|
Post by phludowin on Jul 20, 2017 20:58:47 GMT
Do people who drive cars in Australia advocate the culture of rapeseed in Europe?
|
|
|
Post by Eva Yojimbo on Jul 20, 2017 21:04:26 GMT
tpfkar Eva Yojimbo said:Do the not "pro-choice" advocate the termination of fetuses "with certain restrictions", from none to quite stringent? No, the "pro-choice" advocate for the mother's right to choose "with certain restrictions." Advocating for the mother's right to choose an abortion is not advocating for abortions, nor is it advocating that mothers choose to abort.
|
|
|
Post by Eva Yojimbo on Jul 20, 2017 21:05:16 GMT
the culture of rapeseed in Europe? What even is that?
|
|
|
Post by cupcakes on Jul 20, 2017 21:07:11 GMT
tpfkar Eva Yojimbo said:Do the not "pro-choice" advocate the termination of fetuses "with certain restrictions", from none to quite stringent? No, the "pro-choice" advocate for the mother's right to choose "with certain restrictions." Advocating for the mother's right to choose an abortion is not advocating for abortions, nor is it advocating that mothers choose to abort. What's the salient difference with the NRA example?
|
|
|
Post by phludowin on Jul 20, 2017 21:59:52 GMT
|
|
|
Post by Eva Yojimbo on Jul 20, 2017 22:07:22 GMT
No, the "pro-choice" advocate for the mother's right to choose "with certain restrictions." Advocating for the mother's right to choose an abortion is not advocating for abortions, nor is it advocating that mothers choose to abort. What's the salient difference with the NRA example? The analogy between them would be this: Edit: formatting got messed up on this one, let me try again.
|
|
|
Post by Eva Yojimbo on Jul 20, 2017 22:09:50 GMT
No, the "pro-choice" advocate for the mother's right to choose "with certain restrictions." Advocating for the mother's right to choose an abortion is not advocating for abortions, nor is it advocating that mothers choose to abort. What's the salient difference with the NRA example? Second attempt: analogy would be this: EDIT: formatting screwed up too. *sigh*
|
|
|
Post by Eva Yojimbo on Jul 20, 2017 22:12:54 GMT
No, the "pro-choice" advocate for the mother's right to choose "with certain restrictions." Advocating for the mother's right to choose an abortion is not advocating for abortions, nor is it advocating that mothers choose to abort. What's the salient difference with the NRA example? OK, I'm going to try this one more time without the brackets. Maybe that's what's screwing up the formatting. The analogy would be: (NRA/Pro-choicers) advocate (the right to own firearms/the mother's right to have an abortion). Some members of both would advocate certain restrictions for (owning guns/having an abortion). Members of neither would necessarily advocate (owning firearms/having abortions), though some members might advocate (owning firearms/having abortions) in certain circumstances or in general. EDIT: OK, that finally worked.
|
|
|
Post by THawk on Jul 20, 2017 22:25:08 GMT
tpfkar Eva Yojimbo said:Do the not "pro-choice" advocate the termination of fetuses "with certain restrictions", from none to quite stringent? No, the "pro-choice" advocate for the mother's right to choose "with certain restrictions." Advocating for the mother's right to choose an abortion is not advocating for abortions, nor is it advocating that mothers choose to abort. That is absurd, or at the very least refused to see the viewpoint of the other side. The pro-lifers believe that life is on the line. Giving someone the "choice" to end that life and saying you don't "advocate" for that makes 0 logical sense. It's like if the police told everyone they have the legal choice to go out killing people, but they wouldn't agree with it. No one gives a damn about the latter part, it's the first that makes all the difference.
|
|
|
Post by thorshairspray on Jul 20, 2017 22:28:40 GMT
I think gay people should have the right to marry people of the same sex. I don't care whether they do or not, only that they have the right to do so. I believe all citizens should have the right to vote. I do not care whether they do or not. Only that they have the right.
Anymore examples required?
|
|
|
Post by Eva Yojimbo on Jul 20, 2017 22:32:01 GMT
No, the "pro-choice" advocate for the mother's right to choose "with certain restrictions." Advocating for the mother's right to choose an abortion is not advocating for abortions, nor is it advocating that mothers choose to abort. Giving someone the "choice" to end that life and saying you don't "advocate" for that makes 0 logical sense. It makes perfect logical sense. This thread is full of people making just that argument using many different examples. It's like if the police told everyone they have the legal choice to go out killing people, but they wouldn't agree with it. No one gives a damn about the latter part, it's the first that makes all the difference. Well, sure, it's the first that makes "all the difference," but even in your own example you admit that the police can, one, advocate that people have the right to kill other people and, two, not advocate that people kill other people. These are not mutually exclusive positions (though it's tough, in this example, to think of a reason why they would advocate for the first if they didn't advocate killing other people).
|
|
|
Post by cupcakes on Jul 20, 2017 22:36:10 GMT
tpfkar Eva Yojimbo said:Does that statement make "They advocate the right to possess firearms in general, but the addendum "with certain restrictions" would vary between members. Some might advocate no restrictions, others might advocate quite stringent restrictions."
untrue?
|
|
|
Post by Eva Yojimbo on Jul 20, 2017 23:01:13 GMT
tpfkar Eva Yojimbo said:Does that statement make "They advocate the right to possess firearms in general, but the addendum "with certain restrictions" would vary between members. Some might advocate no restrictions, others might advocate quite stringent restrictions."
untrue? No.
|
|
|
Post by Eva Yojimbo on Jul 20, 2017 23:12:36 GMT
I meant "what is the ' culture of' (rapeseed)?" I thought perhaps you were punning on rape culture, but I didn't quite get the "culture of rapeseed" reference.
|
|
|
Post by cupcakes on Jul 21, 2017 1:43:13 GMT
Eva Yojimbo said: So do you believe that "They advocate the right to possess firearms in general, but the addendum "with certain restrictions" would vary between members. Some might advocate no restrictions, others might advocate quite stringent restrictions."is true but "They advocate the right to possess firearms in general"is false?
|
|
|
Post by phludowin on Jul 21, 2017 3:43:08 GMT
I meant "what is the ' culture of' (rapeseed)?" I thought perhaps you were punning on rape culture, but I didn't quite get the "culture of rapeseed" reference. I meant culture in the sense of agriculture. Guess I should have picked corn or some other pun-less plant. I just felt like asking a completely pointless non-sequitural question, to match the question in this thread about animal testing.
|
|
|
Post by Morgana on Jul 21, 2017 9:37:29 GMT
This is an experiment inspired by another thread. If you vote, it would be nice if you'd share your vote and reasons why you voted for what you did. I'm Pro-Life but I disagree with the title. I think the title description is inflammatory and misleading.
|
|
|
Post by Marv on Jul 21, 2017 13:38:24 GMT
Pro choice and disagree. But this really feels like an almost semantic argument with the word advocate. People want to support the choice even if they disagree with it.
I think if it's worded as more of an accepted casualty of having this option people would feel more comfortable in agreeing even tho it's essentially the same thing.
|
|
|
Post by Eva Yojimbo on Jul 21, 2017 16:40:59 GMT
Eva Yojimbo said: So do you believe that "They advocate the right to possess firearms in general, but the addendum "with certain restrictions" would vary between members. Some might advocate no restrictions, others might advocate quite stringent restrictions."is true but "They advocate the right to possess firearms in general"is false? No, I'm saying they're both true. The former is just elaborating on the latter.
|
|
|
Post by Eva Yojimbo on Jul 21, 2017 16:41:15 GMT
I meant "what is the ' culture of' (rapeseed)?" I thought perhaps you were punning on rape culture, but I didn't quite get the "culture of rapeseed" reference. I meant culture in the sense of agriculture. Guess I should have picked corn or some other pun-less plant. I just felt like asking a completely pointless non-sequitural question, to match the question in this thread about animal testing. Ah, I gotcha.
|
|