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Post by Aj_June on Jun 15, 2018 13:34:03 GMT
Death is inevitable and certain. If you compare our limited existence of 60-100 years in this world to billions of years this universe has existed then we are nothing more than robots. While we may enjoy our lives in the sense of 'living in the moment' we certainly have no impact (or negligible impact tending towards 0) on this world from absolute point of view. Thinking about all this makes me sad. I wish nature had given us choice to live as long as we wanted and decide for ourselves. But we have no choice. It's like nature has played a game on us. A sick sadistic game in which many living beings live a life full of misery.
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Post by Deleted on Jun 15, 2018 13:50:35 GMT
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Post by Aj_June on Jun 15, 2018 14:01:45 GMT
God's help reaches to those who want such a help and consolation. It's when people are willing to have self treatment as a sort of placebo. |
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Post by faustus5 on Jun 15, 2018 15:35:16 GMT
What would "being more" even look or feel like?
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Post by CoolJGS☺ on Jun 15, 2018 15:42:04 GMT
Death is inevitable and certain. If you compare our limited existence of 60-100 years in this world to billions of years this universe has existed then we are nothing more than robots. While we may enjoy our lives in the sense of 'living in the moment' we certainly have no impact (or negligible impact tending towards 0) on this world from absolute point of view. Thinking about all this makes me sad. I wish nature had given us choice to live as long as we wanted and decide for ourselves. But we have no choice. It's like nature has played a game on us. A sick sadistic game in which many living beings live a life full of misery. Why would our existence need any significance in the universe. Personal joy is sufficient to combat sadness and especially if we derive it from others which means community.
This by itself makes us better than, not only robot, but most animals.
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Post by general313 on Jun 15, 2018 15:47:56 GMT
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Post by drystyx on Jun 15, 2018 15:59:06 GMT
If you look over your post, and look abstractly, you'll see outside the box, some clues to help you solve the riddle.
First of all, as you note, the existence we experience under the senses of this "robot" form if you want to believe we're robots (and that's fine, to believe our bodies are robotic. In fact, it serves as part of the solution to the riddle, since it's part of a very finite time in an infinite time frame.
The infinite time frame may apply to a mathematical abstraction, but it's unlikely to apply to the matter and energy of the Universe. It is only speculation that it lasts for billions or trillions of years.
There are those who will use the word "Nature" to describe something without cognition, then apply cognition to it as it suits the whims of their feeble minds.
You have discovered that there is an agenda to some cognition that plays a sadistic game with you, and that obviously involves keeping you and me in confusion.
The confusion is the answer to the riddle. The confusion can't be from accident. Not when it is thrust into every single area. Not when we see every attempt made to confuse our own communication, when we see every attempt at Babel in every control freak who wants to change the way we communicate. Americans are taught English for a portion of every day for 12 years, and for many even more in college, yet there are countless control freaks attempting to confuse the English language. Sure, the control freaks like to act like there is a motive for this which is of their own thinking, but when looks objectively, from outside, one sees that this is a lie. I've done it myself. We try to change the communication because we're out of control to the demon of confusion.
Then one realizes the very brain we rely on for us as meter readers, is a meter of the enemy, and in such a case, those 60-80 years of deterioration seems way too long to be under the thumb of this cognitive force of hate.
You are a verb, not a noun. The mind and body are nouns. You're a verb trapped inside a noun right now. And "yes", that does mean a cognitive force put you in that prison cell. It would be a feeble mind, totally out of control to the demon of confusion, that would wake up in a prison cell with impenetrable bars all around, every direction, and still be under the delusion that one was not placed there by a cognitive force full of sadistic hate.
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Eλευθερί
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Post by Eλευθερί on Jun 17, 2018 0:40:57 GMT
Death is inevitable and certain. Death is highly probable, going by the track record for all known things that have lived in the past. But I don't think anybody has yet shown to have a 100% accurate ability to predict the future. More like 0-120 years. A lot of us don't even make it past the 1st 12 months. If you're old enough to be reading and writing in this forum, you've already lived a lot longer than billions who have come before you. Something is missing in your logic. Let's stipulate that our lives are finite. Let's stipulate that our lives are infinitesmally short, when measured against a cosmic time-frame. Let's stipulate that our bodies (and our minds, to the extent that our minds are the products of our bodies) are subject to the laws of physics, the laws of the material world. Let's stipulate that our impact on the Universe, and, as individual beings, on even just the physical world immediately around us, is negligible. Let's stipulate that the choices we make are predictable, since our minds and bodies are subject to the laws of physics and those laws can be ascertained. It does not follow that that is just "nothing." Indeed, it is "everything." And it is Glorious. |
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Post by Aj_June on Jun 17, 2018 0:56:49 GMT
Death is inevitable and certain. Death is highly probable, going by the track record for all known things that have lived in the past. But I don't think anybody has yet shown to have a 100% accurate ability to predict the future. More like 0-120 years. A lot of us don't even make it past the 1st 12 months. If you're old enough to be reading and writing in this forum, you've already lived a lot longer than billions who have come before you. Something is missing in your logic. Let's stipulate that our lives are finite. Let's stipulate that our lives are infinitesmally short, when measured against a cosmic time-frame. Let's stipulate that our bodies (and our minds, to the extent that our minds are the products of our bodies) are subject to the laws of physics, the laws of the material world. Let's stipulate that our impact on the Universe, and, as individual beings, on even just the physical world immediately around us, is negligible. Let's stipulate that the choices we make are predictable, since our minds and bodies are subject to the laws of physics and those laws can be ascertained. It does not follow that that is just "nothing." Indeed, it is "everything." And it is Glorious. Anything tending toward xero will be considered zero mathematically. Yes, philosophically you can consider it everything. But the thing is that the quality of life that most of us live (living beings not just human beings) is not so good. But I can understand if anyone wants to classify the transient existence as akin to infinity or joyous. |
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Post by Aj_June on Jun 17, 2018 1:03:31 GMT
Death is inevitable and certain. Death is highly probable, going by the track record for all known things that have lived in the past. But I don't think anybody has yet shown to have a 100% accurate ability to predict the future. More like 0-120 years. A lot of us don't even make it past the 1st 12 months. If you're old enough to be reading and writing in this forum, you've already lived a lot longer than billions who have come before you. Something is missing in your logic. Let's stipulate that our lives are finite. Let's stipulate that our lives are infinitesmally short, when measured against a cosmic time-frame. Let's stipulate that our bodies (and our minds, to the extent that our minds are the products of our bodies) are subject to the laws of physics, the laws of the material world. Let's stipulate that our impact on the Universe, and, as individual beings, on even just the physical world immediately around us, is negligible. Let's stipulate that the choices we make are predictable, since our minds and bodies are subject to the laws of physics and those laws can be ascertained. It does not follow that that is just "nothing." Indeed, it is "everything." And it is Glorious. This awesome movie though has same stance as you have.
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Post by Deleted on Jun 17, 2018 1:08:17 GMT
If nature had given us that choice, then humans would take the choice away and either force people to die when they become a burden; or much worse and more likely; force people to live forever because nobody is allowed to dissent from the culture of life.
I don't fret about the fact that nothing that I do will have an impact on anything far in the future. When I was younger, I used to fret about being forgotten and my imprint on people's memories being as ephemeral as a footprint in the sand, but I'm past that now. What I fret about is the fact that I'm trapped in a conscious experience to which I did not consent, and I am compelled by human society and laws to keep 'playing the game', because if I decide that life isn't worth living and am facilitated in discontinuing my life without secrecy and having obstacles placed in my way, then it will offend other people who are insecure about the value and meaning of their own lives.
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Post by lowtacks86 on Jun 17, 2018 1:19:43 GMT
Are we nothing more than suffering puppets for someone else's amusement?
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Post by Aj_June on Jun 17, 2018 1:21:56 GMT
What would "being more" even look or feel like? I don't know. Even if humans lived 1 billion year they will still be zero against infinity. So the only way to be "more than nature's robot" is to be immortal. unfortunately there is nothing immortal. Not just that but science indicates that there is a great possibility that everything is predetermined.I don't know if being immortal will be any better but I certainly feel sad that there is no way to get out of this trap.
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Post by Aj_June on Jun 17, 2018 1:24:09 GMT
Are we nothing more than suffering puppets for someone else's amusement? Actually, I do feel happy if that was the case. Because then there will be a chance. If there is someone who is having billions for his/her/its amusement then we can replicate him. There is that flash of hope. But unfortunately it seems everything is just random. |
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Eλευθερί
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Post by Eλευθερί on Jun 17, 2018 1:50:04 GMT
What would "being more" even look or feel like? I don't know. Even if humans lived 1 billion year they will still be zero against infinity. So the only way to be "more than nature's robot" is to be immortal. unfortunately there is nothing immortal. Not just that but science indicates that there is a great possibility that everything is predetermined.I don't know if being immortal will be any better but I certainly feel sad that there is no way to get out of this trap.
Why is bigger better? Why is longer better? Why is the yardstick by which to measure human existence the timeframe of the existence of the Universe? Measure goodness of a life by the quality of that life, not by the length of the life. |
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Post by Eλευθερί on Jun 17, 2018 1:57:24 GMT
How many species that have ever existed have already gone extinct?
How many family lines have died out due to infertility, disability, premature death?
You are here only because your parents were born and able to meet and create you, and then someone was able to care for you during those long years of childhood.
Think of all the people who were never born because their would-be forebears died of starvation. Or in floods or fires. Or were killed in war. Or died in childhood from disease.
The fact that you exist at all is already a miracle in itself.
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Post by Aj_June on Jun 17, 2018 5:34:00 GMT
I don't know. Even if humans lived 1 billion year they will still be zero against infinity. So the only way to be "more than nature's robot" is to be immortal. unfortunately there is nothing immortal. Not just that but science indicates that there is a great possibility that everything is predetermined.I don't know if being immortal will be any better but I certainly feel sad that there is no way to get out of this trap.
Why is bigger better? Why is longer better? Why is the yardstick by which to measure human existence the timeframe of the existence of the Universe? Measure goodness of a life by the quality of that life, not by the length of the life.The fact that you exist at all is already a miracle in itself. I am more along the lines of choice or no choice than longer or shorter life. Because as I said even if we lived 1 million years it will still be negligible in relation infinity*. The thing is that I didn't ask nature to give birth to me. So I don't know why I should be grateful for the life I have been given? Especially give the fact that most living beings live not so comfortable lives. Yeah, I do agree with you that it is best to live one's life without complaining simply because one is in no power of doing anything about his or her fate. If you see things from that perspective then I do agree with you.
* Time may not be infinite as per current scientific understanding eventually the universe may start contracting. But there is a chance that universe may continue to grow forever.
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Post by Eλευθερί on Jun 17, 2018 10:53:01 GMT
Because as I said even if we lived 1 million years it will still be negligible in relation infinity You still have not explained why the measure should be millions of years. Why not regard human life in microseconds? How long does a bacterium live? Relative to an instant, a human day is inifinitely long. You are insisting on seeing the glass as half empty without explaining why it should not be seen instead as half full. Making predictable choices is not the same as being unable to make choices. You have the power to shape many aspects of your life, if you choose to use it. |
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