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Post by Nora on Feb 20, 2020 3:27:45 GMT
imagine you get hired to do something you are highly skilled at and its a rare and somewhat hard to understand skill so to those that observe it its fairly difficult to tell if you are good at it on level 1 or level 10.
so you are on like 8-9 and you come to this company and see that someone who is the most senior in rank in a team of people who are supposed to be the EXPERTS in this is himself a 2 or 3 max.
its not your boss or your report its your peer in a differnt team but you do need to cooperate to get things done.
now the catch - he is a smart person who also is a fairly good guy (has a cat and brings her on calls and you like that a lot). I am not saying he should be fired but he should not lead that team or represent the company on this expertize until he catches up - which may be years. or at least months and giving if he is even willing to work hard at it.
but his lack of expertise makes your job incredible difficult and exposes the company to a risk as a result too.
whats next?
his boss (who himself is 0-1) , which is ok i guess for someone this senior) thinks this guy is good at what he was hired to do, and the company is pretty conservative about observing ranks and so on.
whats the best solution to this unfortunate situation?
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Post by politicidal on Feb 20, 2020 3:34:52 GMT
Get rid of him. Law of the jungle.
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Post by Nora on Feb 20, 2020 3:36:52 GMT
Get rid of him. Law of the jungle. ok lets say i wanted to do that (which i dont really) but how would u actualy do it? you are new he has been there for some time and you saying he sucks at this might not be enough. and nobody in the company understands this thing - thats why they hired him and eventually me. but he was a bad hire (for this particular position). plus he is very well liked by the big wigs you know... u would have to have other experts examine his work etc...
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Post by politicidal on Feb 20, 2020 3:38:16 GMT
Get rid of him. Law of the jungle. ok but how? you are new he has been there for some time and you saying he sucks at this might not be enough. and nobody in the company understands this thinn thats why they hired him and eventually me. but he was a bad hire (for this particular position). plus he is very well liked by the big wigs you know... Bottom line. Use my expertise to demonstrate the monetary difference between keeping him and dismissing him.
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Post by onethreetwo on Feb 20, 2020 3:39:49 GMT
Definitely leave it be.
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Post by Nora on Feb 20, 2020 3:40:58 GMT
ok but how? you are new he has been there for some time and you saying he sucks at this might not be enough. and nobody in the company understands this thinn thats why they hired him and eventually me. but he was a bad hire (for this particular position). plus he is very well liked by the big wigs you know... Bottom line. Use my expertise to demonstrate the monetary difference between keeping him and dismissing him. ok imagine its like operating on someone. i can do it in a way that i cure the person and he can do it in a way that the patient looks cured but will die in 1-5 years as a result of the surgery. until that happens or u bring in other doctors to examine his process its very hard to prove other than saying: look I know what I am doing and he does not...
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Post by Nora on Feb 20, 2020 3:41:35 GMT
ok and why? and ignore the fact it makes your job Much harder to do?
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Post by Jayman on Feb 20, 2020 3:42:26 GMT
I would never want to cost somebody their job. I would try to give the guy the benefit of my expertise without showing him up.
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Post by onethreetwo on Feb 20, 2020 3:42:47 GMT
ok and why? and ignore the fact it makes your job Much harder to do? Bad juju. You don't want it. Let the man keep his job.
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Post by Nora on Feb 20, 2020 3:43:51 GMT
btw my current plan is to leave but give the big wig guy an honest exit interview and tell him where the weknesses are and recommend solutions and then ill know i did someting so the next person after me might be in a better position but also i dont end up in an unpleasant war...
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Post by Nora on Feb 20, 2020 3:45:19 GMT
I would never want to cost somebody their job. I would try to give the guy the benefit of my expertise without showing him up. I agree but for that to happen you need the other person to be self aware enough to want to learn and also humble enough to accept it from smeone who is like 20 years younger, new, (and a woman) etc.. and I am not sure the conditions are right here for that.
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Post by Nora on Feb 20, 2020 3:46:24 GMT
ok and why? and ignore the fact it makes your job Much harder to do? Bad juju. You don't want it. Let the man keep his job. sounds smart... thanks.
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Post by Jayman on Feb 20, 2020 3:47:18 GMT
I would never want to cost somebody their job. I would try to give the guy the benefit of my expertise without showing him up. I agree but for that to happen you need the other oerson to be self aware enough to want to learn and also humble enough to accept it from smeone who is like 20 years younger, new, (and a woman) etc.. and I am not sure the conditions are right here for that. THat's why you have to be subtle about it and do it little by little when situations arise
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Post by Nora on Feb 20, 2020 3:48:53 GMT
I agree but for that to happen you need the other oerson to be self aware enough to want to learn and also humble enough to accept it from smeone who is like 20 years younger, new, (and a woman) etc.. and I am not sure the conditions are right here for that. THat's why you have to be subtle about it and do it little by little when situations arise well, he already knows I struggle to respect his expert opinion (and he complained about it to my boss) so things are already somewhat tense and subtlety at this point might be a challenge
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Post by Jayman on Feb 20, 2020 3:52:44 GMT
THat's why you have to be subtle about it and do it little by little when situations arise well, he already knows I struggle to respect his expert opinion (and he complained about it to my boss) so things are already somewhat tense and subtlety at this point might be a challenge See this is why from now on you have to come to us and ask us these things sooner before it gets to this point. Actually that is a tough call and I don't know what you do at this point. One day at a time
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Post by Nora on Feb 20, 2020 3:55:48 GMT
well, he already knows I struggle to respect his expert opinion (and he complained about it to my boss) so things are already somewhat tense and subtlety at this point might be a challenge See this is why from now on you have to come to us and ask us these things sooner before it gets to this point. Actually that is a tough call and I don't know what you do at this point. One day at a time I guess Ill go with not wanting bad juju and leaving it be
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Post by Jayman on Feb 20, 2020 3:56:59 GMT
See this is why from now on you have to come to us and ask us these things sooner before it gets to this point. Actually that is a tough call and I don't know what you do at this point. One day at a time I guess Ill go with not wanting bad juju and leaving it be That was my second choice and probably the best one at this point
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Post by twothousandonemark on Feb 20, 2020 3:59:31 GMT
Set the example of effort & skill, let him destroy himself playing catch up & whining.
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Post by Nora on Feb 20, 2020 4:39:54 GMT
I would make it clear that this guy is not qualified for the job. If it impacts my ability to do my job, that's something my superior would have to know about. Sure, I would try to help the guy get up to speed. But if it was going nowhere, my duty is to tell my boss. I already told my boss several times but my boss is not a very strong leader and is a yesman who doesnt want to make waves. Last time I told him he said “go and tell his boss”. Which does set me up for a quite uncomfortable experience I am sure because this requires me to say something negative about a respected older VP to his boss - an established Senior VP. Who Thinks this guy is qualified and likes him... (more than me, but thats not hard, hehe , I am lets say, more unacomodatting than most would probably like:))
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Harmless elf
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I'm a slick shyster the pest Meister
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Post by Harmless elf on Feb 20, 2020 4:41:29 GMT
Bully him, he'll leave on his own.
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