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Post by hi224 on Oct 26, 2018 19:08:11 GMT
I am not.
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Post by Karl Aksel on Nov 4, 2018 0:59:39 GMT
Nothing post PS3. And my PS3 is mainly used for streaming and blu-rays. When I feel like console-gaming, it's my trusty old PS2 that I turn to. Now, that was a console.
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Post by mslo79 on Nov 6, 2018 8:44:09 GMT
I basically stopped with consoles after the XBox360 era. this comes from someone who was pretty much in the old days of video games as I am 39 years old (born late 1979) so I basically go back to the late 1980's/early 1990's which was before the 3D era came which was pretty much 1995-1997 time frame which I can remember well as I was in my teens at that time. NOTE: the Diamond Monster 3D video card for the PC, which was a 3DFX Voodoo 4MB chipset, was basically the first great graphics chip for the PC as I remember seeing Quake in OpenGL mode(basically uses the graphics card instead of software mode which does not) for the first time as that was one of the few times I was WOWED by graphics as that was clearly ahead of the consoles at the time which N64 was pretty much the best the consoles had. there's been maybe a handful of times I was WOWED by graphics. I clearly remember DooM 3 on the PC doing it in Nov 2002 when the alpha demo leaked online as it was well ahead of other games visually at the time but by the time DooM3 was officially released in late-2004 or so, while it's graphics were still high end, other games closed the gap noticeably and lost most of it's WOW effect by that point as it was not way ahead of other games then. I have owned a good portion of consoles in the past at some point or another except those super expensive ones that only rich people could afford like Neo Geo/3DO etc. but those were never mainstream as the system cost and more limited game selection kept them out of the mainstream. but just to list what I had at some point or another from memory... -Atari 2600 Jr (the oldest system I remember using a little in late 1980's to maybe around 1990-ish.) -NES (I had this for a small time frame. I want to say about 1991-1993. I did not have this for long as I want to say maybe a year or two.) -Original Gameboy (this was pretty much my most used system in the early 1990's) -Sega Gamegear -Sega Nomad (it's a portable Sega Genesis) -Sega Genesis -SNES -Sega Saturn -Sega Dreamcast (I still had this but recently gave it to my sister as maybe her kids will use it down the road etc. also, this is the only system that I ever seen that would read burned games straight up from CD-R with no modifications needed) -N64 -PS1 (I was mainly into the N64 in these days so I never got a PS1 if I recall correctly til a while after it was out (probably years later) but the N64 I got ASAP as I remember those were hard to get earlier on.) -PS2 -Nintendo Gamecube (basically I traded this to my cousin for his XBox as his XBox had a faulty DVD-ROM drive but it was worth the trade because the Gamecube, while it was perfectly okay, collected dust but once I moded the XBox in 2004(which was not long after the trade) it was FAR superior and worth the trade as I could run games off of it's hard drive instead of the disc like is normally required. the Gamecube was one system I regretted buying.) -XBox (this system was great due to it's moding abilities to play games from hard drive and use emulators and play video files with XBMC etc. basically if you count pretty much from the modern era, say 2000-2001 to date, this is the system I got the most all around use out of over the years due to it's capabilities after moding it as you had soft mods(mods the system without physically modifying anything)/TSOP(flashes the chip on the motherboard so it can load the 'good stuff' from DVD disc etc. basically you got to solder a small point on the motherboard which gives you write access to the chip and then flash the fancy firmware to it so you can do all of the good stuff)/Mod chip.) -XBox360 (basically you can burn games on DVD+R DL discs and play them from there once you flash the DVD-ROM drives firmware with a modified one) -Gameboy Advance SP (I only fire this up occasionally strictly for playing my original gameboy Tetris cartridge. this I got at a much later date not around the time it was new, or thereabouts, like pretty much everything else listed) the XBox/XBox360 were pretty much the best for me due to moding abilities  NOTE: Genesis/SNES... I am not totally sure on these as I think I went with the Sega Nomad first but I remember not having that for long and got my money back due to the screen scratched a little too easily and it was a battery hog at which point I think I swapped that for either a Sega Genesis or SNES system etc. but with that said... I generally prefer the PC over consoles because shooters are generally what I play and a mouse+keyboard is simply easier to track stuff on screen since it takes noticeably less time to get your crosshairs on target where as with a analog stick I just straight up suck (I am confident I am below average on any random shooter game on a console due to analog stick handicapping me) and basically can't really enjoy shooters on consoles. also, the last time I played shooters on consoles and liked it was prior to the modern era which was GoldenEye on N64 as by the time the more modern standards came along, say PS2/XBox in 2000/2001, I was too used to playing shooters with a mouse+keyboard and I simply could not adjust to a analog stick. a mouse is just far more natural feeling like I can just play without feeling handicapped. p.s. I got a hold of a Nintendo Wii but only recently as it's mainly for the nephew etc as it was only $17 but does not have the main Wii controller so we will have to get one. but once I do, I am going to mod it so I can play burned games on DVD etc. I just never looked into Wii moding because I never really cared about the system back in the day when it was new-ish as it's more of a 'kiddie system' as they say as the more serious gamers pretty much stuck to Playstation/XBox. but the Wii seemed to be geared mainly towards another type of person.
EDIT: Well we got a hold of a used Wii remote for $20 and I got the Wii moded as both of the Wii's we got recently for very little $ work fine although one has a noisy DVD drive but it's a non-issue now because I run the games from USB stick and external 2.5" hard drive which are powered from the Wii's USB port. it works great once I eventually figured out how to get things up and running. so basically for $50-ish tops we got two Wii systems etc. also, the one with the Noisy DVD has the option to install HackMii as boot2 which offers great brick protection and is almost impossible to brick it (as in permanently kill the system). the other system does not have that option, but it's good enough. I also put Priiloader on both as it's nice to have since with that you can have it directly boot into 'USBLoaderGX' once you know what to do which saves time having to wait for basic Wii menu to load, then select The Homebrew channel then USBLoaderGX. if you need to sync Wii remote(like if you got a Wii remote that's not synced to the system), which seems to only work on the actual Wii menu, you can basically power on the system and immediately hold the reset which takes you to the Priiloader menu (assuming you installed this which is needed to get USBLoaderGX to boot as soon as you power on system) and then press reset again and it will reboot the Wii menu. also, you pretty much need your USB thumb drive and/or USB hard drive in FAT32 file system which Windows 10 only allows formatting to NTFS/exFAT. so what I did was use my old laptop which has Linux Mint v19 on it and used it's 'gparted' program as that allows me to format whatever format I want (there is probably some ways in Windows do do it but it was just easier for me to use Linux). also, FAT32 only allows a single file to be basically 4GB so any Wii games larger than that you have to split up which I use another program for but in general not many games exceed the 4GB barrier anyways so it's not much of a issue. also, if one wants to... with USBLoaderGX you can rip your Wii games from their original disc to the hard drive so you don't need to have the disc in the Wii console when playing the games anymore. I tested it out on one game our Wii came with which was 'New Super Mario Bros Wii'. but after running initial exploit to get the basic moding done, which sets up The homebrew channel, when I tried loading some games with USBLoaderGX it just goes to a blackscreen and eventually goes back to Wii menu (i.e. games don't work). but to fix that I used 'd2x cIOS' to load a couple of wad files etc which fixed that problem and then it works great with USBLoaderGX etc at this point.
but anyways to mod the Wii... all you basically need is a SD memory card the Wii can read and that's pretty much it (many random SD cards should work but some do not as I have some SD cards the Wii won't read and some that it will but it's easy to test right on your main Wii menu on SD card logo as if that section works, it will work. if not, it basically won't work on that particular SD card). well, you generally would want a USB thumb drive or USB hard drive to plug into the USB port (the bottom port) for best benefits though. but you can run games, if your SD card is large enough, directly from the SD card to but for that I use WiiFlow v4.2.1 but I prefer USBLoaderGX in general but that only works loading stuff from USB port basically. also, all of this stuff works on the newest Wii dashboard which is v4.3 as it's the last one Nintendo released I think back in 2010. so before doing anything make sure your Wii software is v4.3. if not update the console first.
EDIT #2: I switched to WiiFlow v4.2.1 as it's more stable than USB Loader GX (when playing games etc) as I set the Wii up to boot directly to that when turning on the console. if I need to sync a Wii remote I simply power on and then instantly hold the reset button which will loads up the Priiloader menu and then just wait about 15-20 seconds and press reset and it will load into the official Wii menu and then you can sync your remote etc. because apparently you can't sync Wii remote outside of the official Wii menu. but once your remotes are synced you can just power off the console and then power it on and it will boot into the WiiFlow program without any issues.
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Post by MooseNugget on Nov 7, 2018 1:06:35 GMT
I recently got myself a Sega Genesis.
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Post by laughingsnowman on Nov 13, 2018 14:21:47 GMT
Besides a modded original Xbox with thousands of retro games on it and a PS2 I have nothing else. Sold my 360 and PS3 and haven't got the new consoles. I may pick up a N64 soon though.
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Post by Deleted on Nov 15, 2018 14:35:08 GMT
I haven't bought a console since the PS2 came out.
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Post by Roberto on Nov 17, 2018 4:35:33 GMT
I hadn't bothered for years, and was happy just playing games on the PC. But with Red Dead Redemption II being exclusive to consoles, I had to cave and buy one in order to play it.
Everyone should. It's a masterpiece.
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Post by mslo79 on Nov 17, 2018 12:38:35 GMT
It's [RDR2] a masterpiece.
When it comes to video games if there is one game I would classify as a masterpiece (a word I rarely use on movies etc) it's definitely... Mafia (2002) (on PC) as I first replayed that back when it was new and then here and there over the years since. in fact, I replayed it back in august as it took me 3-4 days to finish it as I finished the last level on it's 16th anniversary. it's still my #1 single player video game experience to date as the overall feeling etc it gives me tends to only happen with higher quality movies and it's more challenging than most shooters to and I like it's realistic ammo reloading to which adds a bit more challenge and forces you to use a bit more strategic reloads of weapons.
I plan on replaying Mafia II (2010) (on PC) soon-ish as while this is not as good as the first game it still pretty much my #2 in behind Mafia (2002) in overall experience. because most games you play and finish but they don't stick with you, but Mafia series does. also, Mafia III (2016) (on PC), while not as good as the first two Mafia games, is still solid and I think is underrated where as the GTA series is quite overrated as I never understood that series high level of popularity (it's $ sales are sky high) as when playing through the single player, which is what these games are all about in my mind, Mafia just has a much better lasting impact on me (just a better all around experience) where as GTA games are decent enough to finish but then you have no real desire to replay them. I would probably have more interest in replaying the Red Dead series IF it was on the PC as consoles pretty much ruin the experience from a gameplay point of view because aiming with a analog stick is just too difficult vs a mouse which is far easier/more natural.
but with that said... I like the Red Dead series over the GTA series for sure but not as much as the Mafia series.
but since you have played RDR2... how does it compare to the previous one? ; better? about the same?
either way, I likely won't be playing RDR2 anytime soon because for what a console and that game costs, it's just a bit too much $ for one game (probably something like at least $200-300+), and not only that, but I dislike shooters on consoles as a general rule (not the game itself just the analog stick which simply takes too long to target something on screen vs a mouse which is much easier for me) even though I did finish the previous games but largely because, at least in the previous game, it has that lock on feature which makes shooting your targets a lot easier as you simply lock onto the target and then you can fine tune where it hits with the analog stick. so while that helps enough to finish the game, it does tend to take a bit of the fun out of it because your not doing all of the aiming like you do in your typical shooter as that's why I like the PC since I would not be handicapped and would get the full experience that way.
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Post by mslo79 on Nov 20, 2018 23:44:47 GMT
I may pick up a N64 soon though.
I been playing Super Mario 64 and Wave Race 64 a little bit on the Wii through a emulator as those two games work well but, looking around online, while it does work well for the two games I played, it don't appear to work perfectly across all N64 games even though it does work well on a decent portion of em etc.
p.s. I used to have a N64 back when it was new but I sold it to someone I worked with back around 2000-2001.
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Post by cwsims on Nov 21, 2018 0:25:53 GMT
all I have is a PS3
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Post by James on Nov 22, 2018 2:16:46 GMT
I’ll wait until PS4 is obscure.
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Post by Deleted on Nov 22, 2018 4:54:48 GMT
I've always been a console gamer. Never got into playing games on the PC outside of playing The Sims for a very short period of time. The only console's that I haven't owned at one point would be the PS3, the WiiU, Any of the Sega ones.
I'm sure I'll be buying the next Xbox and PS system whenever they get made.
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Post by MCDemuth on Nov 22, 2018 20:51:25 GMT
Go full 1970s retro, and buy one of these:
For $249.00 each... LOL!
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Post by Roberto on Nov 23, 2018 7:25:05 GMT
It's [RDR2] a masterpiece.
but since you have played RDR2... how does it compare to the previous one? ; better? about the same?
It's very likely the greatest game ever made. As great as the first RDR was, 2 improves on it in pretty much every possible way. It's worth buying a console for (I did), that's how good it is. RDR2 is not really a shooter. It is so much more than that. To give it a genre would be a disservice to the game. It has lock on just like the first game yeah, which works for the king of game it is, which again I definitely would not consider a shooter. Think of it more as a playable movie, which it basically is. FPS games are better with a keyboard and mouse though. I would not buy an FPS game on a console. TBH you shouldn't be needing to read any of this, you should just go and play it. It's a masterpiece. |
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Post by Marv on Nov 24, 2018 17:42:54 GMT
I’ve always been a console gamer. It’s what I know. At this point too I have too many friends that are console gamers to bother with anything else.
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Post by mslo79 on Nov 25, 2018 15:50:34 GMT
Roberto Maybe ill play it eventually but that will likely be years from now. If it's similar to how the first game plays, which I am assuming it is, it's definitely a shooter type of game. 3rd person shooter basically. but I see your point about the 'playable movie' thing as that's pretty much how I view Mafia series, especially the first two games. I doubt it would top those two games for me personally (as that feeling they give me, especially the first game is only something high quality movies achieve basically) but if I put those two aside it 'might' have a shot at #3 as I think Red Dead Redemption is one of the better games out there in general (I just wish it was on the PC as it would have been a bit better). I have no doubts about RDR2 being one of the better, if not best, games out there though if the first game is anything to go by etc. but being the Red Dead series is by Rockstar it will have a big budget as just taking a quick look online I found... "Media analysts estimated the development budget for the game [Red Dead Redemption] was between US$80 million and US$100 million, making Red Dead Redemption one of the most expensive video games ever made" ; that's like solid movie level budget. but in a way it's pretty cheap considering those games are roughly $50-60 each when new and when you got plenty of people playing it and when it makes the $$$ it made, they easily made a big profit. hell, here is another thing I noticed about RDR2... So while that's impressive, the movie actually would be ahead in terms of total people I am sure because the video game is like $60 each game where as a movie ticket I suspect is probably no more than around $10-ish tops. so that would roughly mean that if the $ figures were about the same that there is something in ball park of 6 times the volume of people seeing the movie vs playing the video game. NOTE: for the record... I am sure I would like RDR2 more than pretty much any super hero movie and especially that one as I am more of a DC as more of those are re-watchable than Marvel. still, anything making hundreds of million of dollars is going to command attention.
NOTE: Red Dead Redemption 2 has already sold more copies in it's first two weeks than Red Dead Redemption did in it's lifetime as RDR did about 15million copies (as of Feb 2017) and RDR2 did about 17 million copies in only two weeks.
p.s. a good article on Red Dead Redemption 2 as it talks about $ and sorta compares it to movies etc... www.nytimes.com/2018/11/23/opinion/sunday/red-dead-redemption-2-fallout-76-video-games.html ; a nice screen capture of the game on that article. but that's one thing I think a high production budget can do is give you more story and have the game last longer because you will have more to do etc. hell, here is some monster $$$... - Oct 14th 2018 article (i.e. www.vulture.com/2018/10/the-making-of-rockstar-games-red-dead-redemption-2.html ) but like I always say... while GTA5 is good it does not leave a lasting impact on me like Mafia/Mafia II etc do. like big budget does not always translate into memorable experience. I wonder what the public see's in those games as just playing them straight up in single player til your finished simply is not as a enjoyable of a experience as Mafia series is for me. all of the messing around that some people seem to do (like running around randomly blowing crap up) I would get tired of that fast.
p.s. for the record... I liked GTA5 more than Avatar.
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Post by Roberto on Nov 29, 2018 8:57:40 GMT
Roberto Maybe ill play it eventually but that will likely be years from now. That is a shame. Nah, it's not really accurate with this game. There's less focus on the shooting in this game and more on the overall experience/atmosphere/world. How can it be a shooter if you spend far more time not shooting? You likely spend more time horse riding, but I wouldn't call it a horse riding game either. It's just a game about a story that involves shooting and horses. Also there is the option to play in either 1st or 3rd person. So it can't really be considered either of those either. The first 2 MAFIA's were great. Haven't played III yet. RDR2 easily beats II. And most likely the first as well (purely story wise I'm talking, obviously it beats it in all technical aspects), although I don't think I ever completed it as I was super young at the time and may not have known how to play the game properly. I remember really enjoying the free roam though. I definitely should revisit the game. The rest I will answer in one go, as splitting it up into quotes is far too much hard work. I'm surprised RDR2 has a much smaller budget than GTA V. It's longer, has much better graphics, the cast is bigger. Surely those figures can't be right. GTA V was a great game, except the story and protagonists left a lot to be desired. Both things are probably the weakest in the GTA series (obviously not counting the weird ones like 1, 2 and London, or ones I haven't played like Chinatown Wars and GTA Advance) The 3 characters weren't particularly great or anything new. Michael was kind of interesting I suppose, but we've seen that before in other movies and shows. Franklin was cool but he was pretty much just a standard generic protagonist that we have already seen before. And Trevor was just garbage. He did have a great voice actor though. From a technical standpoint the game was amazing though. And GTA Online is great apart from the twelvies shooting you on sight for no reason. Which brings me to your point about people who play these games just to go around blowing stuff up and killing civilians. I don't understand how people can enjoy that. It's kind of disgusting and gets boring very quickly. I mean I can understand kids doing it back in the old more cartoony games like the GTA III era games. But to do it in modern games is just gross, especially with how realistic they have become. That's one of the great things about RDR2 as well. It rewards you for playing honorably and punishes you for going around killing people for no reason, something I hope the RDR Online will incorporate as well. |
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Post by mslo79 on Nov 29, 2018 11:23:01 GMT
Roberto Yeah. because I am sure ill like the game it's just a question of how much ill like it. but I just can't justify $300+ for basically one game since I would have to get the XBox One system and the game. 'maybe' $100-150 "IF" the game is pretty great. that's why I might eventually get around to it years from now when XBox One systems are much cheaper unless of course they release it on the PC which would be optimal because if it's system requirements are similar to GTA5 I should be good and it's going to easily give me the best experience to because ill have maximum enjoyment because when shooting stuff I won't be handicapped like I am on a console. Yeah, but the core game is a guy walking the environment and when stuff happens your basically in 3rd person shooter type of mode. hence, it's basically a 3rd person shooter even though it's not a shooter in the sense of say something like Call of Duty which is non-stop shooting basically. so basically outside of the exploring the environment and the like... it's basically a 3rd person shooter at it's core since the general action is that way. hence, why I claim 3rd person shooter type of game even though, like you said, it's got plenty of exploring to. also, that 1st person thing is tacked-on as it's primary camera is the 3rd person view point, so I consider that more of the official view. I am sure most would agree with me on this given the series past etc. or look at it this way... the game feels at it's best in that 3rd person viewpoint, correct? from what I can tell... it seems the general word is that many dis the 3rd Mafia game but I think it's underrated even though not as good as the first two overall. basically I would rate/rank the Mafia series like this... 1)Mafia (2002) - 10/10 (my measuring stick for single player game experience. a masterpiece (a word I rarely use)) 2)Mafia II (2010) - 9/10 (while it did not quite capture the magic of the first game, it's still probably the 2nd best single player experience I have had on a game) 3)Mafia III (2016) - 8/10 (still it easily tops the vast majority of games I have played as at the end of the day this is a game ill replay from time-to-time as the years pass) I hope your right but I don't think it would happen especially since RDR2 is on a console which will detract from it a bit as it will make it that much harder to enjoy playing the game. so even if the characters/story etc are great (which I am assuming they will top the GTA series at the very least given the previous game did) the lack of mouse+keyboard will be a issue and taint the overall experience for me. p.s. I replayed Mafia back in August on it's 16th anniversary as I first played that back when it new and here and there over the years since. so while graphics etc will obviously favor RDR2 I would be very surprised if the overall experience topped Mafia for me as I consider that my #1 video game experience to date and I have been playing games since I was a kid basically in the late 1980's/early 1990's (I was born late 1979) and that one stands out above the rest which is why if there is only one game I would classify as a masterpiece, it's Mafia (2002) (on PC). but being your playing Mafia (2002) (on PC) today and not back in 2002 I suspect it might not have the same impact it did back then(as graphics wise it was solid back when it was new etc) but, personally, I still consider it a strong overall game to this day given my replay of it in Aug as it only took me 3-4 days to finish it and it finishes strong as the ending gives me a feeling that only high quality movies can pull off. basically the characters/voice acting are still strong (some of the voice actors are from The Sopranos (1999-2007) TV show) and just the setting etc makes it all really click. side note: since you played Mafia II but not really the first game. there is one nostalgia moment in Mafia II that was one of the best parts of the first game. but since you never finished Mafia, then when you see that mission in Mafia II, it will seem like just another mission basically. also, Mafia III ties into Mafia II a bit to with some characters etc as Vito(the main character in Mafia II) assists you in Mafia III etc. p.s. but I guess if I had to rate the Mafia games I would likely say... Mafia (2002) = 10/10, Mafia II (2010) = 9/10, Mafia III (2016) = 8/10. as for Red Dead Redemption (2010)... I would probably go with 7/10, maybe a 8/10 tops. GTA5 on the other hand... it's one of those games that enjoyable enough to play through once but I have no real desire to replay it which makes that one a bit more forgettable. who knows, maybe ill bring out my old moded XBox360 and fire up Red Dead Redemption again which would be my 2nd play through of it just to see how it holds up on another play through. but currently I been messing around with the Nintendo Wii as I know that system is basically old now but I recently got a hold of one for next to nothing and moded it (which is easy to do once I figured some stuff out over the last couple of weeks or so. basically if you got a SD memory card the Wii can read you can mod it) so I can run games off of a USB hard drive as I am playing Scarface (released in 2006) on it currently. I got about 130GB worth of games (currently got a 160GB 2.5" hard drive connected to it) Yeah, that's basically my point is the characters etc just don't have the impact the ones in Mafia series do as, while they are not bad by any means, they don't stand out like Mafia's do. sure, you can tell it's budget is high but without the strong characters etc it mostly goes to waste. just looking at the two main black guys in Mafia III vs GTA5, Mafia III's is just more interesting if you ask me and I like the general visual style of Mafia series over GTA series as GTA feels a bit more cartoon/arcade like which ain't helping it (driving around in Mafia series is more fun as the cars just have a more complex driving style to them. or to put it another way they are closer to sim where as GTA series is closer to arcade and I like sim driving in general more than simple arcade style). plus, I like the general feel of the shooting more in the Mafia series etc. plus, one area I like to praise Mafia (2002) is that it's more challenging then most shooter games as it's the only one of the Mafia series that uses a bit more realistic approach to ammo in the sense say you got a Tommy Gun and fire off one shot and reload, in most games it will simply deduct one bullet from your reserves and refil your ammo back to the 50 round drum. but in Mafia (2002) if you do that you will lose 49 shots which forces you to be a bit more strategic in weapon reloading otherwise you could potentially be out of ammo quickly. also, ill say Mafia (2002) starts off pretty slow early on but picks up pace not too far into it. SIDE NOTE: I can give you a free copy of Mafia (2002) (on PC) if you want it (just PM me ) as I have the version that was back-in-the-day not the more recent one that stripped out the music that was in it etc. plus, I added widescreen/unlimited draw distance mod to mine which makes it display properly on 1080p etc resolutions for modern computers and the unlimited draw distance helps boost visuals (well not directly textures but since it will draw more stuff in the distance it makes it look that much better than without it) to since modern computers can easily handle it's graphics when everything is maxed out(you can manually adjust the stuff in it's options). basically it's only about 1.45GB compressed in .7z format as once extracted it's 2GB or so. basically if your on Windows 10 like I am you will likely need to do this for Mafia to work... "Go to Programs and Features -> Turn Windows Features on or off -> checkbox Legacy Components -> check DirectPlay". p.s. but I do like how you can choose three different endings in GTA5 but I prefer the one where you stick together vs crossing the others which is the first one I choose. but Mafia III has different endings to. Yeah, but at the end of the day it's just not all that fun as, at least in my mind, these types of games are meant for single player experience as if that part fails, the game fails. because for some shooting types of games multiplayer is solid etc but for Mafia/RDR/GTA etc are all about single player experience. That's good to hear.
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