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Post by Deleted on Feb 7, 2019 21:13:42 GMT
I would say that's more plagiarism than anything. In the case of movies, people share them because...I guess they just want to. I've never been sure what's in it for them, beyond the benefit of sharing. But I know there's plenty of movies that are almost impossible to find: certain foreign movies, movies with limited releases, collectors items. If you really like them as I sometimes do, you go out of your way to buy them, but in the meantime, some new releases sell for 30 + dollars and that's a lot of money for a test screening to see if it's worth it to own the movie.
I have thousands in my collection and some of them started out as movies that I downloaded because they were impossible to find without being charged an arm and a leg. Half of them I had to specially order and I know I'm paying through the nose because they're movies I like, respect and want to own. Before I know that though, they're asking an awful lot of money for something I could download for free.
In this case the product is experiencing the story. If you experience the story without compensating the creator you have stolen that experience. Which means you have stolen the creators product. If you knew someone that worked in a movie theater and they let you watch movies for free without the permission of the theater owner you are stealing that viewing. In the end, we are just talking about how you are transmitting or receiving the stolen product. IP and Copyright law states that if you own the DVD you can view it with others (in a private setting no public viewing), let someone borrow it, or sell the dvd. When you "share" it online isn't the same as letting someone borrow your dvd. Each "share" is a duplication of the original IP. It would be akin to you buying a dvd copying 10, 100, 10,000, 1,000,000 times and then handing them out to anybody who wants to view it. When it comes to Streaming as some state it isn't duplication because you aren't downloading the whole or storing it. You are duplicating in real time and then destroying the copy as you watch. This is a leap in logic that tries to diminish the theft. It would be like some one making a 1000 copies of a movie, giving it to you free, and then after you watch it destroying the disk. You still experience the IP without compensating which is stealing the product as the product is the Experience. The method on how the Experience is stored is inconsequential. Abandonware is a class of software akin to an out of production movie. The creators don't care or stop protecting their copyright to bit of IP. Where Abandonware and out of production Movies get grey is the technology is getting to where once something was abandoned in the past is coming back. IE Atari, Sega, Nintendo flashbacks. They aren't selling the tech to play 30 year old games. They are selling the ability to play those games. The Software is the Product not the bit of tech that allows you to play it. Hence they have started to protect their copyrights again. The same thing is happening to movies. With the ease of Information transfer (one of the limits on getting foreign or low production count movies out there) people are starting to protect those Copyrights again. No matter how you slice it when it comes to Intellectual Properties... IE Ideas, Experiences, Stories if a creator owns the Copyright and you actively seekout and experience those Ideas without compensating the creators (Creators aren't just the directors, actors, writers, etc they are the studios that made them. As most studios paid money to gain those rights and without them larger IP can't get created) you are stealing. As for the distinction of reading the hypothetical book online. The Statues say that if you "innocently infringe" on copyright you aren't liable. So if you just go to a website looking for something to read and someone has reprinted the book then you are in the innocent category. If you go to a website to read books that you know aren't in the Public Domain then you aren't innocent. It's the intent. If you use a program to stream a movie for free that's still in the theater you know that's not in the Public Domain you aren't innocent. You are stealing the content. That's just it. I've never really not known what I was doing, which is why I started out by asking what is this, a church? I know what the FBI warning says and that I already take my chances with the law, let alone the possibility of downloading a virus or a bad ninja cam copy, of which I'm highly allergic.
I've been in that situation before too where someone who's worked at a movie theater let me in. It never struck me that I was committing a serious crime, or them.
Let me ask you something, have you ever smoked weed before it was legal (or in a state where it wasn't legal) smoked a cigarette or drank underage? If so, how do you reconcile it knowing you're not supposed to? You take your chances, right, knowing you're breaking the law?
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Post by Vassaggo on Feb 7, 2019 21:27:53 GMT
In this case the product is experiencing the story. If you experience the story without compensating the creator you have stolen that experience. Which means you have stolen the creators product. If you knew someone that worked in a movie theater and they let you watch movies for free without the permission of the theater owner you are stealing that viewing. In the end, we are just talking about how you are transmitting or receiving the stolen product. IP and Copyright law states that if you own the DVD you can view it with others (in a private setting no public viewing), let someone borrow it, or sell the dvd. When you "share" it online isn't the same as letting someone borrow your dvd. Each "share" is a duplication of the original IP. It would be akin to you buying a dvd copying 10, 100, 10,000, 1,000,000 times and then handing them out to anybody who wants to view it. When it comes to Streaming as some state it isn't duplication because you aren't downloading the whole or storing it. You are duplicating in real time and then destroying the copy as you watch. This is a leap in logic that tries to diminish the theft. It would be like some one making a 1000 copies of a movie, giving it to you free, and then after you watch it destroying the disk. You still experience the IP without compensating which is stealing the product as the product is the Experience. The method on how the Experience is stored is inconsequential. Abandonware is a class of software akin to an out of production movie. The creators don't care or stop protecting their copyright to bit of IP. Where Abandonware and out of production Movies get grey is the technology is getting to where once something was abandoned in the past is coming back. IE Atari, Sega, Nintendo flashbacks. They aren't selling the tech to play 30 year old games. They are selling the ability to play those games. The Software is the Product not the bit of tech that allows you to play it. Hence they have started to protect their copyrights again. The same thing is happening to movies. With the ease of Information transfer (one of the limits on getting foreign or low production count movies out there) people are starting to protect those Copyrights again. No matter how you slice it when it comes to Intellectual Properties... IE Ideas, Experiences, Stories if a creator owns the Copyright and you actively seekout and experience those Ideas without compensating the creators (Creators aren't just the directors, actors, writers, etc they are the studios that made them. As most studios paid money to gain those rights and without them larger IP can't get created) you are stealing. As for the distinction of reading the hypothetical book online. The Statues say that if you "innocently infringe" on copyright you aren't liable. So if you just go to a website looking for something to read and someone has reprinted the book then you are in the innocent category. If you go to a website to read books that you know aren't in the Public Domain then you aren't innocent. It's the intent. If you use a program to stream a movie for free that's still in the theater you know that's not in the Public Domain you aren't innocent. You are stealing the content. That's just it. I've never really not known what I was doing, which is why I started out by asking what is this, a church? I know what the FBI warning says and that I already take my chances with the law, let alone the possibility of downloading a virus or a bad ninja cam copy, of which I'm highly allergic.
I've been in that situation before too where someone who's worked at a movie theater let me in. It never struck me that I was committing a serious crime, or them.
Let me ask you something, have you ever smoked weed before it was legal (or in a state where it wasn't legal) smoked a cigarette or drank underage? If so, how do you reconcile it knowing you're not supposed to? You take your chances, right, knowing you're breaking the law? I've broken the laws, but I don't rationalize it. I've owned it and feel guilty during and after. Hell I felt guilty doing 100mph to the Hospital with my Dad having a heart attack in my passenger seat back in 2006. Just because I've broken laws doesn't make others doing so any less guilty than I was. Just because I've broken laws doesn't mean that making the distinction of others who break laws as law breakers too any less correct. I guess I've gotten to the point where I actively try not to break the law at all. When I was a kid I didn't care after about 20 I did. My intent now is not to break the law. If I do so innocently now without the intent (say driving through a town with a sound ordinance with windows down and car system blaring) I correct the behavior when I do find out.
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Post by Deleted on Feb 7, 2019 22:40:50 GMT
That's just it. I've never really not known what I was doing, which is why I started out by asking what is this, a church? I know what the FBI warning says and that I already take my chances with the law, let alone the possibility of downloading a virus or a bad ninja cam copy, of which I'm highly allergic.
I've been in that situation before too where someone who's worked at a movie theater let me in. It never struck me that I was committing a serious crime, or them.
Let me ask you something, have you ever smoked weed before it was legal (or in a state where it wasn't legal) smoked a cigarette or drank underage? If so, how do you reconcile it knowing you're not supposed to? You take your chances, right, knowing you're breaking the law? I've broken the laws, but I don't rationalize it. I've owned it and feel guilty during and after. Hell I felt guilty doing 100mph to the Hospital with my Dad having a heart attack in my passenger seat back in 2006. Just because I've broken laws doesn't make others doing so any less guilty than I was. Just because I've broken laws doesn't mean that making the distinction of others who break laws as law breakers too any less correct. I guess I've gotten to the point where I actively try not to break the law at all. When I was a kid I didn't care after about 20 I did. My intent now is not to break the law. If I do so innocently now without the intent (say driving through a town with a sound ordinance with windows down and car system blaring) I correct the behavior when I do find out. It's never my intent to revel in breaking the law either. I know what you mean. I rationalize to the extent I feel I have to if I'm to persuade people I'm not a monster. I'm a chef de cuisine at a busy restaurant. I work really hard, I'm a vacation once a decade kind of person and I'm a strong employee, a gatekeeper of things being done properly. It's a punishing racket that bottlenecks at the top for success and passion makes the difference between going nowhere fast and going nowhere slowly. My hours are all over the place but for the most part, the hours between 1am and 6am are my most free, but who's available to hang out then? Most of the time I'm eating dinner at 3 am, and I don't mean something small to avoid going to sleep hungry. I mean a full meal.
Society leaves me and people like me behind all the time. I have to quit to feel like I can grow at the same time the rest of society does because the hours everyone else is free, I'm in the thick of the action. Weekends, evenings, holidays; one new years eve at work I was tossing a pasta dish during the countdown I gave so little a shit about it. With all that, there's so many things I can't afford and if I could, where do I find the time? Aside from smoking weed and downloading movies occasionally (ones I don't buy) I'm completely law abiding. I stop at stop signs and crosswalks on my bike, and I don't even consider it special because it's the law. I'm not a bad person for needing certain fixes, I just need the respite from time to time. I'm alone too, no partner or children to dump my affection into or help carry the load. If downloading movies is the worst thing I've done, I consider myself pretty lucky.
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Post by Vassaggo on Feb 7, 2019 23:17:42 GMT
I've broken the laws, but I don't rationalize it. I've owned it and feel guilty during and after. Hell I felt guilty doing 100mph to the Hospital with my Dad having a heart attack in my passenger seat back in 2006. Just because I've broken laws doesn't make others doing so any less guilty than I was. Just because I've broken laws doesn't mean that making the distinction of others who break laws as law breakers too any less correct. I guess I've gotten to the point where I actively try not to break the law at all. When I was a kid I didn't care after about 20 I did. My intent now is not to break the law. If I do so innocently now without the intent (say driving through a town with a sound ordinance with windows down and car system blaring) I correct the behavior when I do find out. It's never my intent to revel in breaking the law either. I know what you mean. I rationalize to the extent I feel I have to if I'm to persuade people I'm not a monster. I'm a chef de cuisine at a busy restaurant. I work really hard, I'm a vacation once a decade kind of person and I'm a strong employee, a gatekeeper of things being done properly. It's a punishing racket that bottlenecks at the top for success and passion makes the difference between going nowhere fast and going nowhere slowly. My hours are all over the place but for the most part, the hours between 1am and 6am are my most free, but who's available to hang out then? Most of the time I'm eating dinner at 3 am, and I don't mean something small to avoid going to sleep hungry. I mean a full meal.
Society leaves me and people like me behind all the time. I have to quit to feel like I can grow at the same time the rest of society does because the hours everyone else is free, I'm in the thick of the action. Weekends, evenings, holidays; one new years eve at work I was tossing a pasta dish during the countdown I gave so little a shit about it. With all that, there's so many things I can't afford and if I could, where do I find the time? Aside from smoking weed and downloading movies occasionally (ones I don't buy) I'm completely law abiding. I stop at stop signs and crosswalks on my bike, and I don't even consider it special because it's the law. I'm not a bad person for needing certain fixes, I just need the respite from time to time. I'm alone too, no partner or children to dump my affection into or help carry the load. If downloading movies is the worst thing I've done, I consider myself pretty lucky.
My best friend is the biggest Pirate you can find. Movies, TV, Porn, etc. He knows it and is kind of in the same boat you are in time wise (He has a wife and kid though.) He works 60-70hrs per week as a "Sub Contractor" to a large corporation doing their IT work. It's a cheap way for them to pay him less while expecting the same amount of work. Having a wife and Kid, house 2 cars, etc Makes him work 10-15 hours extra on side projects a week just to scrape by. He is like fuck it. He has not the time nor the money to enjoy media so he steals it. The last little bit of rebel left in him at 42. I think you stepped into a argument with one of our resident trolls though. I've had him blocked for a while so I rarely have to deal with him unless someone replies to him. (Only time I see his inane chatter) Most of the blow back with the stealing is this. He steals content from Marvel Studios then makes Moral Judgement's not only on the characters Morals, but on the creators Morals. One can look the other way on the stealing without the proselytizing or look the other way on the proselytizing if he wasn't stealing.
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Post by Deleted on Feb 7, 2019 23:58:41 GMT
It's never my intent to revel in breaking the law either. I know what you mean. I rationalize to the extent I feel I have to if I'm to persuade people I'm not a monster. I'm a chef de cuisine at a busy restaurant. I work really hard, I'm a vacation once a decade kind of person and I'm a strong employee, a gatekeeper of things being done properly. It's a punishing racket that bottlenecks at the top for success and passion makes the difference between going nowhere fast and going nowhere slowly. My hours are all over the place but for the most part, the hours between 1am and 6am are my most free, but who's available to hang out then? Most of the time I'm eating dinner at 3 am, and I don't mean something small to avoid going to sleep hungry. I mean a full meal.
Society leaves me and people like me behind all the time. I have to quit to feel like I can grow at the same time the rest of society does because the hours everyone else is free, I'm in the thick of the action. Weekends, evenings, holidays; one new years eve at work I was tossing a pasta dish during the countdown I gave so little a shit about it. With all that, there's so many things I can't afford and if I could, where do I find the time? Aside from smoking weed and downloading movies occasionally (ones I don't buy) I'm completely law abiding. I stop at stop signs and crosswalks on my bike, and I don't even consider it special because it's the law. I'm not a bad person for needing certain fixes, I just need the respite from time to time. I'm alone too, no partner or children to dump my affection into or help carry the load. If downloading movies is the worst thing I've done, I consider myself pretty lucky.
My best friend is the biggest Pirate you can find. Movies, TV, Porn, etc. He knows it and is kind of in the same boat you are in time wise (He has a wife and kid though.) He works 60-70hrs per week as a "Sub Contractor" to a large corporation doing their IT work. It's a cheap way for them to pay him less while expecting the same amount of work. Having a wife and Kid, house 2 cars, etc Makes him work 10-15 hours extra on side projects a week just to scrape by. He is like fuck it. He has not the time nor the money to enjoy media so he steals it. The last little bit of rebel left in him at 42. I think you stepped into a argument with one of our resident trolls though. I've had him blocked for a while so I rarely have to deal with him unless someone replies to him. (Only time I see his inane chatter) Most of the blow back with the stealing is this. He steals content from Marvel Studios then makes Moral Judgement's not only on the characters Morals, but on the creators Morals. One can look the other way on the stealing without the proselytizing or look the other way on the proselytizing if he wasn't stealing. I feel your friend's pain, right down to the last bit of rebel left in him. I've been a goodie two-shoes pretty much my whole life. Downloading movies or smoking weed are like my thug life moments. Other than that I have two cats and I abuse the heart emoji on Facebook.
I didn't super mean to step into an argument other people were having. It seems like he and I are on the same (or similar) page in this issue, even if I love the MCU and he does not. I missed his making a big deal about downloading before but I don't mind the jump-off for a bigger discussion. It's all good.
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Post by Vassaggo on Feb 8, 2019 0:12:04 GMT
My best friend is the biggest Pirate you can find. Movies, TV, Porn, etc. He knows it and is kind of in the same boat you are in time wise (He has a wife and kid though.) He works 60-70hrs per week as a "Sub Contractor" to a large corporation doing their IT work. It's a cheap way for them to pay him less while expecting the same amount of work. Having a wife and Kid, house 2 cars, etc Makes him work 10-15 hours extra on side projects a week just to scrape by. He is like fuck it. He has not the time nor the money to enjoy media so he steals it. The last little bit of rebel left in him at 42. I think you stepped into a argument with one of our resident trolls though. I've had him blocked for a while so I rarely have to deal with him unless someone replies to him. (Only time I see his inane chatter) Most of the blow back with the stealing is this. He steals content from Marvel Studios then makes Moral Judgement's not only on the characters Morals, but on the creators Morals. One can look the other way on the stealing without the proselytizing or look the other way on the proselytizing if he wasn't stealing. I feel your friend's pain, right down to the last bit of rebel left in him. I've been a goodie two-shoes pretty much my whole life. Downloading movies or smoking weed are like my thug life moments. Other than that I have two cats and I abuse the heart emoji on Facebook.
I didn't super mean to step into an argument other people were having. It seems like he and I are on the same (or similar) page in this issue, even if I love the MCU and he does not. I missed his making a big deal about downloading before but I don't mind the jump-off for a bigger discussion. It's all good.
Conversation or bigger discussion is always good. Just giving you a little context as it were from my point of view on the impetus on the comments/hate vs downloading.
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Post by Deleted on Feb 8, 2019 0:33:44 GMT
I feel your friend's pain, right down to the last bit of rebel left in him. I've been a goodie two-shoes pretty much my whole life. Downloading movies or smoking weed are like my thug life moments. Other than that I have two cats and I abuse the heart emoji on Facebook.
I didn't super mean to step into an argument other people were having. It seems like he and I are on the same (or similar) page in this issue, even if I love the MCU and he does not. I missed his making a big deal about downloading before but I don't mind the jump-off for a bigger discussion. It's all good.
Conversation or bigger discussion is always good. Just giving you a little context as it were from my point of view on the impetus on the comments/hate vs downloading. It is appreciated.
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Post by ThatGuy on Feb 8, 2019 7:56:42 GMT
Wow... People can't go before or after the movie? Or is 3 hours really that long to not go use the restroom? The Small drink at my local Cinema is 32oz. The special is if you order a popcorn and candy for a dollar more you get a 64oz. instead of 32. Most people I see have those monsters. Screw that. I always eat and drink before and use the restroom before the movie or wait until after.
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