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Post by ArArArchStanton on Dec 10, 2017 23:04:04 GMT
I'd like to hear any thoughts on what would be considered a bigger accomplishment. The resume of the MCU is that of a 22 solid film run that has achieved consistent results, raised it's box office value, established global brand trust, earned the purchasing eye of Disney, produced at least a few of the very best films in the genre, become the largest film study in Hollywood, and has become an influence on the entire industry.
Has any cinematic endeavor accomplished more than that? |
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Post by No Morpho, Only Bánh mì on Dec 10, 2017 23:25:40 GMT
Well, fox is like totally being bought by Disney, too, man, and for way more than Lucasfilm and Marvel.
Lolol just kidding, it's magnificent.
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Post by sdrew13163 on Dec 10, 2017 23:42:17 GMT
Yes...
The Star Wars Saga
The Dark Knight Trilogy
The Indiana Jones Trilogy
The Lord of the Rings Trilogy
...are all greater cinematic achievements. But the MCU might come in fifth.
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Post by Nalkarj on Dec 10, 2017 23:43:56 GMT
Ummm…
Casablanca
Citizen Kane
Hitchcock, Welles, Lubitsch, Hawks, Ford, Chaplin, Keaton, ad infinitum, ad nauseam.
The whole collection of classic films that raised cinema to an art form?
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Post by ArArArchStanton on Dec 11, 2017 0:19:48 GMT
Yes... The Star Wars Saga The Dark Knight Trilogy The Indiana Jones Trilogy The Lord of the Rings Trilogy ...are all greater cinematic achievements. But the MCU might come in fifth. Perhaps the Star Wars saga, but I don't see how the other 3 are even remotely comparable. What did TDK accomplish that the MCU hasn't? What did Indiana Jones accomplish that the MCU hasn't?
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Post by ArArArchStanton on Dec 11, 2017 0:21:17 GMT
Ummm… Casablanca
Citizen Kane
Hitchcock, Welles, Lubitsch, Hawks, Ford, Chaplin, Keaton, ad infinitum, ad nauseam. The whole collection of classic films that raised cinema to an art form? Wait, how are any of those individually bigger accomplishments?
Hitchcock for instance, if you're saying all of his work is a bigger accomplish, that's fine, but can you elaborate on how so? I'm definitely open to this.
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Post by Nalkarj on Dec 11, 2017 0:27:00 GMT
Sure, ArArArchStanton. Taking Hitchcock, for example, his entire oeuvre is widely acknowledged as a huge accomplishment that transformed film and established concepts of suspense in cinematic storytelling, not to mention massive transformations of cinematic technique. Casablanca and Citizen Kane, among others, are often considered the greatest movies ever made. I’d say those are far greater achievements than the Marvel series, like it though I do. |
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Post by sdrew13163 on Dec 11, 2017 0:38:45 GMT
Yes... The Star Wars Saga The Dark Knight Trilogy The Indiana Jones Trilogy The Lord of the Rings Trilogy ...are all greater cinematic achievements. But the MCU might come in fifth. Perhaps the Star Wars saga, but I don't see how the other 3 are even remotely comparable. What did TDK accomplish that the MCU hasn't? What did Indiana Jones accomplish that the MCU hasn't?
The Dark Knight Trilogy has better characters, villains, writing, production design, ambition, cinematography, acting, pacing, and musical scores. The Indiana Jones Trilogy is pretty much the same as above, but I think the MCU has better villains by just a bit. |
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Post by ArArArchStanton on Dec 11, 2017 0:41:52 GMT
Perhaps the Star Wars saga, but I don't see how the other 3 are even remotely comparable. What did TDK accomplish that the MCU hasn't? What did Indiana Jones accomplish that the MCU hasn't?
The Dark Knight Trilogy has better characters, villains, writing, production design, ambition, cinematography, acting, pacing, and musical scores. The Indiana Jones Trilogy is pretty much the same as above, but I think the MCU has better villains by just a bit. We're not talking about better or worse, It's not an evaluation of acting and cinematography
We're talking about bigger accomplishment,
And TDK and Indiana Jones aren't bigger accomplishments.
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Post by Hauntedknight87 on Dec 11, 2017 0:44:29 GMT
Lord of the Rings trilogy.
It's the closest thing we have to a modern Master Piece!
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Post by ArArArchStanton on Dec 11, 2017 0:45:18 GMT
Lord of the Rings trilogy. It's the cli Ok, fair enough, but what makes it a bigger accomplishment? |
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Post by sdrew13163 on Dec 11, 2017 0:49:26 GMT
The Dark Knight Trilogy has better characters, villains, writing, production design, ambition, cinematography, acting, pacing, and musical scores. The Indiana Jones Trilogy is pretty much the same as above, but I think the MCU has better villains by just a bit. We're not talking about better or worse, It's not an evaluation of acting and cinematography
We're talking about bigger accomplishment,
And TDK and Indiana Jones aren't bigger accomplishments.
That makes no sense. How can you judge a movie series by anything other than what makes a movie good (acting, cinematography, writing, etc)? Just because it has more movies doesn't mean it's a greater achievement. All the aspects of filmmaking listed above is what makes those three trilogies and the Star Wars Saga better and therefore more grand of an achievement than the MCU. The MCU has yet to make a movie as iconic or influential as Star Wars or The Empire Strikes Back or Raiders of the Lost Ark or The Fellowship of the Ring or The Dark Knight. |
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Post by ArArArchStanton on Dec 11, 2017 0:51:20 GMT
We're not talking about better or worse, It's not an evaluation of acting and cinematography
We're talking about bigger accomplishment,
And TDK and Indiana Jones aren't bigger accomplishments.
That makes no sense. How can you judge a movie series by anything other than what makes a movie good (acting, cinematography, writing, etc)? Just because it has more movies doesn't mean it's a greater achievement. All the aspects of filmmaking listed above is what makes those three trilogies and the Star Wars Saga better and therefore more grand of an achievement than the MCU. The MCU has yet to make a movie as iconic or influential as Star Wars or The Empire Strikes Back or Raiders of the Lost Ark or The Fellowship of the Ring or The Dark Knight. It's scope, it's impact on pop culture, it's impact on the industry, and yes it's overall quality is a factor, but it's not the only factor.
Otherwise the question would just be "which series is better", but that's not the same thing as "which is the bigger accomplishment"
Also has it not outdone LOTR in terms of iconic status? It certainly gets much higher box office. You're totally right on Star Wars, but I'm not sure about the rest at all.
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Post by Hauntedknight87 on Dec 11, 2017 0:53:03 GMT
Lord of the Rings trilogy. It's the cli Ok, fair enough, but what makes it a bigger accomplishment? The MCU should get it's rightful praise for being a well put together cinematic shared universe. But the lotr films are a cinematic and technical master piece based on one of the best fantasy books ever made. |
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Post by ArArArchStanton on Dec 11, 2017 0:55:54 GMT
Ok, fair enough, but what makes it a bigger accomplishment? The MCU should get it's rightful praise for being a well put together cinematic shared universe. But the lotr films are a cinematic and technical master piece based on one of the best fantasy books ever made. Well I don't disagree with you there. But I might argue that Avengers has a bigger impact and a much larger scope. It does exceed LOTR at the box office and to maintain their level of quality for this long is absolutely unprecedented. |
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Post by sdrew13163 on Dec 11, 2017 1:00:25 GMT
That makes no sense. How can you judge a movie series by anything other than what makes a movie good (acting, cinematography, writing, etc)? Just because it has more movies doesn't mean it's a greater achievement. All the aspects of filmmaking listed above is what makes those three trilogies and the Star Wars Saga better and therefore more grand of an achievement than the MCU. The MCU has yet to make a movie as iconic or influential as Star Wars or The Empire Strikes Back or Raiders of the Lost Ark or The Fellowship of the Ring or The Dark Knight. It's scope, it's impact on pop culture, it's impact on the industry, and yes it's overall quality is a factor, but it's not the only factor.
Otherwise the question would just be "which series is better", but that's not the same thing as "which is the bigger accomplishment"
I consider the MCU to be a great achievement so far, but I just don't think it even comes close to those I listed. We are all, of course, entitled to our own opinion, so we'll just have to agree to disagree. |
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Post by Hauntedknight87 on Dec 11, 2017 1:04:40 GMT
The MCU should get it's rightful praise for being a well put together cinematic shared universe. But the lotr films are a cinematic and technical master piece based on one of the best fantasy books ever made. Well I don't disagree with you there. But I might argue that Avengers has a bigger impact and a much larger scope. It does exceed LOTR at the box office and to maintain their level of quality for this long is absolutely unprecedented. We'll have to see how much of a impact it still has in the next 30 years. Tolkien work inspired an entire genre that still thriving today. We'll have to wait and see if the same could be said about the MCU. |
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Post by ArArArchStanton on Dec 11, 2017 1:05:47 GMT
It's scope, it's impact on pop culture, it's impact on the industry, and yes it's overall quality is a factor, but it's not the only factor.
Otherwise the question would just be "which series is better", but that's not the same thing as "which is the bigger accomplishment"
I consider the MCU to be a great achievement so far, but I just don't think it even comes close to those I listed. We are all, of course, entitled to our own opinion, so we'll just have to agree to disagree. Close how though? I mean if you're saying those other films are better, that's fine, I might even agree with some of them, but something like Indiana Jones for instance didn't maintain consistent quality for this long and didn't have such a big influence on multiple other studios. Yes we can have our own opinions, but I'm not sure I'm agreeing to disagree yet unless there's some reason to view Indiana Jones as having accomplished as much as what the MCU has. |
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Post by ArArArchStanton on Dec 11, 2017 1:08:56 GMT
Well I don't disagree with you there. But I might argue that Avengers has a bigger impact and a much larger scope. It does exceed LOTR at the box office and to maintain their level of quality for this long is absolutely unprecedented. We'll have to see how much of a impact it still has in the next 30 years. Tolkien work inspired an entire genre that still thriving today. We'll have to wait and see if the same could be said about the MCU. That we will. I admit I'm as curious about how things turn out as much as I am the films themselves. Does it ever fizzle out, do they decide to stop. What I compare it to is Pinewood who produces James Bond and since that is their only property, they will never stop making Bond movies. I honestly don't see why Marvel Studios would ever stop either, unless for some reason Disney just shuts it down. |
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Post by Skaathar on Dec 11, 2017 1:29:35 GMT
Yes... The Star Wars Saga The Dark Knight Trilogy The Indiana Jones Trilogy The Lord of the Rings Trilogy ...are all greater cinematic achievements. But the MCU might come in fifth. Nah. None of those even approach what the MCU has accomplished. |
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