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Post by Deleted on Jul 3, 2017 13:04:01 GMT
Recently two major movie franchises released movies with a lot of simularities with other movies. One copying their greatest rival and the other even copying itsself. Wonder Woman and Star Wars The Force Awakens.
Both movies are copies of other movies with the major difference is the female lead.
So I ask you which one is more original and why?
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Post by sostie on Jul 3, 2017 13:11:35 GMT
I really couldn't pick. Neither felt especially fresh or original, yet both were enjoyable, TFA moreso.
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Post by ArArArchStanton on Jul 3, 2017 13:38:57 GMT
Recently two major movie franchises released movies with a lot of simularities with other movies. One copying their greatest rival and the other even copying itsself. Wonder Woman and Star Wars The Force Awakens. Both movies are copies of other movies with the major difference is the female lead. So I ask you which one is more original and why? WW is almost shot for shot a combination of Thor & First Avenger.
At least with Force Awakens everybody left with actual questions like who is snoke, what happened during the training that turned Kylo evil, why did Luke leave, who are Rey's parents, etc. etc etc.
WW didn't make you ask anything at all. It's a very simple copy of the above two films, and with less actually. I wrote another thread with 5 or 6 significant plots points that carry forward from First Avenger, and those sorts of things don't exist in WW.
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Post by Jedan Archer on Jul 3, 2017 14:11:37 GMT
To play Darth Godwin: Who was the bigger monster: Hitler or Churchill..? Force Awakens is infamous for being a story-beat-for-story-beat rehash of Star Wars with some elements from the other OT films (a “Greatest Hits Cover Album”). As from release there were countless analysis and comparisons of that fact. In fact the film - after having the same backstory as Star Wars- starts out with the second Empire (looking nearly identical) attacking underdogs to obtain an item; item is then hidden in R2-droid who escapes into desert, Bad Guy in black mask arrives and questions and kills leader, and takes young rebel as prisoner for torturous interrogation etc etc…. So, I do not even begin to see how that would be remotely comparable to Wonder Woman, except as a silly defamation tactic employed by the usual fanboy-subjects desperately trying to put down a successful genre milestone. TFA was a commercial afterglow of the creative big bang that was Star Wars; WW was the first commercially, critically and artistically successful super hero movie led and directed by women ever. After Wolverine3 one of the few notable genre entries of the last decade...
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Post by President Ackbar™ on Jul 3, 2017 17:23:41 GMT
Both movies are copies of other movies with the major difference is the female lead. WW is almost shot for shot a combination of Thor & First Avenger. WW and CA came out the same year ( 1941 ) and had almost identical costumes ( stars and stripes ) and enemies ( German soldiers ) so it makes perfect sense that the two movies would be very similar. Thor, however, came out 21 years later, and so, any similarities in character, or backstory, to WW would indicate the he was the copy, not her. |
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Post by sdrew13163 on Jul 3, 2017 17:37:19 GMT
Recently two major movie franchises released movies with a lot of simularities with other movies. One copying their greatest rival and the other even copying itsself. Wonder Woman and Star Wars The Force Awakens. Both movies are copies of other movies with the major difference is the female lead. So I ask you which one is more original and why? WW is almost shot for shot a combination of Thor & First Avenger.
At least with Force Awakens everybody left with actual questions like who is snoke, what happened during the training that turned Kylo evil, why did Luke leave, who are Rey's parents, etc. etc etc.
WW didn't make you ask anything at all. It's a very simple copy of the above two films, and with less actually. I wrote another thread with 5 or 6 significant plots points that carry forward from First Avenger, and those sorts of things don't exist in WW.
How could anyone possibly know if they carry forward yet? It's the most recent release in the franchise. As for the "shot for shot" part, it's not even close. WW is nothing close to Thor. WW is way better. The First Avenger and WW are similar (even in overall quality), but I didn't find it to be a remake in disguise like The Force Awakens was. |
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Post by DC-Fan on Jul 3, 2017 18:20:23 GMT
So, I do not even begin to see how that would be remotely comparable to Wonder Woman, except as a silly defamation tactic employed by the usual fanboy-subjects desperately trying to put down a successful genre milestone. Yep, this thread is just another pathetic attempt by a biased MCU fan to try to discredit a great movie like Wonder Woman. The fact is Wonder Woman is nothing like Captain America or Thor or any MCU movies. If Wonder Woman were an MCU movie, then there would be plenty of jokes and 1-liners when they showed the injured soldiers with amputated limbs and showed the women and children killed by poisonous gas. If Wonder Woman were an MCU movie, then the entire No Mans Land scene would be filled with jokes and 1-liners.
Wonder Woman does an excellent job of finding the right balance between the lighter moments (Diana and Steve taking on the boat ride to London, Diana shopping for civilian clothes, Diana and Steve dancing in the snow) and the more serious moments (the No Man's Land scene, injured soldiers with amputated limbs, women and children killed by poisonous gas). That's something MCU movies still haven't figured out how to do right after 15 movies. The trademark of MCU movies is that they always treat war and people getting injured or killed as a joke.
Wonder Woman actually has more in common with Superman: The Movie than with Captain America: The First Avenger.
1. Superman: The Movie has scenes of Clark as a child. Wonder Woman has scenes of Diana as a child. The First Avenger has no scenes of Steve Rogers as a child.
2. Superman: The Movie has Clark catching a bullet in the alley when Lois and Clark are being robbed. Wonder Woman has a nice homage to that scene with Diana blocking a bullet in the alley when Diana and Steve are surrounded by some German spies. The First Avenger has no such scene.
3. First public appearance in costume
Superman - flies up to catch a falling Lois and then catches the falling helicopter with 1 hand, while John Williams' classic theme music (1 of the most recognized theme songs in movie history) is playing. Saves Lois and saves dozens of people on the street who would've been crushed by the falling helicopter. Most iconic scene in CBM history.
Wonder Woman - climbs up the ladder and crosses No Man's Land and then proceeds to the town and takes out the German soldiers. Liberates the town. 2nd-most iconic scene in CBM history.
Captain America - performs a dance and musical number with cheerleaders on stage for Stan Lee. No lives saved. No towns liberated.
4. Genuine and believable romance
In Superman: The Movie, Superman and Lois spend an evening together flying over Metropolis. In Wonder Woman, Diana and Steve spend an evening together dancing in the snow and other things. In The First Avenger, Steve Rogers and Peggy Carter never spent an evening together or went out on a date together. Steve Rogers and Peggy Carter were a really lame "romance" that wasn't genuine or believable and they're easily 1 of the worst couples in CBM history.
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Post by DC-Fan on Jul 3, 2017 18:22:41 GMT
As for the "shot for shot" part, it's not even close. WW is nothing close to Thor. WW is way better. The First Avenger and WW are similar (even in overall quality), but I didn't find it to be a remake in disguise like The Force Awakens was. actually has more in common with Superman: The Movie than with Captain America: The First Avenger.
1. Superman: The Movie has scenes of Clark as a child. Wonder Woman has scenes of Diana as a child. The First Avenger has no scenes of Steve Rogers as a child.
2. Superman: The Movie has Clark catching a bullet in the alley when Lois and Clark are being robbed. Wonder Woman has a nice homage to that scene with Diana blocking a bullet in the alley when Diana and Steve are surrounded by some German spies. The First Avenger has no such scene.
3. First public appearance in costume
Superman - flies up to catch a falling Lois and then catches the falling helicopter with 1 hand, while John Williams' classic theme music (1 of the most recognized theme songs in movie history) is playing. Saves Lois and saves dozens of people on the street who would've been crushed by the falling helicopter. Most iconic scene in CBM history.
Wonder Woman - climbs up the ladder and crosses No Man's Land and then proceeds to the town and takes out the German soldiers. Liberates the town. 2nd-most iconic scene in CBM history.
Captain America - performs a dance and musical number with cheerleaders on stage for Stan Lee. No lives saved. No towns liberated.
4. Genuine and believable romance
In Superman: The Movie, Superman and Lois spend an evening together flying over Metropolis. In Wonder Woman, Diana and Steve spend an evening together dancing in the snow and other things. In The First Avenger, Steve Rogers and Peggy Carter never spent an evening together or went out on a date together. Steve Rogers and Peggy Carter were a really lame "romance" that wasn't genuine or believable and they're easily 1 of the worst couples in CBM history.
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Post by ArArArchStanton on Jul 3, 2017 20:05:20 GMT
WW is almost shot for shot a combination of Thor & First Avenger. WW and CA came out the same year ( 1941 ) and had almost identical costumes ( stars and stripes ) and enemies ( German soldiers ) so it makes perfect sense that the two movies would be very similar. Thor, however, came out 21 years later, and so, any similarities in character, or backstory, to WW would indicate the he was the copy, not her.I'm talking about the movie and the way it played out. |
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Post by ArArArchStanton on Jul 3, 2017 20:10:40 GMT
WW is almost shot for shot a combination of Thor & First Avenger.
At least with Force Awakens everybody left with actual questions like who is snoke, what happened during the training that turned Kylo evil, why did Luke leave, who are Rey's parents, etc. etc etc.
WW didn't make you ask anything at all. It's a very simple copy of the above two films, and with less actually. I wrote another thread with 5 or 6 significant plots points that carry forward from First Avenger, and those sorts of things don't exist in WW.
How could anyone possibly know if they carry forward yet? It's the most recent release in the franchise. As for the "shot for shot" part, it's not even close. WW is nothing close to Thor. WW is way better. The First Avenger and WW are similar (even in overall quality), but I didn't find it to be a remake in disguise like The Force Awakens was. Because there is nothing to carry forward. There were almost no side plots or characters in the film that could carry over. Other than perhaps the Amazons, name something that might realistically show up later. Dr. Poison? Steve for some reason? I can't think of anything that has much of a chance, can you?
WW has a lot in common with Thor, although it's far more First Avenger, but they start in a god like paradise, break some rules, leave their home, have their first human experience, have a final battle with technology, and then end up facing a blood relative god. And I would actually say Thor is easily just as good. First Avenger is definitely better.
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Post by Grabthar's Hammer on Jul 3, 2017 20:13:51 GMT
As for the "shot for shot" part, it's not even close. WW is nothing close to Thor. WW is way better. The First Avenger and WW are similar (even in overall quality), but I didn't find it to be a remake in disguise like The Force Awakens was. actually has more in common with Superman: The Movie than with Captain America: The First Avenger.
1. Superman: The Movie has scenes of Clark as a child. Wonder Woman has scenes of Diana as a child. The First Avenger has no scenes of Steve Rogers as a child.
2. Superman: The Movie has Clark catching a bullet in the alley when Lois and Clark are being robbed. Wonder Woman has a nice homage to that scene with Diana blocking a bullet in the alley when Diana and Steve are surrounded by some German spies. The First Avenger has no such scene.
3. First public appearance in costume
Superman - flies up to catch a falling Lois and then catches the falling helicopter with 1 hand, while John Williams' classic theme music (1 of the most recognized theme songs in movie history) is playing. Saves Lois and saves dozens of people on the street who would've been crushed by the falling helicopter. Most iconic scene in CBM history.
Wonder Woman - climbs up the ladder and crosses No Man's Land and then proceeds to the town and takes out the German soldiers. Liberates the town. 2nd-most iconic scene in CBM history.
Captain America - performs a dance and musical number with cheerleaders on stage for Stan Lee. No lives saved. No towns liberated.
4. Genuine and believable romance
In Superman: The Movie, Superman and Lois spend an evening together flying over Metropolis. In Wonder Woman, Diana and Steve spend an evening together dancing in the snow and other things. In The First Avenger, Steve Rogers and Peggy Carter never spent an evening together or went out on a date together. Steve Rogers and Peggy Carter were a really lame "romance" that wasn't genuine or believable and they're easily 1 of the worst couples in CBM history.
That's an interesting comparison. I'll have to re-watch Superman: The Movie. I probably haven't seen it in over a decade. I have to disagree with a part of 3 though. While the "first public appearance in costume" part is accurate, I find the No Man's Land scene to be more similar to Captain America freeing the prisoners from the Hydra base. I think the No Man's Land scene is far superior to the CA scene, but I find at least those scenes more comparable than anything in Superman. I didn't catch that WW homage to Superman though. Good call. I'll have to re-watch both movies. |
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Post by DC-Fan on Jul 3, 2017 23:12:17 GMT
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Post by DC-Fan on Jul 3, 2017 23:17:16 GMT
end up facing a blood relative god. 1st, Thor and Loki aren't blood relatives, idiot! Loki was adopted. 2nd, Thor and Loki aren't even gods. MCU treats them as just advanced aliens from another world. In MCU, the Asgardians are no more gods than the Kryptonians in DCEU. Thor is easily just as good. First Avenger is definitely better. Nope. Wonder Woman is definitely much better than both Thor and The First Avenger. |
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Post by Hauntedknight87 on Jul 4, 2017 0:52:45 GMT
Neither of them? TFS was a rehash of ANH and Wonder Woman was a mixture of the original Superman and The First Avenger with some Thor sprinkled on it.
Wonder Woman was the better film and a better female lead.
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Post by Grabthar's Hammer on Jul 4, 2017 1:19:32 GMT
That's a good article. I didn't need to read it to know that Wonder Woman is a better movie than CA: TFA though lol. I do like both movies, but I consider CA: TFA to be on the lower quality side of the MCU. I want to see Wonder Woman again. They have a good copy online but I can't bring myself to cheat it out of my money lol. |
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barkingbaphomet
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Post by barkingbaphomet on Jul 4, 2017 4:34:45 GMT
Wonder Woman, with the presumption that we're talking about the world of film, so that it being an adaption doesn't figure.
though i like TFA more.
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gromel
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Post by gromel on Jul 4, 2017 15:37:05 GMT
WW had something to say. Didn't quite pull it off perfectly but I blame the flawed Snyderverse base for that. It also just ignored some base facts of the Snyderverse. It offers hope for the franchise to continue correcting itself.
TFA had nothing to say. Its story ruined the past, present and future of its franchise and insulted people's intelligence. Some fans you are to allow this. Why care about anything when the past didn't matter and the future is already ruined for stupid reasons. It's all pointless now. I can deal with bad DC films or hell Marvel films, but the damage this did won't be undone since rebooting is not in Disney's interests.
If you want to support Disney just watch the MCU. And Disney.
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Post by Tristan's Journal on Jul 4, 2017 16:10:58 GMT
ok, lets cut right through the bullshit to end this crap, alright?
Force Awakens is a shitstain on Star War's best underwear, the Original Trilogy - one that one can never be washed out entirely!
Wonder Woman however is the sexiest lingerie in all Comic Book Movie history. If you beefcake-in-tights fanboys need someone to point that out, shame on you and your misguided nerd boners, really.
Just saying... |
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Post by Deleted on Jul 4, 2017 16:22:48 GMT
ok, lets cut right through the bullshit to end this crap, alright?
Force Awakens is a shitstain on Star War's best underwear, the Original Trilogy - one that one can never be washed out entirely!
Wonder Woman however is the sexiest lingerie in all Comic Book Movie history. If you beefcake-in-tights fanboys need someone to point that out, shame on you and your misguided nerd boners, really.
Just saying... Still WW is very much a copy of Captain America The First Avenger. And dont worry, Im not getting any boner over any CBM. Not even Wonder Woman herself. Gal just aint my kinda gal. |
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Post by politicidal on Jul 4, 2017 17:42:58 GMT
I love both films but definitely Wonder Woman.
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