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Post by Aj_June on Aug 5, 2017 13:53:47 GMT
This is an open question to both the people who believe they are spiritual and those who believe they are not. I am not a person who tends to define words such as spiritual in any limited context. It can have a very very broad meaning. You can define the meaning of spirituality in your own terms but do give the reason as to why you are spiritual or why you are not. I remember that Goz often described herself as spiritual even though she was non-religious and I also remember Erjen describe himself as spiritual and I faintly remember ErJen describe himself as not very religious either. So I am looking for an interesting discussion here with many different point of views.
I am not spiritual. At least for last few years I have never described myself as spiritual. I tend to describe spirituality as feelings associated with search for meaning in life or feelings where we see things connected with our true inner self or soul. I am not spiritual because I am not interested in finding meaning in life. I don't have any feeling that there is something above our existence and we have to seek it. Keep in mind that I am not saying that I deny the possibility of something above our self. I am merely saying that I just don't have any interest in these matters. I spend a lot of time every day on deciding what food I should eat. Food is extremely-important to me. I also dream of visiting a lot of places. There might have been one point of time when I thought my desire to travel around the world was in some way related to spirituality but now I don't see it like that.
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islandmur
Sophomore
All religions have messages of peace and love yet all religions are used for wars and hatred...
@islandmur
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Post by islandmur on Aug 5, 2017 14:08:32 GMT
I see spirituality as striving to become the best that a human has to offer in terms of character. Of concquering your baser instincts and emotions. Things like anger, rage, jealousy etc... To be at peace with yourself and the world around you. Also in my case seeking a connection on a deeper level not only with yourself but everything around you from nature to the universe.
I am not religious. I don't believe in "a god". But I do believe everything is connected and that things are not always what they seem.
I believe because i've experienced things. I believe in beeing good and doing good. I think it's more important to act good than to speak of goodness.
As contradictory as it may sound I believe that in order to combat selfsihness people need to concentrate more on themselves and less on others.
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Post by Terrapin Station on Aug 5, 2017 14:10:34 GMT
I don't feel I'm spiritual because I feel that the very idea of "spirit" is incoherent, and I don't see the point of defining it in some incredibly vague way just to be able to apply the word to myself.
Re "meaning of life," there is no such thing beyond what individuals might choose to make up for themselves. There's nothing wrong with an individual making up some credo or overarching purpose or whatever for him/herself, but that's all it is.
"Soul" is an incoherent concept, too.
Re "true inner self," I'm all for existential authenticity, but that simply amounts to being honest with yourself, exploring how you really feel about things, what you really want to do, etc. I wouldn't say that it has anything to do with "spirit."
"Something above ourself" is ridiculously vague in my opinion. There are things you can't control, of course, like the "laws" of physics. (I don't believe they're literally laws, they're just brute facts of physical particulars.)
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Post by phludowin on Aug 5, 2017 14:25:38 GMT
Spiritual, in this context, is associated with the opposite of "material", in my opinion.
I tend to be materialist, therefore not spiritual in that sense.
On the other hand, I believe that the whole is more than the sum of its parts. In that sense, being spiritual could be compatible with materialism, as in having a high emotional intelligence, being able to recognize patterns, or senses attuned to factors that can not be easily measured.
In that sense, I'm not very spiritual either.
But then, there's the possibility that some people are very enthusiastic about certain things. Be it games, art, music, food, sport... Some practicioners call it a "spiritual experience" when they immerse in their activity, and get in the flow, or even some kind of trance.
In that case, it's possible that I'm a little spiritual; at least about games and music.
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Post by rachelcarson1953 on Aug 5, 2017 17:33:30 GMT
This is an open question to both the people who believe they are spiritual and those who believe they are not. I am not a person who tends to define words such as spiritual in any limited context. It can have a very very broad meaning. You can define the meaning of spirituality in your own terms but do give the reason as to why you are spiritual or why you are not. I remember that Goz often described herself as spiritual even though she was non-religious and I also remember Erjen describe himself as spiritual and I faintly remember ErJen describe himself as not very religious either. So I am looking for an interesting discussion here with many different point of views. I am not spiritual. At least for last few years I have never described myself as spiritual. I tend to describe spirituality as feelings associated with search for meaning in life or feelings where we see things connected with our true inner self or soul. I am not spiritual because I am not interested in finding meaning in life. I don't have any feeling that there is something above our existence and we have to seek it. Keep in mind that I am not saying that I deny the possibility of something above our self. I am merely saying that I just don't have any interest in these matters. I spend a lot of time every day on deciding what food I should eat. Food is extremely-important to me. I also dream of visiting a lot of places. There might have been one point of time when I thought my desire to travel around the world was in some way related to spirituality but now I don't see it like that. Hi, AJ, I was so hoping to find a youtube clip of Steve Martin as a fake faith healer, in a radio interview where he and the DJ talk about the importance of 'spirit' while taking drinks out of a flask. ;-) All kidding aside, I don't think of myself as spiritual. I try to be in tune with the natural world, if there is a label for that. I live in a rural area and spend a lot of time out in nature, constantly aware of all the life forms around me, just being conscious of birds and bugs and plants and air and water and how it has all evolved. Would that make me a naturalist? I am emotionally conscious of the loss of my husband and my father, and wish that something of them still existed and could visit me, but I know that is wishful thinking. What is left of them is what I remember of them. I connect deeply to my pets, especially the tiny kittens I bottle-feed from time to time, when someone abandons a litter at my veterinarian's clinic, but the connection is purely on this level of existence, not something supernatural. Maybe that is the defining word in this - supernatural. I don't believe in anything supernatural, and my consciousness as a human is natural. I suppose it could be described as my spirit. But am I spiritual in the way society defines it at this time? No.
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Post by cupcakes on Aug 5, 2017 17:35:26 GMT
tpfkar It's something of an oxymoron. There's only what is. "Spiritual" seems to be used mostly for things and significance people wish there would be.
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Post by maya55555 on Aug 5, 2017 19:06:26 GMT
rachelcarson1953
GOD bless you!
We have a group of wonderful people who rescue entire cat colonies in a TNA program. We are not a charity and we fund all costs ourselves. That is wonderful what you are doing!!!
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Post by rachelcarson1953 on Aug 5, 2017 19:53:48 GMT
rachelcarson1953
GOD bless you!
We have a group of wonderful people who rescue entire cat colonies in a TNA program. We are not a charity and we fund all costs ourselves. That is wonderful what you are doing!!! I will take that as the sincere good will expression it is meant to be. Though you believe in god and I don't, we are still both working to make this world a better place, and that is what is important. My work, as yours, is funded out of my own pocket, but I have been a part of several non-profits over the years. Rescuing cat colonies is hard work but vital; spaying and neutering is the humane way to stop the pet overpopulation problem. It is wonderful what you and they are doing! :-)
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Post by general313 on Aug 5, 2017 22:27:28 GMT
I occasionally engage in what might be called spiritual thinking, for example when fondly remembering a dead relative or friend. I even will engage in a imagining that is at odds with my rational viewpoint; that deceased family are able to see what I'm doing or look upon the world as it is now. But I realize that this is a fantasy, similar to other fantasies like imagining travelling and living in some far off land in the distant past.
I believe there are scientists that study the human brain/mind to try and understand our capacity for spirituality and faith, with some proposing that there are parts of the brain specialized for this. It makes sense, considering how many people seem to be spiritual and religious. It seems to me that this religious center in the brain is as non-specialized as our language center(s). We have great capacity for language and religion, but there is no specific tuning toward a particular religion or language other than what comes from learning. Identical twins separated at birth can end up being an Arab speaking Muslim and a Greek speaking Orthodox Christian.
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Post by The Herald Erjen on Aug 6, 2017 0:19:27 GMT
True, Aj. I'm very much interested in astral projection, remote viewing, lucid dreaming, prophecy, and spirit guides/guardian angels. I'd like to see Goz try and beat that. If Goz ever comes back she can explain how she feels about it, but I think of myself as a spirit residing temporarily in a body, whereas Goz seems to believe that the spirit will cease to exist once the body dies.
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Post by Arlon10 on Aug 6, 2017 0:42:34 GMT
What I've noticed about people who are uncomfortable with spirituality is that they express a concern for facts. They don't think spiritual people have enough concern for facts. They think spirituality is antithetical to facts. If not that then they think spirituality is somewhat detrimental to the facts at least, even if only accidentally. The irony there is that for all their admiration and respect for science, they are terrible at it themselves. They contribute to widespread notions that are not science at all in the mistaken belief they're promoting science. It is disturbing how wrong they are about how very many things. What they believe is science is actually a lack of depth. You might have noticed that some movies have more "depth" than others. Some movies are more "pithy" than others. They engage your mind as well as your heart more than others. They often deal with things that are quite beyond "science" to manage them. Many people who think they're "scientific" aren't really, they're just shallow. They attribute the "spirituality" they see in other people to flaws or mistakes. They think spiritual people believe in life after death because of some emotional flaw clouding the reason. There are indeed a lot of flawed people on both sides. Just as not everyone who thinks they're scientific is, not everyone who thinks they're spiritual is. All that aside there really is no science that makes any strong case against an afterlife. People who believe in an afterlife are not really slighting any science and did not necessarily fail any science. One of the things that might "pass for" spirituality that is not really is the belief in doing what we are told. There usually are a lot of similarities in believing in doing what we are told and believing in a god, as well there should be. Not always is that true though. Sometimes large numbers of people fail to critically analyze things and a false narrative develops and they just keep following it. Many of the people promoting what they believe is science (and is not) are people who just like many others in the past actually believe in doing what they are told. But such people lately were told Darwin had answers the Bible did not. They were told religion usurps science. None of which on close inspection turns out to be true. They are however incapable of their own critical analysis and just go on believing what they are told. Many of those people are the same type people who believed in a "god" in the past. I have said here before and I will say here again, those people are not necessarily "evil." In fact in ordinary circumstances they are some of the better examples of human behavior and progress, decent and honest. But that depends on the narrative they follow being correct. Sometimes circumstances are not ordinary and the narrative is false. At the present time the widespread lack of critical thinking is obvious and every sort of mistaken idea appears widespread. I just finished arguing with people who actually believe frequent computer security "updates" make any sense. I doubt the people who argued against me could really be that stupid. They just never really critically analyzed the situation. They just followed the narrative, a false narrative. Just believing in doing what you are told can be very efficient. I said that before too. No one has time to analyze every point in the narrative to verify it. It saves time and resources when people just follow the narrative. Many of them are "good kids." It might be what some people call "spiritual" too.
Today that is not true. The narrative is so far wrong about so very many things. The blind are leading the blind and there are far too many of them.
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Post by Aj_June on Aug 6, 2017 10:12:10 GMT
I see spirituality as striving to become the best that a human has to offer in terms of character. Of concquering your baser instincts and emotions. Things like anger, rage, jealousy etc... To be at peace with yourself and the world around you. Also in my case seeking a connection on a deeper level not only with yourself but everything around you from nature to the universe. I am not religious. I don't believe in "a god". But I do believe everything is connected and that things are not always what they seem. I believe because i've experienced things. I believe in beeing good and doing good. I think it's more important to act good than to speak of goodness. As contradictory as it may sound I believe that in order to combat selfsihness people need to concentrate more on themselves and less on others. Thanks Mur for your reply. It's interesting that you said "Also in my case seeking a connection on a deeper level not only with yourself but everything around you from nature to the universe." This is a sort of explanation of spirituality that comes to my mind. I totally agree with the things you have said but I personally find it difficult to apply those things in real life. That said, I am a lot more pessimist now than I was a few years ago.
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Post by Aj_June on Aug 6, 2017 10:24:56 GMT
tpfkar It's something of an oxymoron. There's only what is. "Spiritual" seems to be used mostly for things and significance people wish there would be. I tend to agree with that. I think mental processes dictate such things for individuals. They may be creating their own realities based on their own experiences. May be these experiences are based on things which can't be proven and just happened in their mind and so we are right in finding these connections as wishful but it could be very important to those who have such experiences. Spiritual, in this context, is associated with the opposite of "material", in my opinion. I tend to be materialist, therefore not spiritual in that sense. This is also a very frequently explained meaning of spirituality. It is generally believed that people who have very strong attachment with material pleasures such as money, lifestyle, sports and other exciting stuffs tend to be less spiritual. You covered the alternate opinion to this in your last point when you said "Some practitioners call it a "spiritual experience" when they immerse in their activity". I used to be of such opinion till sometime back but personally I now see those activities as just something that I tend to like more than I like other things.
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Post by Deleted on Aug 6, 2017 10:31:15 GMT
I am not spiritual. At least for last few years I have never described myself as spiritual. I tend to describe spirituality as feelings associated with search for meaning in life or feelings where we see things connected with our true inner self or soul. I am not spiritual because I am not interested in finding meaning in life. I don't have any feeling that there is something above our existence and we have to seek it. Keep in mind that I am not saying that I deny the possibility of something above our self. I am merely saying that I just don't have any interest in these matters. I spend a lot of time every day on deciding what food I should eat. Food is extremely-important to me. I also dream of visiting a lot of places. There might have been one point of time when I thought my desire to travel around the world was in some way related to spirituality but now I don't see it like that. Aj can we please meet one day and travel the world together because this is my exact same dream. However, I do find myself spiritual because I want to find the meaning of life. Not really life in general but meaning to my own personal life. I feel like theres no point in living if there isn't.
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Post by Aj_June on Aug 6, 2017 10:38:42 GMT
I am not spiritual. At least for last few years I have never described myself as spiritual. I tend to describe spirituality as feelings associated with search for meaning in life or feelings where we see things connected with our true inner self or soul. I am not spiritual because I am not interested in finding meaning in life. I don't have any feeling that there is something above our existence and we have to seek it. Keep in mind that I am not saying that I deny the possibility of something above our self. I am merely saying that I just don't have any interest in these matters. I spend a lot of time every day on deciding what food I should eat. Food is extremely-important to me. I also dream of visiting a lot of places. There might have been one point of time when I thought my desire to travel around the world was in some way related to spirituality but now I don't see it like that. Aj can we please meet one day and travel the world together because this is my exact same dream. However, I do find myself spiritual because I want to find the meaning of life. Not really life in general but meaning to my own personal life. I feel like theres no point in living if there isn't. That will be awesome. I already have a few on my list that I am determined to meet. I am supposed to meet OldSamVimes and Sulla and Moviefan as of now. We will go to Canada together to meet them. As for spiritual things I hope you find meaning in your life and come to understanding at what you really are.
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Post by phludowin on Aug 6, 2017 11:02:02 GMT
Spiritual, in this context, is associated with the opposite of "material", in my opinion. I tend to be materialist, therefore not spiritual in that sense. This is also a very frequently explained meaning of spirituality. It is generally believed that people who have very strong attachment with material pleasures such as money, lifestyle, sports and other exciting stuffs tend to be less spiritual. You covered the alternate opinion to this in your last point when you said "Some practitioners call it a "spiritual experience" when they immerse in their activity". I used to be of such opinion till sometime back but personally I now see those activities as just something that I tend to like more than I like other things. To clarify: I meant "materialist" in the philosophical sense; meaning: I believe there's nothing beyond the material or natural world. Some people call this "naturalist"; possibly to avoid confusion with materialism in the sense of loving material pleasures. But in my opinion, naming this "naturalism" does not solve the problem; because others see "naturalism" as opposed to "culturalism"; meaning naturalism in a "back to nature" sense. This is not me.
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Post by Aj_June on Aug 7, 2017 15:15:55 GMT
To clarify: I meant "materialist" in the philosophical sense; meaning: I believe there's nothing beyond the material or natural world. Some people call this "naturalist"; possibly to avoid confusion with materialism in the sense of loving material pleasures. But in my opinion, naming this "naturalism" does not solve the problem; because others see "naturalism" as opposed to "culturalism"; meaning naturalism in a "back to nature" sense. This is not me. Sorry for misunderstanding your usage. Materialism is sometimes attached to love for worldly pleasures and often used in discussions on spirituality in that respect. But thanks for clarifying.
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