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Post by Carl LaFong on Nov 28, 2019 15:50:19 GMT
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Post by weststigersbob on Nov 28, 2019 16:28:16 GMT
I'm not terribly surprised. There is no doubt he acted wrongly, but its also clear he had no idea what he was doing and the facilities at Hillsborough were archaic at best. The decision to open Gate C was a horrendous misjudgment in hindsight, but so is trying to funnel 10,000 spectators through 7 turnstiles, and having many fans walking into a stadium poorly signposted, poorly designed and seemingly only one way towards the ground : Through the tunnel into already overflowing terraces. Duckenfield was way over his head, and short of calling the game off and starting again the next day, Hillsborough almost has a sense of inevitability about it.
The worst thing about Hillsborough was the aftermath - legitimate fans who bought tickets, who weren't in any way doing anything wrong, were categorised by Police, Politicans and Media as being drunks, hooligans, thieves and general lowlifes, who circumvented security and caused this tragedy themselves without a second of thought of doubt, let alone any sort of proper investigation. They were guilty, and did it to themselves.
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Post by TheGoodMan19 on Nov 28, 2019 17:30:44 GMT
I'm not terribly surprised. There is no doubt he acted wrongly, but its also clear he had no idea what he was doing and the facilities at Hillsborough were archaic at best. The decision to open Gate C was a horrendous misjudgment in hindsight, but so is trying to funnel 10,000 spectators through 7 turnstiles, and having many fans walking into a stadium poorly signposted, poorly designed and seemingly only one way towards the ground : Through the tunnel into already overflowing terraces. Duckenfield was way over his head, and short of calling the game off and starting again the next day, Hillsborough almost has a sense of inevitability about it. The worst thing about Hillsborough was the aftermath - legitimate fans who bought tickets, who weren't in any way doing anything wrong, were categorised by Police, Politicans and Media as being drunks, hooligans, thieves and general lowlifes, who circumvented security and caused this tragedy themselves without a second of thought of doubt, let alone any sort of proper investigation. They were guilty, and did it to themselves. Has any of the media been punished for the bullshit they reported? I remember when it happened. The US media reported it as just another bunch of drunken soccer fans killing themselves. Because no US media was there, they had to take it from the tabloids. For years, I thought Hillsborough was nothing but a drunken riot and the fans brought it on themselves. If I was connected to the dead, I'd be nearly as pissed and I would be as Duckenfield.
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Post by Carl LaFong on Nov 28, 2019 17:36:12 GMT
I'm not terribly surprised. There is no doubt he acted wrongly, but its also clear he had no idea what he was doing and the facilities at Hillsborough were archaic at best. The decision to open Gate C was a horrendous misjudgment in hindsight, but so is trying to funnel 10,000 spectators through 7 turnstiles, and having many fans walking into a stadium poorly signposted, poorly designed and seemingly only one way towards the ground : Through the tunnel into already overflowing terraces. Duckenfield was way over his head, and short of calling the game off and starting again the next day, Hillsborough almost has a sense of inevitability about it. The worst thing about Hillsborough was the aftermath - legitimate fans who bought tickets, who weren't in any way doing anything wrong, were categorised by Police, Politicans and Media as being drunks, hooligans, thieves and general lowlifes, who circumvented security and caused this tragedy themselves without a second of thought of doubt, let alone any sort of proper investigation. They were guilty, and did it to themselves. Has any of the media been punished for the bullshit they reported? I remember when it happened. The US media reported it as just another bunch of drunken soccer fans killing themselves. Because no US media was there, they had to take it from the tabloids. For years, I thought Hillsborough was nothing but a drunken riot and the fans brought it on themselves. If I was connected to the dead, I'd be nearly as pissed and I would be as Duckenfield.
To this day, hardly anyone in Liverpool buys the Sun newspaper.
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Post by hi224 on Nov 28, 2019 21:07:59 GMT
sad state of affairs.
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Post by weststigersbob on Nov 29, 2019 3:21:10 GMT
TheGoodMan19I think the worst that happened was some Lord made a rather sanctimonious apology that did nothing but made things worse, as he shifted the blame considerably to the South Yorkshire police, who he claimed as the sources of the information. But as Carl said, many Liverpool residents will never buy the Sun again. They reported horrendous things like fans pickpocketed dead fans on the field, police horses were punched, fans tried to lift up and upend police horses and the worst of the lot, Liverpool fans were urinating on ambulance officers whilst they tried to save people on the pitch. Not one of these were even remotely true. As for the police, the coroner, the government etc etc - for almost 20 years they simply refused to acknowledge that it was anything other than unticketed, drunk fans storming the turnstiles causing the crush. It was an easy kill - especially after Heysel 5 years earlier and the massive problem hooliganism was at the time. The Taylor report modernised all grounds in the highest tiers of English Football - especially the one ticket, one seat rule and the abolition of standing terraces- but Hillsborough expedited the Taylor report, not caused it. Hooliganism was the driver for that - at a lot of games the average Joe wouldn’t go anywhere near the ground, lest he be bashed - let alone take the wife and kids.
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Post by hoskotafe3 on Nov 29, 2019 7:07:18 GMT
Yeah. I think the right call on manslaughter. It was a perfect storm situation that can't possibly be fairly laid at the feet of any one individual. I can understand grief stricken people looking for someone to blame, but his main crime was being tbe wrong person in a terrible situation. As others have mentioned, there probably was no "right person" for that situation.
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