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Post by Prime etc. on May 4, 2024 6:03:43 GMT
"The Night of the Egyptian Queen" This was a pretty good episode with not much humor--it plays more like a serious spy adventure. I liked how Artie is introduced in the bar wearing his disguise (which he sure wore for a long time and it did a very good job hiding his appearance actually--he looked like Boris Karloff at times). How many times someone slips Artie a mickey--here he avoids taking it. When they are trapped in the ice room--I was waiting for Jim to go to his boot storage compartment.
Another thing I liked was the fact that they had jewels on the train that they could use for emergency trade situations--that seemed very realistic and practical since rubies and jewels would likely be a common currency in their business.
I like the colorful nature of the treasure when it pours out and the ending scene on the train with Rosie. The light beam revealing a treasure was also done in Secret of the Incas.
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vrkalak
Sophomore
@vrkalak
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Post by vrkalak on May 4, 2024 9:44:31 GMT
"The Night of the Egyptian Queen" This was a pretty good episode with not much humor--it plays more like a serious spy adventure. I liked how Artie is introduced in the bar wearing his disguise (which he sure wore for a long time and it did a very good job hiding his appearance actually--he looked like Boris Karloff at times). How many times someone slips Artie a mickey--here he avoids taking it. When they are trapped in the ice room--I was waiting for Jim to go to his boot storage compartment.
Another thing I liked was the fact that they had jewels on the train that they could use for emergency trade situations--that seemed very realistic and practical since rubies and jewels would likely be a common currency in their business.
I like the colorful nature of the treasure when it pours out and the ending scene on the train with Rosie. The light beam revealing a treasure was also done in Secret of the Incas. The bar scene fight is one of the best in the series. “Artie, you are a walking encyclopedia.”
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Post by Prime etc. on May 18, 2024 4:07:17 GMT
"The Night of Fire and Brimstone" I liked the balloon! Isn't the fact that the mine has smoke coming out of it a form of "gas" element for the quota?
I was getting disappointed that there was no disguise and then there were two, and well-utilized.
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Post by alpha128 on May 18, 2024 4:50:44 GMT
"The Night of Fire and Brimstone"I liked the balloon! Isn't the fact that the mine has smoke coming out of it a form of "gas" element for the quota? As I wrote here, "I must admit that my element definitions have always been somewhat arbitrary." But when I think of Gas! it's almost always a sudden event, like the popping of a balloon. Therefore, I don't count the smoke coming out of the mine in a steady stream. "The Night of the Double-Edged Knife" has a similar situation. In that episode, Jim eavesdrops on the bad guys while peering through a hole to a cavern below. The bad guys have a fire going and the hole acts as a natural chimney, likewise producing a steady stream of smoke. I didn't count that as "Gas!" either.
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Post by alpha128 on May 18, 2024 19:49:20 GMT
Prime etc. , having watched through "The Night of Fire and Brimstone", you're now ready to proceed with The Wild Wild West - Season 4 - Alternate Viewing Order. It should flow quite smoothly for you. The only downside to this order is you'll first hear Johnny Parker's "The Conquistador Theme", composed for The Night of the Spanish Curse (S4 E14 in air date order), near the end of The Night of the Pistoleros (S4 E19 in air date order). That's a very minor bit of messiness compared to what watching the rest of the season in air date order would do to you! I very much look forward to your reactions to the remaining Season 4 episodes in the order the production team intended.
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Post by Prime etc. on May 18, 2024 20:14:41 GMT
I had to check to make sure I was doing the right watching order--double checked before I watched Fire and Brimstone since Pistoleros is listed so far down the list.
It is going to be jarring to see Artie absent. For the last 4 years I have been dreading this. But still curious since one of them has the big-head villain I first saw in a Famous Monsters issue. Been waiting decades for that.
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Post by alpha128 on May 18, 2024 20:41:36 GMT
I had to check to make sure I was doing the right watching order--double checked before I watched Fire and Brimstone since Pistoleros is listed so far down the list. It is going to be jarring to see Artie absent. For the last 4 years I have been dreading this. But still curious since one of them has the big-head villain I first saw in a Famous Monsters issue. Been waiting decades for that. The next three in the Alternate Viewing Order are episodes that Martin shot earlier in the season. So you'll have a bit more Artie before you get to the nine episodes that feature guest stars instead of Ross Martin. And as you'll see, those episodes go out of their way to tell the audience that Artie is gone but not forgotten. But that wasn't enough for the network, as noted in The Night of the 800 Pound Gorilla.
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vrkalak
Sophomore
@vrkalak
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Post by vrkalak on May 18, 2024 20:46:03 GMT
I had to check to make sure I was doing the right watching order--double checked before I watched Fire and Brimstone since Pistoleros is listed so far down the list. It is going to be jarring to see Artie absent. For the last 4 years I have been dreading this. But still curious since one of them has the big-head villain I first saw in a Famous Monsters issue. Been waiting decades for that. “Big-head villain” 😂. When we were kids we called him “big-headed Raven.”
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Post by Prime etc. on May 18, 2024 20:59:37 GMT
The next three in the Alternate Viewing Order are episodes that Martin shot earlier in the season. So you'll have a bit more Artie before you get to the nine episodes that feature guest stars instead of Ross Martin. That's good to know. I was thinking about cheating so that when the alternates start-I will watch one and then jump ahead to one of the very last episodes so I can say--"well he's back." And do it that each time, but I don't want to spoil the sequential viewing of it.
I don't understand how Vincent Price wasn't on the show. Seems like it would have been perfect for him unless his Batman appearances made it kind of problematic? How many actors who were Batman villains appeared in the WWW?
BTW I thought the tearful soldier stuff in the Fire and Brimstone episode was well-done--the most poignant use of the disguise element in the show.
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Post by alpha128 on May 18, 2024 22:58:25 GMT
The next three in the Alternate Viewing Order are episodes that Martin shot earlier in the season. So you'll have a bit more Artie before you get to the nine episodes that feature guest stars instead of Ross Martin. That's good to know. I was thinking about cheating so that when the alternates start-I will watch one and then jump ahead to one of the very last episodes so I can say--"well he's back." And do it that each time, but I don't want to spoil the sequential viewing of it. I don't understand how Vincent Price wasn't on the show. Seems like it would have been perfect for him unless his Batman appearances made it kind of problematic? How many actors who were Batman villains appeared in the WWW?
IMO, the whole point of the exercise is the sequential viewing. To see if the network was right to avoid a prolonged absence by Ross Martin, or if the production team's strategy of guest agents, along with regular correspondence from Artie, would have worked. If you cheat as you describe, we'll never know. And it's not like the quality plummets when Martin is not there. Jeremy Pike episodes "TNO Miguelito's Revenge" and "TNOT Janus" are among my favorites of the season. Furthermore, Artie episode "TNOT Cossacks" is one of the worst episodes of the entire series, according to both me and vrkalak. I think you should give the Alternate Viewing Order a try. If you find yourself experiencing severe Artie withdrawal, you could always put your other shows on hold and power through the Artie-less episodes and get them over with. You may find, as I did, that these nine episodes are a triumph in the face of adversity. As for your other question, according to the IMDb, Victor Buono appeared in ten Batman episodes as King Tut. He also appeared in three TWWW episodes - in the pilot as Wing Fat, and in two Season 2 episodes as Count Manzeppi. I'm not aware of any other Batman villain actors who also appeared on TWWW.
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Post by Prime etc. on May 18, 2024 23:34:51 GMT
Yeah I remembered Buono after I thought of the question.
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vrkalak
Sophomore
@vrkalak
Posts: 547
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Post by vrkalak on May 19, 2024 0:20:25 GMT
That's good to know. I was thinking about cheating so that when the alternates start-I will watch one and then jump ahead to one of the very last episodes so I can say--"well he's back." And do it that each time, but I don't want to spoil the sequential viewing of it. I don't understand how Vincent Price wasn't on the show. Seems like it would have been perfect for him unless his Batman appearances made it kind of problematic? How many actors who were Batman villains appeared in the WWW?
IMO, the whole point of the exercise is the sequential viewing. To see if the network was right to avoid a prolonged absence by Ross Martin, or if the production team's strategy of guest agents, along with regular correspondence from Artie, would have worked. If you cheat as you describe, we'll never know. And it's not like the quality plummets when Martin is not there. Jeremy Pike episodes "TNO Miguelito's Revenge" and "TNOT Janus" are among my favorites of the season. Furthermore, Artie episode "TNOT Cossacks" is one of the worst episodes of the entire series, according to both me and vrkalak. I think you should give the Alternate Viewing Order a try. If you find yourself experiencing severe Artie withdrawal, you could always put your other shows on hold and power through the Artie-less episodes and get them over with. You may find, as I did, that these nine episodes are a triumph in the face of adversity. As for your other question, according to the IMDb, Victor Buono appeared in ten Batman episodes as King Tut. He also appeared in three TWWW episodes - in the pilot as Wing Fat, and in two Season 2 episodes as Count Manzeppi. I'm not aware of any other Batman villain actors who also appeared on TWWW. There were actually several: Burgess Meredith, John Astin, Malachi Throne, Buono as mentioned, and Ida Lupino.
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Post by Prime etc. on May 19, 2024 4:19:57 GMT
There were actually several: Burgess Meredith, John Astin, Malachi Throne, Buono as mentioned, and Ida Lupino. How could I forget? Mind fuzz.
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Post by alpha128 on May 19, 2024 5:03:52 GMT
There were actually several: Burgess Meredith, John Astin, Malachi Throne, Buono as mentioned, and Ida Lupino. How could I forget? Mind fuzz.
Interestingly, John Astin and Malachi Throne were in the same episode, The Night of the Tartar.
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Post by Prime etc. on Jun 1, 2024 4:07:11 GMT
"The Night of the Pistoleros"- Speaking of the tag (starting at 48:30), I noticed that Ross Martin looked different. Sue Kesler's book confirms that this scene was shot after Ross Martin's return to the series, following his heart attack.
I am confused--how would the episode have footage done after his return? Wouldn't the new footage be starting with the Diva episode?
Oh I guess they decided to add that after his return since they aired Pistoleros so late--did they redo the ending and remove something originally shot?
I thought the episode was alright although the makeup on Artie seemed a bit greyish when he is the general. Also, I knew that Murray wasn't trustworthy because he was with the fake Marilyn in Munsters Go Home.
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Post by alpha128 on Jun 1, 2024 4:46:12 GMT
"The Night of the Pistoleros"- Speaking of the tag (starting at 48:30), I noticed that Ross Martin looked different. Sue Kesler's book confirms that this scene was shot after Ross Martin's return to the series, following his heart attack.
I am confused--how would the episode have footage done after his return? Wouldn't the new footage be starting with the Diva episode? Oh I guess they decided to add that after his return since they aired Pistoleros so late--did they redo the ending and remove something originally shot?
According to Sue Kesler's book: "The Night of the Pistoleros" was the third episode in the Season 4 production run. I don't know if they failed to shoot the tag before Martin left, or if they decided to reshoot it after he came back. Either way, most the footage was from very early in the season. You are correct that The Night of the Diva was the first episode shot after Martin returned to the series.
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Post by Prime etc. on Jun 1, 2024 16:55:41 GMT
So they were shooting season 4 in May? I would have assumed they started a season around summer. That's interesting.
It was good that Jim didn't act emo about the shooting. Someone might say he should be more upset about his partner being shot--but he's a secret service agent in the 19th century. High risk of mortality. Would have looked strange if he was hand wringing too much about it.
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Post by alpha128 on Jun 1, 2024 17:24:28 GMT
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Post by Prime etc. on Jun 1, 2024 19:59:18 GMT
aha that explains the hair. Because Robert Conrad's hair changes--it gets flatter on top but there are a few episodes where it is more pronounced and it looks like older style.
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Post by Prime etc. on Jun 9, 2024 19:00:31 GMT
Since I am only 2 episodes away from the replacement episodes--I started to think about them--Charles Aidman I wasn't familiar with until I connected him to a Hec Ramsey he was in. I guess he could be Ross Martin's depressed brother. I am wondering how they decided on who to get to replace him.
I was also wondering--when the show was created--did they have anyone else in mind besides Conrad and Martin?
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