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Post by Prime etc. on Dec 25, 2020 21:49:18 GMT
Patrick Carey
2 weeks ago
Explanation : 🎄🏢🔫💣💰
1 Plot line: They story revolves around a N.Y. police officer who is travilng across the Country to visit his family on Christmas Eve. Further more his actions are also an attempt to reconnect with his family as he is currently struggling through a failing marriage. Through the Actions of this Terrorist group however (whom of which turn out to be just a band of exceptional thieves), he is forced to take on the villains who have taken over Chistmas. Gruber's plans also revolve around Christmas as he specifically chose Christmas Eve to infiltrate the building because he knew there would be a skeleton crew as well as the very executives of the Company he was planning to heist the money from would have it's top Executives present at the Company Christmas Party. Christmas is intrgal here because any other Holiday would likely not result in a Office party that would also leave the building with a skeleton crew. This would include New Years as most office settings may have a celebration but would like be business as usual on New Years, especially if it fell on a weekday. MANY office business's might not even shut a building down for Christmas. John McLean was ONLY in the building because he planned to meet his wife at the Party and wasn't even sure if he would be visiting his children that night. He also had not seen or visited his family in months, so to assume he would've been in that building at ANY other time or holiday is HIGHLY unlikely. This means that unless it was Christmas Eve it is improbable that EITHER M cClean or Gruber would've been in that building so... No Hans or John means no Die Hard. Without Christmas this movie does not happen. If that alone isn't enough for a start the Writer himself Claimed that he originally framed the story around the Jewish Holiday of Purim. However the studio turned him down but then accepted the script when he switched the holiday for Christmas. So don't listen to Bruce Willis or the dang Director, I'm tired of hearing it.
2 The backdrop: The movie is full of decorations, people scurrying in the background, lights, signs, it's L.A. and everyone is dressed for Cold weather.
3 The soundtrack: Along with the backdrop, Christmas music plays throughout the movie (usually intensifying or played prominently during KEY plot pionts) including several main characters whistling or humming Christmas tunes INCLUDING THE VILLAIN. Right down to the closing scene when White paper falls from the building covering the streets while a rendition of "Let it Snow" plays for the closing sequence. This movie WANTS the audience to know it's Christmas.
4 The Spirit:. People say there must be "aspects of a Christmas Movie to be considered one so.....
John McLean visits his Wife Holly Geniro on Christmas Eve to try and reconnect with his family. That's right HOLLY his wife's name is HOLLY. Along his journey as he fights a battle with the "Grinch that tried to steal billions on Christmas and his band of evil elves" he has a revelation that he may have been the reason for their struggling marriage and seeks redemption wishing he only gets the chance to tell her "he is sorry". He is accompanied on his journey by the Voice of a friendly companion who you could say acts as his Gaurdian Angel or Voice of encouragement who helps him to keep his "FAITH" through his trials. As a joint connection, he himself helps to redeem the Police officer as he is able to overcome his Fear of the Greatest Mistake of his life by finding the courage to overcome his fear and save a newfound friend. Inevitably he reconciles with his Wife, renews a second chance to restore his marriage, even provides us with a visual representation of valuing unconditional love over the value of material objects (for example a $10,000.00 Rolex watch). Even the Limo Driver aids in the story and saves the day with his own little arch. In my opinion this movie has PLENTY of plot points that would qualify with the aspects of a "Christmas Genre Movie".
5 Closing argument:
Christmas is specifically mentioned almost 20 times throughout the movie, Christmas "Miracles" referenced several times from several main characters and also at KEY plot points. How about the "pregnant woman" who we are introduced to and follow is a side note whithin in the plot who is described as "about to give birth" on Christmas Eve by the way, and she even has a conversation about drinking wine! How about the subtle nod to "Santa's Christmas List" on John's right arm. The statement from John McLean that he was always partial to "Roy Rodgers" the "Signing Cowboy" who happens to have his own Christmas Album. The scene where John Lights the "fire in the fireplace" (the C4 sent down the elevator shaft as Santa delivering presents down the chimney).
Finally the very last frame is John and HOLLY riding off on Christmas Morning to be reunited with his Children on Christmas Day. So that's is the end... Die Hard is the greatest Christmas "ACTION MOVIE" ever made. Hope you enjoyed and now have some ammo for the "non believers" lol. Thank you for your time.
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Post by moviemouth on Dec 25, 2020 21:51:58 GMT
I don't understand why this is a thing.
Who cares whether it is a Christmas movie or not?
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Post by Prime etc. on Dec 25, 2020 21:59:37 GMT
I don't understand why this is a thing. Who cares whether it is a Christmas movie or not? It's the politics of the time to suggest Christmas is bad so this is a controversy based on that political nonsense. The story does fit the concept (although I recall one university textbook that said the Rolex watch symbolized Holly McClane's independence from her husband and he removing the watch to save her life also meant she lost her independence--she uses "Holly McClane" at the end).
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Post by moviemouth on Dec 25, 2020 22:10:17 GMT
I don't understand why this is a thing. Who cares whether it is a Christmas movie or not? It's the politics of the time to suggest Christmas is bad so this is a controversy based on that political nonsense. The story does fit the concept (although I recall one university textbook that said the Rolex watch symbolized Holly McClane's independence from her husband and he removing the watch to save her life also meant she lost her independence--she uses "Holly McClane" at the end).
Christmas is awesome.
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Post by Popeye Doyle on Dec 25, 2020 22:28:52 GMT
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Post by lowtacks86 on Dec 25, 2020 22:33:25 GMT
I like that scene, though it never really made much sense. Why would he tell the terrorists he has a gun? It would have been better not to tell them and take them by surprise.
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Post by moviebuffbrad on Dec 25, 2020 22:35:10 GMT
I don't understand why this is a thing. Who cares whether it is a Christmas movie or not? It's the politics of the time to suggest Christmas is bad so this is a controversy based on that political nonsense. The story does fit the concept (although I recall one university textbook that said the Rolex watch symbolized Holly McClane's independence from her husband and he removing the watch to save her life also meant she lost her independence--she uses "Holly McClane" at the end).
I think the watch more so symbolizes shallow materialism, as befitting the Christmas theme. Hans, like your Scrooges and your Mr. Potter's, only cares about material gain, and he gets dropped along with the watch. I wouldn't say the film is about Holly losing her independence. John is kind of a dick about her career which pushes her away, and he pretty much says as much when he tells Al to tell her he's sorry about it if he dies. By the end, he's put her over himself and earned back his name.
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Post by moviemouth on Dec 25, 2020 22:38:03 GMT
I like that scene, though it never really made much sense. Why would he tell the terrorists he has a gun? It would have been better not to tell them and take them by surprise. It is a challenge to the villains by McLaine. It is one of those things that someone does that isn't smart, but there is an urge to show off and mock your enemy.
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Post by Prime etc. on Dec 25, 2020 22:43:16 GMT
I think the watch more so symbolizes shallow materialism, as befitting the Christmas theme. Hans, like your Scrooges and your Mr. Potter's, only cares about material gain, and he gets dropped along with the watch. I wouldn't say the film is about Holly losing her independence. John is kind of a dick about her career which pushes her away, and he pretty much says as much when he tells Al to tell her he's sorry about it if he dies. By the end, he's put her over himself and earned back his name. Right but they will still try to shoehorn in the agenda.
Just shows how university would promote that kind of thing. Same thing when we watched Psycho--they said the Janet Leigh character was being punished for having sex out of marriage and being independent.
I think Nature and physics play a role in it too--she went off to a strange place, she was not physically strong--she would be vulnerable to being attacked. It's not rocket science or a conspiracy.
The common thread between Psycho and Die Hard is that none of the white male characters are presented as the positives in the story.
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Post by moviemouth on Dec 25, 2020 22:50:50 GMT
I have a specific definition of what makes a Christmas movie a Christmas movie. It is movie that exudes Christmas time, and for me Die Hard doesn't do that. Die Hard is a summer action movie that happens to also have Christmas stuff about it.
Though I am more understanding now after reading what is in the OP.
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Post by moviebuffbrad on Dec 25, 2020 22:53:57 GMT
I think the watch more so symbolizes shallow materialism, as befitting the Christmas theme. Hans, like your Scrooges and your Mr. Potter's, only cares about material gain, and he gets dropped along with the watch. I wouldn't say the film is about Holly losing her independence. John is kind of a dick about her career which pushes her away, and he pretty much says as much when he tells Al to tell her he's sorry about it if he dies. By the end, he's put her over himself and earned back his name. Right but they will still try to shoehorn in the agenda.
Just shows how university would promote that kind of thing. Same thing when we watched Psycho--they said the Janet Leigh character was being punished for having sex out of marriage and being independent.
I think Nature and physics play a role in it too--she went off to a strange place, she was not physically strong--she would be vulnerable to being attacked. It's not rocket science or a conspiracy.
The common thread between Psycho and Die Hard is that none of the white male characters are presented as the positives in the story.
There was nothing particularly wrong with Sam Loomis, and he saved the day at the end. The Marion stuff sounds colored by sex equating to death in later slasher films. It doesn't matter much to Psycho, where how good or bad Marion is ends up being completely irrelevant. She decides to bring back the money but dies anyway. As for Die Hard, the minority males weren't too flawless either.
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Post by Prime etc. on Dec 25, 2020 23:00:01 GMT
There was nothing particularly wrong with Sam Loomis, and he saved the day at the end. The Marion stuff sounds colored by sex equating to death in later slasher films. It's kind of irrelevant to Psycho, where how good or bad Marion is ends up being completely irrelevant. She decides to bring back the money but dies anyway. As for Die Hard, the minority males weren't too flawless either. But Sam Loomis dies. Some "private" investigator.
The white collar blacks in Die Hard were among the baddies (including special agent Johnson who didn't care about casualties "I can live with that!").
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Post by moviebuffbrad on Dec 25, 2020 23:09:18 GMT
There was nothing particularly wrong with Sam Loomis, and he saved the day at the end. The Marion stuff sounds colored by sex equating to death in later slasher films. It's kind of irrelevant to Psycho, where how good or bad Marion is ends up being completely irrelevant. She decides to bring back the money but dies anyway. As for Die Hard, the minority males weren't too flawless either. But Sam Loomis dies. Some "private" investigator.
The white collar blacks in Die Hard were among the baddies (including special agent Johnson who didn't care about casualties "I can live with that!").
That was Arbogast. Sam Loomis is Marion's non-dying boyfriend. Mhm. And even Al accidentally killed a child.
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Post by Prime etc. on Dec 25, 2020 23:16:11 GMT
That was Arbogast. Sam Loomis is Marion's non-dying boyfriend. Mhm. And even Al accidentally killed a child. Yeah but Sam Loomis is not doing much in the story. He comes in at the last moment to stop Norman Bates. He's also the one involved in the affair. He's like many Hitchcock male leads in stories where the women are the focus. Kind of anonymous.
Al redeems himself by lifecoaching McClane and killing the nazi ballet guy.
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