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Post by hi224 on May 13, 2019 18:02:11 GMT
makes me re-evaluate him.
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Post by CoolJGS☺ on May 13, 2019 18:20:10 GMT
makes me re-evaluate him. He certainly did.
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Post by Leo of Red Keep on May 13, 2019 18:26:03 GMT
Do this. I have despised the character since S4, since I understood his self-aggrandised view of his own misery was the cause of some of the problems around him. He refused to see the chances his father gave him of proving himself. He refused to acknowledge his sister's attempts at finding a positive, common understanding. He undermined and threatened her, which led to her absolute mistrust and sincere accusations. He then killed his father without a need, out of pure suicidal spite and joined an enemy of his family.
I wonder if there is any worse piece of shit in this story. Daenerys is a monstrous tyrant, the top villain without question but Tyrion is the main stink.
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Post by hi224 on May 13, 2019 18:31:50 GMT
Do this. I have despised the character since S4, since I understood his self-aggrandised view of his own misery was the cause of some of the problems around him. He refused to see the chances his father gave him of proving himself. He refused to acknowledge his sister's attempts at finding a positive, common understanding. He undermined and threatened her, which led to her absolute mistrust and sincere accusations. He then killed his father without a need, out of pure suicidal spite and joined an enemy of his family. I wonder if there is any worse piece of shit in this story. Daenerys is a monstrous tyrant, the top villain without question but Tyrion is the main stink. Not to mention his need to be love his a big fundamental flaw which he never evolved past at all, and likely what does him in. that said, don't like how they killed Jaime at all, what a waste of a character development as well. Based on his progression Jaime should've lived actually.
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Post by Leo of Red Keep on May 13, 2019 18:43:56 GMT
Do this. I have despised the character since S4, since I understood his self-aggrandised view of his own misery was the cause of some of the problems around him. He refused to see the chances his father gave him of proving himself. He refused to acknowledge his sister's attempts at finding a positive, common understanding. He undermined and threatened her, which led to her absolute mistrust and sincere accusations. He then killed his father without a need, out of pure suicidal spite and joined an enemy of his family. I wonder if there is any worse piece of shit in this story. Daenerys is a monstrous tyrant, the top villain without question but Tyrion is the main stink. Not to mention his need to be love his a big fundamental flaw which he never evolved past at all, and likely what does him in. that said, don't like how they killed Jaime at all, what a waste of a character development as well. Based on his progression Jaime should've lived actually. I'm proud of Jaime. I like what was done with him, but then I despise the idea of redemption and never thought he needed any in the first place. Tyrion's need to be loved… is not the main thing. Or maybe it is just a part of the main thing. He wants recognition. What he keeps repeating all along is his perception of not being treated equally, which is often true but just as often fantasised. His father, most of all, expected as much of him as of the other two, but he failed to deliver. Jaime also failed to deliver, but decided to catch up and actually did a fairly good job of it.
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Post by bluerisk on May 13, 2019 18:45:16 GMT
makes me re-evaluate him. Absolutely. I called him bane of the realm in a thread below. He should have let the mad queen attack the Red Keep, and Red Keep only. Maybe, in advance, they should have destroyed the Iron fleet before it got equipped with scorpions - all three dragons. No mission North, no lost dragon, no breached wall, no burned KL but a united realm defending the still standing wall. The dragons could have turned the NK army to ashes, while he had to stay away for Qyburn's scorpions for they could rain dragon glass bolts on him. Even if they can't undo him, they can hurt or even maim him, and they can kill his generals. And with no living or dead bodies to recruits, he would become a army of one; maybe severely maimed. If they let Qyburn live, he and this pyromancer could also produce new wildfire weapons, and machines that could deliver them. But dealing with Cercei would have been the first step. Thx to the writers Tyrion got nothing right, right from the very beginning: letting the Tyrells down, when their was plenty of time to help them: raising troops => Tarly forces, or sending them South, Lannister army took weeks, three dragons had need hours. Why was there no raven from High Garden, and the Lannister couldn't take Riverrun for month but High Garden fell in hours?! And nobody was aware that the Tarlys had turned against their liege Lords and were raising troops. Bullshit from A to Z. Parting the fleet, attacking Castely Rock when it had no strategic meaning. Using the dragons as scout and dealing with the Iron fleet might have been even the first task before parting the fleet.
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Post by hi224 on May 13, 2019 18:52:47 GMT
Not to mention his need to be love his a big fundamental flaw which he never evolved past at all, and likely what does him in. that said, don't like how they killed Jaime at all, what a waste of a character development as well. Based on his progression Jaime should've lived actually. I'm proud of Jaime. I like what was done with him, but then I despise the idea of redemption and never thought he needed any in the first place. Tyrion's need to be loved… is not the main thing. Or maybe it is just a part of the main thing. He wants recognition. What he keeps repeating all along is his perception of not being treated equally, which is often true but just as often fantasised. His father, most of all, expected as much of him as of the other two, but he failed to deliver. Jaime also failed to deliver, but decided to catch up and actually did a fairly good job of it. i honestly felt like it would've made much more sense for Jaime to stay in Kings Landing if that was the route they were going.
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Post by Leo of Red Keep on May 13, 2019 19:04:22 GMT
I'm proud of Jaime. I like what was done with him, but then I despise the idea of redemption and never thought he needed any in the first place. Tyrion's need to be loved… is not the main thing. Or maybe it is just a part of the main thing. He wants recognition. What he keeps repeating all along is his perception of not being treated equally, which is often true but just as often fantasised. His father, most of all, expected as much of him as of the other two, but he failed to deliver. Jaime also failed to deliver, but decided to catch up and actually did a fairly good job of it. i honestly felt like it would've made much more sense for Jaime to stay in Kings Landing if that was the route they were going. Yes, I do not disagree. Stupid writer. And I mean GRRM, because I know he'll do that too.
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Post by hi224 on May 13, 2019 19:05:06 GMT
i honestly felt like it would've made much more sense for Jaime to stay in Kings Landing if that was the route they were going. Yes, I do not disagree. Stupid writer. And I mean GRRM, because I know he'll do that too. I see jaime surviving the books?
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Post by Leo of Red Keep on May 13, 2019 19:20:41 GMT
Yes, I do not disagree. Stupid writer. And I mean GRRM, because I know he'll do that too. I see jaime surviving the books? No, I wouldn't expect that. The "born together, die together" aspect is stronger there. Was it even mentioned in the show? Anyway, I think that's where he's heading too. The other thing I like, or rather the thing I feared which then didn't happen, is that Cersei wasn't turned into that suicidal megalomaniac who blows herself up with the city rather than lose the war. I was half expecting a Downfall type scenario in which the cornered, delusional bad guy decided that only those who would be willing to die around him were worthy and gave orders to keep resisting long after it made sense. They had her accept defeat and seek safety instead, for the sake of her child (which idiots believed was a lie) and herself. Cersei wasn't made the villain, she remained the woman with values I can share. Now, I am sure this won't go this way in the books. I am grateful to D&D for this.
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Post by hi224 on May 13, 2019 19:28:40 GMT
I see jaime surviving the books? No, I wouldn't expect that. The "born together, die together" aspect is stronger there. Was it even mentioned in the show? Anyway, I think that's where he's heading too. The other thing I like, or rather the thing I feared which then didn't happen, is that Cersei wasn't turned into that suicidal megalomaniac who blows herself up with the city rather than lose the war. I was half expecting a Downfall type scenario in which the cornered, delusional bad guy decided that only those who would be willing to die around him were worthy and gave orders to keep resisting long after it made sense. They had her accept defeat and seek safety instead, for the sake of her child (which idiots believed was a lie) and herself. Cersei wasn't made the villain, she remained the woman with values I can share. Now, I am sure this won't go this way in the books. I am grateful to D&D for this. Eh sort of betrayed her character actually
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Post by Leo of Red Keep on May 13, 2019 19:31:44 GMT
No, I wouldn't expect that. The "born together, die together" aspect is stronger there. Was it even mentioned in the show? Anyway, I think that's where he's heading too. The other thing I like, or rather the thing I feared which then didn't happen, is that Cersei wasn't turned into that suicidal megalomaniac who blows herself up with the city rather than lose the war. I was half expecting a Downfall type scenario in which the cornered, delusional bad guy decided that only those who would be willing to die around him were worthy and gave orders to keep resisting long after it made sense. They had her accept defeat and seek safety instead, for the sake of her child (which idiots believed was a lie) and herself. Cersei wasn't made the villain, she remained the woman with values I can share. Now, I am sure this won't go this way in the books. I am grateful to D&D for this. Eh sort of betrayed her character actually Not in the show.
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Post by hi224 on May 13, 2019 19:33:43 GMT
Eh sort of betrayed her character actually Not in the show. the same woman who was prepared to die with her children by way of poison as they almost lost blackwater?.
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Post by lenlenlen1 on May 13, 2019 19:44:14 GMT
Do this. I have despised the character since S4, since I understood his self-aggrandised view of his own misery was the cause of some of the problems around him. He refused to see the chances his father gave him of proving himself. He refused to acknowledge his sister's attempts at finding a positive, common understanding. He undermined and threatened her, which led to her absolute mistrust and sincere accusations. He then killed his father without a need, out of pure suicidal spite and joined an enemy of his family. I wonder if there is any worse piece of shit in this story. Daenerys is a monstrous tyrant, the top villain without question but Tyrion is the main stink. If I pretend to be crazy, and I mean deeply insane, I might, MIGHT, be able to see some of your points.
But: He refused to acknowledge his sister's attempts at finding a positive, common understanding.
When the fuck did THAT ever happen?! Did I miss a season! I'm pretty sure I didn't since I own all of them. Where/when did Cersei ever attempt finding a positive, common understanding with Tyrion?!
Are you on the drugs?
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Post by hi224 on May 13, 2019 19:48:43 GMT
Do this. I have despised the character since S4, since I understood his self-aggrandised view of his own misery was the cause of some of the problems around him. He refused to see the chances his father gave him of proving himself. He refused to acknowledge his sister's attempts at finding a positive, common understanding. He undermined and threatened her, which led to her absolute mistrust and sincere accusations. He then killed his father without a need, out of pure suicidal spite and joined an enemy of his family. I wonder if there is any worse piece of shit in this story. Daenerys is a monstrous tyrant, the top villain without question but Tyrion is the main stink. If I pretend to be crazy, and I mean deeply insane, I might, MIGHT, be able to see some of your points.
But: He refused to acknowledge his sister's attempts at finding a positive, common understanding.
When the fuck did that EVER happen?! Did I miss a season! I'm pretty sure I didn't since I own all of them. Where did Cersei ever attempt finding a positive, common understanding with Tyrion?!
Are you on the drugs?
Point is he antagonized her efforts rather then work around her.
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Post by lenlenlen1 on May 13, 2019 19:49:42 GMT
If I pretend to be crazy, and I mean deeply insane, I might, MIGHT, be able to see some of your points.
But: He refused to acknowledge his sister's attempts at finding a positive, common understanding.
When the fuck did that EVER happen?! Did I miss a season! I'm pretty sure I didn't since I own all of them. Where did Cersei ever attempt finding a positive, common understanding with Tyrion?!
Are you on the drugs?
Point is he antagonized her efforts rather then work around her. The only point there is your point of view.
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Post by hi224 on May 13, 2019 19:54:25 GMT
Point is he antagonized her efforts rather then work around her. The only point there is your point of view. well but Tyrion just simply ruffled her paranoia, especially by mocking her attempts at open dialogue as well. yeah she did mock him as a kid, but he handled situation poorly.
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Post by lenlenlen1 on May 13, 2019 19:57:02 GMT
The only point there is your point of view. well but Tyrion just simply ruffled her paranoia, especially by mocking her attempts at open dialogue as well. yeah she did mock him as a kid, but he handled situation poorly. I think the overall theme in that relationship is that she's a fucking bitch from hell. How are you coming up with other interpretations?
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Post by hi224 on May 13, 2019 19:58:53 GMT
well but Tyrion just simply ruffled her paranoia, especially by mocking her attempts at open dialogue as well. yeah she did mock him as a kid, but he handled situation poorly. I think the overall theme in that relationship is that she's a fucking bitch from hell. How are you coming up with other interpretations? she is horrible,, but everythings a two way street right?.
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Post by lenlenlen1 on May 13, 2019 20:32:20 GMT
I think the overall theme in that relationship is that she's a fucking bitch from hell. How are you coming up with other interpretations? she is horrible,, but everythings a two way street right?. A two way street that in her case skewed quite a bit farther toward the dark. Her claims that everything she did was for family were just an excuse. The only time she was ever TRULY honest was when she told the nun that she did the things she did "because they felt good". And she was only honest then because the nun was about to be killed and would never repeat it. Shame. Shame...
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