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Post by Deleted on Aug 21, 2018 15:31:40 GMT
Ok..................And we should care why ?
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Post by JudgeJuryDredd on Aug 21, 2018 15:37:50 GMT
I basically agree with him, but their solution was a cop out that made it worse - Fragglerock created a mess in terms of storytelling, characters and theme continuity. The best defense is that Marvel perfectly knew that they could at best create a poor man's LotR or Stargate and thus gave their audience what they really want: CGI clobber action, pubescent jokes and licensed pop music a la Guardians. But that's not how you create masterworks, these require risk taking. They wanted to try something new and different and Ragnarok was the best received Thor film, it also honored Jack Kirby better than any prior Marvel film as well.
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Post by Tristan's Journal on Aug 21, 2018 16:01:52 GMT
I basically agree with him, but their solution was a cop out that made it worse - Fragglerock created a mess in terms of storytelling, characters and theme continuity. The best defense is that Marvel perfectly knew that they could at best create a poor man's LotR or Stargate and thus gave their audience what they really want: CGI clobber action, pubescent jokes and licensed pop music a la Guardians. But that's not how you create masterworks, these require risk taking. They wanted to try something new and different and Ragnarok was the best received Thor film, it also honored Jack Kirby better than any prior Marvel film as well. - New and different? As in the Guardians formula which just had proven to be the the raccoon shit with the kids?
- Honored Jack Kirby better? As in objectively desecrated the Norse mysthology and it's own narrative continuity in tone and character.
- Best received Thor film? As in so what, the first two were not that good, the challenge would have been to build a finale based on the set ups, themes and character developments of 1 and 2 and to improve upon them....
....like, say, LOGAN created a hailed trilogy finale, but still in line what came before. What if the Foxes had said: frack the previous films they suuuuuuk, let's do a super-colorful Wolfie3: "Adamantium Apocalypse Clobber Clawfest" movie in which Logan becomes a quipping disco-comedian and Stryker becomes his bumbling sidekick pal and they boogie and woogie it all the way to funky Justin Beaver tracks. T.R.A.S.H
Thor Ragnarök would have been fine outside the trilogy as a spin-off adventure (if renamed "Thor Clobbers the Universe", or similar) paying homage to cult-trash films like Flash Gordon, Masters of the Universe, StarGate etc. But as a trilogy finale: epic fail.
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kanekikun
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Post by kanekikun on Aug 21, 2018 16:05:54 GMT
They wanted to try something new and different and Ragnarok was the best received Thor film, it also honored Jack Kirby better than any prior Marvel film as well. - New and different? As in the Guardians formula which just had proven to be the the raccoon shit with the kids?
- Honored Jack Kirby better? As in objectively desecrated the Norse mysthology and it's own narrative continuity in tone and character.
- Best received Thor film? As in so what, the first two were not that good, the challenge would have been to build a finale based on the set ups, themes and character developments of 1 and 2 and to improve upon them....
....like, say, LOGAN created a hailed trilogy finale, but still in line what came before. What if the Foxes had said: frack the previous films they suuuuuuk, let's do a super-colorful Wolfie3: "Adamantium Apocalypse Clobber Clawfest" movie in which Logan becomes a quipping disco-comedian and Stryker becomes his bumbling sidekick pal and they boogie and woogie it all the way to funky Justin Beaver tracks. T.R.A.S.H
Thor Ragnarök would have been fine outside the trilogy as a spin-off adventure (if renamed "Thor Clobbers the Universe", or similar) paying homage to cult-trash films like Flash Gordon, Masters of the Universe, StarGate etc. But as a trilogy finale: epic fail.
yea new and different. great homage to kirby and the wacky stuff thor did in the 70s. it wasnt like guardians.
marvel thor was never in line with norse myths to start. better to honor kirby.
they did build up on before. everything from before was in this movie.
logan wouldve been cooler if it did something like send him to battleworld instead of the clint eastwood silly stuff.
the mcu movies dont do boring things like ignore how a share univeese works and affects each film.
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Post by Tristan's Journal on Aug 21, 2018 16:19:43 GMT
- New and different? As in the Guardians formula which just had proven to be the the raccoon shit with the kids?
- Honored Jack Kirby better? As in objectively desecrated the Norse mysthology and it's own narrative continuity in tone and character.
- Best received Thor film? As in so what, the first two were not that good, the challenge would have been to build a finale based on the set ups, themes and character developments of 1 and 2 and to improve upon them....
....like, say, LOGAN created a hailed trilogy finale, but still in line what came before. What if the Foxes had said: frack the previous films they suuuuuuk, let's do a super-colorful Wolfie3: "Adamantium Apocalypse Clobber Clawfest" movie in which Logan becomes a quipping disco-comedian and Stryker becomes his bumbling sidekick pal and they boogie and woogie it all the way to funky Justin Beaver tracks. T.R.A.S.H
Thor Ragnarök would have been fine outside the trilogy as a spin-off adventure (if renamed "Thor Clobbers the Universe", or similar) paying homage to cult-trash films like Flash Gordon, Masters of the Universe, StarGate etc. But as a trilogy finale: epic fail.
yea new and different. great homage to kirby and the wacky stuff thor did in the 70s. it wasnt like guardians.
logan wouldve been cooler if it did something like send him to battleworld instead of the clint eastwood silly stuff.
the mcu movies dont do boring things like ignore how a share univeese works and affects each film.
yeah it was all like Guardians sans the depravity.
MCU should have honored Kirby from the first film on if it's so important to them. It remains badly planned and conceived, like Cap 3 was basically Avengers 3: Civil War featuring Iron Man's unexpected mommy issues and Spiderboy & Panthers origins but without Hydra or an emotionally satisfying finale to Cap 1 & 2.
Seriously, Wolverine: Battleworld?
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Post by No Morpho, Only Bánh mì on Aug 21, 2018 16:23:29 GMT
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kanekikun
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Post by kanekikun on Aug 21, 2018 16:26:11 GMT
yea new and different. great homage to kirby and the wacky stuff thor did in the 70s. it wasnt like guardians.
logan wouldve been cooler if it did something like send him to battleworld instead of the clint eastwood silly stuff.
the mcu movies dont do boring things like ignore how a share univeese works and affects each film.
yeah it was all like Guardians sans the depravity.
MCU should have honored Kirby from the first film on if it's so important to them. It remains badly planned and conceived, like Cap 3 was basically Avengers 3: Civil War featuring Iron Man's unexpected mommy issues and Spiderboy & Panthers origins but without Hydra or an emotionally satisfying finale to Cap 1 & 2.
Seriously, Wolverine: Battleworld?
being on a planet with color doesnt make it guardians.
they have been, now they cranked it up.
nah, they just dont think that the movie series should just be about one thing and ignore other characters and not try new plotlines. they try outside the box. cap shouldnt be only about fighting hydra or pretending other characters dont exist and other stories arent happening. and if you can think of a story to bring innew characters then why not?
just like how xmen shouldnt be just the same stuff about mutant fear over and over. we should get stuff like them fighting aliens or sorcerers.
yea logan in space. something cool.
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Post by Tristan's Journal on Aug 21, 2018 16:33:53 GMT
yeah it was all like Guardians sans the depravity.
MCU should have honored Kirby from the first film on if it's so important to them. It remains badly planned and conceived, like Cap 3 was basically Avengers 3: Civil War featuring Iron Man's unexpected mommy issues and Spiderboy & Panthers origins but without Hydra or an emotionally satisfying finale to Cap 1 & 2.
Seriously, Wolverine: Battleworld?
being on a planet with color doesnt make it guardians.
they have been, now they cranked it up.
nah, they just dont think that the movie series should just be about one thing and ignore other characters and not try new plotlines. they try outside the box. cap shouldnt be only about fighting hydra or pretending other characters dont exist and other stories arent happening. and if you can think of a story to bring innew characters then why not?
just like how xmen shouldnt be just the same stuff about mutant fear over and over. we should get stuff like them fighting aliens or sorcerers.
yea logan in space. something cool.
if MCU are ashamed of coherent storytelling they should better do comic books.
The Disney X-Men will be terrible trash. RIP Logan & Co. Excerpt from the leaked Feige script:
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kanekikun
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Post by kanekikun on Aug 21, 2018 16:35:44 GMT
being on a planet with color doesnt make it guardians.
they have been, now they cranked it up.
nah, they just dont think that the movie series should just be about one thing and ignore other characters and not try new plotlines. they try outside the box. cap shouldnt be only about fighting hydra or pretending other characters dont exist and other stories arent happening. and if you can think of a story to bring innew characters then why not?
just like how xmen shouldnt be just the same stuff about mutant fear over and over. we should get stuff like them fighting aliens or sorcerers.
yea logan in space. something cool.
if MCU are ashamed of coherent storytelling they should better do comic books.
The Disney X-Men will be terrible trash. RIP Logan & Co. Excerpt from the leaked Feige script:
telling the same story and never expanding isnt coherant its just lazy. like fox xmen.
disney xmen will have them be good at their mission and make the world better for mutants. at fox they suck at it and never do anything to change things.
your ignoring all the silly dialog from fox. magneot is all about his dead mom too.
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Post by JudgeJuryDredd on Aug 21, 2018 16:41:59 GMT
They wanted to try something new and different and Ragnarok was the best received Thor film, it also honored Jack Kirby better than any prior Marvel film as well. - New and different? As in the Guardians formula which just had proven to be the the raccoon shit with the kids?
- Honored Jack Kirby better? As in objectively desecrated the Norse mysthology and it's own narrative continuity in tone and character.
- Best received Thor film? As in so what, the first two were not that good, the challenge would have been to build a finale based on the set ups, themes and character developments of 1 and 2 and to improve upon them....
....like, say, LOGAN created a hailed trilogy finale, but still in line what came before. What if the Foxes had said: frack the previous films they suuuuuuk, let's do a super-colorful Wolfie3: "Adamantium Apocalypse Clobber Clawfest" movie in which Logan becomes a quipping disco-comedian and Stryker becomes his bumbling sidekick pal and they boogie and woogie it all the way to funky Justin Beaver tracks. T.R.A.S.H
Thor Ragnarök would have been fine outside the trilogy as a spin-off adventure (if renamed "Thor Clobbers the Universe", or similar) paying homage to cult-trash films like Flash Gordon, Masters of the Universe, StarGate etc. But as a trilogy finale: epic fail.
-Yes, new and different. Rather than tread on similar grounds as the other ones they went out-there cosmic taking influence from Big Trouble In Little China and other 80's cult favorites. - The comic books are only loosely inspired by the actual Norse mythology, they were never meant to be the literal translations. Jack Kirby's artwork for the issues of Thor that he worked on were fantastic, dynamic, and influential so yes the more respect given the better - and truly a feast for the eyes. - Everything built upon in the other films was present in Ragnarok and it developed the characters, themes, and set ups. It actually ties better in with the other films the titular character has appeared in more than Wolverine, where all entries were pretty much stand alone with one that had to be erased from continuity altogether( Origins). - Wolverine is actually a pretty flexible character, so what your proposing could actually work, haha. - Not an opinion shared by most.
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Post by JudgeJuryDredd on Aug 21, 2018 16:48:27 GMT
yea new and different. great homage to kirby and the wacky stuff thor did in the 70s. it wasnt like guardians.
logan wouldve been cooler if it did something like send him to battleworld instead of the clint eastwood silly stuff.
the mcu movies dont do boring things like ignore how a share univeese works and affects each film.
yeah it was all like Guardians sans the depravity.
MCU should have honored Kirby from the first film on if it's so important to them. It remains badly planned and conceived, like Cap 3 was basically Avengers 3: Civil War featuring Iron Man's unexpected mommy issues and Spiderboy & Panthers origins but without Hydra or an emotionally satisfying finale to Cap 1 & 2.
Seriously, Wolverine: Battleworld?
Cinematically, sure, but if you're familiar at all with the comic books beyond one or two titles it goes deeper than what you might perceive on face value. They did honor Kirby in the first film, they've honored him plenty of times prior in the MCU but Ragnarok was the most Kirby ever put on screen. The MCU has never had a film which was so poorly received that they had to erase it from continuity outright, which is the case of X-Men Origins, the first Wolverine movie. Only Deadpool has mentioned it and its done for comedic purposes. Compared to X-Men Origins the worst MCU film is Citizen Kane as far as superhero movies go. More than a handful actually would welcome the idea of Wolverine stranded on an alien world clawing his way against alien life forms in an arena. Just saying.
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Post by JudgeJuryDredd on Aug 21, 2018 16:54:42 GMT
being on a planet with color doesnt make it guardians.
they have been, now they cranked it up.
nah, they just dont think that the movie series should just be about one thing and ignore other characters and not try new plotlines. they try outside the box. cap shouldnt be only about fighting hydra or pretending other characters dont exist and other stories arent happening. and if you can think of a story to bring innew characters then why not?
just like how xmen shouldnt be just the same stuff about mutant fear over and over. we should get stuff like them fighting aliens or sorcerers.
yea logan in space. something cool.
if MCU are ashamed of coherent storytelling they should better do comic books.
The Disney X-Men will be terrible trash. RIP Logan & Co. Excerpt from the leaked Feige script:
The MCU is much better put together than whatever is the X-Men continuity and have had more hits than misses too, trying to debate that its the other way around is laughable actually. You've admitted before that you don't read comics, so your idea of what the X-Men really comes from the movies - which if you ask any serious die hard fan of the IP barely scratches the surface of what they're all about. In other words, the first MCU X-Men could be the most comic accurate ever and you'd still call it a fraud.
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mog1138
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Post by mog1138 on Aug 21, 2018 17:21:32 GMT
being on a planet with color doesnt make it guardians.
they have been, now they cranked it up.
nah, they just dont think that the movie series should just be about one thing and ignore other characters and not try new plotlines. they try outside the box. cap shouldnt be only about fighting hydra or pretending other characters dont exist and other stories arent happening. and if you can think of a story to bring innew characters then why not?
just like how xmen shouldnt be just the same stuff about mutant fear over and over. we should get stuff like them fighting aliens or sorcerers.
yea logan in space. something cool.
if MCU are ashamed of coherent storytelling they should better do comic books.
The Disney X-Men will be terrible trash. RIP Logan & Co. Excerpt from the leaked Feige script:
Doesn't sound all that different from X1 to me. I just hope we get stuff that hasn't been done in an X-Men movie before than the tired Human vs Mutant dilemma (but whenever you bring that up the typical fanboy excuse is "But MAH MACHURE THEMEZ!"). I've said Excalibur, but also the Brood, Mojo World, Starjammers with some Shiar action. Awww yeah!
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Post by Hauntedknight87 on Aug 21, 2018 17:33:12 GMT
"Clint Eastwood silly stuff"
Go. Fuck. Yourself.
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Post by Rey Kahuka on Aug 21, 2018 17:35:08 GMT
They wanted to try something new and different and Ragnarok was the best received Thor film, it also honored Jack Kirby better than any prior Marvel film as well. - New and different? As in the Guardians formula which just had proven to be the the raccoon shit with the kids?
- Honored Jack Kirby better? As in objectively desecrated the Norse mysthology and it's own narrative continuity in tone and character.
- Best received Thor film? As in so what, the first two were not that good, the challenge would have been to build a finale based on the set ups, themes and character developments of 1 and 2 and to improve upon them....
....like, say, LOGAN created a hailed trilogy finale, but still in line what came before. What if the Foxes had said: frack the previous films they suuuuuuk, let's do a super-colorful Wolfie3: "Adamantium Apocalypse Clobber Clawfest" movie in which Logan becomes a quipping disco-comedian and Stryker becomes his bumbling sidekick pal and they boogie and woogie it all the way to funky Justin Beaver tracks. T.R.A.S.H
Thor Ragnarök would have been fine outside the trilogy as a spin-off adventure (if renamed "Thor Clobbers the Universe", or similar) paying homage to cult-trash films like Flash Gordon, Masters of the Universe, StarGate etc. But as a trilogy finale: epic fail.
Hey, I liked Stargate!
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Post by seahawksraawk00 on Aug 21, 2018 17:35:44 GMT
being on a planet with color doesnt make it guardians.
they have been, now they cranked it up.
nah, they just dont think that the movie series should just be about one thing and ignore other characters and not try new plotlines. they try outside the box. cap shouldnt be only about fighting hydra or pretending other characters dont exist and other stories arent happening. and if you can think of a story to bring innew characters then why not?
just like how xmen shouldnt be just the same stuff about mutant fear over and over. we should get stuff like them fighting aliens or sorcerers.
yea logan in space. something cool.
if MCU are ashamed of coherent storytelling they should better do comic books.
The Disney X-Men will be terrible trash. RIP Logan & Co. Excerpt from the leaked Feige script:
Dude, you really need to get past the turd/childish jokes. Not sure why you're equating it to the entire MCU when it's Guardians and Gunn who does it. Watch Infinity War and none of that kind of humor is present in it with the Guardians.
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Post by scabab on Aug 21, 2018 17:57:53 GMT
kanekikun You know "dumbing" yourself down by using poor grammar, like not using a capital letter at the start of a sentence...doesn't make you look like you aren't Formersamhmd lol.
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Post by DC-Fan on Aug 21, 2018 18:03:07 GMT
kanekikun You know "dumbing" yourself down by using poor grammar, like not using a capital letter at the start of a sentence...doesn't make you look like you aren't Formersamhmd lol. LOL!!! Funniest post on this board in a long time!
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Aug 22, 2018 3:00:55 GMT
kanekikun You know "dumbing" yourself down by using poor grammar, like not using a capital letter at the start of a sentence...doesn't make you look like you aren't Formersamhmd lol. Lmao He also jams words together in weird ways like "infinityw ars" thinking its a good disguise, while basically staying pretty faithful to the usual Former Sam schtick! It's the online equivalent of wearing a fake mustache.
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Post by Deleted on Aug 22, 2018 3:02:11 GMT
"Clint Eastwood silly stuff" Go. Fuck. Yourself. I had to laugh when I read that line! Clint Eastwood silly stuff? WTF does that even mean?!
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