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Post by Deleted on Apr 19, 2018 13:46:42 GMT
WOW. It looks like the big change has been revealed. Marc is gone and is being replaced by Beth Schwartz as the new showrunner. I said back on the original 'Arrow' board this could happen 'cause the same thing happened with 'Supernatural' and I don't know much about Beth but I am willing to give her a chance 'cause she might fix some of the problems with this show and bring it back to its glory days. With Marc leaving this could be the biggest change we have seen. ‘Arrow’ Promotes Beth Schwartz to Showrunner for Season 7
variety.com/2018/tv/news/arrow-beth-schwartz-showrunner-1202756046/
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Post by General Kenobi on Apr 19, 2018 15:08:56 GMT
Now we do the Dance of Joy!
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Post by Deleted on Apr 21, 2018 13:49:39 GMT
Now we do the Dance of Joy! Lorne from 'Angel.' I liked him. I heard the actor passed away and I was surprised 'cause he was so young and that was the second young actor from that show that died and the actor who played Doyle in Season One passed away too. It is very sad. Back on topic though if the new showrunner decides to make some big changes what do you want to see the most apart from Felicity gone (obviously )?
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Post by General Kenobi on Apr 21, 2018 18:09:02 GMT
I was devastated when Andy Hallett died. Because like you said he was so young. I remember when Gleen Quinn died. Such a tragedy what happened to him.
I'm worried that the new showrunner won't change anything but maintain the status quo. If anything does change, sadly I doubt it will be Felicity. I think they and the people they work for are still deluded about her popularity.
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Post by Deleted on Apr 22, 2018 1:59:28 GMT
Yeah I heard about this. Mericle is also stepping down, however Marc has a consultant role (even though he's also stepping down from co-running other shows) but I wonder if it's in name only, curious about the impact on Arrow. Nevertheless, a step in the right direction. Guys you gotta remember that you kinda have to follow your boss's orders and now that Guggenheim is officially out, let's see what happens. Finally, Beth is apparently an Oliciter.
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Post by General Kenobi on Apr 22, 2018 13:59:58 GMT
Kinda hard to be optimistic and think this is a move in the right direction when you find out the new showrunner is an Oliciter.
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Post by stargazer1682 on Apr 22, 2018 14:05:46 GMT
Kinda hard to be optimistic and think this is a move in the right direction when you find out the new showrunner is an Oliciter.
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Post by Deleted on Apr 23, 2018 8:09:56 GMT
Kinda hard to be optimistic and think this is a move in the right direction when you find out the new showrunner is an Oliciter. Well she's an Oliciter under Gugs I think but let's see what happens when he's outa the picture
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Post by dazz on Apr 23, 2018 13:45:03 GMT
Olicity isn't the problem, never has been, Guggenheim is the issue, Olicity could have worked under a regime that knew how to handle the characters, MG however simply tried to turn the show into Felicity & friends because he's a creepy freak with either a Felicity fetish or an EBR obsession either way that put her and her relationship into the forefront of the show instead of the background where she and it belong.
New show runner if they know this is a show about Green Arrow and keep that the focus even if they are an Olicity fan will be an improvement on the show, this show and a lot of CW shows have the same issue, execution of ideas, most have pretty intriguing set ups or scenarios but the quality is just shit, so if she improves the quality then it can only improve, and seeing how Guggenheim always came across like a barely functioning moron to me I don't see it too difficult a job for her to be better than him.
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Post by Deleted on Apr 26, 2018 12:54:53 GMT
Yeah I heard about this. Mericle is also stepping down, however Marc has a consultant role (even though he's also stepping down from co-running other shows) but I wonder if it's in name only, curious about the impact on Arrow. Nevertheless, a step in the right direction. Guys you gotta remember that you kinda have to follow your boss's orders and now that Guggenheim is officially out, let's see what happens. Finally, Beth is apparently an Oliciter. I thought Greg Berlanti was supposed to be the boss of all these shows and Marc would have been answering to him and Geoff Johns. I know Greg is no longer involved in writing 'Arrow' but I thought he would be the one who would oversee all the episodes before they went to air. I am not sure but Marc and Wendy being out of the picture is a good thing in my opinion 'cause I think they are a big part of the reason why the show has gone so far downhill in quality and I am surprised Marc wasn't fired by the CW Network after Season 4 but they might have given him another chance since he actually admitted how bad it was. I don't know that much about as I mentioned before but I heard she wrote some episodes of 'Brothers & Sisters', 'Hart of Dixie' and 'What About Brian' and I was a fan of the first two and I am hoping Season 7 is a turnaround and the new showrunner brings new and fresh ideas.
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Post by Deleted on Apr 26, 2018 13:02:54 GMT
I was devastated when Andy Hallett died. Because like you said he was so young. I remember when Gleen Quinn died. Such a tragedy what happened to him. I'm worried that the new showrunner won't change anything but maintain the status quo. If anything does change, sadly I doubt it will be Felicity. I think they and the people they work for are still deluded about her popularity. I was really shocked over Glenn Quinn passing away 'cause it wasn't that long after his character, Doyle was written out of the show he passed and if I remember correctly I don't think there was an official reason given for his death. I have always wondered why he was written out of the show and replaced with Wesley when they gave him such a big role in 'Angel' and I didn't Wesley but the way they got rid of Doyle was odd and I didn't get why they got rid of him but if they hadn't killed Doyle off and Glenn had stayed on passed away the writers would have said he died during an episode which would have been a more disappointing way to do it. I do wonder if he had lived if they would have brought him back to 'Angel' at some point. I was surprised Doyle got the role though and not Whistler since Whistler was an already established character.
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Post by hardball on Apr 26, 2018 13:27:05 GMT
Guggenheim's admission he miscalculated fans' reaction to the team Arrow split storylline probably led to the "transition". Of course most of the fans would side with the original team. Not sure how I feel about Beth, but it's good to know the shorunners realize there needs to be a change. I don't know how this season's ratings compare to the previous ones, but something must have happened, if not the ratings then the comments and reactions of viewers.
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Post by dazz on Apr 26, 2018 13:38:25 GMT
This season Arrow became as of last week or so the lowest rated of the CW DC shows, LOT is beating them ffs, last season and the one before it Arrow had a decent lead on LOT until Arrow suffered the april+may decline, Arrow is now CW's 7th highest rated show at the moment with Supernatural surging past them just because they didn't lose viewers, Arrow is down 25% across the board this season and to think it still has several more weeks of lower ratings to end the season meaning that dip and distance between LOT & Arrow is going to get worse...no wonder they fired MG's arse.
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Post by dazz on Apr 26, 2018 13:49:06 GMT
I was devastated when Andy Hallett died. Because like you said he was so young. I remember when Gleen Quinn died. Such a tragedy what happened to him. I'm worried that the new showrunner won't change anything but maintain the status quo. If anything does change, sadly I doubt it will be Felicity. I think they and the people they work for are still deluded about her popularity. I was really shocked over Glenn Quinn passing away 'cause it wasn't that long after his character, Doyle was written out of the show he passed and if I remember correctly I don't think there was an official reason given for his death. I have always wondered why he was written out of the show and replaced with Wesley when they gave him such a big role in 'Angel' and I didn't Wesley but the way they got rid of Doyle was odd and I didn't get why they got rid of him but if they hadn't killed Doyle off and Glenn had stayed on passed away the writers would have said he died during an episode which would have been a more disappointing way to do it. I do wonder if he had lived if they would have brought him back to 'Angel' at some point. I was surprised Doyle got the role though and not Whistler since Whistler was an already established character. Whedon wanted to kill of Doyle from the start saying he liked the idea of killing off a main cast member suddenly, which is what he wanted to do with Jesse in Buffy but they refused to let him put the actor in the opening titles for some reason, though he did say he in the end didn't want to kill of Doyle but Quinn and Boreanaz had a similar intensity that he didn't think meshed and made things a pain on set at times.
Quinn sadly dies of a drug overdose and had been struggling with drug addiction his whole adult life, he passed 2 years after he left Angel, they did want to maybe bring him back but he passed before they could, I assume the plan was to have him be in the role Lindsay ended up playing in S5.
Christian Kane & David Boreanaz were apparently tight with Quinn during the show and when Kane had to have his character fake being Doyle in S5 both he and David found it hard to do and was nervous about it, from what I recall hearing years back atleast.
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Post by hardball on Apr 26, 2018 14:16:39 GMT
This season Arrow became as of last week or so the lowest rated of the CW DC shows, LOT is beating them ffs, last season and the one before it Arrow had a decent lead on LOT until Arrow suffered the april+may decline, Arrow is now CW's 7th highest rated show at the moment with Supernatural surging past them just because they didn't lose viewers, Arrow is down 25% across the board this season and to think it still has several more weeks of lower ratings to end the season meaning that dip and distance between LOT & Arrow is going to get worse...no wonder they fired MG's arse. If LOT is beating them in the ratings then that's a serious problem all right. Makes one wonder where Beth plans to take the show.
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Post by General Kenobi on Apr 28, 2018 14:00:36 GMT
Not surprised Arrow is doing poorly, but to be beaten by LoT? I think I might be rethinking the choices that got me to this point in my life.
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Post by Deleted on May 1, 2018 11:47:08 GMT
I was really shocked over Glenn Quinn passing away 'cause it wasn't that long after his character, Doyle was written out of the show he passed and if I remember correctly I don't think there was an official reason given for his death. I have always wondered why he was written out of the show and replaced with Wesley when they gave him such a big role in 'Angel' and I didn't Wesley but the way they got rid of Doyle was odd and I didn't get why they got rid of him but if they hadn't killed Doyle off and Glenn had stayed on passed away the writers would have said he died during an episode which would have been a more disappointing way to do it. I do wonder if he had lived if they would have brought him back to 'Angel' at some point. I was surprised Doyle got the role though and not Whistler since Whistler was an already established character. Whedon wanted to kill of Doyle from the start saying he liked the idea of killing off a main cast member suddenly, which is what he wanted to do with Jesse in Buffy but they refused to let him put the actor in the opening titles for some reason, though he did say he in the end didn't want to kill of Doyle but Quinn and Boreanaz had a similar intensity that he didn't think meshed and made things a pain on set at times.
Quinn sadly dies of a drug overdose and had been struggling with drug addiction his whole adult life, he passed 2 years after he left Angel, they did want to maybe bring him back but he passed before they could, I assume the plan was to have him be in the role Lindsay ended up playing in S5.
Christian Kane & David Boreanaz were apparently tight with Quinn during the show and when Kane had to have his character fake being Doyle in S5 both he and David found it hard to do and was nervous about it, from what I recall hearing years back atleast.
Oh. Thanks for letting me know about that. I didn’t know that was always Joss’ intentions with Doyle and I thought there might have been a falling out between the actor and the showrunners or he was difficult to work with ‘cause the way they killed him off was so sudden and they were giving him a lot of screen time and even had an episode focused on the character. I don’t think the writers of ‘Angel’ novels were aware of his intentions either ‘cause they still had Doyle in the novels for at least a year after he was killed off in the show before they added Wesley and the novels came out once a month when the show was on. I have a lot of the ‘Angel’ novels and I think some of them were even better than the episodes of the show and would have liked to have seen them adapted.
I didn’t know Jessie was meant to be in the main credits of the first episode of ‘Buffy’ either but they had Amber Benson (Tara) appear in the main credits of the episode where she was killed off and that was surprising ‘cause I thought they had finally made her a Season Regular. I think you are right with the Season 5 storyline for Lindsay but I am not sure how they would have explained Doyle returning as a villain unless it wasn’t really Doyle or someone was controlling him ‘cause he was Angel’s friend whereas Lindsay looked like he was going to turn over a new leaf when he left but wasn’t close to Angel like Doyle was.
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Post by Deleted on May 1, 2018 11:57:51 GMT
Guggenheim's admission he miscalculated fans' reaction to the team Arrow split storylline probably led to the "transition". Of course most of the fans would side with the original team. Not sure how I feel about Beth, but it's good to know the shorunners realize there needs to be a change. I don't know how this season's ratings compare to the previous ones, but something must have happened, if not the ratings then the comments and reactions of viewers. I haven't been a fan of the team split and to be honest, I think it looks foolish to have one when the odds are so stacked against them and they are vastly outnumbered. It would have made more sense for them to try and put their differences to the side and work together to take down Ricardo Diaz then talk about splitting but I think the writers wanted to make it look even harder for Oliver so they had the team split followed by Diggle leaving too. After what we saw on last week's episode of 'Arrow' I think it is safe to say Renee is leaving us this season and will be replaced. With Roy returning, talk of Black Canary being in the 'Birds of Prey' movie and the actor playing Diggle saying he won't be going back Oliver's team anytime in the near future it makes me wonder if they are going to have Dinah, Renee and Curtis all leave at the end of the season and have Oliver start a brand new team next season. They could have Oliver with Arsenal, Arrowette and possibly Black Siren if she does become good.
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Post by General Kenobi on May 1, 2018 19:31:38 GMT
Hey, stupid decisions that serve no purpose but to get people hurt is a hallmar kof this series! We can't change that without radically altering the entire series!
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Post by stargazer1682 on May 1, 2018 19:52:42 GMT
See, I think there may have been a bit of nuance to Doyle's exit. From what I've read, I get the impression that the whole thing of it being "planned" to write him off was mostly to save face; and I think I even read that Joss didn't want to give Glenn a bad reputation if he could get the help he needed and could go back and work. What it really boiled down to was that Glenn wasn't showing up on time, possibly at times not showing up at all, not being prepared; and overall his substance abuse started impacting production. But it was still a difficult decision to make, at least in part because Glenn and David were very close; and there was concern that David might react badly to Glenn being written off. Ultimately though they just didn't have much of a choice, but they didn't want to torpedo his career by publicizing the real reason he was written off, in the event he could turn things around, so the official word was that it had always been the plan - even though the plot development seemed to come out of nowhere.
For Arrow - I had seen one of those Screen Rant type lists of what the change in the show's creative team means; or at least what the author hopes it mean. I'll probably post it at some point, and some of the points were fair, like at least backing off Olicity and the angsty romance crap, if not outright ending the relationship between Oliver and Felicity. Some of it though went into the weeds a bit; like the author seemed to have a hard-on for Laurel/Black Canary. I would say half the list were about her, and some of them seemed redundant; like it was the same idea said a different way. And I get it, Laurel got a raw deal, and Black Canary should be much higher profiler character in the Green Arrow story, but man... it was a whole different level of conviction.
I can't guess whether or not it would be something the new creative team will do, but I would personally like to see them steer the season towards more episodic stories. Not so far as making the season 100% unrelated, but the season (for all of the DC shows) focuses too much of the season on the long arc; and over the course of eight months or so and two dozen episodes, that gets to be tedious. The important thing with one off episodes is to still tell a story worth telling; those are opportunities to build the mythos and develop characters. If you look at other classic series, most of the best things that people remember about them are the episodes that had a beginning, middle and end; and some of them may not have had long lasting ramifications that were talked about by the characters afterwards, but sometimes they did, and when they did it was often in profound ways. Buffy's "Band Candy," on the face of it, just seems like an excuse to make some of the characters behavior unusually; Giles gets to be a bad ass, Joyce is basically a fun house mirror for Buffy see shades of herself in, Snyder's a spaz. But it's also only the second time that the Mayor, the season's primary antagonist, appears; and you get gems like Buffy later learning that her mom and Giles had sex on a cop car - twice. Even better is how this episode changed the nature of Joyce and Giles' relationship; and something as simple as Giles listening to the record he played for her after her death has such incredible emotional weight to it. Buffy's Zeppo, TNG's The Inner Light, DS9's Far Beyond the Stars, DS9's Pale Moon Light (which, ties in with the arc of the show at the point as it relates to the war and the role the Romulans play in it, but it's still a very different and insular type of episode). And the list goes on. So much can be achieved in 45-50 minutes.
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