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Post by moviemouth on Aug 28, 2019 21:30:51 GMT
Solo, unless you are talking cannon. Seriously, Solo can kiss my ass. It probably is too. Then again so are the prequels. There’s a lot more black sheeps in this franchise than usual. Anyway, I was referring to ALL Star Wars movies. Keep in mind I don’t think “black sheep” means that it’s the worst of the series, just different from the others in a storytelling or stylistic manner. Still Solo. It felt more like a post apocalyptic western than a Star Wars movie.
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Post by James on Aug 28, 2019 21:34:47 GMT
It probably is too. Then again so are the prequels. There’s a lot more black sheeps in this franchise than usual. Anyway, I was referring to ALL Star Wars movies. Keep in mind I don’t think “black sheep” means that it’s the worst of the series, just different from the others in a storytelling or stylistic manner. Still Solo. It felt more like a post apocalyptic western than a Star Wars movie. Okay, fair point.
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Post by moviebuffbrad on Aug 29, 2019 0:29:55 GMT
Disney's mistake was admitting it. I think because auteur theory was kinda in a while ago, but now Kevin Feige has made the "overlord who plans everything and filmmakers are just puppets" stuff cool, so Disney saying "yeah, we didn't force Johnson to follow all of JJ's ideas and let him make the movie he wanted to make" was kind of a whoopsie daisy. Despite all the after-the-fact postering, Lucas clearly didn't have the OT planned out. Vader wasn't always Luke's father, Leia sure as hell wasn't Luke's sister, Han was some fish creature and likely not going to be Leia's love interest (him being in the sequels at all was always up in the air with Ford), Guinness said it was his idea to kill off Obi-Wan in the first film, The Emperor went from regular politition to Sith to Sith With Different Actor And Design. Etc. Even the PT, despite 20 years to develop them, was made up as it went along. That's why there's 200 inconsistencies between what they say happened in the OT and what does happen in the PT. You can see in any of the BTS features Lucas struggling to write the scripts. My point is not to say "see, those movies are bad too", but to say "I don't give a shit, and I don't get why anyone else gives a shit." Nolan's Batman trilogy was made up as it went along. The Toy Story trilogy was made up as it went along. It's probably better to tell long form storytelling that way, to let it evolve naturally instead of having a forced conclusion you have to meet. Ie Game of Thrones. Yes, but the Toy Story movies and Nolan's Batman trilogy were play it by ear. It felt like they had a trilogy planned right from the get go with the new Star Wars movies. I never noticed that the stuff about the OT. I just assumed he had the whole Darth Vader is Luke's father thing panned before hand. It felt that way to me, but I guess I just didn't notice. If it was so obvious that he wasn't suppose to be Luke's father is the original, than why did everyone love it so much when it happened. Do they just ignore obvious things that conflict with that in A New Hope? From what I gather, they didn't. Empire was reportedly more divisive when it came out, and a lot of fans (and even James Earl Jones himself) thought Vader was lying to Luke until Yoda confirmed it in Jedi. That one's only really apparent when you look into it,l; the Leia is twist is the one I'd call obvious, mainly since it doesn't make any sense.
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Post by Prime etc. on Aug 29, 2019 1:03:29 GMT
Does it feel to anyone else that the the new trilogy is just not thought through at all? With the OT and even the prequels it felt like Lucas had an idea of where he was going to take everything from the start of both trilogies. There was a lot of hype in the 80s about how Lucas had a Tolkien-like plan for Star Wars--you can see him on Siskel and Ebert in 1990 discussing the future films- but he was always more of an experimental filmmaker with a lot of technical interests more so than a storyteller-especially adventure fantasy. Both Star Wars and Indiana Jones are deconstructing the hero story. The first Star Wars was mostly a remake of Flash Gordon and Prince Valiant (a Fox film). Lucas did not know what he was going to do with a sequel-which is why they had Splinter of the Mind's Eye as a potential sequel.
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Post by CoolJGS☺ on Aug 29, 2019 1:33:04 GMT
The first one wasn;t either which is why there are decades of questions regarding timelines and storylines.
The prequel were thought out to the point they were horrible. They should have been messier and Obi Wan should have been the focus.
Bottom line is I am enjoying the heck out of the latest ones and would probably say they are better than the first 3 so far if not for nostalgia's overwhelming grip.
The prequels are and always will be hot garbage and I will never miss them. They were the worst part of the latest teaser.
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Post by Deleted on Aug 29, 2019 1:42:55 GMT
Perhaps it is, and that’s only because of the shifting of directors/writers going back and forth with each entry. I think TLJ can be considered the black sheep of the trilogy, if not the whole series. Marvel has had a bunch of writers and directors, but the movies still hang together and make sense. And there's more than twenty of them. The difference is the guy in charge at Marvel is willing to tell his directors what they have to do to make their movies fit together, and if they don't like it they're replaced. The one in charge of Star Wars wants to let directors do their own thing... then not... then let them again... then not...
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Post by James on Aug 29, 2019 1:47:06 GMT
Perhaps it is, and that’s only because of the shifting of directors/writers going back and forth with each entry. I think TLJ can be considered the black sheep of the trilogy, if not the whole series. Marvel has had a bunch of writers and directors, but the movies still hang together and make sense. And there's more than twenty of them. The difference is the guy in charge at Marvel is willing to tell his directors what they have to do to make their movies fit together, and if they don't like it they're replaced. The one in charge of Star Wars wants to let directors do their own thing... then not... then let them again... then not... You gotta admit, it’s pretty amazing how consistent Marvel has kept their movies in quality all with different writers, directors and whatnot. And yes, I do think it’s the better franchise of the two.
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Post by moviemouth on Aug 29, 2019 2:48:25 GMT
Yes, but the Toy Story movies and Nolan's Batman trilogy were play it by ear. It felt like they had a trilogy planned right from the get go with the new Star Wars movies. I never noticed that the stuff about the OT. I just assumed he had the whole Darth Vader is Luke's father thing panned before hand. It felt that way to me, but I guess I just didn't notice. If it was so obvious that he wasn't suppose to be Luke's father is the original, than why did everyone love it so much when it happened. Do they just ignore obvious things that conflict with that in A New Hope? From what I gather, they didn't. Empire was reportedly more divisive when it came out, and a lot of fans (and even James Earl Jones himself) thought Vader was lying to Luke until Yoda confirmed it in Jedi. That one's only really apparent when you look into it,l; the Leia is twist is the one I'd call obvious, mainly since it doesn't make any sense. Interesting.
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Post by clusium on Aug 29, 2019 23:35:01 GMT
Does it feel to anyone else that the the new trilogy is just not thought through at all? With the OT and even the prequels it felt like Lucas had an idea of where he was going to take everything from the start of both trilogies. A little bit, but, I am definitely enjoying it more than the prequel trilogy.
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