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Post by Rodney Farber on May 29, 2019 15:28:30 GMT
Jay Lucas, director of Isaac Backus Project
I've heard this by several people over the past two years: Not only are theists telling atheists what they should believe, they are telling atheists what they actually believe. How do they know?
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Post by CoolJGS☺ on May 29, 2019 15:31:52 GMT
Jay Lucas, director of Isaac Backus Project I've heard this by several people over the past two years: Not only are theists telling atheists what they should believe, they are telling atheists what they actually believe. How do they know? Both sides do that. It’s a nothingburger and the correct way to view things is to not to assume anything about someone else unless they give you reason to.
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Post by amyghost on May 29, 2019 15:32:51 GMT
Jay Lucas, director of Isaac Backus Project I've heard this by several people over the past two years: Not only are theists telling atheists what they should believe, they are telling atheists what they actually believe. How do they know? Because they're self-righteous nutters who think god is informing them on these matters, and at least in the case of this particular nutter, they're obviously tinfoil-hat level conspiracy theorists as well.
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Post by FilmFlaneur on May 29, 2019 15:51:35 GMT
Jay Lucas, director of Isaac Backus Project I've heard this by several people over the past two years: Not only are theists telling atheists what they should believe, they are telling atheists what they actually believe. How do they know? The words by Jay Lucas simply play out old philosophical speculation and disputes from down the years over whether 'speculative' atheists (as opposed to 'intuitive' ones) can really exist.
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Post by Deleted on May 29, 2019 17:46:09 GMT
Jay Lucas, director of Isaac Backus Project I've heard this by several people over the past two years: Not only are theists telling atheists what they should believe, they are telling atheists what they actually believe. How do they know? It solves a terrible problem they would otherwise have. Many believers believe that people who don't believe in the christian god go to hell. However, it's difficult to justify punishing a person for not believing something. It's especially difficult to justify punishing a person for not believing something when not believing it is an eminently sensible thing to do. christians with this belief are in a position where they have to accept that a person can reject their religion on completely reasonable grounds, and then have god punish them for that. They can see that this is terribly unfair. But if they accept that their god is acting unfairly, they can't claim omni-benevolence. The solution is to shortcut the entire argument and claim that it's impossible to reasonably reject their god. So they say that the existence of god is so obvious, so certain, that literally every single person in the world definitely does believe it. And therefore anybody who says otherwise must be lying. It's the only thing that gets them out of the pickle; god isn't being unfair in sending atheists to hell, because atheists are a bunch of liars and meanies who reject him on purpose. Having arrived at the need to believe this, they seek justification from the big book of contradictions. Sometimes they go with Psalms 14:1, "The fool has said in his heart, 'There is no God'". But that's problematic because if atheists lack belief because they are stupid, it's a genuine failing and so it's still unfair to punish them for it. So 'fool' gets translated as 'deliberate rebel' a lot. Or you can go with Romans Chapter 1, "For since the creation of the world His invisible attributes are clearly seen, being understood by the things that are made, even His eternal power and Godhead, so that they are without excuse, because, although they knew God, they did not glorify Him as God, nor were thankful." Or you can go to Psalm 19, "The heavens declare the glory of God; the skies proclaim the work of his hands. Day after day they pour forth speech; night after night they display knowledge." Of course atheists know that this is a load of old bollocks; I know my mind, I know what I do and do not believe. But the important point here is that none of this is intended to convince non-believers of anything; that's not the purpose of apologetics at all. Apologetics are intended only to convince those who already believe that they are right to do so. It's not an argument, it's an excuse.
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Post by rizdek on May 30, 2019 9:18:03 GMT
Jay Lucas, director of Isaac Backus Project I've heard this by several people over the past two years: Not only are theists telling atheists what they should believe, they are telling atheists what they actually believe. How do they know? How do they know? It says so right in the Bible. Isn't that proof enough?
Later on in his discourse, Mark Spence (NOT Mike Pence) says,
Is he actually suggesting there are atheists going door to door trying to convince theists there is no god? Is he implying these "fools" are smarter than this hypothetical theist he is advising here?
But he did give some comforting stats which I wasn't aware of...
Although, I seriously doubt 1 our of 4 Americans adhere to the "flying spaghetti monster"...unless he talking about Trump.
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Post by thefleetsin on May 31, 2019 4:35:13 GMT
believers are brainwashed into believing that their spirit father figure is the one true spirit father figure and everyone had better listen or else.
god is nothing more than an encyclopedia of centuries-old recycled excuses for a twisted form of self-infatuation that only a religion could possibly attempt to get away with.
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Post by theauxphou on May 31, 2019 19:41:39 GMT
Jay Lucas, director of Isaac Backus Project I've heard this by several people over the past two years: Not only are theists telling atheists what they should believe, they are telling atheists what they actually believe. How do they know? This Jay Lucas, if he said that and he believes it, clearly needs help. Or a new brain.
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Post by Vegas on May 31, 2019 23:01:06 GMT
Jay Lucas, director of Isaac Backus Project I've heard this by several people over the past two years: Not only are theists telling atheists what they should believe, they are telling atheists what they actually believe. How do they know?
There is an irony here...
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