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Post by JudgeJuryDredd on Jul 20, 2023 18:23:54 GMT
A budget of over $200 million dollars with low viewership, utterly insane. Disney is spending too much on products not enough people want to invest their time into, and after seeing each of the episodes released so far, I cannot honestly say that I blame anyone who has either ditched or skipped the series. Outside of some exciting moments and decent interplay between the characters, it's pretty dull on the whole, and nowhere near as exciting as the comic event it takes its name from. In all honesty, I think Phase Four should have largely been about the Skrulls' secret invasion with the concept of the multiverse being an occasional occurrence in some content, as such we get too much telling and not enough showing. The comic event wasn't that good in the first place, it was just a random excuse to bring back old dead characters by saying "Oh, we were just replaced by Skrulls" and explain way any unpopular characterization for other characters as "Oh, we were replaced by Skrulls".
And it all came down to "Our society has been infiltrated and influenced by insidious subversive forces for years. We can fix it with a punch to the face."
It was like Onslaught, all that build up and the villain ending up being a big waste.
It was good enough to be the basis for this television mini-series, which you seem very determined to defend against any criticism and make it out to be better than it actually is. I wish I could say that the series is an improvement over its source material, but it really isn't. With everything scaled back, and the absence of other major characters like Iron Man, Thor, Captain America, Spider-Man, Spider Woman, Hawkeye, Black Widow, the Fantastic Four, and the X-Men, the impact just isn't where it should be. Despite the huge budget, the series still feels like it has been stretched too thin - the writing, even at its best, is pretty lackluster, despite the best efforts of the cast trying to make it work. The visual scope of it all is so scaled back you have to wonder where all the money went, and even the action is rather dull. When surprises relating to Maria Hill, Talos, and War Machine are barely talked online and in the trades I do not think Marvel Studios has a homerun on their hands.
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Post by JudgeJuryDredd on Jul 20, 2023 18:25:44 GMT
Poor little formersamhmd thought he could bait you with fallacy and now has to go back to the drawing board to defend a series he admits to have already made up his mind about before it even premiered.
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Post by Cat on Jul 20, 2023 18:44:30 GMT
I've been Star Wars'd out for as long as I can remember or longer but Andor's pretty good.
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Post by formersamhmd on Jul 20, 2023 19:06:06 GMT
The comic event wasn't that good in the first place, it was just a random excuse to bring back old dead characters by saying "Oh, we were just replaced by Skrulls" and explain way any unpopular characterization for other characters as "Oh, we were replaced by Skrulls".
And it all came down to "Our society has been infiltrated and influenced by insidious subversive forces for years. We can fix it with a punch to the face."
It was like Onslaught, all that build up and the villain ending up being a big waste.
It was good enough to be the basis for this television mini-series, which you seem very determined to defend against any criticism and make it out to be better than it actually is. I wish I could say that the series is an improvement over its source material, but it really isn't. With everything scaled back, and the absence of other major characters like Iron Man, Thor, Captain America, Spider-Man, Spider Woman, Hawkeye, Black Widow, the Fantastic Four, and the X-Men, the impact just isn't where it should be. Despite the huge budget, the series still feels like it has been stretched too thin - the writing, even at its best, is pretty lackluster, despite the best efforts of the cast trying to make it work. The visual scope of it all is so scaled back you have to wonder where all the money went, and even the action is rather dull. When surprises relating to Maria Hill, Talos, and War Machine are barely talked online and, in the trades, I do not think Marvel Studios has a homerun on their hands. The bare bones idea of "Skrulls infiltrating society", yes. None of that nonsense with Veranke and bringing dead characters back though. Thankfully.
Not barely talked about, I see them on FB a lot. Not as crazy as WandaVision's response but that was back when D+ MCU was a new thing.
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Post by formersamhmd on Jul 20, 2023 19:07:12 GMT
Poor little formersamhmd thought he could bait you with fallacy and now has to go back to the drawing board to defend a series he admits to have already made up his mind about before it even premiered. I knew there'd be backlash to the series because of all the buffoons who jumped on the Hater Bandwagon, so I was simply preparing for the inevitable.
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Post by formersamhmd on Jul 20, 2023 19:08:46 GMT
You wouldn't like it, by your standards.
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Post by Skaathar on Jul 20, 2023 20:32:17 GMT
You wouldn't like it, by your standards. You mean it has incompetent writing? Because that's usually my standard: a show needs to have good writing for me to enjoy it.
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Post by Rey Kahuka on Jul 20, 2023 22:28:16 GMT
You wouldn't like it, by your standards. You mean it has incompetent writing? Because that's usually my standard: a show needs to have good writing for me to enjoy it. Yes, unfortunately it does. The fifth episode was decent though. Seeing the mother of dragons blasting MFers with a shotgun is worth the price of admission.
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Post by formersamhmd on Jul 21, 2023 1:25:52 GMT
You wouldn't like it, by your standards. You mean it has incompetent writing? Because that's usually my standard: a show needs to have good writing for me to enjoy it. I mean it's a slow character driven show without big spectacle. Like Secret Invasion. Meaning you wouldn't like it.
This show is better written than the Mandalorian, any of it
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Post by Skaathar on Jul 21, 2023 1:44:31 GMT
You mean it has incompetent writing? Because that's usually my standard: a show needs to have good writing for me to enjoy it. I mean it's a slow character driven show without big spectacle. Like Secret Invasion. Meaning you wouldn't like it.
This show is better written than the Mandalorian, any of it
Yet I enjoyed shows like Raised by Wolves or Westworld, both were slow-burn, character-driven shows. Difference is that they were well-written shows whereas this one isn't looking like it is. So I guess that's what your standards are like: you seem to love shows with crap writing. No wonder you worship She-Hulk. Bet you would have loved the Twilight movies as well had you been old enough to watch them when they came out.
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Post by JudgeJuryDredd on Jul 21, 2023 2:45:16 GMT
It was good enough to be the basis for this television mini-series, which you seem very determined to defend against any criticism and make it out to be better than it actually is. I wish I could say that the series is an improvement over its source material, but it really isn't. With everything scaled back, and the absence of other major characters like Iron Man, Thor, Captain America, Spider-Man, Spider Woman, Hawkeye, Black Widow, the Fantastic Four, and the X-Men, the impact just isn't where it should be. Despite the huge budget, the series still feels like it has been stretched too thin - the writing, even at its best, is pretty lackluster, despite the best efforts of the cast trying to make it work. The visual scope of it all is so scaled back you have to wonder where all the money went, and even the action is rather dull. When surprises relating to Maria Hill, Talos, and War Machine are barely talked online and, in the trades, I do not think Marvel Studios has a homerun on their hands. The bare bones idea of "Skrulls infiltrating society", yes. None of that nonsense with Veranke and bringing dead characters back though. Thankfully.
Not barely talked about, I see them on FB a lot. Not as crazy as WandaVision's response but that was back when D+ MCU was a new thing.
So, a bombastic storyline in the comic books becomes a low energy, slow paced, and generally uninteresting mini-series with tiny, thin slices of excitement...What an upgrade. Yes, they are barely talked about. Step aside from groups dedicated to this specific kind of content and you won't find a whole lot of chatter for this series, hence the low viewership - not enough people are interested in the series, and on the whole it hasn't been seen as the best thing since sliced bread.
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Post by JudgeJuryDredd on Jul 21, 2023 2:53:52 GMT
Poor little formersamhmd thought he could bait you with fallacy and now has to go back to the drawing board to defend a series he admits to have already made up his mind about before it even premiered. I knew there'd be backlash to the series because of all the buffoons who jumped on the Hater Bandwagon, so I was simply preparing for the inevitable. Sorry, not taking your bait, find a different way to amuse yourself.
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Post by JudgeJuryDredd on Jul 21, 2023 2:59:40 GMT
I mean it's a slow character driven show without big spectacle. Like Secret Invasion. Meaning you wouldn't like it.
This show is better written than the Mandalorian, any of it
Yet I enjoyed shows like Raised by Wolves or Westworld, both were slow-burn, character-driven shows. Difference is that they were well-written shows whereas this one isn't looking like it is. So I guess that's what your standards are like: you seem to love shows with crap writing. No wonder you worship She-Hulk. Bet you would have loved the Twilight movies as well had you been old enough to watch them when they came out. I'm sure formersamhmd, who claims to have a degree in psychology and has practiced it for a living, will give a very thoughtful response, or just say "double standards".
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Post by formersamhmd on Jul 21, 2023 13:11:32 GMT
I mean it's a slow character driven show without big spectacle. Like Secret Invasion. Meaning you wouldn't like it.
This show is better written than the Mandalorian, any of it
Yet I enjoyed shows like Raised by Wolves or Westworld, both were slow-burn, character-driven shows. Difference is that they were well-written shows whereas this one isn't looking like it is. So I guess that's what your standards are like: you seem to love shows with crap writing. No wonder you worship She-Hulk. Bet you would have loved the Twilight movies as well had you been old enough to watch them when they came out. Never saw Raised by Wolves, but Westworld was pretentious tripe that fell apart after 1 season and needed obvious gimmicks like the "2 time periods" stuff to hide an obvious plot that didn't even make sense with how rushed Williams' change was.
Never saw those vampire flicks either, I wasn't offended by She-Hulks' existence like the Fragile Broflakes were though.
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Post by formersamhmd on Jul 21, 2023 13:13:16 GMT
The bare bones idea of "Skrulls infiltrating society", yes. None of that nonsense with Veranke and bringing dead characters back though. Thankfully.
Not barely talked about, I see them on FB a lot. Not as crazy as WandaVision's response but that was back when D+ MCU was a new thing.
So, a bombastic storyline in the comic books becomes a low energy, slow paced, and generally uninteresting mini-series with tiny, thin slices of excitement...What an upgrade. Yes, they are barely talked about. Step aside from groups dedicated to this specific kind of content and you won't find a whole lot of chatter for this series, hence the low viewership - not enough people are interested in the series, and on the whole it hasn't been seen as the best thing since sliced bread. Yes, it rather is. Nice change of pace.
They're talked about enough, considering aside from Fury there's no major MCU characters in this show it's gotten enough chatter. Folks didn't talk much about Breaking Bad and The Wire when they started either.
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Post by Skaathar on Jul 21, 2023 15:00:09 GMT
Yet I enjoyed shows like Raised by Wolves or Westworld, both were slow-burn, character-driven shows. Difference is that they were well-written shows whereas this one isn't looking like it is. So I guess that's what your standards are like: you seem to love shows with crap writing. No wonder you worship She-Hulk. Bet you would have loved the Twilight movies as well had you been old enough to watch them when they came out. Never saw Raised by Wolves, but Westworld was pretentious tripe that fell apart after 1 season and needed obvious gimmicks like the "2 time periods" stuff to hide an obvious plot that didn't even make sense with how rushed Williams' change was.
Never saw those vampire flicks either, I wasn't offended by She-Hulks' existence like the Fragile Broflakes were though.
See, told you your standard pretty much consists of bad writing. That's really the only reason you'd consider Westworld as "pretentious tripe" yet praise the holy hell out of TFATWS's finale. But whether you consider it pretentious or not does not change the fact that I just proved you have no idea what my standards are. BTW, the 3rd season of Westworld is probably a better Black Widow show than the Black Widow movie.
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Post by JudgeJuryDredd on Jul 21, 2023 17:44:58 GMT
Yet I enjoyed shows like Raised by Wolves or Westworld, both were slow-burn, character-driven shows. Difference is that they were well-written shows whereas this one isn't looking like it is. So I guess that's what your standards are like: you seem to love shows with crap writing. No wonder you worship She-Hulk. Bet you would have loved the Twilight movies as well had you been old enough to watch them when they came out. Never saw Raised by Wolves, but Westworld was pretentious tripe that fell apart after 1 season and needed obvious gimmicks like the "2 time periods" stuff to hide an obvious plot that didn't even make sense with how rushed Williams' change was.
Never saw those vampire flicks either, I wasn't offended by She-Hulks' existence like the Fragile Broflakes were though.
Your dislike for Westworld does not and should not dismiss Skaathar response to you that they can enjoy television programs that are slow-paced and character-driven. That's not how the force works, to quote Han Solo. (Since you feel the need to reference Star Wars here and there)
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Post by JudgeJuryDredd on Jul 21, 2023 17:55:54 GMT
So, a bombastic storyline in the comic books becomes a low energy, slow paced, and generally uninteresting mini-series with tiny, thin slices of excitement...What an upgrade. Yes, they are barely talked about. Step aside from groups dedicated to this specific kind of content and you won't find a whole lot of chatter for this series, hence the low viewership - not enough people are interested in the series, and on the whole it hasn't been seen as the best thing since sliced bread. Yes, it rather is. Nice change of pace.
They're talked about enough, considering aside from Fury there's no major MCU characters in this show it's gotten enough chatter. Folks didn't talk much about Breaking Bad and The Wire when they started either.
Not really given how the writing isn't of exceptional quality and has to rely on its actors to try and do all the heavy lifting to elevate the material. The Flash is also talked about "enough" and it's one of the biggest box office flops in recent memory, the latest Indiana Jones is also talked about "enough" and it's looking to be the worst performing release under Disney this year. And neither Breaking Bad or The Wire were mini-series based on superhero comics that aired exclusively on a Disney streaming service, so your argument doesn't work as well as you would like it too.
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Post by Skaathar on Jul 21, 2023 18:16:41 GMT
Never saw Raised by Wolves, but Westworld was pretentious tripe that fell apart after 1 season and needed obvious gimmicks like the "2 time periods" stuff to hide an obvious plot that didn't even make sense with how rushed Williams' change was.
Never saw those vampire flicks either, I wasn't offended by She-Hulks' existence like the Fragile Broflakes were though.
Your dislike for Westworld does not and should not dismiss Skaathar response to you that they can enjoy television programs that are slow-paced and character-driven. That's not how the force works, to quote Han Solo. (Since you feel the need to reference Star Wars here and there) Yeah well, that would have needed foremersam to admit he was wrong, and we all know he's not mature enough for that. So he does what he does, throw lowkey insults and redirect.
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Post by formersamhmd on Jul 21, 2023 18:45:54 GMT
Never saw Raised by Wolves, but Westworld was pretentious tripe that fell apart after 1 season and needed obvious gimmicks like the "2 time periods" stuff to hide an obvious plot that didn't even make sense with how rushed Williams' change was.
Never saw those vampire flicks either, I wasn't offended by She-Hulks' existence like the Fragile Broflakes were though.
See, told you your standard pretty much consists of bad writing. That's really the only reason you'd consider Westworld as "pretentious tripe" yet praise the holy hell out of TFATWS's finale. But whether you consider it pretentious or not does not change the fact that I just proved you have no idea what my standards are. BTW, the 3rd season of Westworld is probably a better Black Widow show than the Black Widow movie. All that fluff about the Bicameral Mind, the two time periods, William going from meek to merciless in like 2 days at the Park. But then again the Nolans' heads have been up their own rears ever since they were praised for Memento.
Oh, so saying that just because someone is labeled a "Terrorist" doesn't make them irredeemably evil and never have any reasons for what they do is a bad thing to say?
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