|
|
Post by ellynmacg on Mar 25, 2018 17:21:38 GMT
Getting older (nearing 68), I'd say a 4-6. Between the ages of 21 and 51, I'd say I was a 7, ocassionally hitting a solid 7, and sometimes an 8. Yep--that pretty well covers it for me...though I am just slightly younger than you, and I'm not sure I would ever have been described as an 8. Well, maybe on my wedding day, since (1) I was happier than usual (not to mention relieved!), and (2) I'd had professional "help" in looking "gawjuss".  Still, my husband has always treated me like a 10, and that means more to me than my own opinion. 
|
|
|
|
Post by Toasted Cheese on Mar 26, 2018 9:17:59 GMT
Do you think perhaps then, women are more concerned with feeling or being ugly than what men are? I do. I started to notice that I simply dont know any women who would genuinly accept and like the way they look. It spans across various nationalities, ages, social groups, its incredible. Even the most beautiful of my friends are still quite unhappy wit the way they look. At first I though this may be simply just my social bubble and I started really exploring outside of my regular environment. I have found exactly one woman that seems to be content or almost happy with the way she looks. (she fucking should be, she is tv-level stunning). but everyone else? not feeling so good. whereas man seem to be more accepting of their looks. Its possible they dont share their genuine thoughts with me since I am a woman, but from observation it seems to be a MUCH bigger deal with a woman to be considered average looking than for a guy. Or wait, its actually even worse: even very attractive women think of themselves as of average or worse. THATS the problem. The bar is set so high they feel like they cannot get there. And often they are viewed as much more attractive by their partners than by themselves. With their men wishing their woman liked herself more. Seems crazy. Do you think then that perhaps women feel more insecure about their whole being as females compared to men, even if they are good or even great looking? Many men can like to pamper themselves to look sharp, but they don't generally go overboard, or wholesale into all the beauty products, and of course make-up is pre-dominantly a female thing. As a general question too, If men don't need makeup— and not all women like to wear makeup either—why do many women feel they need to wear it and what is the ultimate purpose of it's use, apart from the cosmetic industry being a massive dollar making machine?
|
|
|
|
Post by marianne48 on Mar 26, 2018 19:55:25 GMT
Women are constantly brainwashed into how their looks are just WRONG, no matter what. If they're slender, they're too skinny. If they're curvy, they're too fat. If their breasts are small and firm, they don't have any; if they're large and full, they're too floppy, etc., etc. It's no longer good enough to have their hair fixed up nicely and wear makeup; now they're pressured into having different areas of their bodies shorn, bleached, waxed, weaved, whatever. Men are usually judged on their power/financial success, so looks are far less important for them, although the cosmetic/beauty industry have been trying their best in recent years to get men interested in cosmetics and spa treatments.
Am I the only woman who prefers normally balding men over the skinhead/ex-con shaved head look?
|
|
|
|
Post by deembastille on Mar 26, 2018 21:56:10 GMT
thanks marianne48... i hate fakeness. all the beach waves wigs my principal has are just laughable. not real. [ps if she actually did her job she wouldn't have time for wigs -- she'd have to work with children!]
|
|
|
|
Post by Nora on Mar 27, 2018 2:43:15 GMT
I do. I started to notice that I simply dont know any women who would genuinly accept and like the way they look. It spans across various nationalities, ages, social groups, its incredible. Even the most beautiful of my friends are still quite unhappy wit the way they look. At first I though this may be simply just my social bubble and I started really exploring outside of my regular environment. I have found exactly one woman that seems to be content or almost happy with the way she looks. (she fucking should be, she is tv-level stunning). but everyone else? not feeling so good. whereas man seem to be more accepting of their looks. Its possible they dont share their genuine thoughts with me since I am a woman, but from observation it seems to be a MUCH bigger deal with a woman to be considered average looking than for a guy. Or wait, its actually even worse: even very attractive women think of themselves as of average or worse. THATS the problem. The bar is set so high they feel like they cannot get there. And often they are viewed as much more attractive by their partners than by themselves. With their men wishing their woman liked herself more. Seems crazy. Do you think then that perhaps women feel more insecure about their whole being as females compared to men, even if they are good or even great looking? Many men can like to pamper themselves to look sharp, but they don't generally go overboard, or wholesale into all the beauty products, and of course make-up is pre-dominantly a female thing. As a general question too, If men don't need makeup— and not all women like to wear makeup either—why do many women feel they need to wear it and what is the ultimate purpose of it's use, apart from the cosmetic industry being a massive dollar making machine? yes I do think females feel more of the social pressure to attain and maintain looks. And the pressure to wear make up is so intense! like people telling you openly how much better you look with it and how much worse/more tired/bland/older you look without it. Both women and men. The truth is I kinda get it because it DOES help a lot. My before/after make up photos make a big difference. I can go from 6 to 9 just by make up (and good light and photo op  . So I understand, but its still bothersome AF. It costs a lot of money, it takes a lot of time, it doesn't feel good on your skin and you have to change your habits when you have make up on (the way you touch/not touch your face, the way you blow your nose, or sneeze or wink or cry, or smile, or eat or drink. You name it. When you are wearing make up all of this is connected and can be affected. Maybe thats a part of why I love working from home. NO MAKE UP for anyone at the office  The scariest part is what Instagram and Photoshop do for us women. Its so hard to find a natural face on line, but because the technology is so good, there are tun of pictures where you just cant tell if its make up, photoshop, filter or natural beauty (unless you are a woman or someone from the business, then you can tell pretty much most of the time) and new generations of men grow up looking at women altering themselves and accepting it as normal/genuine. What I hate the most is when someone puts #nomakeup or #nofilter on their photo but you as a woman still know and clearly see they ARE wearing some make up or have altered the photo in some way. Grrr.
|
|
|
|
Post by Nora on Mar 27, 2018 2:45:18 GMT
Women are constantly brainwashed into how their looks are just WRONG, no matter what. If they're slender, they're too skinny. If they're curvy, they're too fat. If their breasts are small and firm, they don't have any; if they're large and full, they're too floppy, etc., etc. It's no longer good enough to have their hair fixed up nicely and wear makeup; now they're pressured into having different areas of their bodies shorn, bleached, waxed, weaved, whatever. Men are usually judged on their power/financial success, so looks are far less important for them, although the cosmetic/beauty industry have been trying their best in recent years to get men interested in cosmetics and spa treatments. Am I the only woman who prefers normally balding men over the skinhead/ex-con shaved head look? agreed except the last sentence. I like the shaved skinhead/ex con look much better than natural balding.
|
|
|
|
Post by mslo79 on Mar 27, 2018 7:26:28 GMT
NoraSo to sum it up... it's kind of your overall vibe from reading the person trying to gauge them as a overall person etc. pretty much the way I see it to. Yeah, but good luck with that one. given the people around here... I would not be in a hurry to do something of that sort. Yeah, because while there is only a small percentage of people in here compared to the general public when you look at EVERYONE out there, I would have to assume most people (as in majority) are somewhere around the average range, give or take a little. plus, since you brought up the 10's and 1's thing... I would not be surprised if the 10's were a overestimation and the 1's could be a underestimation as, just in my opinion, there are not many on either end of the extreme when looking at all people. but don't get me wrong, I am sure, when looking at individual people, there will be plenty in the below average or lower range but when looking at all people I would have to assume most are around average give or take. like say if you put things into five simple categories... ugly/below average/average/above average/cream of the crop that the vast majority would be in the below average/average/above average range (with most people being average-ish). it would almost have to be otherwise the rating scale would be flawed. Yeah, but I think that's partially because of how society see's things as women are pressured to look good etc where as guys are not as much. deembastilleI would not read into those words too much. while I completely understand your point about the guy you talked about, and he does appear to be someone people are best off avoiding, I would not worry too much about the whole 'hot' 'pretty' or 'interesting' words. some people might not be all that great with words. but with that said... I could see how some people, like you did, might interpret those words the way you did because 'hot' may imply that they 'just want to get in your pants' sort of thing where as 'pretty' or 'interesting' (and the like) does not seem to imply that (or at least not as much). just for me personally... I guess when judging a random female(since I am a male), I tend to use 'overall attractiveness' (or similar wording) which is basically, like it says, someones overall attractiveness which is paramount with the person as a whole which basically factors in a wider range of things, like say face/body and that special something that makes them tick which is difficult to explain. but that extra something tends to trump other things as face and body is nice, as I am sure we all need to have some level of standards here, but even if that's great and even if the person might be considered 'decent or good looking' by most people, they might still not be nothing special if they are missing that extra something that makes them stand out which can't really be explained as it's pretty much something someone has or they don't. just some random thoughts  That person seems to be consumed by lust. I know a guy is a guy and all, but still, you got to draw the line somewhere. Yeah, speaking of that crap... I don't like when people dye their hair to some unnatural looking crap. it just looks like crap. like that super bleached blonde crap or some off-the-wall random green/blue/pink etc  like people can change their hair color etc, and that's fine, but you want to keep it within 'normal' looking hair colors that people can naturally have. go much outside of that standard, and it's crap. BATouttaheckAgreed. because I imagine that probably some general ball park thing on how it starts because I would have to assume most people would be along those lines, at least to some degree, because even if some people are nice etc once their looks drop below a certain point it becomes too difficult to overlook. like if your not at least average-ish in looks chances are not good for you especially if you ain't got some kind of special charm about you etc that draws people towards you. but I wonder if that's partially the case at times where you see some random couple out in the world who one of the two seems "out of the others league" but maybe the person who we perceive as the lower of the two has some kind of charm etc the other see's in them etc. which helps make them stand out a bit etc. but I guess the more I think about this stuff... I think as long as you got something about your personality or charm etc that stand out from most people and your looks are at least average or a bit better you might be comfortably above most people because of that vs those people who might have comfortably above average looks but are lacking that 'extra something' (say charm etc) about them which brings them down. but don't get me wrong... some people got it all basically with well above average looks and got that extra charm about them etc. but I would imagine most of us probably got one or the other, or might just be, well, pretty average-ish in both personality/looks etc. but average-ish range can still have some decent qualities here and there as average does not mean crap. just some random thoughts  @deblovesbeccy I would not entirely say that because as you see people over the years, without knowing them personally with the details etc, we all can sort of form a rough opinion of them giving what we know and then simply convert that overall judgement of them into a number. but I guess if we only strictly had a picture to judge someone on that could skew things a bit because a picture does not really get across how someone comes across etc, like you can't see their qualities as well in a picture at times vs say seeing them in person or at least a video of seeing them interact with others etc for a bit. I am sure you get the gist of what I am saying ellynmacgYeah, that's always a good way to look at things. also, I noticed, which I imagine others around here would agree with is that some couples just click together. like they just have that extra something that gives you the general impression they work better than most couples (like even amongst my cousins etc, you can tell some of them seem to click better together than others). I don't see that too often but you do see it here and there. Toasted Cheeseonly pre-dominantly? ; it's ENTIRELY a female thing. only times guys wear some makeup is pretty much when they are in front of a camera in Hollywood etc. outside of that, it would probably look pretty weird for a guy wearing makeup in my mind. hell, there is no way in hell I would be wearing makeup and it's pretty safe to say the vast majority of guys would agree with me simply because there are just some things that are basically 'female only' sort of things and that's one of them. sort of how I don't know how some guys wear the 'pink' color as that's THE color I would not wear. period. it's too affiliated with females. I am a guy and it's obvious what it's purpose is... enhances females looks basically. but it's only good when used correctly as some people, not many but some, go overboard and ends up making them look worse. NOTE: females reading this... don't worry, chances are your not one of those people  but I would imagine most females you see pretty much know what they are doing with makeup stuff because you can tell when they are doing it right in that we(us guys) don't notice it too much. like it enhances their looks etc but it's just one of those things you take for granted. but it's only when they start caking it on their face etc (which is typically not the case) is when you start noticing it, but in a bad way. marianne48It's all about shape and how they fit the body as size is not that important. I doubt I am the only guy who feels this way. but don't worry, we don't need perfection or anything as even decent is good enough  ; so if ones weight is roughly normal-ish, odds are their body can't be bad and at the end of the day your either attractive or your not in a basic sense as if someones weight (even a little over ain't the end of the world(especially if it's proportioned right  )) is around normal they basically don't have to worry. Good luck with that. it's not happening for the vast majority of us males in my mind. like some basic care (to keep yourself more presentable and the like) is as far as things are going to go for us guys. the hell with the excess crap  ; but I guess you can't blame them for trying because it's more $$$ for them if they can tap into another market, even if it's a small one.
|
|
|
|
Post by Toasted Cheese on Mar 29, 2018 11:31:11 GMT
only pre-dominantly? ; it's ENTIRELY a female thing.only times guys wear some makeup is pretty much when they are in front of a camera in Hollywood etc. outside of that, it would probably look pretty weird for a guy wearing makeup in my mind. hell, there is no way in hell I would be wearing makeup and it's pretty safe to say the vast majority of guys would agree with me simply because there are just some things that are basically 'female only' sort of things and that's one of them. sort of how I don't know how some guys wear the 'pink' color as that's THE color I would not wear. period. it's too affiliated with females. I always feel better about myself when I go out with my rouge on. 
I think you may be projecting a little, due to your own sense of style and what you like to wear color wise. It depends on the persons skin tone themselves, but I think males can look better in pink than what some females do. It can balance out the masculine, just as when a female may dress in masculine style clothing, it balances out the femininity. Pink can be considered a feeble color and can make females look even softer. It also depends on the shade, but many males can wear it well and it can quite frankly be hot looking on a dude.
|
|
|
|
Post by Toasted Cheese on Mar 29, 2018 11:38:20 GMT
Do you think then that perhaps women feel more insecure about their whole being as females compared to men, even if they are good or even great looking? Many men can like to pamper themselves to look sharp, but they don't generally go overboard, or wholesale into all the beauty products, and of course make-up is pre-dominantly a female thing. As a general question too, If men don't need makeup— and not all women like to wear makeup either—why do many women feel they need to wear it and what is the ultimate purpose of it's use, apart from the cosmetic industry being a massive dollar making machine? yes I do think females feel more of the social pressure to attain and maintain looks. And the pressure to wear make up is so intense! like people telling you openly how much better you look with it and how much worse/more tired/bland/older you look without it. Both women and men. The truth is I kinda get it because it DOES help a lot. My before/after make up photos make a big difference. I can go from 6 to 9 just by make up (and good light and photo op  . So I understand, but its still bothersome AF. It costs a lot of money, it takes a lot of time, it doesn't feel good on your skin and you have to change your habits when you have make up on (the way you touch/not touch your face, the way you blow your nose, or sneeze or wink or cry, or smile, or eat or drink. You name it. When you are wearing make up all of this is connected and can be affected. Maybe thats a part of why I love working from home. NO MAKE UP for anyone at the office  The scariest part is what Instagram and Photoshop do for us women. Its so hard to find a natural face on line, but because the technology is so good, there are tun of pictures where you just cant tell if its make up, photoshop, filter or natural beauty (unless you are a woman or someone from the business, then you can tell pretty much most of the time) and new generations of men grow up looking at women altering themselves and accepting it as normal/genuine. What I hate the most is when someone puts #nomakeup or #nofilter on their photo but you as a woman still know and clearly see they ARE wearing some make up or have altered the photo in some way. Grrr. Females wear makeup well. No harm or shame in them wearing it. It enhances their fairer looks. I would like to feel though, that women can wear it because they are also confident in themselves even without make-up on, and not use it as a device to make them feel more secure and prettier within themselves because of low self-worth. The time factor would also be consuming like you have mentioned. It is a societal pressure thing though and this appears to be deliberately conditioned onto people. It's to keep the cash registers ringing.
|
|
|
|
Post by shangel on Mar 29, 2018 13:01:45 GMT
yes I do think females feel more of the social pressure to attain and maintain looks. And the pressure to wear make up is so intense! like people telling you openly how much better you look with it and how much worse/more tired/bland/older you look without it. Both women and men. The truth is I kinda get it because it DOES help a lot. My before/after make up photos make a big difference. I can go from 6 to 9 just by make up (and good light and photo op  . So I understand, but its still bothersome AF. It costs a lot of money, it takes a lot of time, it doesn't feel good on your skin and you have to change your habits when you have make up on (the way you touch/not touch your face, the way you blow your nose, or sneeze or wink or cry, or smile, or eat or drink. You name it. When you are wearing make up all of this is connected and can be affected. Maybe thats a part of why I love working from home. NO MAKE UP for anyone at the office  The scariest part is what Instagram and Photoshop do for us women. Its so hard to find a natural face on line, but because the technology is so good, there are tun of pictures where you just cant tell if its make up, photoshop, filter or natural beauty (unless you are a woman or someone from the business, then you can tell pretty much most of the time) and new generations of men grow up looking at women altering themselves and accepting it as normal/genuine. What I hate the most is when someone puts #nomakeup or #nofilter on their photo but you as a woman still know and clearly see they ARE wearing some make up or have altered the photo in some way. Grrr. Females wear makeup well. No harm or shame in them wearing it. It enhances their fairer looks. I would like to feel though, that women can wear it because they are also confident in themselves even without make-up on, and not use it as a device to make them feel more secure and prettier within themselves because of low self-worth. The time factor would also be consuming like you have mentioned. It is a societal pressure thing though and this appears to be deliberately conditioned onto people. It's to keep the cash registers ringing. Good point. I feel that females, myself definitely included, are our own worst critics. I don't know if that is from our own low self esteem, upbringing, societal pressures, etc. I do go out sans make up but I'm never comfortable doing it. I closely monitor my diet and get a decent amount of physical activity but if I were to be honest with myself I'm still not satisfied.
|
|
|
|
Post by Toasted Cheese on Mar 29, 2018 13:50:24 GMT
Females wear makeup well. No harm or shame in them wearing it. It enhances their fairer looks. I would like to feel though, that women can wear it because they are also confident in themselves even without make-up on, and not use it as a device to make them feel more secure and prettier within themselves because of low self-worth. The time factor would also be consuming like you have mentioned. It is a societal pressure thing though and this appears to be deliberately conditioned onto people. It's to keep the cash registers ringing. Good point. I feel that females, myself definitely included, are our own worst critics. I don't know if that is from our own low self esteem, upbringing, societal pressures, etc. I do go out sans make up but I'm never comfortable doing it. I closely monitor my diet and get a decent amount of physical activity but if I were to be honest with myself I'm still not satisfied. Any of us regardless of gender can only really only go so far within each of our own means, to feel content or satisfied within ourselves, without limiting the inner qualities we possess. Masculine\Feminine has never really been equal on a physical\biological\emotional level though. It appears that what men want and feel within themselves, might not always be what women want and feel within themselves. Both genders can feel insecure, but express it in different ways. Wanting to look good, might also include wanting endorsement or approval from others. I do feel we have become an extreme narcissistic society though. It's all about looks and material gain. Praise we receive can be flattering, but I think the most important thing is to be genuine and as humble as possible, and of course if we have good taste and even some sense of style, we can also make an impression that isn't necessarily to boost our pride or ego. Overall, it's the intention behind everything we do that counts the most and perhaps not always buying or succumbing to what is projected or conditioned onto us. The facade of life is only temporary.
|
|
|
|
Post by Xcalatë on Mar 29, 2018 15:08:28 GMT
I Think i'm a 4/10 at best, although no one has ever called me ugly I do have ridiculously low self esteem.
|
|
|
|
Post by Nora on Mar 30, 2018 1:55:54 GMT
yes I do think females feel more of the social pressure to attain and maintain looks. Females wear makeup well. No harm or shame in them wearing it. It enhances their fairer looks. I would like to feel though, that women can wear it because they are also confident in themselves even without make-up on, and not use it as a device to make them feel more secure and prettier within themselves because of low self-worth. The time factor would also be consuming like you have mentioned. It is a societal pressure thing though and this appears to be deliberately conditioned onto people. It's to keep the cash registers ringing. I love going out without make up and feel good not wearing any. But you do get people that will tell you things like: "its better when you wear it" and "oh you look tired today" and "oh you are one of Those women". That piss me off and eventually often tire me into wearing it just to shut them up and not have to deal with it. On other occasions I of course wear it because I want to, and it fits the event. its just there is so much you can do with your face and body (not just make up but all the fake hair, fake eye lashes fake contact lenses, shape wear, clinch-wear, push-up underwear, high heels etc), sometimes it just feels overwhelming the amount of things you can (and thus "should"  do. I spent some time in a boxing camp a few times (like living and training there, not going in and out everyday) and I was one of only two women there amongst like a dozen men, and since all we did all day was just train, neither of us wore any make up or did our hair or anything and it was "accepted" and we would both say how amazing it felt, to experience it. I sometimes wish the whole world was like that. One big boxing camp where women can look natural and its ok 
|
|
|
|
Post by Nora on Mar 30, 2018 1:57:27 GMT
I Think i'm a 4/10 at best, although no one has ever called me ugly I do have ridiculously low self esteem. from my research and my experience most people who think they are not great looking will under-estimate their looks. Its somewhat a safe bet that you could probably add at least one point and that would be how others see it.
|
|
|
|
Post by Toasted Cheese on Mar 30, 2018 12:11:39 GMT
I love going out without make up and feel good not wearing any. But you do get people that will tell you things like: "its better when you wear it" and "oh you look tired today" and "oh you are one of Those women". That piss me off and eventually often tire me into wearing it just to shut them up and not have to deal with it. On other occasions I of course wear it because I want to, and it fits the event. its just there is so much you can do with your face and body (not just make up but all the fake hair, fake eye lashes fake contact lenses, shape wear, clinch-wear, push-up underwear, high heels etc), sometimes it just feels overwhelming the amount of things you can (and thus "should"  do. I spent some time in a boxing camp a few times (like living and training there, not going in and out everyday) and I was one of only two women there amongst like a dozen men, and since all we did all day was just train, neither of us wore any make up or did our hair or anything and it was "accepted" and we would both say how amazing it felt, to experience it.
I sometimes wish the whole world was like that. One big boxing camp where women can look natural and its ok  You would need the makeup after being at a boxing camp, to cover all your bruises and gashes and cuts from being pummeled and beaten to a pulp. 
|
|
|
|
Post by nausea on Mar 31, 2018 17:55:01 GMT
I dunnot what u thinl?
|
|