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Post by JudgeJuryDredd on Jun 2, 2020 1:20:55 GMT
right before or after November due to the political divide? Most of the roster and people behind the scenes are right leaning, but the other half are lean pretty left like Rey Mysterio, Roman Reigns, Sonya Deville(Who recently retweeted Taylor Swift's demand to vote Trump out later in the year), Mia Yim, Zelina Vega, and Sasha Banks.
What do you think?
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Nike316
Sophomore
@nike316
Posts: 980
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Post by Nike316 on Jun 2, 2020 17:31:58 GMT
I'm guessing everyone is just gonna continue to come together for WWE sponsorships which promote equality.
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Post by Jayman on Jun 2, 2020 18:14:31 GMT
What does politics have to do with anything?
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Post by JudgeJuryDredd on Jun 2, 2020 19:53:12 GMT
What does politics have to do with anything? These days? Everything. And if Jaxson Ryker, who tweeted support of Donald Trump last night and is taking a lot of heat right now from his fellow WWE peers - none shy of using swear words at him, continues to stay with the company I'd imagine some of them might want out, or not and continue accepting those paychecks. My take? It's all stupid, everyone is allowed to have their opinion but most fans of the company who subscribe to the social media feed of these superstars are not there for political commentary to begin with. And while many in the WWE are trying to present an image that demands instant 'brownie points' no amount of 'orange man bad' from, say, Soyna Deville or former superstars like Dave Bautista or Shane Helms are going to erase the fact that Trump is a hall of famer and the company has serious ties with him, and of course that the McMahons are very good friends with him. The best thing to do? Not talk politics, focus on your art, because eventually the double standards will bite you in the rear.
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Post by Jayman on Jun 2, 2020 20:18:19 GMT
What does politics have to do with anything? These days? Everything. And if Jaxson Ryker, who tweeted support of Donald Trump last night and is taking a lot of heat right now from his fellow WWE peers - none shy of using swear words at him, continues to stay with the company I'd imagine some of them might want out, or not and continue accepting those paychecks. My take? It's all stupid, everyone is allowed to have their opinion but most fans of the company who subscribe to the social media feed of these superstars are not there for political commentary to begin with. And while many in the WWE are trying to present an image that demands instant 'brownie points' no amount of 'orange man bad' from, say, Soyna Deville or former superstars like Dave Bautista or Shane Helms are going to erase the fact that Trump is a hall of famer and the company has serious ties with him, and of course that the McMahons are very good friends with him. The best thing to do? Not talk politics, focus on your art, because eventually the double standards will bite you in the rear. I can't stand how partisan politics have creeped into every part of our society. Music, sports, tv, movies, etc.. It is nauseating to me. Everybody wants to be a political activist.
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Post by JudgeJuryDredd on Jun 3, 2020 1:15:34 GMT
These days? Everything. And if Jaxson Ryker, who tweeted support of Donald Trump last night and is taking a lot of heat right now from his fellow WWE peers - none shy of using swear words at him, continues to stay with the company I'd imagine some of them might want out, or not and continue accepting those paychecks. My take? It's all stupid, everyone is allowed to have their opinion but most fans of the company who subscribe to the social media feed of these superstars are not there for political commentary to begin with. And while many in the WWE are trying to present an image that demands instant 'brownie points' no amount of 'orange man bad' from, say, Soyna Deville or former superstars like Dave Bautista or Shane Helms are going to erase the fact that Trump is a hall of famer and the company has serious ties with him, and of course that the McMahons are very good friends with him. The best thing to do? Not talk politics, focus on your art, because eventually the double standards will bite you in the rear. I can't stand how partisan politics have creeped into every part of our society. Music, sports, tv, movies, etc.. It is nauseating to me. Everybody wants to be a political activist. Amen! It's hard to chill and just enjoy even the most no-brainer of entertainment and be preached to. And if Ryker is fired from the WWE I'll be at a loss for words, as mentioned previously most employed by the company lean right anyway, and the Undertaker is also a Trump supporter(The Last Ride shows it and they're pumping that one out).
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Post by PreachCaleb on Jun 3, 2020 14:35:00 GMT
These days? Everything. And if Jaxson Ryker, who tweeted support of Donald Trump last night and is taking a lot of heat right now from his fellow WWE peers - none shy of using swear words at him, continues to stay with the company I'd imagine some of them might want out, or not and continue accepting those paychecks. My take? It's all stupid, everyone is allowed to have their opinion but most fans of the company who subscribe to the social media feed of these superstars are not there for political commentary to begin with. And while many in the WWE are trying to present an image that demands instant 'brownie points' no amount of 'orange man bad' from, say, Soyna Deville or former superstars like Dave Bautista or Shane Helms are going to erase the fact that Trump is a hall of famer and the company has serious ties with him, and of course that the McMahons are very good friends with him. The best thing to do? Not talk politics, focus on your art, because eventually the double standards will bite you in the rear. I can't stand how partisan politics have creeped into every part of our society. Music, sports, tv, movies, etc.. It is nauseating to me. Everybody wants to be a political activist. What? Politics have always been in every part of our society. Music, sports, movies, even wrestling. This is nothing new.
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Post by Jayman on Jun 3, 2020 16:45:24 GMT
I can't stand how partisan politics have creeped into every part of our society. Music, sports, tv, movies, etc.. It is nauseating to me. Everybody wants to be a political activist. What? Politics have always been in every part of our society. Music, sports, movies, even wrestling. This is nothing new. i knew you were going to say that before I even read your post. Yeah sure, partisan politics was always injected into pro wrestling, music, and sports like it is now. Riiiiiight.
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Post by JudgeJuryDredd on Jun 3, 2020 21:32:04 GMT
I can't stand how partisan politics have creeped into every part of our society. Music, sports, tv, movies, etc.. It is nauseating to me. Everybody wants to be a political activist. What? Politics have always been in every part of our society. Music, sports, movies, even wrestling. This is nothing new. You are correct in that politics have always been in every part of our society, however partisan politics have become far more attached to our general entertainment output in recent years than had been in a very, very long time ago, and much of the average consumer population is just tired of it. It doesn't help all that much when the creators of these entertainments and their portrayers for viewing audiences decide to get involved in certain social and political issues on their social media and often get into online knife fights with the average Joe or Josephine and in the end pretty much tell them to go screw themselves because they do not see eye to eye with them on an issue, like, say, climate change or a recent decision made by a politician. As a fan of professional wrestling its pretty cringe inducing to see what we are to believe as alpha males and females act like such beta soys and devolve into five year olds in front of their consumer base publicly. At some point, one just cannot separate the art from the artist anymore as they, and rightfully so, as it becomes apparent that some of these entertainers just don't want anything to do with them on a personal level, and with that why bother to continue to show support? I used to be a fan of Dave Bautista and Shane Helms back in the day, but since Trump came into office I've just seen no need to either follow them on social media, re-watch their matches on YouTube, or really financially support their recent work - I'll only see a movie starring Dave Bautista if it is based on a property that I really hold dear to me, like a Marvel movie or the upcoming adaptation of Dune. Otherwise, won't bother - Stuber? Didn't bother. My Spy? Nope. Both he and Helms have shown that they are a bunch of overgrown children who don't know jacksh!t about political matters and what is right for the average person and they do not care for anyone's opposing viewpoints. Hilariously, both tend to preach about having a strong sense of moralism, when neither of them can really be called aspirational - Bautista cheated on his wife when she stricken with cancer, Helms has a history of alcoholism and been arrested for intoxication more than once. But as I said before, it's all really unnecessary and kind of silly really. In the end, nobody follows these athletes or such companies for political commentary, they follow because they want info on their training, sporting events and other athletic activities, and their movies, TV appearances, TV programs, video games, books, etc. Also, to see some athletes competing in the WWE express negative views on Trump or conservative/republican beliefs is akin to a Burger King telling people not to eat burgers, all their attempts, like from Soyna Deville or Sami Zayn or Sasha Banks, to score brownie points is ineffective and comes across as very fake - because, again, the company has a long history of being right leaning, has strong ties with Trump and his businesses, and Vinnie Mac and Linda are thick as thieves with him. Like I said, a Burger King telling people not to buy burgers. Now of course everyone should have their right to an opinion, but don't be hypocritical or ignore your role as being a myth maker in America's popular culture. Certainly you can comment on some issues, but not to such a degree that it will likely alienate consumers/fans, but some topics are best left alone.
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Post by JudgeJuryDredd on Jun 3, 2020 21:36:40 GMT
What? Politics have always been in every part of our society. Music, sports, movies, even wrestling. This is nothing new. i knew you were going to say that before I even read your post. Yeah sure, partisan politics was always injected into pro wrestling, music, and sports like it is now. Riiiiiight. I do not recall any superstar from the WWE getting very vocal about Bill Clinton's sexual assault allegation in the late 90's, or the show opening an debate about it anywhere. Just the same, even after 9/11 they did not integrate political messaging into program and kept things as playing the national anthem, and having the American flag be displayed on the big screens during events. During Bush's whole run as POTUS I cannot recall any show or any superstar talking up a storm about them, same with Obama who appeared once to open RAW back in the day I believe.
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Post by Jayman on Jun 4, 2020 16:03:51 GMT
i knew you were going to say that before I even read your post. Yeah sure, partisan politics was always injected into pro wrestling, music, and sports like it is now. Riiiiiight. I do not recall any superstar from the WWE getting very vocal about Bill Clinton's sexual assault allegation in the late 90's, or the show opening an debate about it anywhere. Just the same, even after 9/11 they did not integrate political messaging into program and kept things as playing the national anthem, and having the American flag be displayed on the big screens during events. During Bush's whole run as POTUS I cannot recall any show or any superstar talking up a storm about them, same with Obama who appeared once to open RAW back in the day I believe. Nobody ever knew anybody's political leanings and nobody wanted to know. Until now. There were a few times where Bill Watts made a few statements about Russia on Mid South wrestling tv during a Nicolai Volkolf or Krusher Kruschev match, but it was very general and was designed to get more heat on the guys.
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Post by PreachCaleb on Jun 5, 2020 14:08:40 GMT
What? Politics have always been in every part of our society. Music, sports, movies, even wrestling. This is nothing new. i knew you were going to say that before I even read your post. Yeah sure, partisan politics was always injected into pro wrestling, music, and sports like it is now. Riiiiiight. Yep, they were. Anyone who lived during the 60s will tell you that. Please watch the sarcasm unless you know your history.
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Post by PreachCaleb on Jun 5, 2020 15:15:24 GMT
i knew you were going to say that before I even read your post. Yeah sure, partisan politics was always injected into pro wrestling, music, and sports like it is now. Riiiiiight. I do not recall any superstar from the WWE getting very vocal about Bill Clinton's sexual assault allegation in the late 90's, or the show opening an debate about it anywhere. Just the same, even after 9/11 they did not integrate political messaging into program and kept things as playing the national anthem, and having the American flag be displayed on the big screens during events. During Bush's whole run as POTUS I cannot recall any show or any superstar talking up a storm about them, same with Obama who appeared once to open RAW back in the day I believe. One thing to keep in mind is that there was no easily accessible social media. Twitter's only been around since 2006 and didn't really explode until around 2012. And even then, we've still had all kinds of politics in wrestling from Sgt. Slaughter being an Iraqi sympathizer to DX mocking the Clinton scandal to Muhammad Hassan post-911. It's not new. And I do also have to disagree that people don't follow celebrities for their takes on politics. There are plenty of fans that interested in all aspects of their favorite celebrities' lives. Including their personal opinions and political leanings.
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Post by Jayman on Jun 5, 2020 16:42:45 GMT
i knew you were going to say that before I even read your post. Yeah sure, partisan politics was always injected into pro wrestling, music, and sports like it is now. Riiiiiight. Yep, they were. Anyone who lived during the 60s will tell you that. Please watch the sarcasm unless you know your history. and you lived during the 60’s? I’ve been watching wrestling for nearly 40 years. If you’re talking about gimmicks and angles for foreign wrestlers to reflect issues happening during that time, that is not a valid comparison
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Post by JudgeJuryDredd on Jun 6, 2020 1:51:08 GMT
I do not recall any superstar from the WWE getting very vocal about Bill Clinton's sexual assault allegation in the late 90's, or the show opening an debate about it anywhere. Just the same, even after 9/11 they did not integrate political messaging into program and kept things as playing the national anthem, and having the American flag be displayed on the big screens during events. During Bush's whole run as POTUS I cannot recall any show or any superstar talking up a storm about them, same with Obama who appeared once to open RAW back in the day I believe. One thing to keep in mind is that there was no easily accessible social media. Twitter's only been around since 2006 and didn't really explode until around 2012. And even then, we've still had all kinds of politics in wrestling from Sgt. Slaughter being an Iraqi sympathizer to DX mocking the Clinton scandal to Muhammad Hassan post-911. It's not new. And I do also have to disagree that people don't follow celebrities for their takes on politics. There are plenty of fans that interested in all aspects of their favorite celebrities' lives. Including their personal opinions and political leanings. You're referring to a tiny compilation of gimmicks and angles used for foreign competitors which were, mostly, done for comedic effect, not to be taken seriously, and did not overtake the entire program or tell the viewer that there is only one perspective to have on an issue. You seem to be missing what we are getting at here - we're not talking about storylines and characters designed to entertain we're talking about how in the age of cancel culture and political correctness many people involved in the sport, and entertainment as a whole, seem to take issue with opposing viewpoints, broadcast them for the whole world to see without thinking about possibly alienating consumers, and that some people might lose work if they don't 'go with the flow'. Get the idea better? I hope so. A very small number of fans want to see what their favorite celebrities think and feel politically - most however follow their favorite celebrities just to get updates on their work not be lectured by, and sometimes when they call them out on their BS said favorite celebrities tell them to screw off which isn't very professional or a good look.
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Post by JudgeJuryDredd on Jun 6, 2020 2:01:21 GMT
i knew you were going to say that before I even read your post. Yeah sure, partisan politics was always injected into pro wrestling, music, and sports like it is now. Riiiiiight. Yep, they were. Anyone who lived during the 60s will tell you that. Please watch the sarcasm unless you know your history. Nope. Most people living in the 60's would say that they got their source of political updates form the news and less of their TV shows where you may have gotten a rare one talking about an issue or politician but not have the whole series be built upon it. And if you call BS to that claim, then you may be confusing humanism with politics. Compare The Twilight Zone now to The Twilight Zone from back then. The original series were essentially moral fables that were heavily generalized and allowed the viewer to apply the lesson to equivalent situations in life, regardless of identified political party, and they didn't call specific politicians of the day. The new one? Pretty much the opposite, and none too subtle either. Same deal with newer Star Trek, Discovery and Picard feel like a middle finger to the original shows and their fans.
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Post by PreachCaleb on Jun 8, 2020 13:29:54 GMT
Yep, they were. Anyone who lived during the 60s will tell you that. Please watch the sarcasm unless you know your history. and you lived during the 60’s? I’ve been watching wrestling for nearly 40 years. If you’re talking about gimmicks and angles for foreign wrestlers to reflect issues happening during that time, that is not a valid comparison Yep, me too. So then you should know that yes, it is a very valid comparison. You can't dismiss history just because it doesn't agree with you.
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Post by PreachCaleb on Jun 8, 2020 13:37:08 GMT
One thing to keep in mind is that there was no easily accessible social media. Twitter's only been around since 2006 and didn't really explode until around 2012. And even then, we've still had all kinds of politics in wrestling from Sgt. Slaughter being an Iraqi sympathizer to DX mocking the Clinton scandal to Muhammad Hassan post-911. It's not new. And I do also have to disagree that people don't follow celebrities for their takes on politics. There are plenty of fans that interested in all aspects of their favorite celebrities' lives. Including their personal opinions and political leanings. You're referring to a tiny compilation of gimmicks and angles used for foreign competitors which were, mostly, done for comedic effect, not to be taken seriously, and did not overtake the entire program or tell the viewer that there is only one perspective to have on an issue. You seem to be missing what we are getting at here - we're not talking about storylines and characters designed to entertain we're talking about how in the age of cancel culture and political correctness many people involved in the sport, and entertainment as a whole, seem to take issue with opposing viewpoints, broadcast them for the whole world to see without thinking about possibly alienating consumers, and that some people might lose work if they don't 'go with the flow'. Get the idea better? I hope so. A very small number of fans want to see what their favorite celebrities think and feel politically - most however follow their favorite celebrities just to get updates on their work not be lectured by, and sometimes when they call them out on their BS said favorite celebrities tell them to screw off which isn't very professional or a good look. Huge disagreement there. Fritz Von Erich, The Sheik, Iron Sheik, Nikita Koloff, Ivan Koloff (who defeated Bruno Sammartino), and the list goes on. These were not comedic and in fact were more often than not, the main events. I disagree about it being only a small number of fans. People want to know everything. They only get upset when it disagrees with their views. It's the curse of being a celebrity. You're missing the point. All areas of life have involved politics for decades. You can even go back to people trying to destroy Beatles albums because of some seemingly anti-religious statement. That right there is cancel culture. This isn't new. Get it? I hope so, too.
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Post by PreachCaleb on Jun 8, 2020 13:39:33 GMT
Yep, they were. Anyone who lived during the 60s will tell you that. Please watch the sarcasm unless you know your history. Nope. Most people living in the 60's would say that they got their source of political updates form the news and less of their TV shows where you may have gotten a rare one talking about an issue or politician but not have the whole series be built upon it. And if you call BS to that claim, then you may be confusing humanism with politics. Compare The Twilight Zone now to The Twilight Zone from back then. The original series were essentially moral fables that were heavily generalized and allowed the viewer to apply the lesson to equivalent situations in life, regardless of identified political party, and they didn't call specific politicians of the day. The new one? Pretty much the opposite, and none too subtle either. Same deal with newer Star Trek, Discovery and Picard feel like a middle finger to the original shows and their fans. Shows called out politicians all the time. Even back then. Again, this isn't anything new. People just think it is because of social media. But politics have been a huge part of the entertainment industry for decades.
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Post by JudgeJuryDredd on Jun 10, 2020 22:46:40 GMT
Nope. Most people living in the 60's would say that they got their source of political updates form the news and less of their TV shows where you may have gotten a rare one talking about an issue or politician but not have the whole series be built upon it. And if you call BS to that claim, then you may be confusing humanism with politics. Compare The Twilight Zone now to The Twilight Zone from back then. The original series were essentially moral fables that were heavily generalized and allowed the viewer to apply the lesson to equivalent situations in life, regardless of identified political party, and they didn't call specific politicians of the day. The new one? Pretty much the opposite, and none too subtle either. Same deal with newer Star Trek, Discovery and Picard feel like a middle finger to the original shows and their fans. Shows called out politicians all the time. Even back then. Again, this isn't anything new. People just think it is because of social media. But politics have been a huge part of the entertainment industry for decades. Dude, I was talking about the original Twilight Zone series specifically for comparison, I was not referring to every other show that was airing around the time period. Of course the television shows from the past talked about the politicians of the time, when did I say they didn't? I was saying that the programs were story driven and didn't need politics to define themselves as entertainment and most of the performers of them weren't trying to alienate viewers in interviews because they had better class. Not only that, most shows on the marketplace were much more accessibly political and generally took a centrist perspective. The Simpsons in its golden era? Made fun of both democrats and republicans. The Simpsons today? Makes fun of republicans and paints all dems as angels in the sky. South Park is really one of the very few shows on today that takes the middle ground and realizes there a lot more issues to talk about than 'orange man bad'. Seriously, just watch just one episode of the original Twilight Zone and then see any of the more recent ones, or watch a classic Simpsons episode and then watch a much more recent one - not only is the old better done but far more accessible for a viewer.
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