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Post by Stammerhead on Oct 12, 2019 22:36:23 GMT
Mind you, did we take control of the British Isles following a war that that started after Italy objected to us illegally importing drugs into their country? You'll have to explain that one. The Opium Wars en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Opium_Wars
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Post by Schwarzwald Magnus on Oct 12, 2019 23:50:16 GMT
No it isn't. It hasn't been ruled by China in over 100 years. I'd say it's the land of the people who live there. Let them decide their future and I guarantee the majority don't want to be part of China. Using your logic England would belong to Italy. I hope they win but freedom is given to those who hit the hardest.
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Post by Schwarzwald Magnus on Oct 13, 2019 3:27:00 GMT
Meh, Britain also brought them Western technology and the concept that a rice paddy farmer was the equal of the nobility. I'd say it was a fair trade off. In Beijing they drive cars now - some poor oaf isn't pulling a rickshaw. Do you have any idea how fucked up China was in the 1800s because of European powers? Look up Taiping Rebellion, the Second Opium Wars, all the raids and massacres, the Boxer Rebellion, Japan fucking up China's shit decades before Nanking, how the Treaty of Versailles left them high and dry with more deadly protests 100 years ago.
And this is all before Manchuria and Mao.
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Post by Stammerhead on Oct 13, 2019 12:32:28 GMT
Drugs are just a hollow scapegoat, just like today. The War On Drugs is futile. There has to be something that can be seen as a diversion, when other agendas are at stake. Homosexuality was only illicit, so it could be used as blackmail purposes. But it must be annoying when a foreign power illegally smuggles drugs into your country and then fights a war with you before taking land away as punishment for you starting a war with them.
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Post by Stammerhead on Oct 13, 2019 12:36:05 GMT
Meh, Britain also brought them Western technology and the concept that a rice paddy farmer was the equal of the nobility. I'd say it was a fair trade off. In Beijing they drive cars now - some poor oaf isn't pulling a rickshaw.
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Post by Stammerhead on Oct 13, 2019 12:38:42 GMT
But it must be annoying when a foreign power illegally smuggles drugs into your country and then fights a war with you before taking land away as punishment for you starting a war with them. What was the issue with the drugs though being smuggled in the first place? It was an excuse to start a war over something that was made out to be an issue, when there were more grubby hands in the establishments honey pot tainting it for their own profits and greed and dominance. I like how you and GameBoy are painting one side with a completely negative brush. Why not ask why we smuggled drugs into another country in the first place?
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Post by Stammerhead on Oct 13, 2019 13:15:54 GMT
I like how you and GameBoy are painting one side with a completely negative brush. Why not ask why we smuggled drugs into another country in the first place? That exactly is what I am asking? It wasn’t about the drugs, it was about the land. What land?
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Post by Stammerhead on Oct 13, 2019 17:52:55 GMT
Europeans invented the bicycle as well. At lease that poor oaf isn't running barefoot like the Chinese did it for centuries before we enlightened them. Why are you insulting the man?
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Post by Stammerhead on Oct 13, 2019 20:53:25 GMT
Please stop being obtuse Stammy. It was actually about trade. When the wars started land wasn't the issue as far as I can tell but I was hoping you would be able to inform me. You say the wars were about land so what land was it about?
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Post by Stammerhead on Oct 13, 2019 21:40:23 GMT
It was actually about trade. When the wars started land wasn't the issue as far as I can tell but I was hoping you would be able to inform me. You say the wars were about land so what land was it about? You made the claim that they took the land away as punishment. The Brits wanted a grasp in China, just as they did in India. What the frick do you think it is really all about? That was the underlying agenda. It was the conquering spirit and dominance of the twit poms. They did do some good and that is the point being made and brought British ingenuity along with their need to take what wasn't rightfully theirs, but that is colonialism for you. So they illegally imported opium to start a war and thus get land.
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Post by Stammerhead on Oct 13, 2019 21:50:09 GMT
So they illegally imported opium to start a war and thus get land. What was it about the opium that was so important? Why did they illegally import it? It made a lot of money. The Wiki article explains it but if you want you can rewrite it to present a more accurate account of that time and place.
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Post by Stammerhead on Oct 13, 2019 22:28:54 GMT
It made a lot of money. The Wiki article explains it but if you want you can rewrite it to present a more accurate account of that time and place. Of course it made a lot of money, that is why the establishment like drugs to be illicit, so they can control what they can to make more.
The opium was also used as a ruse to gain control of as much land as they could. Why do you think they ended up with HK Island? They could operate from there. They bullied their way onto Indian and Chinese lands, but the point is, their presence wasn't entirely detrimental.
So it was about trade and not land even though you said it was about land. Of course we bullied our way into other countries but you are retrofitting history here.
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Post by Stammerhead on Oct 13, 2019 22:35:55 GMT
So it was about trade and not land even though you said it was about land. Of course we bullied our way into other countries but you are retrofitting history here. Don't believe everything you read Stammy. If you don't think it wasn't about colonialism first and foremost, then you have your head in the sand. Keep on retrofitting if what you read doesn’t quite match what you think.
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Post by Stammerhead on Oct 14, 2019 9:10:16 GMT
Why are you insulting the man? I'm not insulting him. It's like calling him a "poor bastard". But he's a bit of an oaf if he has to cart tourists around all day. Manual work and probably done to get some much needed money at the time. There are some “oafs” who serve people food all day.
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Post by Stammerhead on Oct 14, 2019 9:12:50 GMT
Keep on retrofitting if what you read doesn’t quite match what you think. Stam, you even stated that land was taken as punishment for starting a war with them. This was spurred on by the illegal Opium trade that the Brits paid no heed to Chinese law. They wanted the war, because they wanted to lay dibs on the land. Sheeesh! So they illegally started smuggling drugs to start a war? Okay as a theory or speculation but when you state it as a fact you look foolish.
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Post by Stammerhead on Oct 14, 2019 9:45:03 GMT
So they illegally started smuggling drugs to start a war? Okay as a theory or speculation but when you state it as a fact you look foolish. Oh you again....
The war on drugs never ends stammy. So yes, as speculation and theory, that was the intention and intention is everything. I guess I must have more insight than you. The Brits would have found some other excuse if it wasn't opium to take what they wanted.
Hark you you still trying to fix this one onto “the war on drugs”. BTW: Have you noticed that there are many people on these boards who seem to think they have more insight than the “sheeples”...?
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Post by Stammerhead on Oct 14, 2019 10:06:01 GMT
Hark you you still trying to fix this one onto “the war on drugs”. BTW: Have you noticed that there are many people on these boards who seem to think they have more insight than the “sheeples”...? So what would it be then stammy, if it wasn't Opium?
Your sarcasm is coming across as anemic and desperate.
Trade. Of course it was centred around opium which the Chinese rulers didn’t want in their country but calling it “the war on drugs” is retrofitting history. Next you’ll be saying that people who object to drug dealers in their community are being used as pawns in the “war on drugs”.
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Post by Stammerhead on Oct 14, 2019 10:33:56 GMT
Trade. Of course it was centred around opium which the Chinese rulers didn’t want in their country but calling it “the war on drugs” is retrofitting history. Next you’ll be saying that people who object to drug dealers in their community are being used as pawns in the “war on drugs”. Way to take something out of context stammy, by focusing on my flippancy, to avoid your own narrow sightedness. Look beneath the surface matey, you might get a more expansive view.
At any rate, drug war, drug scapegoat, land snatching, the whole main point that started this discussion was about the British\Western influence in these regions. Despite the Brits conquering arrogance, what they left behind wasn't such a bad thing. Gandhi was just a whiner.
I suppose you’ll next be claiming that “Gandhi was just a whiner” is another example of your self-proclaimed flippancy. I can accept speculation and theories and can accept that these can often contain the truth but when one of those is being stated as fact I start to get “narrow minded”. The accompanying “I’m smarter than thou” attitude can also brings this on.
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Post by Stammerhead on Oct 14, 2019 19:22:47 GMT
Manual work and probably done to get some much needed money at the time. There are some “oafs” who serve people food all day. And some oafs post on message boards. Okay, so now you're standing up for the working man of China! Yet you don't seem to give a fuck about working folks in Hong Kong. It belongs to the despots in Beijing! I was standing up for the working man in London you fool. Did your eyes fail to spot the London bus?
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Post by Stammerhead on Oct 14, 2019 19:24:44 GMT
I suppose you’ll next be claiming that “Gandhi was just a whiner” is another example of your self-proclaimed flippancy. I can accept speculation and theories and can accept that these can often contain the truth but when one of those is being stated as fact I start to get “narrow minded”. The accompanying “I’m smarter than thou” attitude can also brings this on. Well, with your rants, it is starting to prove to be a fact that you are narrow sighted and triggered by flippancy, so I guess I must be smarter than you. Nah, Nah, Nah Nah!
So I’m ranting now. Hey, did anyone out there spot a rant or are Toasted’s unblinkered eyes seeing things again?
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