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Post by FilmFlaneur on Jun 13, 2023 16:58:25 GMT
The Bible is banned in a Utah district at elementary and middle schools after being deemed 'too vulgar or violent' for children. The Davis, Utah, school district declared the Bible too violent for children and banned the book in schools. The move came after a parent was frustrated by a push to ban other titles. The Book of Mormon could be next in the state with a high population of member of Church of Jesus Christ and the Latter-Day Saints.. A copy of the complaint obtained by The Salt Lake Tribune through a public records request shows that the parent concerned noted the Bible contains instances of incest, prostitution and rape....[don't forget the genocides] www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-12157953/Bible-banned-Utah-district-elementary-middle-school-students-vulgar.html A case of unintended consequences for the religious right, busy throwing stones in glass houses. The deliberate irony here reminds me of the affair in Florida where in order to confirm religious pluralism, there was a push to place a Statue of Baphomet next to a Ten Commandments monument by The Satanic Temple. |
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Post by novastar6 on Jun 13, 2023 21:30:12 GMT
Given the real shock is that it wasn't banned years ago tells you how many kids in those schools actually read it. But they're SURE going to be curious about what's in it NOW when they're not ALLOWED to read it.
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jackbrock
Sophomore
@jackbrock
Posts: 119
Likes: 20
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Post by jackbrock on Jun 14, 2023 1:41:20 GMT
Odd that those religious people would want to ban a book that they cherry pick with quotations to make themselves appear pious.
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Post by MCDemuth on Jun 15, 2023 3:13:29 GMT
So much for Freedom Of Religion...
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Post by novastar6 on Jun 15, 2023 3:21:45 GMT
So much for Freedom Of Religion... Funny how the other religious books in the library weren't removed. |
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Post by FilmFlaneur on Jun 15, 2023 20:30:23 GMT
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Post by novastar6 on Jun 15, 2023 22:29:59 GMT
The one that says kill yourself for Allah and you get 72 virgins?
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Post by FilmFlaneur on Jun 16, 2023 20:35:38 GMT
The one that says kill yourself for Allah and you get 72 virgins?
I didn't say the Qu'ran was not violent, just found not as violent. |
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Post by novastar6 on Jun 16, 2023 23:05:42 GMT
The one that says kill yourself for Allah and you get 72 virgins?
I didn't say the Qu'ran was not violent, just found not as violent.
And yet...Christians being executed in other countries for crimes of blasphemy, refusing to convert to Islam, etc. is still happening today, and that's not considered violent?
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Post by FilmFlaneur on Jun 17, 2023 11:18:53 GMT
I didn't say the Qu'ran was not violent, just found not as violent.
And yet...Christians being executed in other countries for crimes of blasphemy, refusing to convert to Islam, etc. is still happening today, and that's not considered violent?
I think that refers to actions of (some of the followers of) Islam not what specifically occurs in the Qu'ran, which is what the point of comparison here is. |
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Post by novastar6 on Jun 17, 2023 13:48:28 GMT
And yet...Christians being executed in other countries for crimes of blasphemy, refusing to convert to Islam, etc. is still happening today, and that's not considered violent?
I think that refers to actions of (some of the followers of) Islam not what specifically occurs in the Qu'ran, which is what the point of comparison here is.
So the Bible wasn't banned because of the 'sexual' passages but because it's too violent...with no illustrations or graphic language whatsoever. Oh so and so got stabbed, so and so got a spike in the temple, big whoop, that's child's play compared to the stuff on fanfiction sites that all these kids can access on their phones. Hell, it's child's play compared to any history book that discusses battles, wars, massacres, genocide, etc.
So I guess the schools are going to have to ban the history books next...oops, probably already too late since they quit teaching it years ago.
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Post by FilmFlaneur on Jun 18, 2023 18:30:33 GMT
I think that refers to actions of (some of the followers of) Islam not what specifically occurs in the Qu'ran, which is what the point of comparison here is. So the Bible wasn't banned because of the 'sexual' passages but because it's too violent...with no illustrations or graphic language whatsoever. Oh so and so got stabbed, so and so got a spike in the temple, big whoop, that's child's play compared to the stuff on fanfiction sites that all these kids can access on their phones. Hell, it's child's play compared to any history book that discusses battles, wars, massacres, genocide, etc.
So I guess the schools are going to have to ban the history books next...oops, probably already too late since they quit teaching it years ago.
That's a slippery slope argument, en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Slippery_slope which is a fallacy. I don't think the complainant was ignorant of the problems with aspects of modern culture. The ban was asked for to highlight with irony the propensity (apparently growing worse in the States over recent years) to ban texts in schools and libraries. |
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Post by novastar6 on Jun 18, 2023 19:05:23 GMT
So the Bible wasn't banned because of the 'sexual' passages but because it's too violent...with no illustrations or graphic language whatsoever. Oh so and so got stabbed, so and so got a spike in the temple, big whoop, that's child's play compared to the stuff on fanfiction sites that all these kids can access on their phones. Hell, it's child's play compared to any history book that discusses battles, wars, massacres, genocide, etc.
So I guess the schools are going to have to ban the history books next...oops, probably already too late since they quit teaching it years ago.
That's a slippery slope argument, en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Slippery_slope which is a fallacy. I don't think the complainant was ignorant of the problems with aspects of modern culture. The ban was asked for to highlight with irony the propensity (apparently growing worse in the States over recent years) to ban texts in schools and libraries.
Porn books that read like shitty fanfiction. Oh how will those kids ever get a cultured education?
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Post by FilmFlaneur on Jun 18, 2023 19:08:17 GMT
That's a slippery slope argument, en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Slippery_slope which is a fallacy. I don't think the complainant was ignorant of the problems with aspects of modern culture. The ban was asked for to highlight with irony the propensity (apparently growing worse in the States over recent years) to ban texts in schools and libraries.
Porn books that read like shitty fanfiction. Oh how will those kids ever get a cultured education?
There is always Fox News and Truth Social, plenty of "alternate facts" to be had if one know where to look! |
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Post by novastar6 on Jun 18, 2023 19:56:55 GMT
Porn books that read like shitty fanfiction. Oh how will those kids ever get a cultured education?
There is always Fox News and Truth Social, plenty of "alternate facts" to be had if one know where to look!
There's also public libraries that cater to all age levels so they're allowed to carry porn books in the adult section.
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Post by FilmFlaneur on Jun 18, 2023 20:00:30 GMT
There is always Fox News and Truth Social, plenty of "alternate facts" to be had if one know where to look!
There's also public libraries that cater to all age levels so they're allowed to carry porn books in the adult section.
It sounds against you are against all porn. (Obscenity being notoriously hard to define while community standards change over time). My view on porn is this: that as with any sort of human creation there are good and bad examples; that for adults censorship generally is for the most part unwelcome and ultimately unhealthy to the state (with some exceptions); and that porn is the natural literature of sex, where sex of all sorts is an abiding interest for virtually all of humankind. |
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Post by novastar6 on Jun 18, 2023 20:57:24 GMT
There's also public libraries that cater to all age levels so they're allowed to carry porn books in the adult section.
It sounds against you are against all porn. (Obscenity being notoriously hard to define while community standards change over time). My view on porn is this: that as with any sort of human creation there are good and bad examples; that for adults censorship generally is for the most part unwelcome and ultimately unhealthy to the state (with some exceptions); and that porn is the natural literature of sex, where sex of all sorts is an abiding interest for virtually all of humankind.
I'm against schools saying 'these books are perfectly FINE for kids to read, to recite in class in front of other kids, parents need to mind their own business and leave us and their kids alone, there is NOTHING WRONG with this material', but when a parent reads a passage from one of those same books at the school board meeting, in a room full of grown ass adults, they are silenced because 'that's not appropriate'.
School kids need to read a book about a 7 year old's account of being raped by her daddy?
"There's a child in our board room so you can't read that book, that's on the library shelf for children to read."
Now maybe they just didn't have YA books when you were growing up but if you read ones from the 70s, 80s, early 90s, etc., you'll be disappointed because those teenagers are so busy dealing with school, sports, gangs, drugs, divorce, heartache, personal beliefs, sense of identity, politics, nuclear war, stalkers, murderers, etc., that they hardly have time for sex and when/if they have it, very little of it is graphic whatsoever and it's not even usually the main characters having it. How sheltered those teenagers were 40-50 years ago, how DEPRIVED they were with authors like Lois Duncan, Joan Lowery Nixon, Richard Peck, Robert C. O'Brien, R.L. Stine, Jerry Spinelli, Diane Hoh, A. Bates, etc., who deprived them of the normal childhood literary adventures of oral/anal sex with every dick that walks by.
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Post by FilmFlaneur on Jun 18, 2023 21:24:59 GMT
I'm against schools saying 'these books are perfectly FINE for kids to read, to recite in class in front of other kids, parents need to mind their own business and leave us and their kids alone, there is NOTHING WRONG with this material', but when a parent reads a passage from one of those same books at the school board meeting, in a room full of grown ass adults, they are silenced because 'that's not appropriate'. You give a false impression of the way things are heading (in the States at least). That wasn't the view of concerned groups during those times with, for instance moral panics, based around sex and violence in comics: boomers-daily.com/2021/07/17/1950s-a-moral-panic-that-targeted-comic-books/ A censoriousness which continues unabated today: www.ala.org/advocacy/bbooks/frequentlychallengedbooks/decade2019while book banning has a long and proud history in the USA and such prudery and anti-intellectualism can make a county a laughing stock overseas. Unfortunately such sweeping, sensationalist language probably tells one more about you than the issues surrounding a modern education system which needs to offer a range of material which sometimes challenges readers and students. Right wingers often talk about the Snowflake Generation when they ought to review the snow storm they are blowing in their own backyard. |
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Post by novastar6 on Jun 18, 2023 22:30:53 GMT
I'm against schools saying 'these books are perfectly FINE for kids to read, to recite in class in front of other kids, parents need to mind their own business and leave us and their kids alone, there is NOTHING WRONG with this material', but when a parent reads a passage from one of those same books at the school board meeting, in a room full of grown ass adults, they are silenced because 'that's not appropriate'. You give a false impression of the way things are heading (in the States at least). That wasn't the view of concerned groups during those times with, for instance moral panics, based around sex and violence in comics: boomers-daily.com/2021/07/17/1950s-a-moral-panic-that-targeted-comic-books/ A censoriousness which continues unabated today: www.ala.org/advocacy/bbooks/frequentlychallengedbooks/decade2019while book banning has a long and proud history in the USA and such prudery and anti-intellectualism can make a county a laughing stock overseas. Unfortunately such sweeping, sensationalist language probably tells one more about you than the issues surrounding a modern education system which needs to offer a range of material which sometimes challenges readers and students. Right wingers often talk about the Snowflake Generation when they ought to review the snow storm they are blowing in their own backyard.
Given the public school system has churned out 2/3 of students that suffer from various levels of illiteracy which puts them on the fast track to welfare or prison, low income jobs, no jobs, years without medical care, etc., the issue/answer isn't 'Johnny needs to read more porn in school so he can be challenged'.
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Post by FilmFlaneur on Jun 19, 2023 10:29:55 GMT
You give a false impression of the way things are heading (in the States at least). That wasn't the view of concerned groups during those times with, for instance moral panics, based around sex and violence in comics: boomers-daily.com/2021/07/17/1950s-a-moral-panic-that-targeted-comic-books/ A censoriousness which continues unabated today: www.ala.org/advocacy/bbooks/frequentlychallengedbooks/decade2019while book banning has a long and proud history in the USA and such prudery and anti-intellectualism can make a county a laughing stock overseas. Unfortunately such sweeping, sensationalist language probably tells one more about you than the issues surrounding a modern education system which needs to offer a range of material which sometimes challenges readers and students. Right wingers often talk about the Snowflake Generation when they ought to review the snow storm they are blowing in their own backyard.
Given the public school system has churned out 2/3 of students that suffer from various levels of illiteracy which puts them on the fast track to welfare or prison, low income jobs, no jobs, years without medical care, etc., the issue/answer isn't 'Johnny needs to read more porn in school so he can be challenged'.
Literacy and having a broad education are two different things. And please see above for PEN's view of the way porn is dragged into things. |
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