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Post by Leo of Red Keep on Jun 23, 2017 5:41:14 GMT
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Post by Aj_June on Jun 24, 2017 17:59:53 GMT
He did exhibit extreme stupidity last season during battle of bastards by almost getting himself killed because of sheer stupidity.
I sort of like Tywin Lannister and Stannis Baratheon style of commanding in which you try to avoid danger and live a little longer to win a battle.
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Post by Leo of Red Keep on Jun 25, 2017 5:09:11 GMT
I strongly suspect White Walkers never had any intention to pass the Wall. It's theirs and they're only pushing people south. Jon Snow is your typical fool jumping to conclusions without checking facts or even trying to get more information. The "Great War" is the one he'll start, very much like the previous "Great War" of history, also known as the First World War, was started only because everyone was afraid of everyone else.
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Post by Karl Aksel on Jun 25, 2017 15:03:31 GMT
I strongly suspect White Walkers never had any intention to pass the Wall. It's theirs and they're only pushing people south. Jon Snow is your typical fool jumping to conclusions without checking facts or even trying to get more information. The "Great War" is the one he'll start, very much like the previous "Great War" of history, also known as the First World War, was started only because everyone was afraid of everyone else. Assuming the walkers have no intention to pass the wall is just as much of a baseless assumption as assuming they are intending to pass the wall. Jon would be more a fool if he were to take no precautions. Hope for the best, but prepare for the worst.
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Post by Leo of Red Keep on Jun 26, 2017 6:47:50 GMT
I strongly suspect White Walkers never had any intention to pass the Wall. It's theirs and they're only pushing people south. Jon Snow is your typical fool jumping to conclusions without checking facts or even trying to get more information. The "Great War" is the one he'll start, very much like the previous "Great War" of history, also known as the First World War, was started only because everyone was afraid of everyone else. Assuming the walkers have no intention to pass the wall is just as much of a baseless assumption as assuming they are intending to pass the wall. Jon would be more a fool if he were to take no precautions. Hope for the best, but prepare for the worst. I wouldn't blame anyone for taking the threat seriously. I don't see Jon Snow hoping for the best, though. He is dead set for the worst he "knows" is coming and will not consider alternatives. He never gave any sign he thought of any, nor did anyone else around him. I won't be surprised if he is the one starting hostilities. By the way, this absolute unanimity of everyone involved about the White Walker threat I see as a strong hint that they will be proven wrong. Everyone who witnessed it jumped to the same conclusion and met no contradiction. It looks a lot like a writer's trick to better surprise viewers.
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Post by Karl Aksel on Jun 26, 2017 7:07:09 GMT
Assuming the walkers have no intention to pass the wall is just as much of a baseless assumption as assuming they are intending to pass the wall. Jon would be more a fool if he were to take no precautions. Hope for the best, but prepare for the worst. I wouldn't blame anyone for taking the threat seriously. I don't see Jon Snow hoping for the best, though. He is dead set for the worst he "knows" is coming and will not consider alternatives. He never gave any sign he thought of any, nor did anyone else around him. I won't be surprised if he is the one starting hostilities. By the way, this absolute unanimity of everyone involved about the White Walker threat I see as a strong hint that they will be proven wrong. Everyone who witnessed it jumped to the same conclusion and met no contradiction. It looks a lot like a writer's trick to better surprise viewers. I think he does intend a surprise concerning the walkers, but I do not think he means to surprise us with an anticlimax.
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Post by Leo of Red Keep on Jun 26, 2017 8:13:51 GMT
I wouldn't blame anyone for taking the threat seriously. I don't see Jon Snow hoping for the best, though. He is dead set for the worst he "knows" is coming and will not consider alternatives. He never gave any sign he thought of any, nor did anyone else around him. I won't be surprised if he is the one starting hostilities. By the way, this absolute unanimity of everyone involved about the White Walker threat I see as a strong hint that they will be proven wrong. Everyone who witnessed it jumped to the same conclusion and met no contradiction. It looks a lot like a writer's trick to better surprise viewers. I think he does intend a surprise concerning the walkers, but I do not think he means to surprise us with an anticlimax. I am strongly convinced Daenerys will fail and I expect Jon to die again. I suspect he was brought back for one purpose and will be discarded afterwards. But even if this doesn't happen, I can very much see GRRM concluding his story in a way which does not involve a military victory. Remember Jojen in S3E10: "The Night's Watch can't stop them. The Kings of Westeros and all their armies can't stop them." The anti-war atmosphere is way too strong in the whole story and I believe Jojen's words were explicit foreshadowing. We have seen visions come true, as opposed to prophecies. He was telling us that none of what Jon Snow is presently doing will make any difference. He was telling us that the whole "Great War" hype used to make people watch Season 7 is just another misdirection. The implication always was that Bran would be the decisive person. Surely he's not there just to download fan pleasing stuff like the Tower of Joy video. I don't know if he'll stab the Night King in the back with a chicken bone from Drogon's dung or sign a peace treaty with him. I think GRRM is capable of any of both.
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Post by Karl Aksel on Jun 26, 2017 10:36:39 GMT
Personally I suspect Daenerys is Little Miss Author's Pet, as she has been given a whole lot for free, story-wise, already. I wouldn't be surprised if George has her in mind as top dog by the end.
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Post by Leo of Red Keep on Jun 26, 2017 12:41:19 GMT
Personally I suspect Daenerys is Little Miss Author's Pet, as she has been given a whole lot for free, story-wise, already. It would be a surprising treatment for a pet character. You'd think the author would give it more depth than just being granted "free stuff". He has actually said there is some of him in Tyrion and Sam while admitting he had to promise not to kill Arya, his wife's favourite character, before the last book. The connection to Sam makes me pretty sure the fat coward will find out how to cook dragon meat before the end of the story. I'd bet GRRM would love nothing more. I wonder what characteristics of Tyrion he is most afflicted with… That's a funny little game, by the way. Which Game of Thrones characters do you have most in you? (I won't answer that one, though) I'd be very surprised if Daenerys were given what she wants. The glorification of entitlement by bloodline is not something I expect the author to have in mind and she has shown no intention to step down from her Targaryen legacy, not even to mention how politically unwise it would be. Varys explicitly mentioned her "right family name" when he tried to convince Tyrion in S5E01. This is not where this story is headed, not with this writer.
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Post by Nightman on Jun 26, 2017 14:54:50 GMT
Personally I suspect Daenerys is Little Miss Author's Pet, as she has been given a whole lot for free, story-wise, already. It would be a surprising treatment for a pet character. You'd think the author would give it more depth than just being granted "free stuff". He has actually said there is some of him in Tyrion and Sam while admitting he had to promise not to kill Arya, his wife's favourite character, before the last book. The connection to Sam makes me pretty sure the fat coward will find out how to cook dragon meat before the end of the story. I'd bet GRRM would love nothing more. I wonder what characteristics of Tyrion he is most afflicted with… That's a funny little game, by the way. Which Game of Thrones characters do you have most in you? (I won't answer that one, though) I'd be very surprised if Daenerys were given what she wants. The glorification of entitlement by bloodline is not something I expect the author to have in mind and she has shown no intention to step down from her Targaryen legacy, not even to mention how politically unwise it would be. Varys explicitly mentioned her "right family name" when he tried to convince Tyrion in S5E01. This is not where this story is headed, not with this writer. Dany hasn't been given anything free. People like to claim this, but she went through hell as a child and in the first book. You think her embracing the Targaryens legacy is a bad thing, as if you think GRRM doesn't like them? Which House has several side novels dedicated to them? Who gets the most focus in TWOIAF? Which House is the only one receiving several generations of development, rather than just snippets of information? Even the beloved Starks haven't been treated so well by the author. If you think the Targs are getting the shaft after all that, you haven't been paying attention.
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Post by Leo of Red Keep on Jun 26, 2017 15:31:28 GMT
You think her embracing the Targaryens legacy is a bad thing, as if you think GRRM doesn't like them? Which House has several side novels dedicated to them? Who gets the most focus in TWOIAF? Which House is the only one receiving several generations of development, rather than just snippets of information? Even the beloved Starks haven't been treated so well by the author. If you think the Targs are getting the shaft after all that, you haven't been paying attention. GRRM likes history and has written loads of Targaryen background, fine. Most of it went to show that while the unification of the kingdoms under one rule stopped wars between them, succession squabbles replaced them with just as much bloodshed. The Targaryen history he wrote, for all entertaining it is, essentially negates the advantage the conquest claims to have brought. It is just another argument against the legacy of unrestrained power. I do not believe he will have that sort of principle win the game, especially not with the return of dragons. I could be wrong and he could show an idealistic, enlightened despot learning to rule wisely together with a funny dwarf and a dry-humoured eunuch or he could show just how such an attempt fails. I hope it won't even come to that. Be sure I'll be shitting all over his plate if he does. The reason I don't believe in Daenerys' success in the books is that Tyrion is turning into a villain and Varys has his own agenda there. Aegon will have to fail and no wise funny dwarf will be there to help the lizard bitch but a resentful, bitter man hell bent on vengeance. No, whichever way you turn it, the lizard bitch must die. I even have my own special wish on how:
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Post by Nightman on Jun 26, 2017 15:53:27 GMT
You think her embracing the Targaryens legacy is a bad thing, as if you think GRRM doesn't like them? Which House has several side novels dedicated to them? Who gets the most focus in TWOIAF? Which House is the only one receiving several generations of development, rather than just snippets of information? Even the beloved Starks haven't been treated so well by the author. If you think the Targs are getting the shaft after all that, you haven't been paying attention. GRRM likes history and has written loads of Targaryen background, fine. Most of it went to show that while the unification of the kingdoms under one rule stopped wars between them, succession squabbles replaced them with just as much bloodshed. The Targaryen history he wrote, for all entertaining it is, essentially negates the advantage the conquest claims to have brought. It is just another argument against the legacy of unrestrained power. I do not believe he will have that sort of principle win the game, especially not with the return of dragons. I could be wrong and he could show an idealistic, enlightened despot learning to rule wisely together with a funny dwarf and a dry-humoured eunuch or he could show just how such an attempt fails. I hope it won't even come to that. Be sure I'll be shitting all over his plate if he does. The reason I don't believe in Daenerys' success in the books is that Tyrion is turning into a villain and Varys has his own agenda there. Aegon will have to fail and no wise funny dwarf will be there to help the lizard bitch but a resentful, bitter man hell bent on vengeance. No, whichever way you turn it, the lizard bitch must die. I even have my own special wish on how: As bloody as the Targ years were, the Seven Kingdoms were still more peaceful than they were when they were independent. Unfortunately, I highly doubt the dragons will survive. As for Dany, I'm betting money she'll die giving birth to Jon's baby. It's more vague in the books, but the foreshadowing is obvious as seven hells in the show.
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Post by Leo of Red Keep on Jun 26, 2017 16:00:35 GMT
As for Dany, I'm betting money she'll die giving birth to Jon's baby. It's more vague in the books, but the foreshadowing is obvious as seven hells in the show. Eek! Why not have them adopt Lil'Sam instead?
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Post by Nightman on Jun 26, 2017 16:21:30 GMT
As for Dany, I'm betting money she'll die giving birth to Jon's baby. It's more vague in the books, but the foreshadowing is obvious as seven hells in the show. Eek! Why not have them adopt Lil'Sam instead? They can't just steal Gilly's baby from her, dude. You've been hanging around the Lannisters too much. Where are your morals?
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Post by Marv on Jun 29, 2017 13:02:39 GMT
He did exhibit extreme stupidity last season during battle of bastards by almost getting himself killed because of sheer stupidity. I sort of like Tywin Lannister and Stannis Baratheon style of commanding in which you try to avoid danger and live a little longer to win a battle. I think the most enjoyable is the warrior commander. We didn't really get to see it but I would have liked to see Robert Baratheon on the battlefield in his prime swinging that war hammer. I have a feeling it would be most impressive.
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Post by Aj_June on Jun 29, 2017 20:02:08 GMT
This was him as a rebel. He could have been impressive as lord commander. He was never impressive as king.
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