's what Ronan would be expecting. He'd have just brought the hammer down and killed everyone. Quill needed to surprise him, get him to pause, and the surest way to do that was to do something that just completely takes the piss out of Ronan's grandstanding. The scene makes perfect sense. The film is goofy and irreverent as all hell, anyway, but Quill's dancing is where you drew the line? This is why I roll my eyes whenever somebody whines about the "dance off." One of the major themes of the Guardians sub-franchise is "people dancing through life and hardship." The film set the tone and the theme in place with Quill dancing through danger in the opening credits scene, as well as establishing his character. So yeah, distracting Ronan by dancing was a completely in-character thing for him to do. I guarantee right now that no one would have complained about the scene before it became popular to bitch and moan about everything. Wrong. I don't like humor whenever it can be used, and you ARE a stick in the mud. You're way overblowing a non-issue by claiming it ruined the film for you. Such nonsense. Its a reference to Man of Steel.
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Post by formersamhmd on Oct 6, 2017 9:42:20 GMT
Thinking like yours leads to movies like Fant4stic. And no, humor doesn't instantly destroy dramatic tension and suspense. Humor is everywhere in real life, and only self-serious pretentious nonsense tries to act otherwise. As I said, humor at the expense of character can ruin dramatic tension. Humor in Superman the movie did not harm its dramatic moments. Neither did the humor in Robocop. Humor in Superman very much did kill dramatic moments. Like when he sadistically took down General Zod in Superman II with a smile on his face. And Robocop was a thorough satire, so it worked due to that. Never seen it.
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Post by formersamhmd on Oct 6, 2017 9:43:31 GMT
He's forgetting how the X-Men were once D-Listers who couldn't hold a book. Wrong. X-Men were always the absolute most popular book ever from the moment they launched it, not something dominant for a brief period in the late-80s to mid-90s that happened to coincide with my childhood and early adolescence. My memory on this is 100% accurate and in no way tainted by nostalgia or youth. And they were never D-listers! If they were they would've gotten cancelled at some point in the mid-seventies and only brought back some time later. It was actually earlier than the mid 70s that they were canceled, but I'll let that slide.
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Post by ArArArchStanton on Oct 6, 2017 10:24:07 GMT
I know there are a couple people point to in the MCU, but honestly none of those have bothered me and I think people make too much out of them. I actually like them. The dance of for instance I would actually call brilliant. The dance off ruined GotG for me. In my opinion, the gold standard for mixing humor and drama is Raimi's first two Spider-Man movies. They are both really funny, but ditch the humor when it gets serious. Even the entire Captain America trilogy did it really well. It's just one of those things to me that can actually ruin the entire movie if done poorly. Ruined it for you? I sort of understand, but then that's exactly what that character would do to give the rocket character time to build a machine in 5 seconds. It's not really done for comedic value, that's just what he would do. I personally find that one of the coolest scenes ever and I absolutely love it. In fact I would say they needed it to break up the incredibly tense moment right before it from the incredibly tense moment right after it. It's a little risky, I understand, but it's not like it's Martha or Tornadocide. It's a well thought out, respectable, character driven moment. I wish I could help you out with it.
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Post by Primemovermithrax Pejorative on Oct 6, 2017 14:45:08 GMT
Humor in Superman very much did kill dramatic moments. Like when he sadistically took down General Zod in Superman II with a smile on his face. And Robocop was a thorough satire, so it worked due to that. There was over the top humor in Superman 2, but him pointing to his head as if to say "thinking" did not undermine the moment he tricked Zod. The dramatic tension was kept when needed. Robocop had serious moments--the Murphy story itself is serious. Difference with a MCU movie is that when humor comes, it is always undercutting any dramatic moment or aimed at the character. Like when the nerd in Winter Soldier is talking to Steve Rogers in the library. Or the Ultron humor. You'd have to understand the difference humor that is part of character behavior and humor that is added at expense of character. "He's adopted" is at expense of character and tension. Zod correcting the president is not.
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Post by coldenhaulfield on Oct 6, 2017 14:59:35 GMT
Wrong. X-Men were always the absolute most popular book ever from the moment they launched it, not something dominant for a brief period in the late-80s to mid-90s that happened to coincide with my childhood and early adolescence. My memory on this is 100% accurate and in no way tainted by nostalgia or youth. And they were never D-listers! If they were they would've gotten cancelled at some point in the mid-seventies and only brought back some time later. It was actually earlier than the mid 70s that they were canceled, but I'll let that slide. Meh. The whole thing is still funny. ![:)](//storage.proboards.com/forum/images/smiley/smiley.png)
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Post by Deleted on Oct 6, 2017 15:46:36 GMT
The dance off ruined GotG for me. In my opinion, the gold standard for mixing humor and drama is Raimi's first two Spider-Man movies. They are both really funny, but ditch the humor when it gets serious. Even the entire Captain America trilogy did it really well. It's just one of those things to me that can actually ruin the entire movie if done poorly. Ruined it for you? I sort of understand, but then that's exactly what that character would do to give the rocket character time to build a machine in 5 seconds. It's not really done for comedic value, that's just what he would do. I personally find that one of the coolest scenes ever and I absolutely love it. In fact I would say they needed it to break up the incredibly tense moment right before it from the incredibly tense moment right after it. It's a little risky, I understand, but it's not like it's Martha or Tornadocide. It's a well thought out, respectable, character driven moment. I wish I could help you out with it. Exactly. From the very first time we meet Peter Quill grownup, he's dancing to "Come and Get Your Love" right through a cave full of dangerous little rodent-like aliens.
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Post by Deleted on Oct 6, 2017 15:50:42 GMT
Marvel's action-comedy films are getting stale.
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Post by coldenhaulfield on Oct 6, 2017 15:52:24 GMT
Marvel's action-comedy films are getting stale. They should take a different approach with the inevitable reboot.
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Post by ArArArchStanton on Oct 6, 2017 16:14:10 GMT
Ruined it for you? I sort of understand, but then that's exactly what that character would do to give the rocket character time to build a machine in 5 seconds. It's not really done for comedic value, that's just what he would do. I personally find that one of the coolest scenes ever and I absolutely love it. In fact I would say they needed it to break up the incredibly tense moment right before it from the incredibly tense moment right after it. It's a little risky, I understand, but it's not like it's Martha or Tornadocide. It's a well thought out, respectable, character driven moment. I wish I could help you out with it. Exactly. From the very first time we meet Peter Quill grownup, he's dancing to "Come and Get Your Love" right through a cave full of dangerous little rodent-like aliens. To me it's odd to have people say they don't like things like that for one major reason. We always ask for new and interesting characters and then when we get one who does something new we dismiss it and ask for it to be done in a traditional way. I for one, really really really really really appreciate that they followed through with the character to do the dance off, and the execution of it. I loved Ronan's reaction, I loved that Quill made the huge sacrifice right after. All of it. I can't say enough that I find the scene to be refreshingly brilliant.
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Post by Deleted on Oct 6, 2017 16:30:26 GMT
Exactly. From the very first time we meet Peter Quill grownup, he's dancing to "Come and Get Your Love" right through a cave full of dangerous little rodent-like aliens. To me it's odd to have people say they don't like things like that for one major reason. We always ask for new and interesting characters and then when we get one who does something new we dismiss it and ask for it to be done in a traditional way. I for one, really really really really really appreciate that they followed through with the character to do the dance off, and the execution of it. I loved Ronan's reaction, I loved that Quill made the huge sacrifice right after. All of it. I can't say enough that I find the scene to be refreshingly brilliant. Again, exactly. Not to mention Marvel Studio has been busting its chops to come up with creative alternatives to just simply having a big climatic fight. In Guardians, trying to fight Ronan is repeatedly proven futile, because he's just too powerful. He needed to outwitted and the killing blown ended up having to come from an Infinity Stone. In The Winter Soldier, sure, they had a big final fight, but the true victory of the film is Steve bringing Bucky back to his senses with unconditional brotherly love. In Ant-Man, the hero never actually beats Cross in that fight, he just takes advantage of the technologies drawbacks to condemn them both to the Quantum Realm. Doctor Strange: "Dormammu, I've come to bargain!" Strange wins by annoying his enemy into submission. Guardians of the Galaxy Vol. 2: The big fight only becomes necessary when the Sovereign wreak their Plan 1, but even then its just another distraction to keep Ego busy while Groot blows up his brain. ...I'm disturbed that's not the oddest sentence I've ever typed. Spider-Man: Homecoming: Spider-Man only ruins Vulture's plans. The only reason Toomes ends up getting arrested is his own desperation/recklessness when he tries taking off bearing heavy cargo with a damaged suit. He could probably have just flown away again just fine had he not gone for the gold again. And I'm sure Thor: Ragnarok will have a clever take on defeating horned Cate Blanchett.
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Post by formersamhmd on Oct 6, 2017 17:34:39 GMT
There was over the top humor in Superman 2, but him pointing to his head as if to say "thinking" did not undermine the moment he tricked Zod. The dramatic tension was kept when needed. Uh no, I'm talking about the big grin he had when he sadistically tortured Zod a the end. And then going back to beat up the Trucker when the Trucker was defenseless. I suppose he should've talked about how he was a Cancer patient with 6 months to live so it'd be "profound". His mind was based on Tony's, of course he'd joke like that. Says you.
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Post by Primemovermithrax Pejorative on Oct 6, 2017 17:45:39 GMT
Uh no, I'm talking about the big grin he had when he sadistically tortured Zod a the end. And then going back to beat up the Trucker when the Trucker was defenseless. Says you. You appear to have no idea whatsoever how dramatic tension works in a movie. The point of him beating up the trucker was that the guy was a bully and needed to be lowered a few pegs--and on a personal level, Superman was showing that he had a human desire to redeem himself. Zod was an asshole--of course an emotional character would have some satisfaction in turning the humiliation and abuse back on the abuser. Wow-I am shocked by your lack of grasp on these obvious things. Are you a robot? You probably think the Hulk Iron Man fight in Avengers 2 was more exciting than the Ed 209 Robocop fight in the 87 film--that would be sad. You must be very young. Give it a few years.
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Post by formersamhmd on Oct 6, 2017 17:54:35 GMT
You appear to have no idea whatsoever how dramatic tension works in a movie. I do, I just don't like pretentious self-important pomp. Beating up a defenseless guy just makes you an asshole. Then again, Superman was pretty unheroic throughout all of Superman II anyways. That's what separates a hero from an asshole. The ED-209 fight that ended with him slipping on stairs, falling over and squealing like a little piggy? That ED-209? [/quote]
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Post by Primemovermithrax Pejorative on Oct 6, 2017 17:59:45 GMT
That's what separates a hero from an asshole. Oh baby-you would probably start crying if you watched For a Few Dollars More or some other adult film. Better keep to the Wall Street approved products. You have a limited scope. I bet you think MCU muzak is better than Poledouris too. haha
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Post by Deleted on Oct 6, 2017 18:09:39 GMT
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