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Post by WullieFort on Jan 30, 2020 13:07:38 GMT
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Post by MrFurious on Jan 30, 2020 15:16:49 GMT
Looking forward to that tonight on the Beeb. Love all his moments except Persona(bored the shit outta me), Social Network and All That Jazz,
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Post by masterofallgoons on Jan 30, 2020 16:44:20 GMT
Excellent choices all around.
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Post by Rey Kahuka on Jan 30, 2020 17:38:29 GMT
Perfect Dialogue - The Social Network
Let's set aside the fact that I hate that film, hate Facebook and hate Mark Zuckerberg. By no means is the dialogue perfect. I remember one specific scene towards the end of the film where a woman says something like, "You're not an asshole, Mark. You just try so hard to be one." No. He's an asshole. He's been an incredible asshole throughout the entire film. This line makes no sense to me. What's more, I find it fascinating that The Social Network continues to age so well in the public's mind despite Zuckerberg clearly being one of the worst people on Earth in real life.
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Post by Carl LaFong on Jan 30, 2020 17:39:54 GMT
Looking forward to that tonight on the Beeb. Love all his moments except Persona(bored the shit outta me), Social Network and All That Jazz, Persona is superb! The other two you mention aren't great I must admit. Lost in Translation is utter shit. Twbb boring. Like the rest of his choices though! |
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Post by masterofallgoons on Jan 30, 2020 18:21:35 GMT
Perfect Dialogue - The Social Network Let's set aside the fact that I hate that film, hate Facebook and hate Mark Zuckerberg. By no means is the dialogue perfect. I remember one specific scene towards the end of the film where a woman says something like, "You're not an asshole, Mark. You just try so hard to be one." No. He's an asshole. He's been an incredible asshole throughout the entire film. This line makes no sense to me. What's more, I find it fascinating that The Social Network continues to age so well in the public's mind despite Zuckerberg clearly being one of the worst people on Earth in real life. I think the choice of 'perfect dialouge' is specifically the opening scene. Since it's a list of 'perfect moments' I don't think we're talking about the entirety of the script. And the real life Zuckerberg going on to publicly be terrible person only serves to reinforce the film and is largely why it's aged as well as it has. 'Despite' is not a word I'd use here. |
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Post by Rey Kahuka on Jan 30, 2020 18:31:01 GMT
Perfect Dialogue - The Social Network Let's set aside the fact that I hate that film, hate Facebook and hate Mark Zuckerberg. By no means is the dialogue perfect. I remember one specific scene towards the end of the film where a woman says something like, "You're not an asshole, Mark. You just try so hard to be one." No. He's an asshole. He's been an incredible asshole throughout the entire film. This line makes no sense to me. What's more, I find it fascinating that The Social Network continues to age so well in the public's mind despite Zuckerberg clearly being one of the worst people on Earth in real life. I think the choice of 'perfect dialouge' is specifically the opening scene. Since it's a list of 'perfect moments' I don't think we're talking about the entirety of the script. And the real life Zuckerberg going on to publicly be terrible person only serves to reinforce the film and is largely why it's aged as well as it has. 'Despite' is not a word I'd use here. Good point, it was the specific scene. Disagree on the logic behind the popularity of the film, though. I don't think the intent of the film was to portray him as a prick, so I'm not sure the general public takes this into account. I could be dead wrong, though. I hate the movie and therefore have spent zero time talking about it with anyone who might be a fan. Maybe you're right, maybe the audience appreciates that Zuckerberg is a dick and it resonates more strongly with audiences as the years go by.
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Post by masterofallgoons on Jan 30, 2020 18:55:57 GMT
I think the choice of 'perfect dialouge' is specifically the opening scene. Since it's a list of 'perfect moments' I don't think we're talking about the entirety of the script. And the real life Zuckerberg going on to publicly be terrible person only serves to reinforce the film and is largely why it's aged as well as it has. 'Despite' is not a word I'd use here. Good point, it was the specific scene. Disagree on the logic behind the popularity of the film, though. I don't think the intent of the film was to portray him as a prick, so I'm not sure the general public takes this into account. I could be dead wrong, though. I hate the movie and therefore have spent zero time talking about it with anyone who might be a fan. Maybe you're right, maybe the audience appreciates that Zuckerberg is a dick and it resonates more strongly with audiences as the years go by. It would be very hard for me to imagine anybody coming out of that movie thinking that it was a flattering look at its subject that treated him like a hero. He's obviously a prick that screws over his friends and the people who actually had the idea and starts his project in spiteful misogyny. Again, I really don't think that could be lost on anybody. Maybe there are some people that are that stupid, but how could there be? And the why would they like it? It's also about the irony of how a guy with no social skills at all and no regard for how to treat people creates a 'social network' and how the idea of connecting people has become so profoundly impersonal and anti-intimate. I don't know if that's particularly novel or if it's especially deep as satire, but it's certainly continued to be a relevant theme. And the other big stories in his life and otherwise in the world of tech have also reinforced the movie as a pretty evocative representation of it's time. |
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Post by Rey Kahuka on Jan 30, 2020 19:39:09 GMT
Good point, it was the specific scene. Disagree on the logic behind the popularity of the film, though. I don't think the intent of the film was to portray him as a prick, so I'm not sure the general public takes this into account. I could be dead wrong, though. I hate the movie and therefore have spent zero time talking about it with anyone who might be a fan. Maybe you're right, maybe the audience appreciates that Zuckerberg is a dick and it resonates more strongly with audiences as the years go by. It would be very hard for me to imagine anybody coming out of that movie thinking that it was a flattering look at its subject that treated him like a hero. He's obviously a prick that screws over his friends and the people who actually had the idea and starts his project in spiteful misogyny. Again, I really don't think that could be lost on anybody. Maybe there are some people that are that stupid, but how could there be? And the why would they like it? It's also about the irony of how a guy with no social skills at all and no regard for how to treat people creates a 'social network' and how the idea of connecting people has become so profoundly impersonal and anti-intimate. I don't know if that's particularly novel or if it's especially deep as satire, but it's certainly continued to be a relevant theme. And the other big stories in his life and otherwise in the world of tech have also reinforced the movie as a pretty evocative representation of it's time. I think many people enjoy the film for the wrong reasons. A generation of Wall Street douchebags emulated Gordon Gecko when he was written to be a warning of how not to behave. Satire is the only way the line in question works, but I think the irony is lost on the audience. It's a Fincher film, so there's surely satire baked into it, but to answer your question, yes it goes over the audience's head. Do you realize how many times a year I have to explain to people Fight Club (possibly my favorite comedy of all time) is indeed a comedy, a social satire? Most of its fanbase doesn't even understand the point of the film, I'm guessing the same is true of Social Network. It's a cleverly put together film, but ultimately I believe the average idiot likes that movie because they wish they were the smartest guy in the room who cared more about money than relationships.
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Post by masterofallgoons on Jan 30, 2020 20:20:28 GMT
It would be very hard for me to imagine anybody coming out of that movie thinking that it was a flattering look at its subject that treated him like a hero. He's obviously a prick that screws over his friends and the people who actually had the idea and starts his project in spiteful misogyny. Again, I really don't think that could be lost on anybody. Maybe there are some people that are that stupid, but how could there be? And the why would they like it? It's also about the irony of how a guy with no social skills at all and no regard for how to treat people creates a 'social network' and how the idea of connecting people has become so profoundly impersonal and anti-intimate. I don't know if that's particularly novel or if it's especially deep as satire, but it's certainly continued to be a relevant theme. And the other big stories in his life and otherwise in the world of tech have also reinforced the movie as a pretty evocative representation of it's time. I think many people enjoy the film for the wrong reasons. A generation of Wall Street douchebags emulated Gordon Gecko when he was written to be a warning of how not to behave. Satire is the only way the line in question works, but I think the irony is lost on the audience. It's a Fincher film, so there's surely satire baked into it, but to answer your question, yes it goes over the audience's head. Do you realize how many times a year I have to explain to people Fight Club (possibly my favorite comedy of all time) is indeed a comedy, a social satire? Most of its fanbase doesn't even understand the point of the film, I'm guessing the same is true of Social Network. It's a cleverly put together film, but ultimately I believe the average idiot likes that movie because they wish they were the smartest guy in the room who cared more about money than relationships. I don't buy that in the case of this movie. Fight Club may be pretty up front, but not the way The Social Network is. The biggest flaw of the movie really is that it's so clearly critical of certain characters and of the way they succeed that it's too obvious what it's trying to say. It still think it works, but Mark Zuckerberg is so obviously a distasteful person in this story, especially because of how he ultimately treats the only good friend he has and the only likeable character the movie has. I know that people like Goodfellas or The Godfather or something, or there's the love for Scarface or Wall Street like you said (kind of a funny moment in the movie Boiler Room deals with that.. not a great movie but that part was interesting), but those are dynamic and charismatic characters. The closest thing to that in The Social Network is Justin Timberlake's character, but he's obviously a douche and his last moments on screen make him a cowering pussy. I can see people taking the wrong things from some of those movies, but not really this one. And this line of thinking and underestimating the audience is what leads critics to write 'think pieces' about how Joker celebrates 'incels' and will lead to real world violence, before they ever even see it. I don't think American Psycho, misunderstood as it may be as a satire, makes people want to conform to being a yuppie prick who kills those who dont appreciate their dinner reservations and ultimately will completely all sense of identity. And as much as there are people who want to go to Silicon valley and make billions, I don't think those are the people who prop of this movie. |
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Post by Rey Kahuka on Jan 30, 2020 20:46:32 GMT
I think many people enjoy the film for the wrong reasons. A generation of Wall Street douchebags emulated Gordon Gecko when he was written to be a warning of how not to behave. Satire is the only way the line in question works, but I think the irony is lost on the audience. It's a Fincher film, so there's surely satire baked into it, but to answer your question, yes it goes over the audience's head. Do you realize how many times a year I have to explain to people Fight Club (possibly my favorite comedy of all time) is indeed a comedy, a social satire? Most of its fanbase doesn't even understand the point of the film, I'm guessing the same is true of Social Network. It's a cleverly put together film, but ultimately I believe the average idiot likes that movie because they wish they were the smartest guy in the room who cared more about money than relationships. I don't buy that in the case of this movie. Fight Club may be pretty up front, but not the way The Social Network is. The biggest flaw of the movie really is that it's so clearly critical of certain characters and of the way they succeed that it's too obvious what it's trying to say. It still think it works, but Mark Zuckerberg is so obviously a distasteful person in this story, especially because of how he ultimately treats the only good friend he has and the only likeable character the movie has. I know that people like Goodfellas or The Godfather or something, or there's the love for Scarface or Wall Street like you said (kind of a funny moment in the movie Boiler Room deals with that.. not a great movie but that part was interesting), but those are dynamic and charismatic characters. The closest thing to that in The Social Network is Justin Timberlake's character, but he's obviously a douche and his last moments on screen make him a cowering pussy. I can see people taking the wrong things from some of those movies, but not really this one. And this line of thinking and underestimating the audience is what leads critics to write 'think pieces' about how Joker celebrates 'incels' and will lead to real world violence, before they ever even see it. I don't think American Psycho, misunderstood as it may be as a satire, makes people want to conform to being a yuppie prick who kills those who dont appreciate their dinner reservations and ultimately will completely all sense of identity. And as much as there are people who want to go to Silicon valley and make billions, I don't think those are the people who prop of this movie. Fair enough. Admittedly I'm extremely cynical regarding this film, as I made abundantly clear in my initial post in this thread. I'm looking at it through the lens of a person who loathes the subject matter itself, so of course I'm going to question the appreciation of said topic by others. It's not that I think people can't appreciate it as a film, whether they understand the satire or not; I just have an inherent suspicion toward film idolatry of morally bankrupt characters. I think we've talked about it before but I won't even watch Wolf of Wall Street, which is an absolute send-up of the central character's lifestyle and ethos. I know you're not supposed to think he's a good guy, but that doesn't make me any more interested in seeing his story transpire onscreen.
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Post by masterofallgoons on Jan 30, 2020 21:11:08 GMT
I don't buy that in the case of this movie. Fight Club may be pretty up front, but not the way The Social Network is. The biggest flaw of the movie really is that it's so clearly critical of certain characters and of the way they succeed that it's too obvious what it's trying to say. It still think it works, but Mark Zuckerberg is so obviously a distasteful person in this story, especially because of how he ultimately treats the only good friend he has and the only likeable character the movie has. I know that people like Goodfellas or The Godfather or something, or there's the love for Scarface or Wall Street like you said (kind of a funny moment in the movie Boiler Room deals with that.. not a great movie but that part was interesting), but those are dynamic and charismatic characters. The closest thing to that in The Social Network is Justin Timberlake's character, but he's obviously a douche and his last moments on screen make him a cowering pussy. I can see people taking the wrong things from some of those movies, but not really this one. And this line of thinking and underestimating the audience is what leads critics to write 'think pieces' about how Joker celebrates 'incels' and will lead to real world violence, before they ever even see it. I don't think American Psycho, misunderstood as it may be as a satire, makes people want to conform to being a yuppie prick who kills those who dont appreciate their dinner reservations and ultimately will completely all sense of identity. And as much as there are people who want to go to Silicon valley and make billions, I don't think those are the people who prop of this movie. Fair enough. Admittedly I'm extremely cynical regarding this film, as I made abundantly clear in my initial post in this thread. I'm looking at it through the lens of a person who loathes the subject matter itself, so of course I'm going to question the appreciation of said topic by others. It's not that I think people can't appreciate it as a film, whether they understand the satire or not; I just have an inherent suspicion toward film idolatry of morally bankrupt characters. I think we've talked about it before but I won't even watch Wolf of Wall Street, which is an absolute send-up of the central character's lifestyle and ethos. I know you're not supposed to think he's a good guy, but that doesn't make me any more interested in seeing his story transpire onscreen. I guess I can respect that. It's just that there are so many great movie about morally bankrupt people. Lots of Scorsese's career, for instance. Thematically I'd say The Social Network is aiming for sort of the tech age Citizen Kane. It also has a similar 'empire of emptiness' quality as There Will be Blood, or something. Maybe I'm naive but I give most of the audience a bit moew credit than to think these are characters to look up to. |
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Post by NJtoTX on Jan 30, 2020 21:26:34 GMT
The establishing scene was the only good part of Blue Velvet.
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Post by Rey Kahuka on Jan 30, 2020 21:27:33 GMT
Fair enough. Admittedly I'm extremely cynical regarding this film, as I made abundantly clear in my initial post in this thread. I'm looking at it through the lens of a person who loathes the subject matter itself, so of course I'm going to question the appreciation of said topic by others. It's not that I think people can't appreciate it as a film, whether they understand the satire or not; I just have an inherent suspicion toward film idolatry of morally bankrupt characters. I think we've talked about it before but I won't even watch Wolf of Wall Street, which is an absolute send-up of the central character's lifestyle and ethos. I know you're not supposed to think he's a good guy, but that doesn't make me any more interested in seeing his story transpire onscreen. I guess I can respect that. It's just that there are so many great movie about morally bankrupt people. Lots of Scorsese's career, for instance. Thematically I'd say The Social Network is aiming for sort of the tech age Citizen Kane. It also has a similar 'empire of emptiness' quality as There Will be Blood, or something. Maybe I'm naive but I give most of the audience a bit moew credit than to think these are characters to look up to. True. I guess it's more the type of morally bankrupt person. I love a good bad guy, don't get me wrong. But I'm not huge on gangster flicks, and movies based on real assholes that exist in the world are even less appealing. If I want that I'll watch the news.
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Post by hoskotafe3 on Jan 31, 2020 7:05:59 GMT
Haven't seen The Social Network, Persona or All That Jazz as none of them reall appealed. Have seen and liked the rest but I wouldn't call any aspect of them perfect, apart from maybe The Godfather Part 2.
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Post by MrFurious on Jan 31, 2020 18:02:15 GMT
It was an excellent program. The talk through from Mendes for that long 1917 scene was brilliant, unbelievable how they shot it in so few shots.
8/13 to win best picture. Parasite second favourite @9/2
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