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Post by BATouttaheck on Jun 27, 2017 19:54:13 GMT
naterdawgHey, I know that your particular schtick is this un-remitting negativity, desire to debate endlessly and to always have the last word. I can give you only the third. Have a nice day.
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Post by naterdawg on Jun 28, 2017 3:43:30 GMT
Thank you. That's more than enough.
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Post by naterdawg on Jun 28, 2017 18:35:51 GMT
enigma72 When "The Middle" first came on I saw the commercials and assumed that it was just another of those "fighting families with quirks" shows and didn't bother watching it. Around the time of season three, I had read about the show and about Atticus Shaffer and decided to give it a chance. The characters really grew on me and the stories, though exaggerated, are often rather true to life. Sometimes they are really REALLY familiar situations presented with a twist. I went out and bought the dvds of season 1 and 2 so's I could catch up. What I really appreciate about the show is that Brick's physical condition is never discussed. Just his quirks. Sue and Axel have major quirks too, also treated in a humorous manner. As far as taking mr dawg's word about the show , I suggest looking at THE MIDDLE (link) for some unbiased reviews and avoid his habitually negative analysis of everything.
Did you look at the reviews? Naterdawg did review it? The review is near the end & negative www.imdb.com/title/tt1442464/reviews?start=50Yes, indeedy, here's my IMDB review: On its last legs! 3/10 Author: Naterdawg123 from London, England 21 August 2016 In October, ABC will be launching The Middle's 8th season--on a brand-new day and about two weeks later than its usual premiere. That, to me, sounds like the death-knell is ringing for The Middle. I never for a second believed that this show was conceived to last more than two to three seasons, at best. It's all about "family," and you can't have family if two of your children are away at college. So, The Middle kept struggling along because ABC kept renewing it, and the actors want to work, but the writers got lazy. They simply didn't know what to do with Axl or Sue when they graduated from high school. One option, of course, was to have them "take time off" from college, stay home and work. That's the most logical and obvious option. But noo. The writers chose instead to give Axl a "football scholarship" (haha), have it be a full "boat," which means he lives on campus paid for by the school, and everything's fine and dandy. EXCEPT it means he has to be away from home. So, after establishing all of that, and devoting an entire episode to dropping Axl off at school, Axl ends up back home and has been home ever since. The same thing has happened for Sue. All these college visits, all the "angst" about which college to choose, and she ends up at the same campus as Axl. And she also ends up home. The writers have depleted their warehouse of ideas. The last original one they had was the Halloween episode last season. Characters are introduced and then disappear for years. Ideas are introduced too, and they might last for one or two episodes, and then they're forgotten. Much hoopla was made about Frankie becoming a dental assistant. After that happened, an ENTIRE SEASON went by without it being mentioned once. Axl has a girlfriend one episode and the next, she's just dropped like a hot potato. Sue has a boyfriend one episode, changes her entire personality to suit his (the tree-hugger episode), and then poof! He disappears without a mention again. And need we even address poor Darin? He was not only Sue's boyfriend but Axl's best friend? Not mentioned ONCE last season, not even glimpsed. The show is stagnant. The characters are dull and predictable, and the "cuteness" is gone. Brick's insane, Axl's a narcissistic jerk, and Sue's is bordering on psychomania. Mike's probably having an affair on the side (who could blame him?), and Frankie is just detestable. The Thanksgiving episode last season showed every aspect of her disgusting personality. I hate the character completely. This will be its last season, but it really should've finished with Axl's high school graduation. It's running just on fumes, now.
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Post by naterdawg on Jun 28, 2017 18:38:27 GMT
And while you're at it, read this very similar older review from the IMDB:
Cancel it already! 4/10 Author: Naterdawg 28 November 2015 The Middle used to be a charmingly funny show about a middle-class family living in "the middle" of the US. For the first four seasons, the writers were able to balance everything beautifully. Then they ran into a brick wall called REALITY.
First, they didn't know what to do with Axl. He'd graduated from high school and VERY conveniently (and a little unbelievably, as well) won a full scholarship to play football at college. The first episode of Season five was spent bringing him to the college campus...but by the end of the episode, he was right back at home. That signified to me, at least, that the writers didn't want the character to grow emotionally, and they certainly didn't want him far from the family unit.
Therefore, since then, we've seen Axl play football once. Just once. He's home more than at school. In fact, his scenes at school have been very rare.
Now, they've reached another impasse with Sue. She graduated from high school last year and VERY conveniently is going to the SAME college as Axl. And like Axl, she's home in every episode, except for the first two episodes of this season. The writers again don't want the character to mature, and they need all the family members together. For whatever reason--and it certainly escapes me--the writers have determined that The Middle is JUST ABOUT THE HECKS. Nobody else. And they must all be together, interact with one another, and end every episode either in the house, on the front lawn, at the kitchen table or eating in front of the television. Axl could be a Nobel Prize winner, but he'd be home every night eating potato chips. Go figure.
Now that brings me to Brick, the youngest child. He's presented as someone in the 8th grade, through physically, he's showing the maturity of a teenager. He has a visible beard that they attempt to cover up with make-up, and his voice has changed into this nasally honk. Instead of merely walking, he struts around like a automaton, arms swinging, and instead of maturing, he's become even more stupid that in the first episode. We're to believe that he doesn't know his way home from the local library, cannot follow directions on "300 flushes" when cleaning the toilet and actually FLUSHES 300 TIMES, can't remember to pick up party goods at a store and walks out in a Batman costume and in some kind of dreamy fugue state. If I were his parents, I'd take him to be tested, because it's obvious something is very wrong with him. Very SERIOUSLY wrong. But Frankie and Mike aren't caring parents. They just think he's "quirky and weird." The biggest change in The Middle is in Frankie Heck. Initially, we felt sympathy for her. She was trying to make ends meet and really struggling, but everything seemed to go wrong. Then season five began, and a brand new Frankie emerged: selfish, narcissistic and downright rude. She takes no responsibility seriously, always looks for a way to not follow the rules, forgets the first day of school and forgets her child's birthday. Not only thank, she outright refused to feed Brick any more, leaving him to his own devices. I find absolutely no redeeming grace in Frankie Heck, as she's portrayed right now. She's totally unfunny.
As for Mike, eh, he's a cypher. His role could be played by a plastic blow up doll. No emotion, nothing.
The Middle is on its last legs. It's the 7th season, and I doubt it'll see #10. Has it jumped the shark? Oh, yeah--when Axl suddenly became a straight "B" student at college. Axl, who was thicker than a post, and now he's way above average.
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Post by naterdawg on Jun 28, 2017 18:55:02 GMT
And here's still another one of my reviews from IMDB about The Middle. See what can of worms you opened?
Going downhill fast! 4/10 Author: Naterdawg from United States 15 December 2014 I used to love The Middle. I stumbled across it in the fall of 2009 and was instantly struck by its quirky humor. Since Patty Heaton is one of my favorite TV personalities because of her superlative work on Everybody Loves Raymond, I was looking forward to a long stay with The Hecks. And they didn't disappoint me. The family was weird, sure, but in a good way. Frankie (Heaton) was a harried housewife trying to make ends meet while catering to her dysfunctional family. Husband Mike was supporting her without getting too involved, and the kids all had their particular problems. Axl, the oldest, was a freshman in high school and an incredible narcissist. But you knew that life would eventually straighten him out. Sue, the second oldest and only girl, was the eternal optimist. No matter what she failed at--and she failed at a lot--she always came out with a lesson learned and a smile on her face. Nothing could bring her down, she was a refreshing optimist to the nth degree. Little Brick was a cute kid with an obvious developmental problem, either Asbergers or mild autism, but the parents weren't that concerned. They'd help him out the best way they could--with love and understanding.
Frankie was employed in a car dealership, where she was basically treated like the lowest on the ladder by everyone. We felt sympathy for her, this hard-working mom who really was the glue that held the family together. For four straight seasons, The Middle continued this way. Sometimes, it was touching, sometimes mildly humorous, and many times, downright hilarious. We were introduced to many other characters, and they all fit in with the grand scheme of things.
Then came Season Five...and everything changed.
Now, suddenly, Axl is a freshman in college who spends all his time at home--though he has a room on campus. Sue is a junior in high school and just as clueless as when she was in the 7th grade. No emotional growth at all. Brick had grown into a weird man-child with 5 o'clock shadow barely disguised by make-up, though he's supposedly in the 6th grade. What was cute was now just weird.
But the biggest change was in Frankie. Now, instead of a harried housewife with a heart of gold, we found a housewife who hated being a housewife, was lazy, manipulative, a liar, a thief and a cheat. Every parental responsibility that came her way was a "pain," and she groused and complained about it and usually screwed up. Instead of being delightfully charming, she displayed a harder, more narcissistic edge.
The change in direction was a bit startling and literally happened overnight, with season five. It has continued into season six. Now, Sue is a senior and so completely and utterly stupid, she doesn't know what the word "Caucasian" means. She can't even pronounce it. She thinks "native American" means "I'm born in the United States." She looks exactly like she did as a 7th grader and her optimism and naivety has become almost borderline psychotic. Then, there's Axl. His narcissism has grown even worse over the years. Though he fails at everything, it's everybody else's fault but his own. After almost bombing out of college first semester, the writers pulled a rabbit out of their hat and made him a "B" student. Not only is this completely incomprehensible, it's so against how the character's been presented for the last four seasons! Brick, meanwhile, has become even more weird. Pale, with the 5 o'clock shadow evident, round-headed and marching through the house like a locomotive, he looks and acts like someone who could snap at any moment and kill the entire family.
By now, The Middle has been on for close to 7 seasons. It's a bona-fide hit, a veteran, and will probably go out with 9 seasons. That's nothing to sneeze at. But its quality has definitely declined. Rather than let the characters grow as they naturally would, the writers have kept them exactly as they have always been...and it's just not working. Too bad. I really liked The Middle, but not anymore.
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Post by poelzig on Jun 28, 2017 19:36:17 GMT
I didn't say it was "detestable," I said Frankie was detestable. And I enjoyed the first season especially because Patricia Heaton was a favorite of mine from Everybody Loves Raymond. Back then, the kids were cute, Frankie really was struggling, and even Mike was more engaging. Now, 8 years later, the kids are all moronic and immature beyond belief, Brick is slowly growing into a round-headed, blank-faced automaton who charges through the house by swinging his arms and walking robotically, Mike has shown some development, in that he's no longer a curmudgeon who doesn't give a shat about his children, and Frankie has become an avaricious, cheating, lying, snake in the grass. Let's not forget what she did to the Donahue's Thanksgiving dinner. Perfect example of her "it's all about me," attitude and "screw the rest." Maybe you find that endearing, maybe it makes you laugh, but her character is definitely the worst mom on TV EVER. Frankie is deplorable and a truly wretched person on almost every level. However, Mallory Archer or Marie Barone are the worst mothers on TV ever. At least Mallory is funny and her maliciousness is not focused mainly on her family like that evil witch Marie.
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Post by naterdawg on Jun 29, 2017 1:11:48 GMT
You know, I didn't think Marie was evil. She was mean to Debra, true, and favored Raymond over Robbie--but she always fed them well, tried to teach them things, and never neglected them. Frankie Heck routinely neglects her children. She's never cooked a meal for them, so they eat fast food every night. She forgets Brick's birthday, she even refused to feed Brick once Sue was away at college. And let's not forget how she had to muster up the tears to appear sad when Sue was leaving for college--when in reality, she couldn't give a crap. But when Axl, her established favorite, left, she was a sobbing mess.
I think, in order to find a main character funny, you must relate to them in some way. There's no relating to Frankie Heck. She's just detestable.
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Post by poelzig on Jun 29, 2017 3:30:36 GMT
I tried to watch Everybody Loves Raymond but Marie made it tough to watch. After the episode where Robert BEGGED Marie to not interfere with him getting his dream job with the FBI and she destroyed his chances anyway just because she was a malicious c word I couldn't watch another episode.
Frankie is right there with Marie though. Just a truly awful person. The letting the kids go hungry thing isn't funny on any level. Maybe if the kids were just as selfish and cruel to her I might see a tiny bit of humor in it but the kids are not that bad. Well Axl is an annoying douchebag but the other 2 try to be good kids. Hell like you pointed out, Brick can't help that he's annoying. He needs medical help.
I get that these are comedies but when the parent is criminally negligent it makes me despise the parent. Hard to laugh when you're wanting to see the mother get bashed in the head with a baseball bat. Brick snapping and attacking Frankie might be hilarious.
Tonight on a very special episode of The Middle
Brick "What are we having for dinner mom?"
Frankie "I ate 4 burgers and 2 large fries before I got home. I'm not hungry."
Brick "You won't feed Brick? feed brick. OK. I'll feed you brick."
Frankie "What? Why are you so weird?"
Frankie turns in time to see a brick smash her in the face. She screams and Brick repeatedly smashs her in the face with his favorite brick until she is unconscious. Brick then shoves pieces of the broken brick into what remains of Frankie's mouth and super glues her mouth shut.
Brick "I hope dad cooks dinner. I hate wasting a good brick. good brick."
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Post by naterdawg on Jun 29, 2017 5:18:05 GMT
I get that these are comedies but when the parent is criminally negligent it makes me despise the parent. Hard to laugh when you're wanting to see the mother get bashed in the head with a baseball bat. Brick snapping and attacking Frankie might be hilarious. Tonight on a very special episode of The Middle Brick "What are we having for dinner mom?" Frankie "I ate 4 burgers and 2 large fries before I got home. I'm not hungry." Brick "You won't feed Brick? feed brick. OK. I'll feed you brick." Frankie "What? Why are you so weird?" Frankie turns in time to see a brick smash her in the face. She screams and Brick repeatedly smashs her in the face with his favorite brick until she is unconscious. Brick then shoves pieces of the broken brick into what remains of Frankie's mouth and super glues her mouth shut. Brick "I hope dad cooks dinner. I hate wasting a good brick. good brick." This would be a great way to end the series. A finale sure to be remembered!
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sagenesse
Sophomore
@sagenesse
Posts: 306
Likes: 116
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Post by sagenesse on Jun 30, 2017 4:29:43 GMT
All I have to say is if the show is as awful as people in a few old reviews claim then why is it renewed for season 9. Your complaints are trumped by the network renewal. So complain all you want. The show is renewed. Enough said.
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Post by BATouttaheck on Jun 30, 2017 4:33:53 GMT
sagenesseThere is a full range of likes and dislikes in the user reviews. nater has cherry picked only the negatives that agree with his opinion of the show. It's what he does.
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Post by BATouttaheck on Jun 30, 2017 4:35:41 GMT
All I have to say is if the show is as awful as people in a few old reviews claim then why is it renewed for season 9. Your complaints are trumped by the network renewal. So complain all you want. The show is renewed. Enough said. But on the other hand, they renewed "Two and a Half Men" .
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Post by naterdawg on Jun 30, 2017 13:55:16 GMT
All I have to say is if the show is as awful as people in a few old reviews claim then why is it renewed for season 9. Your complaints are trumped by the network renewal. So complain all you want. The show is renewed. Enough said. According to Jim lasted as many seasons as The Middle. Not exactly "class TV." But I think you probably liked it!
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Post by naterdawg on Jun 30, 2017 13:55:56 GMT
sagenesse There is a full range of likes and dislikes in the user reviews. nater has cherry picked only the negatives that agree with his opinion of the show. It's what he does. I posted my own IMDB reviews, Brick. I mean, Bat Outtaheck. Naterdawg is right at the top. Pay attention, instead of looking for ways to "one up" me.
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Post by RedDeadFallout on Jun 30, 2017 21:26:50 GMT
Frankie Heck is not above lying and stealing, if it benefits her or her motley family. The Donahues, who are their neighbors and picture-perfect (and nice) in every way, are painted out to be "weird" by them and the producers of the show. But it's not "weird" for Frankie to borrow their spotless car and leave it full of trash, or when she keeps forgetting her youngest child's birthday or doesn't even know when school starts (the kids were late by a week). At first, she was written as a "harried, every day housewife" dealing with "trying to get by." But eventually, she became a manipulative, cheating liar who takes nothing seriously, including motherhood. Yeah it's definitely the womans fault. No other possibility.
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Post by naterdawg on Jun 30, 2017 21:48:51 GMT
Frankie Heck is not above lying and stealing, if it benefits her or her motley family. The Donahues, who are their neighbors and picture-perfect (and nice) in every way, are painted out to be "weird" by them and the producers of the show. But it's not "weird" for Frankie to borrow their spotless car and leave it full of trash, or when she keeps forgetting her youngest child's birthday or doesn't even know when school starts (the kids were late by a week). At first, she was written as a "harried, every day housewife" dealing with "trying to get by." But eventually, she became a manipulative, cheating liar who takes nothing seriously, including motherhood. Yeah it's definitely the womans fault. No other possibility. If you honestly think there's "no other possibility," you've never watched The Middle.
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Post by poelzig on Jun 30, 2017 22:17:15 GMT
Frankie Heck is not above lying and stealing, if it benefits her or her motley family. The Donahues, who are their neighbors and picture-perfect (and nice) in every way, are painted out to be "weird" by them and the producers of the show. But it's not "weird" for Frankie to borrow their spotless car and leave it full of trash, or when she keeps forgetting her youngest child's birthday or doesn't even know when school starts (the kids were late by a week). At first, she was written as a "harried, every day housewife" dealing with "trying to get by." But eventually, she became a manipulative, cheating liar who takes nothing seriously, including motherhood. Yeah it's definitely the womans fault. No other possibility. So you're suggesting Frankie's horrible actions and loathsome neglect towards her kids is somehow NOT her fault? Fictional character aside, how do you propose we spin it so you can blame a male for HER actions?
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barkingbaphomet
Junior Member
all backlit and creepysmoking
@barkingbaphomet
Posts: 2,252
Likes: 1,006
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Post by barkingbaphomet on Jul 1, 2017 0:22:47 GMT
Yeah it's definitely the womans fault. No other possibility. So you're suggesting Frankie's horrible actions and loathsome neglect towards her kids is somehow NOT her fault? Fictional character aside, how do you propose we spin it so you can blame a male for HER actions? Mike didn't beat her enough.
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Post by BATouttaheck on Jul 1, 2017 0:29:34 GMT
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Post by naterdawg on Jul 1, 2017 1:42:33 GMT
Hello, genius! Entertainment is art, tossed out to the masses. Therefore, it can be critiqued, judged, and criticized--and surprise, surprise, not always to your liking or the liking of your friends. Why does it "bother" you so much that people think The Middle is past its overdue date and that Frankie is a textbook example of a neglectful parent? Does her portrayal make your feel better about your own neglected kids (if you have any, which I somehow doubt)? Or do you routinely steal, cheat, lie, cut lines, and cut corners whenever possible, because you don't like being "pressured?" It's amazing to me that you're constantly pushing "being positive," but you endorse a truly heinous character like Frankie Heck. Your priorities are seriously in need of a rethink.
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