Deleted
Deleted Member
@Deleted
Posts: 0
Likes:
|
Post by Deleted on Apr 20, 2017 20:54:34 GMT
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
@Deleted
Posts: 0
Likes:
|
Post by Deleted on Apr 20, 2017 21:03:34 GMT
I dunno really. I suspect a very subtle form of racism, not like out and out racism, but I think if you see a black sportsmen, you almost expect them to be maybe a bit faster and maybe a bit better at sport, which in itself is a subtle form of racism, but you might not expect them to be as intelligent or trust them tactically, so I suspect they aren't getting as many chances. I dunno, I'm just guessing. There is no doubt though, we probably all have subtle biases, as much as we try not too, it is probably good to be aware of them though so you can work on shedding them, and not just pretend you are perfectly fair. |
|
|
|
Post by runie on Apr 20, 2017 21:14:04 GMT
Well The Brighton lad has done wonders.
He must be a superhero to have got that team winning that league so fast...
|
|
|
|
Post by Excellent Bulletproof Vest on Apr 20, 2017 22:47:09 GMT
Slight racism and the fact that management is a largely fraudulent profession.
If managers were really as influential as people think any non racist chairman or owner could cheaply hire the best black manager in the world who would be on par with the best white managers and dominate the game. If this happened nobody would discriminate against black managers any more because they'd be left behind.
This is the reason there's no racism when it comes to signing players - if anyone discriminated against black players they'd be seriously disadvantaging themselves against other teams by reducing their potential pool of players and reducing the price for good black players for other teams.
This is also a big reason that Liverpool haven't won the league for 30 years.
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
@Deleted
Posts: 0
Likes:
|
Post by Deleted on Apr 20, 2017 23:08:21 GMT
Slight racism and the fact that management is a largely fraudulent profession. If managers were really as influential as people think any non racist chairman or owner could cheaply hire the best black manager in the world who would be on par with the best white managers and dominate the game. If this happened nobody would discriminate against black managers any more because they'd be left behind. It isn't quite as straight forward as that though, you don't actually know who the next black Mourinho is going to be until you give perhaps hundreds of black guys a chance all over Europe over a sustained period of time. Let's face it, almost every manager is going to end up a failure whether white or black, only a small handful are going to stay successful at or near the top of European football for a long period time, so a chairman is going to need almost blind luck to pluck the best black manager out of the pool of ex players. It is really a trial and error business, but you need to be getting a trial in the first place. I don't really know how you fix the problem overnight, but I do think people are getting less racist and less homophobic and less sexist etc over time (with perhaps some prejudices having slight spikes now and again). You probably aren't going to change the hearts of old men in suits today, but tomorrow there will be a new breed of chairman. I think it just needs patience, it isn't ideal but it is the best I've got. |
|
|
|
Post by Excellent Bulletproof Vest on Apr 21, 2017 0:06:59 GMT
Slight racism and the fact that management is a largely fraudulent profession. If managers were really as influential as people think any non racist chairman or owner could cheaply hire the best black manager in the world who would be on par with the best white managers and dominate the game. If this happened nobody would discriminate against black managers any more because they'd be left behind. It isn't quite as straight forward as that though, you don't actually know who the next black Mourinho is going to be until you give perhaps hundreds of black guys a chance all over Europe over a sustained period of time. Let's face it, almost every manager is going to end up a failure whether white or black, only a small handful are going to stay successful at or near the top of European football for a long period time, so a chairman is going to need almost blind luck to pluck the best black manager out of the pool of ex players. It is really a trial and error business, but you need to be getting a trial in the first place. I don't really know how you fix the problem overnight, but I do think people are getting less racist and less homophobic and less sexist etc over time (with perhaps some prejudices having slight spikes now and again). You probably aren't going to change the hearts of old men in suits today, but tomorrow there will be a new breed of chairman. I think it just needs patience, it isn't ideal but it is the best I've got. There are many black managers in Africa. If managers really make a difference and you're a non elite side you could hire the best black manager in all of Africa, chances are pretty high that he'll have superior qualities as a manager than the best white manager you could get. The biggest discrimination is against people who've never played professional football. I'm a white British male, but someone like Dwight Yorke has an infinitely better chance of becoming a manager than I do. When Dwight Yorke complains about not getting interviews it goes on BBC Sport, if I apply for jobs and complain about not getting interviews I get laughed at. If managers really do make a difference maybe one of job's key criteria is for the manager to command the respect of the players. Maybe black managers, female managers, non-footballer managers really would get worse results when managing because racism, sexism and snobbishness about having played the sport professionally on the part of some of the players means they respect them less. If that's the case I don't know what the solution is. |
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
@Deleted
Posts: 0
Likes:
|
Post by Deleted on Apr 21, 2017 0:22:07 GMT
If managers don't make a difference then you wont mind David Moyes getting another crack at the whip at Man United? Or maybe even Big Ron or Tommy Docherty? (is he still alive?)
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
@Deleted
Posts: 0
Likes:
|
Post by Deleted on Apr 21, 2017 11:57:59 GMT
Yeah, I actually don't believe Big Ron is a racist. If you look at his record, he signed 3 black players in his West Brom team in the 70s when racism was still rife and black players were struggling to get a chance. He's just a bit old fashioned. Apparently on the training ground he used to say "right, coloured players versus whites", and the players loved it. And actually the ex black players who played under him came out in his defence when he got sacked from ITV.
I'd be more worried about the guy who knows which words to avoid, but hardly ever hires a black man. There are one or two formers managers I can think of who fit this bill who have never been outed.
.
Love the Big Sam. Respect the Sam!
|
|
|
|
Post by runie on Apr 21, 2017 12:30:05 GMT
Erm its not just Jose and Big Sam. Tony Pullis and Poch also have a huge impact.
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
@Deleted
Posts: 0
Likes:
|
Post by Deleted on Apr 21, 2017 12:41:38 GMT
Erm its not just Jose and Big Sam. Tony Pullis and Poch also have a huge impact. Almost every team would plummet down the table if you put a random Joe off the street in charge. I mean most people, they'd probably just pick a 4-4-2, play 11 a sides in training, and maybe do a bit of shooting practice and think that would be enough. |
|
|
|
Post by wonderburstanger on Apr 21, 2017 17:44:48 GMT
Racism, homie. It's always about race.
|
|
|
|
Post by mangekyoalleluia on Apr 21, 2017 19:33:38 GMT
Institutional racism... and just a culture of white men being the majority of managers I guess.
|
|
|
|
Post by Excellent Bulletproof Vest on Apr 21, 2017 23:32:07 GMT
Erm its not just Jose and Big Sam. Tony Pullis and Poch also have a huge impact. Almost every team would plummet down the table if you put a random Joe off the street in charge. I mean most people, they'd probably just pick a 4-4-2, play 11 a sides in training, and maybe do a bit of shooting practice and think that would be enough. I don't think they necessarily would, it's not like the manager is the only person at the club, there are many coaches and the players will know what they're doing. When teams fire their managers and appoint caretakers the caretakers are normally drawn from the existing staff, I'd expect any manager pulled from the street would pay a lot of attention to senior staff. |
|
|
|
Post by hairybuttcheeks on Apr 21, 2017 23:42:09 GMT
it's not racism, it's an intelligence issue.
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
@Deleted
Posts: 0
Likes:
|
Post by Deleted on Apr 22, 2017 1:20:30 GMT
Institutional racism... and just a culture of white men being the majority of managers I guess. Same thing - arguably worse - in NFL where blacks are the majority of players but black head coaches are a rarity. |
|
