|
Post by DC-Fan on Jan 28, 2018 22:12:26 GMT
It definitely is. The scene in the Avengers with those 6 idiots standing in a circle was really stupid. When you're in a battle, you don't stand close together in a circle like that and give the enemy a chance to take out your entire unit with just 1 shot. But—as is hobowar ’s point, I think, and he can correct me if I’m wrong—that is opinion, and we cannot base iconicity, rightly or wrongly, on opinion. I, for one, thought that shot in The Avengers was just as bombastic, absurd, and silly-looking as the whole movie, but I wouldn’t deny that it was iconic. On the other hand, I greatly enjoyed Wonder Woman, but there’s not a single shot in the movie that I would call “iconic.” To be iconic, 1st it would have to be something that most of the general public remembers or is familiar with and 2nd it stands the test of time. That scene in the Avengers wasn't iconic at all. It's just 6 idiots standing around doing nothing while aliens are killing people. Nothing iconic about that.
On the other hand, the No Man's Land scene is iconic because most of the general public is familiar with it and it'll stand the test of time (like Superman flying up to catch Lois and then catching the helicopter while John Williams' classic theme is playing or the upside-down kiss in Spider-Man).
The No Man's Land scene in Wonder Woman is so iconic that it even has its own name and when people say "the No Man's Land scene", everyone knows what is being referred to. The scene of the 6 idiots standing around in the Avengers, what is that called? "6 idiots standing around doing nothing during a battle while civilians are getting killed"?
|
|
|
Post by Nalkarj on Jan 28, 2018 22:13:41 GMT
Yes, well.
|
|
tresix
Sophomore
@tresix
Posts: 491
Likes: 195
|
Post by tresix on Jan 28, 2018 22:17:23 GMT
1. "Superman"-running towards the camera, ripping open his shirt as his chest fills the screen to reveal the "S"! 2. "Batman Forever"-The newly-formed Dynamic Duo running towards the camera, backlit by the Bat-signal, capes flowing behind them. 3. "Wonder Woman"-Wonder Woman's march into No Man's Land and throwing a tank. 4. "Spider-Man"-As Spidey tries to save Mary Jane and a tram, the Green Goblin keeps attacking him until, finally fed up, the people of NY begin pelting GG with rocks and garbage. 5. "Batman" (1989)-A cowled man has caught up with the two muggers that robbed the tourist family. He's kayoed one thug and is dangling the other over the edge of a roof. The hood is begging for his life, the figure informs him that he's not going to kill him. That he wants him to tell all of his friends about him. "What are you?!" the mugger asks, the cowled figure pulls him so that they're nose-to-nose and informs him who he is: "I'm Batman." 6. "The Flash" (1990)-Barry Allen has acquired superspeed powers and wants to get rid of them until his brother, a police officer, is murdered by the brother's former partner and his gang. Allen wants the costume that he's wearing to be made into something more, a symbol. We see a red streak zoom around the screen until he comes to a stop. The camera starts at his feet, panning up until we see him in full Flash regalia. 7. "Superman"-Superman proves that he really is "more powerful than a locomotive" by supporting one with just his back.
|
|
|
Post by Nalkarj on Jan 28, 2018 22:18:11 GMT
I’m really starting to doubt that we quite grasp the meaning of the word iconic.
|
|
|
Post by seahawksraawk00 on Jan 28, 2018 22:19:42 GMT
I’m really starting to doubt that we quite grasp the meaning of the word iconic. Well go through my list if you like, but how would you define iconic?
|
|
|
Post by Nalkarj on Jan 28, 2018 22:28:17 GMT
To be honest, seahawksraawk00, I think your list is fairer than DC-Fan’s. The OED gives us iconic, in this context, as “designating a person or thing regarded as representative of a culture or movement; important or influential in a particular (cultural) context.” While this particular scene in Wonder Woman is indeed stirring (in my opinion), can we actually say that it’s important or influential in our culture? Naturally, the term comes with a degree of subjectivity, depending on the circles in which we move (who can say for certain what the cultural consensus is?), but it may be informed by what James Q. Wilson called “public” rather than “popular” opinion—that is to say, a general feeling that comes out of talking to others, reading (in this case) opinions and reviews, etc. Note that this definition has nothing whatever to do with one’s own opinion—I don’t like The Avengers or The Dark Knight (I know, I’m a loony), but I recognize the iconicity of the former’s “circle shot” and the latter’s interrogation scene (and “why so serious?”). At the most basic level, I see references of these often. (There are films I like that are iconic, too— Superman, for example. ) I’d call WW’s scene stirring—but not iconic, not yet at least. It’s simply the wrong word used. N.B.: My comment was prompted by your list above, tresix . I agree with many of your choices, and I wasn’t trying to be snarky (though I see it could have come off that way), but are there many people who even know there was a 1990 Flash series? I certainly didn’t, and—if it’s generally little-known—that conflicts with the very definition of iconic.
|
|
|
Post by Hauntedknight87 on Jan 28, 2018 22:52:01 GMT
The "Why so Serious" scene is definitely iconic. Hell Ledger performance alone is definitely iconic.
Spider-Man 2 train scene should definitely be on the list.
Bane in The Dark Knight Rises is another iconic character and brought us the reimagining of the backbreaker comic moment. Plus as someone from Pittsburgh, watching bane wreck Heinz Field was pretty cool!
The upside down kids in Spider-Man is another iconic moment as well as the "with great power comes great responsibility".
Magneto prison break in X2 is a must have on list as well as the mansion invasion.
The statue of liberty scene in X-Men 1 and the X-MEN suiting up to save rogue. With the additional Logan flipping Cyclops off with his middle claw.
"Why do we fall Bruce?" And "It's not who I am underneath, but what I do that defines me." Scenes were definitely iconic.
Eddie Brock transformation into Venom in Spider-Man 3.
The opening in Blade 1.
X3 "I'm the Juggernaut bitch!" Scene as well as Xavier's "death"
Johnny Blaze first transformation into Ghost Rider, although it's iconic for a whole different reason.
Logan's death in Logan.
No man's land in Wonder Woman.
BATMAN WHOOPING SUPERMAN'S LITTLE BITCH BOY ASS IN BVS! SUCK IT SUPERMAN FANS! SUPERMAN FUCKING SUCKS!!!
The highway fight in Deadpool.
Tony Stark in the completed iron Man suit killing Terrorist.
Steve Rogers transformation into a Super Soldier.
The Avengers regrouping scene.
Hulk smashing Loki.
Steve Rogers vs Winter Soldier on the street.
The prison break in GotG vol 1
The party where the Avengers try lifting Thor's hammer.
The airport fight in Civil War.
Yondu funeral in GotG vol 2.
Slipknot head exploding.
Jesse Eisenberg over the top performance in BvS.
Steppenwolf destroying the Amazon warriors in Justice League.
Hela killing the Asgardian soldiers at the start of her attack on asgard.
Batman killing Joker in Batman 89.
Penguin death in returns.
Mr freeze ice puns.
Batnipples.
|
|
|
Post by sostie on Jan 28, 2018 23:11:31 GMT
Not yet mentioned Batman Returns "Meeow" Hulk's Gladiator appearance in Thor Ragnarok Ant-Man launched on Hawkeye's arrow in Civil War...probably iconic only to those that are a fan of the comic This from Dark Knight The Justice League choice by the OP is laughable. At a stretch Wonder Woman standing on the Scales Of Justice in London might one day be seen as iconic but it is so quick and inconsequential. Other than that..nothing in JL springs to mind. The only two I can think of in the whole of the DCEU is WW in no mans land and, personally, I always thought the brief scene with Superman at Day Of The Dead in BvS was very striking if not iconic.
|
|
|
Post by ShrunkenHeadonKnightBus on Jan 28, 2018 23:14:32 GMT
Not the greatest movie, but certainly memorable.
|
|
|
Post by ShrunkenHeadonKnightBus on Jan 28, 2018 23:36:03 GMT
But—as is hobowar ’s point, I think, and he can correct me if I’m wrong—that is opinion, and we cannot base iconicity, rightly or wrongly, on opinion. I, for one, thought that shot in The Avengers was just as bombastic, absurd, and silly-looking as the whole movie, but I wouldn’t deny that it was iconic. On the other hand, I greatly enjoyed Wonder Woman, but there’s not a single shot in the movie that I would call “iconic.” To be iconic, 1st it would have to be something that most of the general public remembers or is familiar with and 2nd it stands the test of time.
Well, that criteria should eliminate most scenes from Justice League, given it's lackluster box office. Scenes can be iconic even when they make little narrative sense. In the 89 Batman film, the Batwing flies over the clouds until it silhouetted against the moon. Story-wise, there's no reason for this to happen, but the resulting shot is iconic.
|
|
|
Post by Nalkarj on Jan 28, 2018 23:41:37 GMT
|
|
|
Post by James on Jan 29, 2018 0:06:46 GMT
The "Why so Serious" scene is definitely iconic. Hell Ledger performance alone is definitely iconic. Spider-Man 2 train scene should definitely be on the list. Bane in The Dark Knight Rises is another iconic character and brought us the reimagining of the backbreaker comic moment. Plus as someone from Pittsburgh, watching bane wreck Heinz Field was pretty cool! The upside down kids in Spider-Man is another iconic moment as well as the "with great power comes great responsibility". Magneto prison break in X2 is a must have on list as well as the mansion invasion. The statue of liberty scene in X-Men 1 and the X-MEN suiting up to save rogue. With the additional Logan flipping Cyclops off with his middle claw. "Why do we fall Bruce?" And "It's not who I am underneath, but what I do that defines me." Scenes were definitely iconic. Eddie Brock transformation into Venom in Spider-Man 3. The opening in Blade 1. X3 "I'm the Juggernaut bitch!" Scene as well as Xavier's "death" Johnny Blaze first transformation into Ghost Rider, although it's iconic for a whole different reason. Logan's death in Logan. No man's land in Wonder Woman. BATMAN WHOOPING SUPERMAN'S LITTLE BITCH BOY ASS IN BVS! SUCK IT SUPERMAN FANS! SUPERMAN FUCKING SUCKS!!! The highway fight in Deadpool. Tony Stark in the completed iron Man suit killing Terrorist. Steve Rogers transformation into a Super Soldier. The Avengers regrouping scene. Hulk smashing Loki. Steve Rogers vs Winter Soldier on the street. The prison break in GotG vol 1 The party where the Avengers try lifting Thor's hammer. The airport fight in Civil War. Yondu funeral in GotG vol 2. Slipknot head exploding. Jesse Eisenberg over the top performance in BvS. Steppenwolf destroying the Amazon warriors in Justice League. Hela killing the Asgardian soldiers at the start of her attack on asgard. Batman killing Joker in Batman 89. Penguin death in returns. Mr freeze ice puns. Batnipples. LOL those last two doe
|
|
|
Post by Nalkarj on Jan 29, 2018 2:53:16 GMT
... Mr freeze ice puns. Batnipples. LOL those last two doe Ah, but that’s the point. Iconic is not the same as good; it’s not even the same as stirring. It is, rather, the OED definition I referenced above, “…a person or thing regarded as representative of a culture or movement; important or influential in a particular (cultural) context.” These two, which are admittedly ridiculous, yet characterize the particularly context of the Schumacher Batman flicks—so I would accept them, albeit tenuously, as fitting the word. At the risk of paraphrasing the late, great Justice Antonin Scalia, a word means what it means, not what we wish it meant.
|
|
|
Post by scabab on Jan 29, 2018 11:32:28 GMT
I agree with Superman's first save and Spider-man's upside down kiss. The Wonder Woman No Man's Land scene might become iconic in time but it's still too early and the Trinity in Batman vs Superman I don't think will be considered iconic.
I'd say the whole interrogation scene in The Dark Knight would have to be up there. The pencil scene and at least the "Why So Serious" line is.
Others have mentioned the Avengers Circle shot, I'd agree with that, it's probably the most iconic scene in a MCU movie so far.
Perhaps the museum scene from Batman 89? And the scene where Joker see's his face in the mirror and laughs which was also parodied in Simpsons.
Superman breaking Zod's neck....that might not be iconic but just memorable. Can't think of anything else right now.
|
|
|
Post by charzhino on Jan 29, 2018 11:37:43 GMT
Batman punching Joker in '89 and him responding, you wouldnt hit a guy with glasses would ya. Ive seen that quote used and paradoied a number of times in popular culture media.
|
|
|
Post by James on Jan 29, 2018 13:33:59 GMT
Ah, but that’s the point. Iconic is not the same as good; it’s not even the same as stirring. It is, rather, the OED definition I referenced above, “…a person or thing regarded as representative of a culture or movement; important or influential in a particular (cultural) context.” These two, which are admittedly ridiculous, yet characterize the particularly context of the Schumacher Batman flicks—so I would accept them, albeit tenuously, as fitting the word. At the risk of paraphrasing the late, great Justice Antonin Scalia, a word means what it means, not what we wish it meant. I guess so. It's quite amazing how those bat nipples become so familiar with superhero fans. They weren't even that focused on. What the hell, it made the costumes look like trash.
|
|
tresix
Sophomore
@tresix
Posts: 491
Likes: 195
|
Post by tresix on Jan 31, 2018 0:18:29 GMT
From the 1976 "Wonder Woman": WW deflecting bullets fired at her from a Thompson machine gun.
|
|
|
Post by leesilm on Jan 31, 2018 5:01:15 GMT
C.Reeves's Superman as he catches Lois Lane and deals with the helicopter. I'm sorry, but when they say of the movie and Reeves's performance, "they made you believe a man can fly", it is true. C.Evans's stepping out with the Howling Commandos (inc.Bucky) and all the freed POWs when they come back into the camp, just before he turns himself in for disciplinary action. As well as his earlier scenes as pre-serum Steve with, "I could do this all day" in the back alley to "I don't like bullies" with Dr.I., and his figuring out the flag and diving on the grenade in basic training. Wonder Woman's No Man's Land scene, although I would also argue for her rising into the air during the WW vs. Ares fight at the end when she basically smites him after telling him, "It isn't about Deserve". Captain America standing across from the Winter Soldier in CAPTAIN AMERICA: THE WINTER SOLDIER, when he is bloodied and torn up, and he tosses his shield aside and says he won't fight Bucky because Bucky is his friend, through the, "Then finish it, cause I'm with ya till the end of the line." scene in the hellicarrier. Also, Steve's speech, "The price of freedom is high, and it's a price I'm willing to pay. But I'm betting I'm not alone." Superman flying backwards around the world, in order to turn back time after finding Lois dead and nearly breaking something with that scream. Michael Keaton's arrival as Batman in his first BATMAN movie, plus the "let's get nuts" scene, holding Vicky Vale while hanging in the spotlight, Joker's death, Joker's scene at the art gallery, and the end with Batman looking up at the Batsignal as the music sweeps. Logan/Wolverine and Marie/Rogue at the top of the Statue of Liberty in the first X-MEN movie, as well as his coming up out of the water almost as if in a bazerker-rage when he first got his adamantium attached to his skeleton in the sequel. Captain America vs. Iron Man, in CAPTAIN AMERICA: CIVIL WAR, when they are fighting in the bunker one on one, bus especially Steve's, "He's my friend" because that is SO Steve/Cap. The Amazons vs. the Germans in WONDER WOMAN's beach scene, and honestly from the comics I used to read of hers (as well as some of the newer ones) that is a really nice page-to-screen transition.
(I have not seen IRON MAN 2 or 3, GUARDIANS OF THE GALAXY 2, ANT-MAN, BATMAN RETURNS, or DOCTOR STRANGE, so I can't give opinions on them, but I've seen all the other BATMAN movies and Marvel movies)
|
|
|
Post by DC-Fan on Jan 31, 2018 5:10:45 GMT
From the 1976 "Wonder Woman": WW deflecting bullets fired at her from a Thompson machine gun. That was awesome!
|
|
|
Post by dazz on Jan 31, 2018 5:43:10 GMT
Emo Peter dancing in Spidey 3 for all the wrong reasons, iconic & legendary for it's cringe inducing badness.
Also just curious but reading DC-Fans post at the top of this page in what world does a film seen by less than 100m people in the cinema's on a planet of 7.6 billion equals the majority? I mean general public means the masses right?
|
|