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Post by moviebuffbrad on Feb 11, 2018 0:56:36 GMT
Deadshot as played by Will Smith turned out really entertaining. Etc. A character that was originally white. Personally I thought he was a great bit of casting...but was DC being diverse for diversity sake or just picking the biggest Box Office star they could get for the role Yes, that's why I brought him up. And it could be either, but either way, it worked and felt natural. An example of the opposite I would say is female Jimmy Olson, which was a change pointless enough to get retconned in the first 10 minutes of the sequel.
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Post by thenewnexus on Feb 11, 2018 1:17:26 GMT
At least the DCEU has not whitewashed anybody yet like Marvel did with Mandarin and Ancient. MCU also didn't use Miles Morales in Homecoming even though they use his uncle and best friend.
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Post by formersamhmd on Feb 11, 2018 1:19:51 GMT
At least the DCEU has not whitewashed anybody yet like Marvel did with Mandarin and Ancient. The Ancient One and Mandarin were no-win scenarios. Just like Iron Fist.
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Post by sostie on Feb 11, 2018 1:59:01 GMT
At least the DCEU has not whitewashed anybody yet like Marvel did with Mandarin and Ancient. MCU also didn't use Miles Morales in Homecoming even though they use his uncle and best friend. Not sure Mandarin is a great example of "whitewashing"..he is a fictional creation within the MCU of no particular ethnic background. (Also the Mandarin in the comics is of Asian/English parentage. Ben Kingsley is of Indian/English parentage...so not quite whitewashed As for the Ancient One. If the character in the film was said to be Asian then the accusation might stick. But it is said she is Celtic...if they had Tilda Swinton playing an Asian then I would say it was whitewashing. Why did they change it...to avoid what had become the tired cliche of the Asian sage/mentor. Did notice no one complained about changing the Ancient One's sex
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Post by Deleted on Feb 11, 2018 12:08:39 GMT
Yeah they've done a good job so far. Still want to see a LGBT character. We have a chance of FINALLY seeing that with Batwoman and Batgirl's best friend and room mate, Alysia Yeoh in the series the 'Batgirl' movie is said to be based on is a transgender character which could be groundbreaking in a comic book movie.
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Post by Deleted on Feb 11, 2018 12:11:32 GMT
No. Neither the DCEU or MCU have been particularly great with diversity so far and having a few characters of colour is not true diversity but the DCEU appears to be the most likely one to make waves in that field and a 'Batwoman' movie could be the biggest LGBT movie ever made and talked about for centuries to come.
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Post by JudgeJuryDredd on Feb 12, 2018 1:21:22 GMT
At least the DCEU has not whitewashed anybody yet like Marvel did with Mandarin and Ancient. MCU also didn't use Miles Morales in Homecoming even though they use his uncle and best friend. "The Mandarin" in Iron Man 3 was not the real Mandarin, Trevor was an actor hired by Aldrich Killian who was taking inspiration from the mythical figure that is the father of the Ten Rings terrorist group in the middle east seen from the prior two films. The one-shot All Hail The King confirms that the real Mandarin is still out there and isn't happy with what AIM did to his image. The Ancient One is a title in the MCU as opposed to being an actual person, its passed down to person to person. Tilda Swinton was not playing the first and only Ancient One, many came before her and many will come after her. They didn't use Miles Morales in Homecoming because most of the movie going public is familiar with Peter Parker as being Spider-Man, if they have to have Miles in a movie they need to lead into it properly. They didn't use Miles' friend either, Ganke wasn't anywhere in the movie.
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Post by thenewnexus on Feb 12, 2018 4:19:10 GMT
At least the DCEU has not whitewashed anybody yet like Marvel did with Mandarin and Ancient. MCU also didn't use Miles Morales in Homecoming even though they use his uncle and best friend. "The Mandarin" in Iron Man 3 was not the real Mandarin, Trevor was an actor hired by Aldrich Killian who was taking inspiration from the mythical figure that is the father of the Ten Rings terrorist group in the middle east seen from the prior two films. The one-shot All Hail The King confirms that the real Mandarin is still out there and isn't happy with what AIM did to his image. The Ancient One is a title in the MCU as opposed to being an actual person, its passed down to person to person. Tilda Swinton was not playing the first and only Ancient One, many came before her and many will come after her. They didn't use Miles Morales in Homecoming because most of the movie going public is familiar with Peter Parker as being Spider-Man, if they have to have Miles in a movie they need to lead into it properly. They didn't use Miles' friend either, Ganke wasn't anywhere in the movie. Those reasons for Mandarin and Ancient One are straws they were still whitewashed. The fat kid that likes Legos is Miles Friend they just called him Ned Leeds. Its messsd up Miles gets the short end of the stick.
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Post by JudgeJuryDredd on Feb 12, 2018 5:56:04 GMT
"The Mandarin" in Iron Man 3 was not the real Mandarin, Trevor was an actor hired by Aldrich Killian who was taking inspiration from the mythical figure that is the father of the Ten Rings terrorist group in the middle east seen from the prior two films. The one-shot All Hail The King confirms that the real Mandarin is still out there and isn't happy with what AIM did to his image. The Ancient One is a title in the MCU as opposed to being an actual person, its passed down to person to person. Tilda Swinton was not playing the first and only Ancient One, many came before her and many will come after her. They didn't use Miles Morales in Homecoming because most of the movie going public is familiar with Peter Parker as being Spider-Man, if they have to have Miles in a movie they need to lead into it properly. They didn't use Miles' friend either, Ganke wasn't anywhere in the movie. Those reasons for Mandarin and Ancient One are straws they were still whitewashed. The fat kid that likes Legos is Miles Friend they just called him Ned Leeds. Its messsd up Miles gets the short end of the stick. Sorry to break it to you but bringing The Mandarin and The Ancient One to the screen were not easy things to accomplish and the decision to go in the routes they took was not based on "well screw it, we want whites in these roles because we want to make fans unhappy" its because those characters as they were originally presented in the source material are not politically correct and would turn off many film goers internationally, this is especially true with The Ancient One. Doctor Strange scribe C. Robert Cargill said in an interview that the character was comparable to Star Trek's Kobayashi Maru( A lose-lose situation). His quote goes, The route they went with in the film was that there is no single Ancient One in the MCU's history, there have been multiple and Tilda Swinton was playing the more recent one. It was the best and safest way they could make maintain that aspect of Strange's origins while making it accessible and presentable for as wide an audience as possible. The Mandarin was created at a time when America had a very different perspective on his place of origin and as time went on Marvel recognized he was a negative stereotype and many artists and writers tried to rewrite the him and make him relevant with the times, and sorry to say but not a single reinvention stuck for very long. He never achieved the same status as Loki, Dr. Doom, The Joker, or Lex Luthor. The twist they went with in the movie worked in the context of what they were setting up, that what you see is not always what you think. And again, we know Trevor was just an actor hired to play a fraudulent version of The Mandarin so Aldrich Killian could play war games with the government and eventually gain enough financial backing for AIM. However, the actual Mandarin, thought to be a myth in AIM's eyes, is still out there and was the legitimate founder of the Ten Rings group from the first two Iron Man movies, and as All Hail The King says he is not happy with what they did to his image. When is he going to show up in the MCU? I don't know, I figure once somebody "cracks" the character and makes them very accessible to all readers and it sticks around for a lot longer than other renditions had. Ned in Homecoming was a blend of a number of Spider-Man's friends over the years including Ganke, this is what some adaptations do - they take bits and pieces from different supporting characters and create a singular entity. And like I said, it's too early for Miles to be in the MCU, but he has his own movie coming at the end of the year and hey it isn't tied to the MCU so you've got another wish of yours there.
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Post by kleinreturns on Feb 12, 2018 6:08:46 GMT
Is Hayley Atwell Part Native American, from her father side???
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Post by Jedan Archer on Feb 12, 2018 10:19:41 GMT
Yes.
Film 3 had a black female and male lead in an ensemble piece and a female antagonist without making a huge marketing fuss out of it.
Film 4 had a female lead and female director. One of the special merits is that this one is not an on-your-bloody-nose diversity stories but a great horrors-of-war and coming of age storyline involving females ad males reasonably interacting with each other. Unlike The Last Jedi which engaged an awkward plot-hole driven battle of sexes storyline.
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Post by Jedan Archer on Feb 12, 2018 10:29:40 GMT
Yeah they've done a good job so far. Still want to see a LGBT character. I think the DCEU Flash is gay for sure. At least I read him this way.
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Post by formersamhmd on Feb 12, 2018 12:12:27 GMT
Yes.
Film 3 had a black female and male lead in an ensemble piece and a female antagonist without making a huge marketing fuss out of it. Does that mean anything if the movie is terrible? [quote[]Film 4 had a female lead and female director. One of the special merits is that this one is not an on-your-bloody-nose diversity stories but a great horrors-of-war and coming of age storyline[/quote] Too bad they were too cowardly to put their lead in any real danger and never had her struggle.
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Post by Jedan Archer on Feb 12, 2018 12:35:56 GMT
Yes.
Film 3 had a black female and male lead in an ensemble piece and a female antagonist without making a huge marketing fuss out of it. Does that mean anything if the movie is terrible? I do not know. Does MCU printing loads of money mean anything if thd movies are terrible?
You did not see the movie, or are just too immature to understand it.
WW lost her love interest Steve who sacrificed himself, and unlike with MCU-films Steve is not only fake-dead but really dead for good (look up what that means). Also, the village she protects is wiped out with everybody dead and she is pretty destroyed by it. She is also wrong about the root cause of agression. These are called stakes and development.
Alien concepts to you obviously. Grow up and you will be able to appreciate mature storytelling more, I promise.
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Post by formersamhmd on Feb 12, 2018 12:42:48 GMT
I do not know. Does MCU printing loads of money mean anything if thd movies are terrible? No, but thankfully the movies are genre redefining and have been on an unparalleled winning streak. I did, and I saw a film about a naïve woman child who becomes a slightly less naïve woman-child while never really struggling during WWI and all the real characterization going to her supporting cast. She barely knew Steve, and he'll be back. We didn't know anyone there. Blow up Themyscira and now you're talking. Not by much. And in her final battle instead of having to use what abilities she has and maybe outsmarting her villain she pulls Deus Ex Machina powers out of nowhere to defeat him, and then when these powers would've come in handy later she never uses them. No, it's called a bare bones archetype in a basic story who is carried by everyone else. Like most of DC.
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Post by Hauntedknight87 on Feb 12, 2018 16:10:59 GMT
Yeah they've done a good job so far. Still want to see a LGBT character. I think the DCEU Flash is gay for sure. At least I read him this way. He seemed like he was a little autistic. Plus Iris West was cast as a black woman. So unless he's Bisexual, it's looking like he straight.
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Post by DC-Fan on Feb 12, 2018 19:47:48 GMT
You did not see the movie, or are just too immature to understand it.
WW lost her love interest Steve who sacrificed himself, and unlike with MCU-films Steve is not only fake-dead but really dead for good (look up what that means). Also, the village she protects is wiped out with everybody dead and she is pretty destroyed by it. She is also wrong about the root cause of agression. These are called stakes and development.
Alien concepts to you obviously. Grow up and you will be able to appreciate mature storytelling more, I promise.
formersamhmd just got owned!
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Post by Jedan Archer on Feb 12, 2018 19:48:25 GMT
I think the DCEU Flash is gay for sure. At least I read him this way. He seemed like he was a little autistic. Plus Iris West was cast as a black woman. So unless he's Bisexual, it's looking like he straight. Pity, I could have sworn he was, though autism and gayness are not mutually exclusive. Then again I was positive Poe Dameron was gay too until TLJ played it pretty straight.
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Post by formersamhmd on Feb 12, 2018 20:02:06 GMT
You did not see the movie, or are just too immature to understand it.
WW lost her love interest Steve who sacrificed himself, and unlike with MCU-films Steve is not only fake-dead but really dead for good (look up what that means). Also, the village she protects is wiped out with everybody dead and she is pretty destroyed by it. She is also wrong about the root cause of agression. These are called stakes and development.
Alien concepts to you obviously. Grow up and you will be able to appreciate mature storytelling more, I promise.
formersamhmd just got owned! No, it still stands that Trevor will be back and we didn't know anyone in the village enough to care. Ares still influenced the War in ways, and there were no stakes because the whole movie was a flashback so we already knew she'd live.
Giving her random deus ex machina powers at the end was epic laziness though.
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Post by Jedan Archer on Feb 12, 2018 20:04:33 GMT
I do not know. Does MCU printing loads of money mean anything if thd movies are terrible? I did, and I saw a film about a naïve woman child who becomes a slightly less naïve woman-child while never really struggling during WWI and all the real characterization going to her supporting cast. She barely knew Steve, and he'll be back.We didn't know anyone there. Blow up Themyscira and now you're talking. Not by much. And in her final battle instead of having to use what abilities she has and maybe outsmarting her villain she pulls Deus Ex Machina powers out of nowhere to defeat him, and then when these powers would've come in handy later she never uses them. No, it's called a bare bones archetype in a basic story who is carried by everyone else. Like most of DC. LOL. The absurd things you write. I wonder if you actually understand what you are saying or just use pretentious walls of text to suffocate discussion and criticism. "No, it's called a bare bones archetype in a basic story who is carried by everyone else. Like most of DC. "
What does this jibberish even mean? Can you rationally describe this notion with other words and examples in the context of the topic of story stakes and character development?
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