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Post by sostie on Jul 6, 2021 20:00:51 GMT
I bet the Disney ads weren't put up free by the Government. I can guarantee if I defaced one I wouldn't be sent to a gulag or worse. When Disney stopped allowing FOX movies to be shown in retro theaters--none of the theater managers would go on record by name to criticize Disney. Why? What were they afraid of?
A cursory look on the internet shows there was criticism. What were they afraid of? Well seeing that tere was confusion and no confirmation at the time what the policy was on Fox back catalogue, no cinema owner in their right mind would go on a full blown tirade against any film company, Disney or not, in that situation. Tax relief from certain States and other countries to entice (all) film companies to use their locations is not the same as Government sponsored propaganda What news media holding does Disney have beyond a major share in ABC(+ own 8 other stations and over 200 affiliates) Not sure of its reach outside USA but I struggle to find it in the UK. FOX still own In the US FOX News Media + own 18 other stations and over 200 affiliates , New York Post, Wall Street Journal. A radio network syndicated on 500 stations In the UK - Sky News on TV, 3 of the biggest national newspapers , 15 radio stations In Australia - Sky News on TV, 15 national newspapers, over 100 local newspapers As well as a number of international advertising/branding companies An idiot can see which has the biggest (potential) news media influence Have they erased them. Or have you just noticed there are more non-white faces? 1) was it his philosphy? 2) if it was and those that currently run the show want to include more non-white faces as a reaction against it, it says a lot about those that want to uphold that old view if it means US History & culture only relates to the white man. 3) Disney's reach is worldwide. The world is not all white Americans. Just because you don't doesn't mean you are. If an executive committee makes films that I can sit down and generally enjoy for 2+ hours I'm all for it Entertainment is not necessarily good "art". And vice versa. If I want to be entertained for a few hours I wont go see a Bergman film. If I want to sit down and watch a film about the human condition and marvel at its aesthetics I won't go see a Comic Book film. From MCU film I primarily want entertainment, and I get it. And hey are films that are not devoid of any artistry.
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Post by Prime etc. on Jul 6, 2021 20:32:07 GMT
A cursory look on the internet shows there was criticism. What were they afraid of? Well seeing that tere was confusion and no confirmation at the time what the policy was on Fox back catalogue, no cinema owner in their right mind would go on a full blown tirade against any film company, Disney or not, in that situation. Have they erased them. Or have you just noticed there are more non-white faces? 1) was it his philosphy? 2) if it was and those that currently run the show want to include more non-white faces as a reaction against it, it says a lot about those that want to uphold that old view if it means US History & culture only relates to the white man. 3) Disney's reach is worldwide. The world is not all white Americans. If an executive committee makes films that I can sit down and generally enjoy for 2+ hours I'm all for it Entertainment is not necessarily good "art". And vice versa. If I want to be entertained for a few hours I wont go see a Bergman film. If I want to sit down and watch a film about the human condition and marvel at its aesthetics I won't go see a Comic Book film. From MCU film I primarily want entertainment, and I get it. And hey are films that are not devoid of any artistry. The theater owners did not criticize Disney in any harsh way-all they said was Disney refused to honor agreements on screening FOX films that audiences wanted to see--older ones-they just refused to comment on it by name. Like they were afraid of reprisals?
Why be afraid?
As we have said, many times, and others notice, as movie content shrinks--and it has--they aren't making theatrical films in the numbers they used to make 40 50 years ago. European characters are getting less common and weaker.
I sure hope you aren't one of those types who is going to explain to us how Chris Pratt is a more charismatic and strong presence than any dozen of leading men white actors from 30-60 years ago. Or that conversation on talk shows today is more intellectual than the same from 50 years ago.
I sure hope not since it is an opinion that cannot be supported by facts.
Disney regarded European culture as normal and good--not something that was evil like Disney management believes now.
Remember that Disney made mass-market movies--and he was appreciated by Americans, European audiences and others who liked it. But he was focused on Americans and Europe. That was his creative focus.
Modern Disney is more interested in China.
Europe invented film. It invented the technology and the artistic apparatus--such as drama and tragedy. That all comes from Europe-even though some places had their own history like Japan.
Disney Co.s philosophy now is to show anyone but European artists and culture. And they control the message so if you are black-you have to make what they tell you to make.
You can't make your own characters or story themes--you have to do what they will allow you to do. Apparatchiks.
Walt Disney didn't fret about what he made--he felt he could make a film and if audiences liked it-great. He wasn't doing it by committee. One single man and artist was in charge.
Not a room full of Wall Street executives who don't even like film.
It's like saying which you would prefer--a painting done by Michelangelo and his assistants, or a painting done by a room full of priests who dictate every line or paint stroke.
You can love these movies as much as you want but I think discerning viewers realize how cookie-cutter and impersonal they are--because they are made by Wall Street people, not artists.
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Post by thebayharborbutcher on Jul 6, 2021 20:56:11 GMT
Marvel is far from my favorite, but they make money. Disney is so big that it cannot ever be out of business. It really does not matter what audiences prefer--there's no choice.
This is what everyone is noticing.
Disney and Marvel are like Lenin posters in Soviet-era Moscow. Who really wanted to see Lenin's face on every building? I bet most people did not. And Disney is dictating what people should watch because they dominate the media channels. They control newspapers, magazines, tv, internet... so you can't avoid what they peddle easily.
In truth, Black Widow--no one wanted it. That's why they didn't make it 10 years ago. No interest. So they are making things no one really wants--and boosting it with ridiculous ballyhoo beyond anything of merit.
Everyone sees it. They are thinking: why are we getting all this less than compelling media?
It's because these companies are not making decisions to be popular with audiences. They don't care. They are guided by ridiculous political concerns.
I kinda disagree. Yes, Disney has a ton of power. They have the ability to sell their films better than other studios. They also get the "come along" audiences of friends and family dragging others to these movies. However, the truth is if audiences didn't want these movies they wouldn't get made. There's still a lot of other content out there to watch nowadays. Arguably there is the most there has ever been. Viewers don't have to watch Marvel films. They watch because they want to. And because they want to, more so than other films, they keep getting made and will keep getting made. As for why Black Widow wasn't made years ago I think there are several reasons why. For one, action lead female films have been tough sells in the past. It's only with the more recent success of Wonder Woman and Captain Marvel that a door has kinda opened for an appetite for these female lead action films. Secondly, 10 years ago the Marvel universe wasn't as popular as it is now. Very few people even knew who Black Widow was. So selling a film on a character that very few people were familiar with would have been incredibly tough. Now that people know her, and like her, there is an audience there to sell this film too.
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Post by Prime etc. on Jul 6, 2021 21:30:45 GMT
I kinda disagree. Yes, Disney has a ton of power. They have the ability to sell their films better than other studios. They also get the "come along" audiences of friends and family dragging others to these movies. However, the truth is if audiences didn't want these movies they wouldn't get made. There's still a lot of other content out there to watch nowadays. Arguably there is the most there has ever been. Viewers don't have to watch Marvel films. They watch because they want to. And because they want to, more so than other films, they keep getting made and will keep getting made. As for why Black Widow wasn't made years ago I think there are several reasons why. For one, action lead female films have been tough sells in the past. It's only with the more recent success of Wonder Woman and Captain Marvel that a door has kinda opened for an appetite for these female lead action films. Secondly, 10 years ago the Marvel universe wasn't as popular as it is now. Very few people even knew who Black Widow was. So selling a film on a character that very few people were familiar with would have been incredibly tough. Now that people know her, and like her, there is an audience there to sell this film too.
There were women-starring action movies made decades ago. Hundra 1983. S.H.E. 1980. Cleopatra Jones 1973. And she was black. And they made and sold such a film.
So, it's not that they haven't done it--they are not making decisions like a normal business-that's why Hollywood Accounting is not the same as Airline accounting or Pencil manufacturing accounting It's more corrupt and irrational.
50 years ago-you could name dozens of directors of horror films working every year.
Now? How many? The only ones that get any wider media focus are Jordan Poole and Eli Roth and Snyder.
That is not merit-based art-making.
Merit-based is where audiences are making some selection on what artists they like.
If Marvel movies were so good, they would not be criticized like they are.
Because Disney is swallowing up theaters and reducing variety and even those who were loyal to the system are noticing this squeezing and reduction.
It isn't just that Black Widow is widely promoted beyond its value-there's less variety and choice for alternatives. 50 years ago there were a number of leading actor films--and these days--it's all brand names.
Did the public demand that? I think that is like saying white Americans love Biden. We know that isn't true.
The media company owners hate Trump and his voter--and these are the same people greenlighting the films.
No wonder they are losing the audience.
It would be wonderful to learn Indonesia loves Black Widow--but that doesn't do any good if you live in Indianapolis.
And Disney, despite its loathing for Walt Disney's audience, seeks to be entertainer for the globe.
It is crazy. We hate you but we want to be in your face. Like Lenin. He was said to refer to them as useful idiots and yet he wants his face dominating everywhere they look.
Crazy.
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Post by spooner5020 on Jul 6, 2021 21:47:18 GMT
Yet it really really was. Nah boring female lead ruined the movie for me. The rest of the cast was okay and Spoonfuloflard0050 will you shut up about trolls for god's sakes you went all the way to a politics forum to call black users racist. I’m not gonna discuss anything with you, but I’d be happy to tell you what REALLY happened with in a PM, but you’ve already shown your intelligence to me so it’s probably not worth it. |
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Post by Prime etc. on Jul 6, 2021 21:51:34 GMT
Another thing with covid and theater attendance.
Supposedly China is doing great with movie-making despite the virus.
And if we had much smaller companies-they would not be able to close down.
Disney and the others can do it because movie-making is a tiny part of the corporation assets-they can stop it tomorrow and still have other business and stock activity.
That's not good-that they are so big-they can shut down and it doesn't matter to them.
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