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Post by Deleted on Jun 16, 2017 22:53:39 GMT
You can't have a truly successful DC universe without a good Superman series. Why do they keep kicking the can (of steel) down the road???
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Post by thisguy4000 on Jun 16, 2017 23:16:52 GMT
From what I've been hearing, they're waiting to see how JL performs before announcing more movies.
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Post by sdrew13163 on Jun 17, 2017 0:27:46 GMT
You can't have a truly successful DC universe without a good Superman series. Why do they keep kicking the can (of steel) down the road??? Exactly. Superman is supposed to be the heart of the JL. Batman is the leader. We need another Superman movie with heart. I've like both Man of Steel and Batman v Superman, but I miss the campy Supes. We need something in the middle, like how Wonder Woman was in her movie.
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Post by primeone on Jun 17, 2017 3:31:20 GMT
I have been saying for a while, Man of Steel 2 should've been in development long ago for a 2018 release. Superman's 80 year anniversary. They will do it for Batman in 2019.
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northernlad
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Post by northernlad on Jun 17, 2017 4:27:19 GMT
Yes, they need another Superman movie...and they need to lighten up with him just a bit...not too much, but like someone said...meet somewhere in the middle with him.
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Post by furiousstyles77 on Jun 17, 2017 11:08:51 GMT
You can't have a truly successful DC universe without a good Superman series. Why do they keep kicking the can (of steel) down the road??? because the first one sucked big time, sucked more than a slut on prom night, did i also mention that it sucked? suckiest superman film ever it really sucked
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Post by ArArArchStanton on Jun 17, 2017 14:21:30 GMT
You can't have a truly successful DC universe without a good Superman series. Why do they keep kicking the can (of steel) down the road??? Because Superman sucks, and I'm not trolling, but look at the reality. They always use kryptonite, they always use Lex. The character is inherently too strong, too good, too invulnerable to do anything interesting with. Soooo kryptonite. Again, and again, and again. Oh there was that one film where they made him super moody and replaced kryptonite with different air which did the same damn thing. They've made him boring as shit. There hasn't been a good Superman film since the 80's.
I'm very openly a Marvel guy, and I say that honestly to convey that from my perspective, it is very curious to me how DC fans don't see how Superman has become generic to most of the public. Yeah he still gets a decent turn out at theaters, and that's probably why fans still think he's relevant, but if you think this is the character that your franchise needs to be built on, I would honestly suggest that's a problem. Superman is DC's biggest problem, not it's main character. Not anymore.
And that is exactly why they are waiting. They'd rather not make one, but then they feel like they have to.
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Post by Deleted on Jun 17, 2017 17:15:14 GMT
You can't have a truly successful DC universe without a good Superman series. Why do they keep kicking the can (of steel) down the road??? Because Superman sucks, and I'm not trolling, but look at the reality. They always use kryptonite, they always use Lex. The character is inherently too strong, too good, too invulnerable to do anything interesting with. Soooo kryptonite. Again, and again, and again. Oh there was that one film where they made him super moody and replaced kryptonite with different air which did the same damn thing. They've made him boring as shit. There hasn't been a good Superman film since the 80's.
I'm very openly a Marvel guy, and I say that honestly to convey that from my perspective, it is very curious to me how DC fans don't see how Superman has become generic to most of the public. Yeah he still gets a decent turn out at theaters, and that's probably why fans still think he's relevant, but if you think this is the character that your franchise needs to be built on, I would honestly suggest that's a problem. Superman is DC's biggest problem, not it's main character. Not anymore.
And that is exactly why they are waiting. They'd rather not make one, but then they feel like they have to.
Though you make some good points I disagree with the grim assessment that Superman "sucks" and can't be interesting. That being said, I do believe you're spot on about the studio's perspective. i think they looked at Superman Returns and thought "Okay, people don't want that Classic Supes anymore, let's go for a more serious approach..." Then they looked at MoS and thought "Dammit! People don't want that either! Fuck this character! Nobody likes his antiquated Kryptonian ass (of steel)!" But the truth is that both of those movies failed to launch a series because they were fatally flawed, not because of the character himself.
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Post by ArArArchStanton on Jun 17, 2017 20:06:29 GMT
Though you make some good points I disagree with the grim assessment that Superman "sucks" and can't be interesting. That being said, I do believe you're spot on about the studio's perspective. i think they looked at Superman Returns and thought "Okay, people don't want that Classic Supes anymore, let's go for a more serious approach..." Then they looked at MoS and thought "Dammit! People don't want that either! Fuck this character! Nobody likes his antiquated Kryptonian ass (of steel)!" But the truth is that both of those movies failed to launch a series because they were fatally flawed, not because of the character himself. I do agree that saying "superman sucks" flat out is an overstatement.
However, I do think most of the problem is the character. Being a pure good character works if you're Captain America, because Cap is vulnerable. There are whole articles on how Superman isn't brave because he's so overpowered, which results in there being little that's particularly interesting to do with him. So we're stuck with a rather boring boy scout who also can't be hurt unless they turn it into dragonball z fight.
I honestly think the character will just continue to wane in popularity. There will be a few more attempt, but I'll be genuinely surprised if they ever do a truly significant film with him again.
So I'd just ask, if you can't have a truly successful DCU without a strong superman series, and there isn't going to be a strong Superman series, what does that say about DC?
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Post by politicidal on Jun 18, 2017 1:09:59 GMT
You can't have a truly successful DC universe without a good Superman series. Why do they keep kicking the can (of steel) down the road??? Exactly. Superman is supposed to be the heart of the JL. Batman is the leader. We need another Superman movie with heart. I've like both Man of Steel and Batman v Superman, but I miss the campy Supes. We need something in the middle, like how Wonder Woman was in her movie. Same. He doesn't have to go back to being campy or anything necessarily reminiscent of the Christopher Reeve version. My favorite incarnation of the character is the animated version from the DCAU like Superman:TAS and Justice League/JL Unlimited. I think if they take cues from that or similar, they'd fare better.
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Post by Deleted on Jun 18, 2017 2:31:40 GMT
You can't have a truly successful DC universe without a good Superman series. Why do they keep kicking the can (of steel) down the road??? Because Superman sucks, and I'm not trolling, but look at the reality. They always use kryptonite, they always use Lex. The character is inherently too strong, too good, too invulnerable to do anything interesting with. Soooo kryptonite. Again, and again, and again. Oh there was that one film where they made him super moody and replaced kryptonite with different air which did the same damn thing. They've made him boring as shit. There hasn't been a good Superman film since the 80's.
I'm very openly a Marvel guy, and I say that honestly to convey that from my perspective, it is very curious to me how DC fans don't see how Superman has become generic to most of the public. Yeah he still gets a decent turn out at theaters, and that's probably why fans still think he's relevant, but if you think this is the character that your franchise needs to be built on, I would honestly suggest that's a problem. Superman is DC's biggest problem, not it's main character. Not anymore.
And that is exactly why they are waiting. They'd rather not make one, but then they feel like they have to.
You seriously need to start watching Bruce Timm's DC Animated Universe. He managed to take many characters that fit the description you gave Superman and turned them all into relatable and compelling characters capable of sustaining a whole story about them.
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Post by brownstones on Jun 18, 2017 2:47:09 GMT
Because Superman sucks, and I'm not trolling, but look at the reality. They always use kryptonite, they always use Lex. The character is inherently too strong, too good, too invulnerable to do anything interesting with. Soooo kryptonite. Again, and again, and again. Oh there was that one film where they made him super moody and replaced kryptonite with different air which did the same damn thing. They've made him boring as shit. There hasn't been a good Superman film since the 80's.
I'm very openly a Marvel guy, and I say that honestly to convey that from my perspective, it is very curious to me how DC fans don't see how Superman has become generic to most of the public. Yeah he still gets a decent turn out at theaters, and that's probably why fans still think he's relevant, but if you think this is the character that your franchise needs to be built on, I would honestly suggest that's a problem. Superman is DC's biggest problem, not it's main character. Not anymore.
And that is exactly why they are waiting. They'd rather not make one, but then they feel like they have to.
You seriously need to start watching Bruce Timm's DC Animated Universe. He managed to take many characters that fit the description you gave Superman and turned them all into relatable and compelling characters capable of sustaining a whole story about them. If I'm not mistaken he's not a DC fan in general.
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Post by Deleted on Jun 18, 2017 4:10:53 GMT
You seriously need to start watching Bruce Timm's DC Animated Universe. He managed to take many characters that fit the description you gave Superman and turned them all into relatable and compelling characters capable of sustaining a whole story about them. If I'm not mistaken he's not a DC fan in general. And? Doesn't change the fact he's wrong about Superman being lame.
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Post by brownstones on Jun 18, 2017 4:16:10 GMT
If I'm not mistaken he's not a DC fan in general. And? Doesn't change the fact he's wrong about Superman being lame. no I get that, just saying I don't think he's going to watch the series.
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Post by Deleted on Jun 18, 2017 4:21:02 GMT
And? Doesn't change the fact he's wrong about Superman being lame. no I get that, just saying I don't think he's going to watch the series. More the shame, because I've seen a few people who also once thought Superman sucked change their tone after seeing a sampling of the 90s animated series.
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Post by ArArArchStanton on Jun 18, 2017 4:21:06 GMT
You seriously need to start watching Bruce Timm's DC Animated Universe. He managed to take many characters that fit the description you gave Superman and turned them all into relatable and compelling characters capable of sustaining a whole story about them. Animation is different. Things work in animation that don't work in live action for various reasons.
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Post by misstique on Jun 18, 2017 8:49:07 GMT
Same. He doesn't have to go back to being campy or anything necessarily reminiscent of the Christopher Reeve version. My favorite incarnation of the character is the animated version from the DCAU like Superman:TAS and Justice League/JL Unlimited. I think if they take cues from that or similar, they'd fare better. Mine too! The DCAU Superman is perfect and I wish they had made "Man of Steel" based more on the cartoon series. That Superman is the right balance of fun and serious. And even though they did use Kryptonite most of the time, they found innovative way of using it and not just someone always carrying a green glowing rock. And that Superman was also shown to be vulnerable. Shots from bigger and powerful weapons didn't just bounce off him but actually hurt him and knocked him back a bit. Come to think of it, pretty much all the Superman universe characters in the DCAU are much better than any that have appeared in the movies so far. Whether it's Luthor or Lois or anybody else, they are all better.
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Post by Deleted on Jun 18, 2017 22:51:31 GMT
You seriously need to start watching Bruce Timm's DC Animated Universe. He managed to take many characters that fit the description you gave Superman and turned them all into relatable and compelling characters capable of sustaining a whole story about them. Animation is different. Things work in animation that don't work in live action for various reasons. I'm not talking about what looks good in animation but not in live-action. I'm referring to the writing, strictly.
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Post by ArArArchStanton on Jun 18, 2017 23:07:27 GMT
Animation is different. Things work in animation that don't work in live action for various reasons. I'm not talking about what looks good in animation but not in live-action. I'm referring to the writing, strictly. Sure, and I get it. It's just that the medium allows you to write in a different way, such that things don't need to be as believable, and you can use more powerful villains suitable to him and come up with stories that are more compellilng about him in that regard. Silver Surfer has great issues about him as a person.
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Post by Deleted on Jun 18, 2017 23:25:08 GMT
I'm not talking about what looks good in animation but not in live-action. I'm referring to the writing, strictly. Sure, and I get it. It's just that the medium allows you to write in a different way, such that things don't need to be as believable, and you can use more powerful villains suitable to him and come up with stories that are more compellilng about him in that regard. Silver Surfer has great issues about him as a person. I don't see why they can't do the same thing in film. If the DCEU just says "screw it" to the 'grounded' route it seems to love so much, they could do great things with Superman. And Superman DOES have villains who are in his league in terms of power, other than Zod.
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