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Post by Deleted on Feb 23, 2018 1:28:43 GMT
in BvS when Superman said it and then Lois explaining it? Why did you say that name???!!
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Post by politicidal on Feb 23, 2018 2:02:08 GMT
I'll concede it was less stupid than a jar of piss. *pause* IT'S BEEN TWO F**KING YEARS AND I STILL CAN'T BELIEVE THAT HAPPENED!!!!!!!!!!
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Post by Deleted on Feb 23, 2018 2:12:27 GMT
MARTHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA
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Post by hobowar on Feb 23, 2018 2:51:23 GMT
It's still not as bad as the Knightmare scene. My God that was dogsh!t.
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Post by politicidal on Feb 23, 2018 2:53:01 GMT
Criticism aside, which is much deserved, I can see a conversation or piece of dialogue working like this. Certainly not fucking 'MARTHA' but something that clicks in Batman's brain "oh hey we're not so different after all". Apparently an academy award winning writer like Chris Terrio wasn't up to that.
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Post by Deleted on Feb 23, 2018 6:30:04 GMT
It's still not as bad as the Knightmare scene. My God that was dogsh!t. I actually liked that scene. What was your problem with it? |
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Post by taylorfirst1 on Feb 23, 2018 17:16:43 GMT
It was a horrible idea.
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Post by brownstones on Feb 23, 2018 18:35:24 GMT
I think it could have worked if they built the film and/or fight to come to that resolution.
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Post by justanaveragejoe on Feb 23, 2018 19:39:24 GMT
A good idea gone horrbly wrong. Having Batman realize that Superman is more human than alien is a great concept. What isn't great is the execution. Having Superman shout "Save Martha," and having Batman remembering the death of his mother is just an emotional force, and it doesn't work. For two reasons; 1). Superman calling his mother by his first name. What son calls his mother by his first name? If Superman said "Find my mother," it could've been more impactful. Also, it shows that Batman would've killed him if his mother's name wasn't Martha. 2). Batman constantly shouting ""WHY DID YOU SAY THAT NAME?" Having him shout that over and over again doesn't add to the emotional weight, it just deflates what little there is. It makes the scene extremely silly.
Take Civil War for example, Tony's reaction to watching his parents' murder wasn't over the top, it felt real thanks to the direction and RDJ's acting; therefore it's more emotional, and the audience care.
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Post by moviebuffbrad on Feb 23, 2018 19:51:22 GMT
I think it would have worked as a little scene afterward (perhaps Clark's funeral) for Bruce to learn Martha Kent's name and really drive home how they weren't so different. What made it laughable was having it stop a fight to the death when Batman was otherwise "absolutely certain" Superman was ET Hitler.
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Post by Skaathar on Feb 23, 2018 20:18:26 GMT
It's so stupid I'm surprised it even made it into the script. I mean, I understand the idea behind it, but did not a single person read the script and realize how stupid that scene was?
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Post by hobowar on Feb 23, 2018 23:32:50 GMT
It's still not as bad as the Knightmare scene. My God that was dogsh!t. I actually liked that scene. What was your problem with it? Apart from some nice cinematography, it makes absolutely no sense with the film. It comes out of nowhere, goes nowhere and feels like it was only there to look good in the trailer(That's pretty much the main problem with the whole movie). I remember when everyone was bashing Thor's cave scene in AoU, but at least that scene served some kind of purpose. You could put the Knightmare scene anywhere in the movie and it wouldn't make any more or less sense. It's a perfect example of Snyder wanting a cool action scene, but not caring to come up with a story based reason for why it's happening. |
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Post by jamesbamesy on Feb 24, 2018 0:06:59 GMT
I don't think it was the idea that was bad, but the execution that ultimately ruined it.
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Post by ThatGuy on Feb 24, 2018 1:29:17 GMT
A good idea gone horrbly wrong. Having Batman realize that Superman is more human than alien is a great concept. What isn't great is the execution. Having Superman shout "Save Martha," and having Batman remembering the death of his mother is just an emotional force, and it doesn't work. For two reasons; 1). Superman calling his mother by his first name. What son calls his mother by his first name? If Superman said "Find my mother," it could've been more impactful. Also, it shows that Batman would've killed him if his mother's name wasn't Martha. 2). Batman constantly shouting ""WHY DID YOU SAY THAT NAME?" Having him shout that over and over again doesn't add to the emotional weight, it just deflates what little there is. It makes the scene extremely silly. Take Civil War for example, Tony's reaction to watching his parents' murder wasn't over the top, it felt real thanks to the direction and RDJ's acting; therefore it's more emotional, and the audience care. It could have even worked if Bruce heard him stutter "We have to save Ma-Martha!" but then realize he said "We have to save my mother!" while being choked. Then afterwards she says her name to him. Have it that we hear him say "save Ma-Martha!" the 1st time with Bruce. |
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Post by Daisy on Feb 24, 2018 22:10:24 GMT
It's still not as bad as the Knightmare scene. My God that was dogsh!t. Look at this guy helpfully take a knee so Bruce can smack him more easily.  |
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Post by Hauntedknight87 on Feb 24, 2018 22:24:14 GMT
It was a good idea on paper, but it was obviously executed poorly.
Now it's become a meme.
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Post by Larcen26 on Feb 26, 2018 22:22:11 GMT
I would have been sort of OK with the Martha if Superman had said a sentence that anyone would actually say in that situation...
Nobody would say "You're letting him kill Martha!" when the other person has no idea who Martha is.
It could have been:
"He's going to kill my mother!" - Batman, having lost his mother, will empathize and will also see Superman as someone who has real ties to this world. Then, later, Martha would introduce herself to him and he could say "That was my mother's name."
"You're letting him kill an innocent woman!" - Not as definite that Batman will stop, maybe Lois steps in and explains like she did in the original version.
Or a longer option when he sees Batman is winning:
Superman drops to his knees. "You are going to do this, and apparently I can't stop you. But after it's done, make me a promise. Lex Luthor is holding a woman hostage. She is a good and innocent woman and if you don't hurry up and kill me, he will murder her. Her name is Martha, tell her I love her and I tried."
ANYTHING but "YOU'RE LETTING HIM KILL MARTHA!"
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Post by PreachCaleb on Feb 27, 2018 16:56:01 GMT
I would have been sort of OK with the Martha if Superman had said a sentence that anyone would actually say in that situation... Nobody would say "You're letting him kill Martha!" when the other person has no idea who Martha is. It could have been: "He's going to kill my mother!" - Batman, having lost his mother, will empathize and will also see Superman as someone who has real ties to this world. Then, later, Martha would introduce herself to him and he could say "That was my mother's name." "You're letting him kill an innocent woman!" - Not as definite that Batman will stop, maybe Lois steps in and explains like she did in the original version. Or a longer option when he sees Batman is winning: Superman drops to his knees. " You are going to do this, and apparently I can't stop you. But after it's done, make me a promise. Lex Luthor is holding a woman hostage. She is a good and innocent woman and if you don't hurry up and kill me, he will murder her. Her name is Martha, tell her I love her and I tried."ANYTHING but "YOU'RE LETTING HIM KILL MARTHA!" Damn, I like that third one. And it actually sounds like something Superman would say. |
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Post by Archelaus on Feb 27, 2018 18:08:50 GMT
It was a bad idea. It felt too contrived to end a tense fight like that.
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Post by politicidal on Feb 27, 2018 18:14:52 GMT
Or a longer option when he sees Batman is winning: Superman drops to his knees. " You are going to do this, and apparently I can't stop you. But after it's done, make me a promise. Lex Luthor is holding a woman hostage. She is a good and innocent woman and if you don't hurry up and kill me, he will murder her. Her name is Martha, tell her I love her and I tried."ANYTHING but "YOU'RE LETTING HIM KILL MARTHA!" Shit we're doing this off the cuff. What's Goyer and Terrio's excuses? |
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