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Post by hi224 on Sept 13, 2017 16:37:50 GMT
I am wondering myself honestly.
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Post by MCDemuth on Sept 13, 2017 19:31:50 GMT
I do believe that some people see and experience UNEXPLAINED phenomenon.
Is it Ghosts or Demons or Psychokinesis or simply past events that were recorded into the environment being played back? Who Knows...
Yes, there have been hoaxes, and equipment problems, and people with vivid imaginations... But not everything can be attributed to these things.
But, there has been enough genuine "evidence" throughout history, that does suggest that something real is happening... However, to even believe in the possibility of the real claims, there are many questions that need answering and they are not being answered.
For example: People claim that things happen all the time, and when people go to investigate, nothing happens. So why are these events not repeatable? If a spirit wants people to leave a home, then they should want everyone to leave... or if they just want to make their presence known... Then they should be active when strangers are there too! It seems they are not...
After all the centuries of claims, there should be patterns that should help people prove that these things are really happening, and yet, here we are talking about how we just don't know if they are real or not.
To make matters worse, people ask "where is the evidence?"...
I've seen some shows and documentaries, where people seem to provide evidence. Some of which convinces me that there are real UNEXPLAINED phenomenon going on. In fact, I see new stories just about every week taking about new claims. And yet, it never goes any further... Scientists are not saying "finally, we have proof", and science books are not changing... So what does it take, for the world to accept this stuff?
Even the close minded skeptics are no help at all... You put put an orange in front of them, and tell them that is an orange, and they still won't believe it's an orange (Yes they are that bad)... And of course their hateful attitude makes it even worse, by telling a bunch of frightened and honest people they are "crazy" and "insane", instead of trying to show them some compassion...
As I said, I do believe that some people see and experience UNEXPLAINED phenomenon. What that is, is something I can't answer...
And sadly, it seems like we not going to get to the bottom of this mystery anytime soon.
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Post by hi224 on Sept 13, 2017 22:39:47 GMT
I do believe that some people see and experience UNEXPLAINED phenomenon. Is it Ghosts or Demons or Psychokinesis or simply past events that were recorded into the environment being played back? Who Knows... Yes, there have been hoaxes, and equipment problems, and people with vivid imaginations... But not everything can be attributed to these things. But, there has been enough genuine "evidence" throughout history, that does suggest that something real is happening... However, to even believe in the possibility of the real claims, there are many questions that need answering and they are not being answered. For example: People claim that things happen all the time, and when people go to investigate, nothing happens. So why are these events not repeatable? If a spirit wants people to leave a home, then they should want everyone to leave... or if they just want to make their presence known... Then they should be active when strangers are there too! It seems they are not... After all the centuries of claims, there should be patterns that should help people prove that these things are really happening, and yet, here we are talking about how we just don't know if they are real or not. To make matters worse, people ask "where is the evidence?"... I've seen some shows and documentaries, where people seem to provide evidence. Some of which convinces me that there are real UNEXPLAINED phenomenon going on. In fact, I see new stories just about every week taking about new claims. And yet, it never goes any further... Scientists are not saying "finally, we have proof", and science books are not changing... So what does it take, for the world to accept this stuff? Even the close minded skeptics are no help at all... You put put an orange in front of them, and tell them that is an orange, and they still won't believe it's an orange (Yes they are that bad)... And of course their hateful attitude makes it even worse, by telling a bunch of frightened and honest people they are "crazy" and "insane", instead of trying to show them some compassion... As I said, I do believe that some people see and experience UNEXPLAINED phenomenon. What that is, is something I can't answer... And sadly, it seems like we not going to get to the bottom of this mystery anytime soon. As far as skeptics are concerned thats just how some also cope. Ie you are crazy im rational and sane, sad aspect of society as well. I want to believe but i need proof basically.
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Post by politicidal on Sept 14, 2017 2:01:24 GMT
Not at the moment really. So many of the ones I heard either through fiction or those television 'documentaries' turned out to be bogus or just up in the air, I'm generally more skeptical though still fascinated by it.
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Post by mecano04 on Sept 14, 2017 15:06:04 GMT
I got a similar opinion to the one expressed by MCDemuth in the sense that there are unexplained phenomenons. The reasons they are unexplained or strange is either we don't have the equipment or we're stuck with old frozen mentalities. For example, a few years ago, scientists were in disbelief when they found a methane sea on the surface of Titan. ( www.nasa.gov/feature/jpl/cassini-explores-a-methane-sea-on-titan, recent link about the thing). At first, they didn't trust the data sent by the probe based on the fact that you can't have methane sea on Earth. That was weird because the logic was based on the assumption that our whole universe works the way it works here on Earth. To go further with the fact that sometimes our understanding is limited, what would be your reaction (or your stance), if I told you it's possible have boiling water at room temperature? By water I mean, plain tap water, nothing special about it. The answer : You need a bell jar and a vacuum pump. You place a glass of water under the jar, then activate the pump and after a few seconds, the water is gonna boil. The condition to see it happen is that you remove the air(pressure) from the top of the water. If I remember correctly, the lowest temperature from which you can see this phenomenon is around 15ºC/59ºF. Even if I'm like Saint-Thomas at times, I don't deny the fact people experienced something strange(or whichever word you want to use) but my issue is that in many cases, because it's strange, then the first and most credible answer becomes the paranormal. Thing is, many times, people haven't even eliminated most probable answers. I'm not talking about possible or far fetched, just probable, like the wind making some noise in a 200-300 years old home, instead of ghosts. That was just as an example, not as an answer to specific stories or claims. I must admit the only haunted houses I have been to are the ones found in fairs and amusement parks.
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Post by Nalkarj on Sept 14, 2017 15:46:53 GMT
Seriously, I tend to agree with mecano04 (and St. Thomas) on this one, but I too agree with MCDemuth on the possibility of the unexplained. "More things in heaven and on earth, Horatio...," etc. I agree with politicidal here too: "skeptical though still fascinated." I do have my own unexplained story, though, so I'd never be too overly skeptical.
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Post by hi224 on Sept 14, 2017 19:38:37 GMT
Honestly I agree with everyones possibilities.
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sagenesse
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Post by sagenesse on Oct 21, 2017 5:25:47 GMT
I've seen and heard spirits all my life. So yes there are spirits as I call them. They are here visiting or taking a peek at our world. I do not interact or communicate with spirits. Doing this is inviting demons too. I just accept the spirits and enjoy their visit.
A haunting, a real confirmed one is not a spirit. It's a demon who is there to cause fear and disruption. They are there for no good. Demons are very dangerous. I've been attacked by one once as a teen when I tried to interact with what I saw and heard. What happened was terrifying and I learned my lesson. Years later I had a friend ask to pray for me and she said she saw a demon attached to me. She prayed and after that full depression and other things went away.
Each haunting has to be looked at individually. I've talked openly and honestly with many people over my life about this. Sometimes it's nothing but wishful thinking. Some are so eager to see and hear things they "think" they heard the door open on its own. Reality it's just the air switching on, a draft and the door creaks. But other times it is something.
I have tons and tons of examples and stories. I hope to maybe one day write it down. But at the moment family who don't understand would very loudly protest and just cause too much trouble.
But the key thing is spirits are just here passing through. Just last week my family was standing on my inlaws porch with the front door open. We heard clear as day "Well, hello there!" My husband turned to enter the home and greet his mom. Then my husbands eyes got huge. He said "Wait. Moms car isn't even here." I had to laugh and calmly told him it was his grandma. She died 3 years ago. My kids are use to this too since they can see and hear things. My husband still freaks out. I reasurrued my husband it was ok but he still searched the house. As we left my mother inlaw gave us a large box of things that belonged to her mom, my husbands grandmother who greeted us. I guess grandma was there to see us get them. Lol What's funny is just that morning I was talking my oldest about how I had only seen her great grandma once which was the night she died. It was like she knew we needed to hear her again. I personally find this awesome and not frightening. But there have been scary moments but mainly at night. I often pray and ask God to keep them away at night. My younger two kids have this gift and don't like it. So I taught them years ago to ask not to see and hear things when alone. They rarely see and hear things. So it's my oldest and I who mainly live with this.
But anyway that was an example of a spirit visit. Not haunting. I've personally never been in a haunting which as I said was a demon causing trouble. I've had a demon attack but that was because I was stupid and invited it.
We have had long time vistior spirits that lasted on and off for a few years. But it's not a haunting. When my kids were young a little girl was often here. She appeared from the 1920s by how she dressed. She was about 8. She'd watch me cook and tend to my family. She'd listen to stories I read, play with our cats and scare the kids when they saw her. This was when I had to teach my kids to pray they didn't seen her. She slowly left as my kids grew. I haven't seen her in 5 years. I'd love to know who she was but that is just pure curiosity. I'm honored she wanted to visit us. No, our home isn't old. It's the grounds we live on that attract spirits, not homes. Our home use to be farm land.
Another long term visitor was a woman who I think is actually my guardian angel. She's been with me since I was very little and I thought she was my great grandmother but others I speak to about her feel she's an angel. She for many years would cover me up and tuck me in a night. Even now in my adult years. But I haven't seen or felt her in about 3 years. At times she seems near but nothing like she use to be which confuses me. I wonder why she has gone and ask God to let me see her again but I don't. So oh well.
So while some may think long term spirits are a haunting they are not because they are just there. They are not there to cause harm or trouble.
Hope this helps and I'm sure many will think I'm nuts. I have family who sure do. Lol
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Post by sagenesse on Oct 21, 2017 5:49:06 GMT
I do have one comment about the tv shows on ghost hunting. It's stupid and dangerous. These people are trying to communicate with demons and some have no idea what they are truely messing with. I also get the feeling a lot are scripted and edited for excitement.
One last comment about homes where people claim to have been forced out of yet others are ok. What happens here is simple in my mind. Some are more sensitive to spirits and demons. My daughter who is very sensitive like I am lives in a dorm that was part of a hospital about 100 years ago. I know it sounds like a horror movie set but it's true. There is a floor where many claim to hear knocking and noises. One room is actually often empty. Some girls don't hear the knocking. Like one roommate might and the other doesn't. It's odd but some are more sensitive. The dorm doesnhave demon activity too. My daughter has a friend who is very sensitive like we are. So remember demons can make you think you hear or see things. So you may have one person claim the front door blew off the hinges the night the whole family fled the house but yet upon examining the door everyone else sees nothing. Demons are liars and fool people. So that's my explanation for why people who tell the famous home hauntings have the current residences say we don't hear a things. Plus keep in mind some demons follow the family. Not the house. Or the demon is banished as seen in some movies & documentaries.
I honestly don't think someone who comes public with a haunting is doing it to make a book or movie deal. When I speak to people about my experiences I'm often looked at like I'm out of my mind and I hate that. I admit this is one reason I don't want to write down all I've experienced. My daughter and her college friends beg me to. But family will harshly judge me and so will many others. I don't want that. But I do enjoy sharing because I find it's fascinating. So it's a huge risk for people to come forward. It takes courage. I always give these families the benifit of the doubt. No one wants to be called a liar and especially those who continue to tell their story for many many years. Each time they talk people call them liars. That's got to hurt.
My husband was a big time skeptic. He took my stories with a grain of salt for sure. But as our kids saw and heard things we had to talk more about it. He has come to accept it and that's the best he can do. I'll never forget the day our little girl spirit touched him. I saw her standing next to him. I acknowledged her with just my usual smile and that was that. Our dog greeted her too but I didn't point that out to my husband. The little girl stood near our bed which tugged the blankets ans scared my husband. I still didn't say a word. But he kept looking next to him. Then he jumped as she poked him. She just wanted to be acknowledged. I gave her a stern look like I'd give my kids and she seemed to giggle hard even though I heard nothing. I had to laugh and told him what happened. He was beyond freaked out. But didn't say much. She left him alone. He didn't ever question us again. So I think she helped us. Lol
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Post by sagenesse on Oct 21, 2017 6:19:02 GMT
Seriously, I tend to agree with mecano04 (and St. Thomas) on this one, but I too agree with MCDemuth on the possibility of the unexplained. "More things in heaven and on earth, Horatio...," etc. I agree with politicidal here too: "skeptical though still fascinated." I do have my own unexplained story, though, so I'd never be too overly skeptical. Interesting story. Sounds more to me like telepathic talking than anything. You and your dad are connected. This is often discovered in childhood. Kinda like twins who always know this or that. It's common. My husband and I mentally talk often. Sadly he also feels my chronic pain. It's interesting for sure. I'm not sure why you'd hear each other scream out. My guess is you two were just alone enjoying the moment and wished the other was there to enjoy it. So your minds called each other. I did this to my mom a few times when I was a kid and spent the night. She hated it saying I kept her up. Lol
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Post by MCDemuth on Oct 21, 2017 20:59:34 GMT
I do have one comment about the TV Shows on ghost hunting. It's stupid and dangerous. These people are trying to communicate with demons and some have no idea what they are truly messing with. First I have to note that I am not religious, and I am skeptical in that I would require proof to be a believer, however, as I noted in an earlier post, that I do believe there are unexplained events that people do experience, so I am open minded... So assuming for a moment here, that everything we are taught about the afterlife is all true... (With that said...) I've seen a few shows, where they feature the occasional know-it-all sending spirits to heaven... This concerns me greatly. 1.) If a spirit was meant to be in heaven, I think it should be able to get there on it's own, or at least with the assistance of God... So how do we know that any Earth bound spirit, should be messed with, and sent up to heaven by the living? 2.) And we have heard stories about evil dead people... and demons pretending to be friendly... WHAT HAPPENS IF SOME STUPID HUMAN SENDS A DEMON TO HEAVEN? Will that destroy the pleasant afterlife environment that we are all taught to believe in? I don't think even hardened skeptics would want to go to heaven and find it to be "Hell 2"! Humans need to leave Earthbound spirits alone... After all, what right do we have to go against God's afterlife design and wishes?
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Post by Deleted on Oct 22, 2017 11:56:14 GMT
I don`t know but i don't dismiss the possibility of hauntings
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Post by Nalkarj on Oct 22, 2017 16:23:08 GMT
Interesting story. Sounds more to me like telepathic talking than anything. You and your dad are connected. This is often discovered in childhood. Kinda like twins who always know this or that. It's common. My husband and I mentally talk often. Sadly he also feels my chronic pain. It's interesting for sure. I'm not sure why you'd hear each other scream out. My guess is you two were just alone enjoying the moment and wished the other was there to enjoy it. So your minds called each other. I did this to my mom a few times when I was a kid and spent the night. She hated it saying I kept her up. Lol Thanks, Sagenesse. The thing with this story is, I'm not sure what it is. I never really put it down as a "ghost story" because I simply don't know. With that said, I suppose I never really considered the possibility that it may be some kind of psychic connection because I couldn't imagine my father with any kind of "psychic powers." Dad's a real salt-of-the-earth, pull-up-your-own-bootstraps kind of guy, with no real interest in the paranormal and no past history of anything spooky. To wit, he simply doesn't believe in any of that stuff; even when there's something that may be supernatural that he's around, none of it affects him personally. I have had my own "psychic" experiences that I can't explain: hearing thoughts before they're spoken, knowing when someone's going to call, feeling of someone watch, etc. Now, all of these could be explained away rationally, so I'm not going to presuppose a paranormal explanation for them; I'd simply think that I'd be more susceptible to these events than Dad. (I also love this sort of thing and purposely go searching out for haunted houses, etc., so there's that, too.) So--what is it? What explains the Venice story? I still have no idea; it is, as I've written before, not exactly "story-shaped," sadly, so I don't know if I'll ever find an explanation, to be honest.
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Post by sagenesse on Oct 23, 2017 2:21:03 GMT
I do have one comment about the TV Shows on ghost hunting. It's stupid and dangerous. These people are trying to communicate with demons and some have no idea what they are truly messing with. First I have to note that I am not religious, and I am skeptical in that I would require proof to be a believer, however, as I noted in an earlier post, that I do believe there are unexplained events that people do experience, so I am open minded... So assuming for a moment here, that everything we are taught about the afterlife is all true... (With that said...) I've seen a few shows, where they feature the occasional know-it-all sending spirits to heaven... This concerns me greatly. 1.) If a spirit was meant to be in heaven, I think it should be able to get there on it's own, or at least with the assistance of God... So how do we know that any Earth bound spirit, should be messed with, and sent up to heaven by the living? 2.) And we have heard stories about evil dead people... and demons pretending to be friendly... WHAT HAPPENS IF SOME STUPID HUMAN SENDS A DEMON TO HEAVEN? Will that destroy the pleasant afterlife environment that we are all taught to believe in? I don't think even hardened skeptics would want to go to heaven and find it to be "Hell 2"! Humans need to leave Earthbound spirits alone... After all, what right do we have to go against God's afterlife design and wishes? I agree with you about the shows where people claim to help spirits go to Heaven. I've always struggled to believe that. Mainly due to my faith. I wasn't raised Christian but did at rare times attend church. I married into a deeply religious family. They are Christians. Southern Baptist to be exact. I too am now Souther Baptist or at least attend a Southern Baptist church. Most Christian religions are the same in my book. Anyway I believe once we die we either go to Heaven or Hell. Nothing even a demon can stop us. We die and boom we are judged by God. I believe that with all my heart. So I strongly question the claims of "earth bound spirits." A demon isn't stronger than God and prevent God from calling one home even if that home is hell. My faith is one thing that keeps me from speaking out more about what I've experienced. Family would especially be quick to say I'm seeing only demons. My brother inlaw is a pastor and we've talked a lot about this. My daughter actually lost a friend over it which is sad. My brother inlaw believes as I do. We die and we go to either place. Plus after we die why would we want to leave Heaven even for a visit? So there are still deep questions we have. He also knows many who have seen things like I do. He agreees spirits (ghosts) are talked about in the Bible. Even Jesus is seen as a spirit at one point then later eats & drinks to prove he is human again and returned. So I guess we will never fully know.
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Post by mecano04 on Oct 24, 2017 12:16:48 GMT
sagenesse Considering pretty much everybody asked their questions it might feel like an inquisition at this point but it's not my goal. I do have a few, if you wish to answer them, to get a better understanding. My goal is not to debunk anything. 1. So demons are malevolent and spirits/ghosts are benevolent. Is it always black and white, good or evil, or is there some neutral entities/beings? 2. If there is some neutral entities, then would you be kind enough to make(list) a full spectrum of entities and based on much they are good or evil? 3. So far, it seems you got spirits and demons. From a religious standpoint, are spirits what we would call angels or are those two different beings? If they are distinct entities, does it mean angels are a rare sight? 4. Another related to religion. If God created our universe, does that mean that all spirits and demons originated from God's doing or are there entities that somehow "emanated" from his doing like side effects, for a lack of a better wording? 5. Just to make it clear, can spirits and demons interact with us and eventually harm us if we don't want them to or don't invite them t do so? 6. On another tone, most incredible thing you've witnessed (can be good or bad but it just blew you away)?
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Post by Terrapin Station on Oct 24, 2017 12:48:22 GMT
I want it to be true, but my fundamental disposition is that of a pretty hardcore skeptic, to an extent where I'm sure I come across like a "close-minded skeptic."
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sagenesse
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Post by sagenesse on Oct 28, 2017 4:12:32 GMT
I'll answer your questions but I'm far from an expert and mainly know what I've experienced and read. Plus I'm sure many may disagree so please don't take this as a perfect answer.
1. So demons are malevolent and spirits/ghosts are benevolent. Is it always black and white, good or evil, or is there some neutral entities/beings? - from my experience and the experience of others that I've spoken to, yes. But others may disagree saying spirits who died violent death carry their anger and can be violent. I've never personally seen or experienced that.
2. If there is some neutral entities, then would you be kind enough to make(list) a full spectrum of entities and based on much they are good or evil? - I wouldn't feel even qualified to try such a thing. I know what I've experienced and there is so much out there that I don't know.
3. So far, it seems you got spirits and demons. From a religious standpoint, are spirits what we would call angels or are those two different beings? If they are distinct entities, does it mean angels are a rare sight?- angels and spirits are two separate beings. An angel is God created to serve God and protect us. Demons are angels who reject God and decide to serve the devil instead. They live to destroy. Both angels & demons have never been a living spirit like us. They are and always will be nonhuman. But they can assume a form as a human for a moment. As the Bible says "entertaining angel disguise". I have had a few encounters with angels and a few are published in a book. If you read angel encounters you will see the encounters are always for a short moment. I personally have never seen a demon in human form but my guess is they only go in human form when they possess people.
4. Another related to religion. If God created our universe, does that mean that all spirits and demons originated from God's doing or are there entities that somehow "emanated" from his doing like side effects, for a lack of a better wording?- I believe God created all. He doesn't set out to create demons as I said. He created angels and they by free will turn against Him. God gives us all a choice.
5. Just to make it clear, can spirits and demons interact with us and eventually harm us if we don't want them to or don't invite them t do so?- As far as I understand spirits can not harm us but I could be wrong. Again I'm going on experience. Demons can and will harm us. That is their goal. They are here to destroy. As my former pastor said if you are serving God and not feeling under the attack then you are not serving God. The devil wants to stop us and the closer to God you get, the more attacks you will feel. But staying in God gives you the power to stop them. There is always a battle going on. As I write this I think of TobyMacs song Hey Devil.
6. On another tone, most incredible thing you've witnessed (can be good or bad but it just blew you away? - there are way too many that have blown me away. Each one did because it's a message from the other side. But what first came to my mind was once while walking past my sons door away I saw our cat leaning into a small hand and purring loudly. I assumed of course it was my son. Our cat was nudging and rubbing his head hard into this hand. I paused and watched a moment. I walked down the hall way and into the livingroom where my three kids were gathered playing a game. There was no way one of my kids could have passed me so I stood in shock. My oldest asked what was wrong and I just said "I thought one of you was in (my sons nsme) room." They said no and asked why. I turned and peeked into my sons room and our cat now was actually leaning and snuggled against nothing. My kids followed me and I explained what I had seen. It was likely our little girl spirit. My oldest who sees them as much as I do replied how our cat loves our little girl spirit. The reason this blew me away was I saw the hand and arm so clear. Plus our cat clearly felt her too as he purred so loudly. It wasn't scary it just startled me how I mistook her for a second for one of my own.
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Post by sagenesse on Oct 28, 2017 5:45:13 GMT
I want it to be true, but my fundamental disposition is that of a pretty hardcore skeptic, to an extent where I'm sure I come across like a "close-minded skeptic." I'm currently readings "The demonologist the extraordinary career of Ed & Lorainne Warren." It's a pretty fascinating book. I started reading it last Halloween season and never finished. Anyway I just read a quote that made me think of what you said terra. Ed says about people who don't believe is they are actually saying they don't know the data of the subjects of hauntings or spirits. Because it's out there either hidden by the government who actually has hired them many times or people just haven't looked closely at certain cases. Last night as I was reading how our government personally contacted The Warren's to do an investigation I was stunned. I mean here we have officials who are so spooked and frustrated that they call on people who have been accused of being a hoax. Then there is the fact that we even have church's like the Catholic Church who does openly acknowledge the existence of something unhuman like demons. So we have two trusted sources here whole religious group and government who say yes to this stuff. That should be enough for any skeptic. I'm still blown away Army officials would call on "ghost hunters" lol The story itself is funny. Pretty much a pickpocket spirit. The head of the army group basically said he can't let important people over because their wallets go missing. I highly recommend the book. I have trouble agreeing on some points but these are highly skilled demonolgists. I will say I don't believe they are a hoax or scammers. My grandparents were actually good friends of theirs and I met them once at about age 10 or so. I didn't realize who they were till after my grandparents died. I knew them as grandma's best friends or by their first names. I didn't start to look into who The Warren's were till a few years ago and was stunned when I saw their photo. My dad confirmed it. They were very genuine honest people. My dad had a few interesting stories about talking to them a few times but my grandma always put a stop to it. "We don't quiz you on your job do we?" I hate reading nasty things about them. My grandparents spoke highly of them. I researched all the nasty stuff people claim they did and refuse to believe it. So anyway the book is great and I sure with I could sit when them and talk. It's sad Ed's gone. I wish I know how Lorraine was. My dad never knew them as well as his parents.
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Post by looking4klingons on Dec 9, 2017 5:43:47 GMT
I do believe that some people see and experience UNEXPLAINED phenomenon. Is it Ghosts or Demons or Psychokinesis or simply past events that were recorded into the environment being played back? Who Knows... Yes, there have been hoaxes, and equipment problems, and people with vivid imaginations... But not everything can be attributed to these things. But, there has been enough genuine "evidence" throughout history, that does suggest that something real is happening... However, to even believe in the possibility of the real claims, there are many questions that need answering and they are not being answered. For example: People claim that things happen all the time, and when people go to investigate, nothing happens. So why are these events not repeatable? If a spirit wants people to leave a home, then they should want everyone to leave... or if they just want to make their presence known... Then they should be active when strangers are there too! It seems they are not... After all the centuries of claims, there should be patterns that should help people prove that these things are really happening, and yet, here we are talking about how we just don't know if they are real or not. To make matters worse, people ask "where is the evidence?"... I've seen some shows and documentaries, where people seem to provide evidence. Some of which convinces me that there are real UNEXPLAINED phenomenon going on. In fact, I see new stories just about every week taking about new claims. And yet, it never goes any further... Scientists are not saying "finally, we have proof", and science books are not changing... So what does it take, for the world to accept this stuff? Even the close minded skeptics are no help at all... You put put an orange in front of them, and tell them that is an orange, and they still won't believe it's an orange (Yes they are that bad)... And of course their hateful attitude makes it even worse, by telling a bunch of frightened and honest people they are "crazy" and "insane", instead of trying to show them some compassion... As I said, I do believe that some people see and experience UNEXPLAINED phenomenon. What that is, is something I can't answer... And sadly, it seems like we not going to get to the bottom of this mystery anytime soon. It’s because the invisible forces behind the real events, their only goal is to confuse and mislead. They really don’t want solid, repeatable evidence of them to exist. That would probably cause even the staunchest skeptics and atheists to consider god a possibility, and they don’t want anyone searching for truth.
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Post by faustus5 on Dec 9, 2017 14:19:51 GMT
I am wondering myself honestly. No. As Sean Carroll is fond of pointing out, our current understanding of physics is so deep that we already understand how almost every physical transaction in the universe works. There just isn't any room or need for belief for paranormal forces. They literally have no jobs to perform.
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