For agnostics, atheists, non-believers, secular humanists - what do you like most about it?
Sept 20, 2018 12:41:36 GMT
Post by rachelcarson1953 on Sept 20, 2018 12:41:36 GMT
In another thread started for only atheists I made a comment about a criticism of religion I found there. Mz. Carson said that was against her rules for the thread. I don't believe you get to make your own rules for threads, but I am going to follow hers anyway, well this time at least. All that aside an apparent atheist replied to my comment and I am going to reply back, except in this thread which I created for theists.
Hairynosedwombat had noted in Rachel's thread that the Church of England publicly came out in favour of invading Vietnam because our government had made the decision and as a Christian country that obeys the rule of law, when the government says something we have an obligation to obey as members of that community.
I, Arlon10 , replied that lots of religious people oppose wars. In fact religion is the only opposition to war. On what basis can an atheist oppose war? Tell me. Your problem is with the Church of England, which at one point obviously failed to be very religious.
Hairynosedwombat replied ...
If a country decides they want to go to war against another what are you going to do exactly? Threaten them with frowns of disapproval?
Here's how religion can work, although it doesn't always, fear of something else. Something you don't know, can't see, can't control, and yes even can't predict could oppose you. Did Hebrews slaughter infants? Technically, no they did not, at least not recorded in the Bible. Some magic or other did, excusing the Hebrew people from what might have been their normal duty in those barbaric times to slaughter children. See how that works? Religion can be a source of "circumspection." It gives your frowns of disapproval a lot more kick.
Your complaint about the Church of England illustrates that without religion there is no check on the state. Atheism has no enforcement mechanism except the state. When religion fails you get what atheism can do about the state which is nothing.
Religion has an alternate enforcement mechanism, albeit a very remote system of rewards and punishments. Being so remote is actually a good thing as this makes the art of persuasion all the more necessary, and the art of coercion all the more uninformed.
I, Arlon10 , replied that lots of religious people oppose wars. In fact religion is the only opposition to war. On what basis can an atheist oppose war? Tell me. Your problem is with the Church of England, which at one point obviously failed to be very religious.
Hairynosedwombat replied ...
LOL
Like the Crusaders.
Like the US Marines who Go with God to war.
On what basis can an atheist oppose war?
Joke, right?
I suppose in between my second job of serial killer, I can justify hating others who might want my land and want to shoot me if I don't leave like the Jews is the West Bank do to Muslims.
Or just maybe, some atheists have a humanistic view of social interactions, think family and strong community are a good way to live.
Like the Crusaders.
Like the US Marines who Go with God to war.
On what basis can an atheist oppose war?
Joke, right?
I suppose in between my second job of serial killer, I can justify hating others who might want my land and want to shoot me if I don't leave like the Jews is the West Bank do to Muslims.
Or just maybe, some atheists have a humanistic view of social interactions, think family and strong community are a good way to live.
Here's how religion can work, although it doesn't always, fear of something else. Something you don't know, can't see, can't control, and yes even can't predict could oppose you. Did Hebrews slaughter infants? Technically, no they did not, at least not recorded in the Bible. Some magic or other did, excusing the Hebrew people from what might have been their normal duty in those barbaric times to slaughter children. See how that works? Religion can be a source of "circumspection." It gives your frowns of disapproval a lot more kick.
Your complaint about the Church of England illustrates that without religion there is no check on the state. Atheism has no enforcement mechanism except the state. When religion fails you get what atheism can do about the state which is nothing.
Religion has an alternate enforcement mechanism, albeit a very remote system of rewards and punishments. Being so remote is actually a good thing as this makes the art of persuasion all the more necessary, and the art of coercion all the more uninformed.
And, if you will notice, I started another genuine thread for theists to talk about what they find positive in theism. Clusium started the conversation, and perhaps you could say your positive feelings about theism on that thread.
imdb2.freeforums.net/thread/128493/theists-most-theism-equal-opportunity
Anyway, I have moved (posted a copy there, deleted the one here) the comment to the theist thread where it was intended.