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Post by harpospoke on Oct 28, 2017 2:13:29 GMT
If it were the same then audience reception wouldn't be equivalently positive. The ones that are often considered the worst MCU movies would be The Incredible Hulk, Captain America, Iron Man 2, Thor 2 and Ant-man. None of them are bad movies. They're not great either but amongst bad superhero movies none of them could be included. Critics ripped Inhumans to shreds, it's probably gonna be cancelled. They also tore into Iron Fist as well and no coincidence that those two properties audiences don't like. I for real don't see how anything you wrote refutes anything I've said. The fact is: when Disney needs a property to deliver at the box office they seem to always get almost laughably high marks (see: Force Awakens, The). In fact Metacritic is often a key indicator of this disparity and often presents a much more realistic picture than RT, which at best is a gross distortion of movie criticism and a detriment to it. How can Metacritic only "often" be right if there is quality in art to be measured? Interesting how we only believe in these claimed "measurements" when we agree with them. RT doesn't match your opinion....Disney is paying critics! (but not paying the same people for Metacritic apparently)
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Post by harpospoke on Oct 28, 2017 2:15:17 GMT
True. But they seem to have settled into a slightly less lofty plateau than before. Instead of every movie being among the best in the history of animation, they seem to be alternating between really good to ok to great. To be fair, an era that is represented by 'Ratatouille' to 'Toy Story 3' was bit of an unusual era even for Pixar. Case in point, a lot of people will say that 'A Bug's Life' isn't quite on par with early Pixar classics. Also, 'The Good Dinosaur' got into nasty production issues and 'Cars 3' is... well... a 'Cars' film. I never got what was supposed to be wrong with A Bug's Life. I think it's fantastic. Frankly I like it a lot more than Ratatouille.
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Post by blockbusted on Oct 28, 2017 2:16:20 GMT
I for real don't see how anything you wrote refutes anything I've said. The fact is: when Disney needs a property to deliver at the box office they seem to always get almost laughably high marks (see: Force Awakens, The). In fact Metacritic is often a key indicator of this disparity and often presents a much more realistic picture than RT, which at best is a gross distortion of movie criticism and a detriment to it. How can Metacritic only "often" be right if there is quality in art to be measured? Interesting how we only believe in these claimed "measurements" when we agree with them. RT doesn't match your opinion....Disney is paying critics! (but not paying the same people for Metacritic apparently) Also, Metacritic gave 'Dragonball Evolution' 45/100 and gave 'Speed Racer' 37/100. I mean, say what you will about the latter, but film looked like people were putting actual effort into it, which is more than I can say about the former.
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Post by blockbusted on Oct 28, 2017 2:22:05 GMT
To be fair, an era that is represented by 'Ratatouille' to 'Toy Story 3' was bit of an unusual era even for Pixar. Case in point, a lot of people will say that 'A Bug's Life' isn't quite on par with early Pixar classics. Also, 'The Good Dinosaur' got into nasty production issues and 'Cars 3' is... well... a 'Cars' film. I never got what was supposed to be wrong with A Bug's Life. I think it's fantastic. Frankly I like it a lot more than Ratatouille. Oh, it was a great film, alright. It was just that films that followed were even better that 'A Bug's Life' somewhat looked pale by comparison.
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Post by poelzig on Oct 28, 2017 5:30:56 GMT
You and a lot of other haters are salivating over that caper. "Oh God, let it be Captain Marvel!" Hee hee hee... if Cpt Marvel gets good reviews will formersomething say it's because of artificial boosters? Because you know, it has a female protagonist just like Wonder Woman Of course he won't. He's a mcu fan therefor hypocrisy is..... well you know. As far as when will the marvel bubble burst? How long were those mindless dreck Idol shows insanely popular? Close to a decade? Longer? No one ever went broke underestimating the intelligence of the American public or the world public for that matter. Shiny images, colorful costumes, loud explosions without fear of any character the kids love being hurt and most importantly jokes that can be understood by toddlers as well as grandparents and everyone in between is a can't miss recipe for success. As long as the mcu sticks to that basic formula and hires somewhat competent directors the masses will laugh their selves silly and keep buying tickets. The fact a larger percentage of people know Drax said "I have famously huge turds" than know the famous quote from my paragraph above speaks volumes. Not to be condescending but how many posters reading this even know there was a famous quote above? I could name the people here who most likely do but that would only make other people complain to the mod so I digress. Toss in the fact a "critic" these days is anyone with access to an internet connection who is capable of using spellcheck and the marvel bubble is safe. I myself have enjoyed several mcu movies despite the fact the majority are as imminently forgettable as the sweet or salty snacks consumed while watching them.
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Peter B. Parker
Sophomore
Watch the hands, not the mouth
@babygroot
Posts: 853
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Post by Peter B. Parker on Oct 28, 2017 7:48:59 GMT
Marvel continues to pay critics to give their crappy movies good reviews.
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Post by scabab on Oct 28, 2017 11:32:48 GMT
How can Metacritic only "often" be right if there is quality in art to be measured? Interesting how we only believe in these claimed "measurements" when we agree with them. RT doesn't match your opinion....Disney is paying critics! (but not paying the same people for Metacritic apparently) Also, Metacritic gave 'Dragonball Evolution' 45/100 and gave 'Speed Racer' 37/100. I mean, say what you will about the latter, but film looked like people were putting actual effort into it, which is more than I can say about the former. Dragon Ball Evolution hurt my soul. There was so much potential to be had and it was ruined entirely.
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Post by formersamhmd on Oct 28, 2017 11:34:20 GMT
Also, Metacritic gave 'Dragonball Evolution' 45/100 and gave 'Speed Racer' 37/100. I mean, say what you will about the latter, but film looked like people were putting actual effort into it, which is more than I can say about the former. Dragon Ball Evolution hurt my soul. There was so much potential to be had and it was ruined entirely. Eh, I knew it was going to bomb. Dragonball isn't cut out for movies, it should be either animated or a big-budget miniseries or something.
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Post by scabab on Oct 28, 2017 11:45:02 GMT
Dragon Ball Evolution hurt my soul. There was so much potential to be had and it was ruined entirely. Eh, I knew it was going to bomb. Dragonball isn't cut out for movies, it should be either animated or a big-budget miniseries or something. It was always going to bomb, it was a destined failure from the start when they made Goku some Peter Parker wannabe who went to school, got picked on and had a crush on a girl. The complete exact opposite of the character. I do think if it was done right, with the proper budget, the proper talent working on it who were familiar with the series and them not being afraid to adapt the series properly and accurately like what all these Marvel movies do then it could have been a big thing. It's got everything it really needs to be successful, it'd be like the new Thor I suppose, a colourful movie, nice and unique looking sets, plenty of humour, large scale action scenes, likable characters etc. Not likely to happen though so yeah they should probably stick to the animated movies they've been doing.
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Post by blockbusted on Oct 28, 2017 13:23:49 GMT
Eh, I knew it was going to bomb. Dragonball isn't cut out for movies, it should be either animated or a big-budget miniseries or something. It was always going to bomb, it was a destined failure from the start when they made Goku some Peter Parker wannabe who went to school, got picked on and had a crush on a girl. The complete exact opposite of the character. I do think if it was done right, with the proper budget, the proper talent working on it who were familiar with the series and them not being afraid to adapt the series properly and accurately like what all these Marvel movies do then it could have been a big thing. It's got everything it really needs to be successful, it'd be like the new Thor I suppose, a colourful movie, nice and unique looking sets, plenty of humour, large scale action scenes, likable characters etc. Not likely to happen though so yeah they should probably stick to the animated movies they've been doing. I could tell you that you're a pretty big 'Dragon Ball' fan by looking at your avatar.
I feel sorry for Brian Tyler. His score deserved so much better.
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Post by Tristan's Journal on Oct 28, 2017 13:57:33 GMT
How can Metacritic only "often" be right if there is quality in art to be measured? Interesting how we only believe in these claimed "measurements" when we agree with them. RT doesn't match your opinion....Disney is paying critics! (but not paying the same people for Metacritic apparently) Also, Metacritic gave 'Dragonball Evolution' 45/100 and gave 'Speed Racer' 37/100. I mean, say what you will about the latter, but film looked like people were putting actual effort into it, which is more than I can say about the former. No, no, no, how often have you people be humored that Metacritic and RT do not award scores but only calculate average scores of the professional critics they have contracted...? It's not that difficult a concept. RT is usually a bit more representative as it's average scores are usually based on three times the critics Metacritic has (often the same critics btw). RT additionally (next to the average score) has also the infamous Tomatometer gimmick which simply is the average binary system of thumbs down or up (rotten/fresh) and often yielding absurd high and low results. It's a crap system but it's their unique selling gimmick, so that's that.
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Post by Hauntedknight87 on Oct 28, 2017 15:20:54 GMT
Well first, the idea that critics are somehow unaware that they really don't like Marvel movies is a nice fantasy. But that's just a device to avoid admitting Marvel is doing a good job. Naturally critics, awards, and box office are always wrong when it doesn't support our opinion. But at some point Marvel will stumble. It happens to everyone. That they've gone 17 films in a row without a critical dud is astounding already and is probably a record in Hollywood. Pretty much nothing at this point. Some thought it was going to Guardians of the Galaxy, some thought it was going to be Ant-Man, some thought it was going to be Doctor Strange. Really, after Scott Derrickson of all people delivered, and looking at their upcoming movies and directors, It's safe to say that they won't release a dud for awhile. Oh, and Ant-Man almost burst the bubble. I remember that it started with a 63% when reviews first came. Now it's at 82%. It is pretty amazing. All those examples you cited were risks and predicted to be "this is where Marvel will fail"...and they pulled it off each time. And if Pixar recovered after ‘Cars 2’, Marvel certainly can. I don't think Pixar did recover. Probably going to get a lot of hate for saying this but a part of me actually hopes that the entire super hero craze bubble burst. Marvel, DC and fox. Both the movies and TV shows. If anything just to give us a period of peace. At least 30 years and then reboot it all. I don't get the logic. It sounds elitist. You don't like a genre so you don't want it to be available to anyone else either? There is this other option I heard about... ...not buying a ticket to movies you don't want to watch? I know it sounds crazy, but it could work. Well, and because we live in a "Rotten Tomatoes" society the scores are laughably immodest. "98%" of people looking back in twenty years will think it's hilarious and trashy and pathetic that we put any of these popcorn movies on this much of a pedestal, culturally or otherwise. And I mean all of it, not just the dreaded MCU. It's GOOFY. When I was growing up nobody took any of this crap seriously. We took shit like Saving Private Ryan seriously. That's not true. "Popcorn movies" are not liked by hipsters, but the general public loves them more than the "Oscar bait" movies. T2 is the best remembered movie of 1991...not all those movies the hipsters love. We tend to remember the comedies more than the dramas most of the time too. Even go back to the 30s....the 2 most remembered movies from 1933 are King Kong and Duck Soup imo. Where are all those "serious" movies? Elitist? I wasn't demanding it. I only said that a PART of me wants that. I've got nothing against CBM, hell I loved them so far... well some of them at least. Be honest here. You know just as well as I do that it's starting to become a overly saturated market. Especially since Fox, Warner Bros and Marvel Studios are going to release multiple CBM in the same year with Marvel even planning FOUR films a year. I'm calling it now: It the next 10 years these films will start bombing more than the United States bombing a country of brown people.
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Post by coldenhaulfield on Oct 28, 2017 15:36:04 GMT
Well first, the idea that critics are somehow unaware that they really don't like Marvel movies is a nice fantasy. But that's just a device to avoid admitting Marvel is doing a good job. Naturally critics, awards, and box office are always wrong when it doesn't support our opinion. But at some point Marvel will stumble. It happens to everyone. That they've gone 17 films in a row without a critical dud is astounding already and is probably a record in Hollywood. It is pretty amazing. All those examples you cited were risks and predicted to be "this is where Marvel will fail"...and they pulled it off each time. I don't think Pixar did recover. I don't get the logic. It sounds elitist. You don't like a genre so you don't want it to be available to anyone else either? There is this other option I heard about... ...not buying a ticket to movies you don't want to watch? I know it sounds crazy, but it could work. That's not true. "Popcorn movies" are not liked by hipsters, but the general public loves them more than the "Oscar bait" movies. T2 is the best remembered movie of 1991...not all those movies the hipsters love. We tend to remember the comedies more than the dramas most of the time too. Even go back to the 30s....the 2 most remembered movies from 1933 are King Kong and Duck Soup imo. Where are all those "serious" movies? Elitist? I wasn't demanding it. I only said that a PART of me wants that. I've got nothing against CBM, hell I loved them so far... well some of them at least. Be honest here. You know just as well as I do that it's starting to become a overly saturated market. Especially since Fox, Warner Bros and Marvel Studios are going to release multiple CBM in the same year with Marvel even planning FOUR films a year. I'm calling it now: It the next 10 years these films will start bombing more than the United States bombing a country of brown people. This guy gets it.
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Post by Tristan's Journal on Oct 28, 2017 15:56:56 GMT
Elitist? I wasn't demanding it. I only said that a PART of me wants that. I've got nothing against CBM, hell I loved them so far... well some of them at least. Be honest here. You know just as well as I do that it's starting to become a overly saturated market. Especially since Fox, Warner Bros and Marvel Studios are going to release multiple CBM in the same year with Marvel even planning FOUR films a year. I'm calling it now: It the next 10 years these films will start bombing more than the United States bombing a country of brown people. This guy gets it. indeed, how could you ever not trust such a honest face and sweet benevolent smile?
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Post by ThatGuy on Oct 28, 2017 16:15:57 GMT
It was asked before but it needs to be asked again. When will critics finally say they've had enough? When does the bubble burst? I mean...if a freaking Thor movie can't kill the streak...what will? I think Marvel is in its glory right now. It would take a lot for the "streak" to break at this point.
Maybe if Avengers 4 is seen as being too big, too many characters, too much CGI, too messy, that could be the start of a down turn. But I doubt it.
I think its more likely that the entire genre, Marvel, DC, all of them, will start to go downward simultaneously, the way westerns did.
I sometimes think we might be better off if we did go back to 1 or 2 super hero movies a year, instead of 4 or 5. Too much of a good thing and all that...
We were never at 1 or 2 superhero movies a year. Maybe in the 80s. The thing now is that they are more noticeable because it is the in thing. Also, Marvel Studios is a movie studio that only makes Marvel movies. Of course you are going to constantly get comic book movies from them. That's what they do. You'll never see Marvel's The Girl on the Train.
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Post by ThatGuy on Oct 28, 2017 16:32:35 GMT
Eh, I knew it was going to bomb. Dragonball isn't cut out for movies, it should be either animated or a big-budget miniseries or something. It was always going to bomb, it was a destined failure from the start when they made Goku some Peter Parker wannabe who went to school, got picked on and had a crush on a girl. The complete exact opposite of the character. I do think if it was done right, with the proper budget, the proper talent working on it who were familiar with the series and them not being afraid to adapt the series properly and accurately like what all these Marvel movies do then it could have been a big thing. It's got everything it really needs to be successful, it'd be like the new Thor I suppose, a colourful movie, nice and unique looking sets, plenty of humour, large scale action scenes, likable characters etc. Not likely to happen though so yeah they should probably stick to the animated movies they've been doing. That's what they were going for. You can see they were really trying to make a Spider-man movie. It had that look. I mean, why was Gohan even there if not to be Uncle Ben. Then they tried to merge the Pilaf, King Piccolo, and Piccolo Jr. sagas.
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Post by Hauntedknight87 on Oct 28, 2017 16:59:05 GMT
indeed, how could you ever not trust such a honest face and sweet benevolent smile? Aw you're making me blush! 😊
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Post by harpospoke on Oct 28, 2017 17:29:53 GMT
if Cpt Marvel gets good reviews will formersomething say it's because of artificial boosters? Because you know, it has a female protagonist just like Wonder Woman Of course he won't. He's a fan therefor hypocrisy is..... well you know. FIFY All fans act like that. Or did you miss all the things DC fans complain about with Marvel movies that also happen in DC movies? JL is about to have " jokes", " character coming back from the dead", and " faceless horde attack"....can you guess how many DC fans will be consistent and claim those are "flaws"? As far as when will the marvel bubble burst? How long were those mindless dreck Idol shows insanely popular? Close to a decade? Longer? No one ever went broke underestimating the intelligence of the American public or the world public for that matter. Shiny images, colorful costumes, loud explosions without fear of any character the kids love being hurt and most importantly jokes that can be understood by toddlers as well as grandparents and everyone in between is a can't miss recipe for success. As long as the mcu sticks to that basic formula and hires somewhat competent directors the masses will laugh their selves silly and keep buying tickets. The fact a larger percentage of people know Drax said "I have famously huge turds" than know the famous quote from my paragraph above speaks volumes. Not to be condescending but how many posters reading this even know there was a famous quote above? I could name the people here who most likely do but that would only make other people complain to the mod so I digress. Toss in the fact a "critic" these days is anyone with access to an internet connection who is capable of using spellcheck and the marvel bubble is safe. I myself have enjoyed several mcu movies despite the fact the majority are as imminently forgettable as the sweet or salty snacks consumed while watching them. Wow...the elitism is strong with this post. "The masses" are of course stupid because they don't share the taste of the hipsters who feel they should be in charge of all entertainment. How dare they not know the quotes that are deemed "worthy"? And of course the usual turning on any critic who doesn't fall in line with the hipster opinion of art. How dare they enjoy fun movies! RT additionally (next to the average score) has also the infamous Tomatometer gimmick which simply is the average binary system of thumbs down or up (rotten/fresh) and often yielding absurd high and low results. It's a crap system but it's their unique selling gimmick, so that's that. I find the RT score far more useful than the "average score". I use reviews to decide whether or not to see a movie after all....not to tell me how much I "should" like a movie. The average score is pretty worthless to me. Elitist? I wasn't demanding it. I only said that a PART of me wants that. I've got nothing against CBM, hell I loved them so far... well some of them at least. Be honest here. You know just as well as I do that it's starting to become a overly saturated market. Especially since Fox, Warner Bros and Marvel Studios are going to release multiple CBM in the same year with Marvel even planning FOUR films a year. I'm calling it now: It the next 10 years these films will start bombing more than the United States bombing a country of brown people. I don't believe in a "saturated market" unless they start putting out bad movies or repeating themselves. That gets boring and of course the public will get tired of it. That's what kills popular genres. If they stay creative in the genre it will continue to thrive. The public doesn't get tired of TV shows that come out once a week. Game of Thrones has 10 episodes a year until recently and the fans are in mourning every time a season ends. 6 CB movies a year isn't that big a time commitment. Thor 3 is different so that is going to have a positive effect on genre. (And....Nazis were "brown people"?)
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Post by Tristan's Journal on Oct 28, 2017 17:41:43 GMT
(And....Nazis were "brown people"?) you have a strong propensity for blatant misinterpretation and good old ignorance. Coming from an innocent bystander: 1. No evidently that was not meant by his statement. 2. And yes, the Nazis were referred to as the "Browns" (Die Braunen), as this was their official party color. Learn history.
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Post by coldenhaulfield on Oct 28, 2017 18:16:56 GMT
Of course he won't. He's a fan therefor hypocrisy is..... well you know. FIFY All fans act like that. Or did you miss all the things DC fans complain about with Marvel movies that also happen in DC movies? JL is about to have " jokes", " character coming back from the dead", and " faceless horde attack"....can you guess how many DC fans will be consistent and claim those are "flaws"? As far as when will the marvel bubble burst? How long were those mindless dreck Idol shows insanely popular? Close to a decade? Longer? No one ever went broke underestimating the intelligence of the American public or the world public for that matter. Shiny images, colorful costumes, loud explosions without fear of any character the kids love being hurt and most importantly jokes that can be understood by toddlers as well as grandparents and everyone in between is a can't miss recipe for success. As long as the mcu sticks to that basic formula and hires somewhat competent directors the masses will laugh their selves silly and keep buying tickets. The fact a larger percentage of people know Drax said "I have famously huge turds" than know the famous quote from my paragraph above speaks volumes. Not to be condescending but how many posters reading this even know there was a famous quote above? I could name the people here who most likely do but that would only make other people complain to the mod so I digress. Toss in the fact a "critic" these days is anyone with access to an internet connection who is capable of using spellcheck and the marvel bubble is safe. I myself have enjoyed several mcu movies despite the fact the majority are as imminently forgettable as the sweet or salty snacks consumed while watching them. Wow...the elitism is strong with this post. "The masses" are of course stupid because they don't share the taste of the hipsters who feel they should be in charge of all entertainment. How dare they not know the quotes that are deemed "worthy"? And of course the usual turning on any critic who doesn't fall in line with the hipster opinion of art. How dare they enjoy fun movies! RT additionally (next to the average score) has also the infamous Tomatometer gimmick which simply is the average binary system of thumbs down or up (rotten/fresh) and often yielding absurd high and low results. It's a crap system but it's their unique selling gimmick, so that's that. I find the RT score far more useful than the "average score". I use reviews to decide whether or not to see a movie after all....not to tell me how much I "should" like a movie. The average score is pretty worthless to me. Elitist? I wasn't demanding it. I only said that a PART of me wants that. I've got nothing against CBM, hell I loved them so far... well some of them at least. Be honest here. You know just as well as I do that it's starting to become a overly saturated market. Especially since Fox, Warner Bros and Marvel Studios are going to release multiple CBM in the same year with Marvel even planning FOUR films a year. I'm calling it now: It the next 10 years these films will start bombing more than the United States bombing a country of brown people. I don't believe in a "saturated market" unless they start putting out bad movies or repeating themselves. That gets boring and of course the public will get tired of it. That's what kills popular genres. If they stay creative in the genre it will continue to thrive. The public doesn't get tired of TV shows that come out once a week. Game of Thrones has 10 episodes a year until recently and the fans are in mourning every time a season ends. 6 CB movies a year isn't that big a time commitment. Thor 3 is different so that is going to have a positive effect on genre. (And....Nazis were "brown people"?) This guy doesn't get it.
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