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Post by Aj_June on Aug 31, 2018 7:39:45 GMT
Note - Rest assure I am not one of those sarcastic posters who would say "oh, so you need a religion to be a better human being."
Religions can influence various human beings in different ways. Religious teachings can inspire you. Religious experiences can bring out the Scrooge in you. Religion can probably help you understand yourself or others in some way that can give a direction to your life. In this thread please share what elements of religion have helped you become a better person or a wiser person. Do not be shy. I would appreciate any honest response and I would assume your replies are honest.
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Post by The Herald Erjen on Aug 31, 2018 9:41:40 GMT
Religion sets a constant standard of personal behavior, independent of what society says is acceptable or unacceptable at any given moment in time. The standard may not always be adhered to, but at least its always there.
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Post by Deleted on Aug 31, 2018 10:10:42 GMT
Religion sets a constant standard of personal behavior, independent of what society says is acceptable or unacceptable at any given moment in time. The standard may not always be adhered to, but at least its always there. Do you not have an in-built moral compass? Do you need to be given rules on acceptable behaviour? Myself, I know what behaviours I am comfortable with on my part, and which cause internal cognitive dissonance. |
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Post by general313 on Aug 31, 2018 14:47:26 GMT
I don't think there's a net benefit. At least in Christianity, the idea that one is saved and that your name is in "the book" often leads to careless, negligent behavior like that of a spoiled overprivileged rich child that knows its parents will always back them up regardless of how they behave.
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Post by OpiateOfTheMasses on Aug 31, 2018 15:24:18 GMT
I don't think there's a net benefit. At least in Christianity, the idea that one is saved and that your name is in "the book" often leads to careless, negligent behavior like that of a spoiled overprivileged rich child that knows its parents will always back them up regardless of how they behave. You must be mistaking our Christians with some other spoiled brats. |
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Post by rachelcarson1953 on Aug 31, 2018 15:56:24 GMT
I think that whether religion brings positive effects or negative ones depends on the person in question.
All human behavior is determined by a combination of four things: genetics, brain chemistry, psychology and environment.
An innately compassionate person will take positives from religion.
A flawed or damaged person will use religion to achieve his own desires, which may be negatives to people around him.
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Post by The Herald Erjen on Aug 31, 2018 17:45:19 GMT
Religion sets a constant standard of personal behavior, independent of what society says is acceptable or unacceptable at any given moment in time. The standard may not always be adhered to, but at least its always there. Do you not have an in-built moral compass? Do you need to be given rules on acceptable behaviour? Myself, I know what behaviours I am comfortable with on my part, and which cause internal cognitive dissonance. Yes, I do, and it's God-given. Next. |
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Post by The Herald Erjen on Aug 31, 2018 17:47:25 GMT
I don't think there's a net benefit. At least in Christianity, the idea that one is saved and that your name is in "the book" often leads to careless, negligent behavior like that of a spoiled overprivileged rich child that knows its parents will always back them up regardless of how they behave. I hope you know that idea is not universally subscribed to in Christianity. I don't subscribe to it, and there are others. Don't know how many, but they exist. |
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Post by geode on Sept 2, 2018 11:20:26 GMT
I don't think there's a net benefit. At least in Christianity, the idea that one is saved and that your name is in "the book" often leads to careless, negligent behavior like that of a spoiled overprivileged rich child that knows its parents will always back them up regardless of how they behave. I hope you know that idea is not universally subscribed to in Christianity. I don't subscribe to it, and there are others. Don't know how many, but they exist. Anybody that follows the actual teachings of Jesus rather than men's interpretation of what Christianity means will agree with you about this. |
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Post by The Herald Erjen on Sept 2, 2018 11:22:40 GMT
I hope you know that idea is not universally subscribed to in Christianity. I don't subscribe to it, and there are others. Don't know how many, but they exist. Anybody that follows the actual teachings of Jesus rather than men's interpretation of what Christianity means will agree with you about this. It rather flies in the face of the concept known as God-given free will, doesn't it? |
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Post by captainbryce on Sept 2, 2018 17:18:26 GMT
Note - Rest assure I am not one of those sarcastic posters who would say "oh, so you need a religion to be a better human being." I don’t see that as sarcasm at all. I think that is a perfectly reasonable criticism that rings true for anyone who claims that morality comes from God. Anyone who thinks that obviously thinks that they cannot be a moral person without religion. And so can secular teachings; so that’s kind of a wash! The point is, one does not need religion to make them more moral, and there is no reason to believe that it actually makes anyone better than anyone else. And if they believe that morals comes from religion, that’s an admission that from their perspective, they are incapable of being moral without god. I’m not a religious person, but I believe in about 80% of the teachings attributed to Jesus Christ. Most of them are just common sense (as in you don’t need to be a messiah or the son of God to promote these teachings), yet they are also indicative of just how selfish and immoral the average person is (that they view such teachings as radically good). |
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Post by Aj_June on Sept 2, 2018 21:45:17 GMT
captainbryce That's not the point as intended by this thread. Sure, it is indeed true that one does not need to be religious to be moral. And this thread thread is not saying that in anyway. But what if one is religious? Not everyone becomes religious to be moral. Many kids become religious just because they followed the religion or culture of their parents. They believe religion is an established truth. Many adults follow religion to satisfy their spiritual needs. Not because they think religion is more moral. Now that one becomes religious, the elements of religion can help a person become a moral person in various ways. Even if the goal of being more moral was not the reason why the religious person became religious. This automatically doesn't mean that secular lifestyle can't make people more moral than religious lifestyle. But being a non-religious person and being around non-religious people I already know many ways in which secular values aspire me to become better person. This thread is not intended as religious vs non-religious. It simply asks different religious people to share their experience of how religion helped them become better human beings.
While there may be many religious people who think morality comes from God not all religious people think like that. Even among Christians not everyone thinks morality comes from God. gadreel for example probably doesn't believe morality comes from God. There can of course be legitimate criticism of people who believe that morality comes from god but this thread is not intending to debate on whether morality comes from god. This thread is more abut how smaller cultural elements or organisational activities help religious people become more moral human beings.
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Post by Aj_June on Sept 2, 2018 22:07:29 GMT
Religion sets a constant standard of personal behavior, independent of what society says is acceptable or unacceptable at any given moment in time. The standard may not always be adhered to, but at least its always there. Can these standards adapt to changes in lifestyle and culture? |
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Post by captainbryce on Sept 2, 2018 23:32:01 GMT
captainbryce That's not the point as intended by this thread. Sure, it is indeed true that one does not need to be religious to be moral. And this thread thread is not saying that in anyway. Apologies. I thought you were asking how can religion help you in becoming a better human being as compared to atheism. I agree. Like what? Examples? Understood. I’m aware of that; I wasn’t suggesting otherwise. |
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Post by captainbryce on Sept 2, 2018 23:34:30 GMT
I hope you know that idea is not universally subscribed to in Christianity. I don't subscribe to it, and there are others. Don't know how many, but they exist. Anybody that follows the actual teachings of Jesus rather than men's interpretation of what Christianity means will agree with you about this. Every man, including every Christian has an interpretation about what Christianity and Jesus mean. There is no single correct interpretation that can be objectively defined. |
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Post by Aj_June on Sept 2, 2018 23:46:20 GMT
captainbryce Thanks for clearing your misunderstanding in the last post. A person who is otherwise lethargic can be inspired to be better and more active human being under influence of co-religionists. Let's take Sikhs for example. They do not do good things with the view to make you a Sikh. During the ISIS crisis, many Sikhs went to various areas of danger to serve the orphans, old people and helpless people while endangering their own lives. Not one of them tried to convince the people they helped that they should become Sikhs. Teachings of Sikhism is to help others irrespective of race, ethnicity or religion. You can say a secular person can do the same. Of course I agree as I am a non-religious person myself. But at end of the day at least some people showed extraordinary bravery and humanitarianism for others because they were working due to their religious values. Yoga can make a person more calm and take away anger. Slowly and steadily many people can start living more content life and become less jealous of others due to teachings of Yoga and other religion inspired views. Ultimately, happiness of self may transform in general improvement in behaviour. I have known examples of people who were extremely childish, anger prone and selfish who have become a changed person under influence of religion. This is not to say that a person can't become better without coming under influence of religion.
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Post by The Herald Erjen on Sept 3, 2018 0:15:43 GMT
Religion sets a constant standard of personal behavior, independent of what society says is acceptable or unacceptable at any given moment in time. The standard may not always be adhered to, but at least its always there. Can these standards adapt to changes in lifestyle and culture? Not really. Right is still right, and wrong is still wrong. |
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Post by mslo79 on Sept 3, 2018 2:03:44 GMT
Religion sets a constant standard of personal behavior, independent of what society says is acceptable or unacceptable at any given moment in time. The standard may not always be adhered to, but at least its always there.
Exactly.
but liberals tend to think morality is subjective instead of sticking to God's morality which does not change.
but it's not surprising as you can see that in general as time passes, as the worlds morality standards decline, the world sides with liberals. but... the world tends to oppose God more often than not and that's evident in major moral areas like abortion etc. just on the abortion issue alone is enough to tell you which side is opposed to God and which one is in favor of God, in general.
p.s. when I say God I am always referring to The Holy Trinity (Father/Son(Jesus Christ)/Holy Spirit).
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Post by lowtacks86 on Sept 3, 2018 2:19:22 GMT
Religion sets a constant standard of personal behavior, independent of what society says is acceptable or unacceptable at any given moment in time. The standard may not always be adhered to, but at least its always there.
Exactly.
but liberals tend to think morality is subjective instead of sticking to God's morality which does not change.
but it's not surprising as you can see that in general as time passes, as the worlds morality standards decline, the world sides with liberals. but... the world tends to oppose God more often than not and that's evident in major moral areas like abortion etc. just on the abortion issue alone is enough to tell you which side is opposed to God and which one is in favor of God, in general.
p.s. when I say God I am always referring to The Holy Trinity (Father/Son(Jesus Christ)/Holy Spirit).
"but liberals tend to think morality is subjective"
It is subjective, there is no getting around that. Even overlooking the fact that "objective" morality of Christianity mostly from the subjective interpretation of the Bible, the concept of objective morality in still presents a bit of a paradox. Believing that "objective" morality is the best morality to live by is still a matter of subjective opinion, so in that sense can you really call it "objective morality" if the morality is subject to, well subjectivity? "Objective" morality seems like an illusionary concept at best.
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Post by dirtypillows on Sept 3, 2018 5:54:48 GMT
I could never, would never say that religion makes a person a "better human being" because that automatically places the atheist as inferior in some way and that's too much of a generalization, and it's rude. (not that you were being rude in your OP!) What I would say that religion does that is almost always a good thing is that -
1) it instills a sense of awe and wonder and humility within the person, and it fosters a belief of the existence of some higher power, and I think anybody would benefit from that
2) for the person with faith, it is probably going to be of monumental importance in helping see the individual through the really rough times
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