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Post by ArArArchStanton on Mar 6, 2017 2:43:35 GMT
You'll need a lot more like yourself (I'm talking millions) if you want to enforce the notion that religious belief is delusional, and you're not winning friends or influencing people here. I'm not trying to win friends here, it's a chat room.
Also, there are millions of atheists, just in case you didn't know.
And religious belief is delusional, whether there are millions of people to promote it or not.
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Post by Deleted on Mar 6, 2017 2:46:31 GMT
I've heard quite a lot of them from the argument from design to the cosmological argument and many others, and none of those actually mean that a god exists.
So are you aware of an argument that actually shows a god is necessary for anything we observe in reality?
Can anybody demonstrate that it's even possible for some kind of intelligence to exist prior to the known universe?
If not, then I honestly don't know how anybody accepts it as true that any such thing exists. I'm yet to hear an Atheist provide a good argument for not believing in God. Now, I don't mind that they don't believe that is their right and I am sure that their reasons mean a great deal to them. You don't need to justify your beliefs or non beliefs as it were. These things are all very personal and usually can't be understood by others even if they share similar beliefs anyway. Arguing about it is pointless to be honest.
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Post by The Herald Erjen on Mar 6, 2017 2:49:18 GMT
You'll need a lot more like yourself (I'm talking millions) if you want to enforce the notion that religious belief is delusional, and you're not winning friends or influencing people here. I'm not trying to win friends here, it's a chat room.
Also, there are millions of atheists, just in case you didn't know.
And religious belief is delusional, whether there are millions of people to promote it or not.
Atheist =/= anti-theist. Atheists don't try to convince me to dispense with my religion. They have better things to do.
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Post by CoolJGS☺ on Mar 6, 2017 2:54:07 GMT
We can't say that for a certainty can we? I have no idea what your beliefs are since you are so interested in mine you don't have time to convince me of yours. People with conviction about something are prone to discuss that over the convictions of others but you can;t do that for some reason which is odd. It make me assume you have no convictions which makes your certainty of them a pretty easy thing to accomplish. And to be clear, you can't help but fail at least as much as me on that front and you seem to lack more interest in doing so than I do. You don't have to worry about me questioning them because I don't care enough about you to ask, but by all means explain it if you wish. I believe in lots of things, and pick any of them, from black holes organizing galaxies, to time being infinite at the speed of light, to stars fusing gas molecules into iron, to evolution, to potential creation models like quantum fluctuation.
Having conviction in a delusion is just called being delusional. That's why I try not to do that.
If any of my ideas failed as much as the idea of a god, guess what? I'd stop believing it.
How does the idea of God fail? Why does it disturb you? This is what makes you perhaps the most irrational person on the board.
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Post by CoolJGS☺ on Mar 6, 2017 3:02:40 GMT
For the record, I also don;t necessarily have problems with anything you believe since they are so vague as to encompass any number of explanations. What you have is blind faith in paper research which is OK, but they are just beliefs which by your view of things would make them irrational.
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Post by ArArArchStanton on Mar 6, 2017 3:09:42 GMT
I'm yet to hear an Atheist provide a good argument for not believing in God. Now, I don't mind that they don't believe that is their right and I am sure that their reasons mean a great deal to them. You don't need to justify your beliefs or non beliefs as it were. These things are all very personal and usually can't be understood by others even if they share similar beliefs anyway. Arguing about it is pointless to be honest. There is no evidence for a god, and that is a good reason to not believe something.
No, it's not all very personal. A claim about reality is not personal, it's the most public thing there is. If they can't be understood by others, then there is no difference between that and something imaginary.
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Post by ArArArchStanton on Mar 6, 2017 3:11:19 GMT
Atheist =/= anti-theist. Atheists don't try to convince me to dispense with my religion. They have better things to do. I'm an atheist doing just that, and I gladly admit that I'm anti religion.
What better thing is there to do than encourage the diminishment of mass delusion.
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Post by ArArArchStanton on Mar 6, 2017 3:12:41 GMT
Mass delusion doesn't disturb you? Really?
The idea of god fails because there is no supporting evidence for it.
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Post by Deleted on Mar 6, 2017 3:14:01 GMT
I think it comes down to each person's definition of God. To each person, God represents something different. Part of Faith is not the "proof" (that's Science not Faith), but Faith is about believing. A good example came from the movie Contact. "Do you love your father? Prove it!" How do you prove to someone else that you love, or how you love, or what that love looks like to you.
People always want proof of existence, or proof of non-existence. Some of us believe God refers to Source Energy, creator of whatever that initial force was the started the universe as we know it, in ways we cannot yet understand.
As time goes on, that definition may evolve. To others, God is a floating old man in the sky.
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Post by Deleted on Mar 6, 2017 3:15:18 GMT
I'm yet to hear an Atheist provide a good argument for not believing in God. Now, I don't mind that they don't believe that is their right and I am sure that their reasons mean a great deal to them. You don't need to justify your beliefs or non beliefs as it were. These things are all very personal and usually can't be understood by others even if they share similar beliefs anyway. Arguing about it is pointless to be honest. There is no evidence for a god, and that is a good reason to not believe something.
No, it's not all very personal. A claim about reality is not personal, it's the most public thing there is. If they can't be understood by others, then there is no difference between that and something imaginary.
Well you made the statement, prove that there isn't a God. This is what happens, you can't accept someone else's beliefs. And yes, it is very personal, what do you care what someone else believes? Why or how does that effect you? What makes you think your reality is right? Maybe what you believe is imaginary? Why are you so defensive about your belief system being challenged?
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Post by The Herald Erjen on Mar 6, 2017 3:16:19 GMT
Atheist =/= anti-theist. Atheists don't try to convince me to dispense with my religion. They have better things to do. I'm an atheist doing just that, and I gladly admit that I'm anti religion.
What better thing is there to do than encourage the diminishment of mass delusion.
No, you're a parasite. I'm 50+ years old now, and I've known many atheists, and I've never seen any of them try to validate their nonbelief by talking people out of their beliefs. I never saw that until I came to this board.
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Post by ArArArchStanton on Mar 6, 2017 3:24:34 GMT
There is no evidence for a god, and that is a good reason to not believe something.
No, it's not all very personal. A claim about reality is not personal, it's the most public thing there is. If they can't be understood by others, then there is no difference between that and something imaginary.
Well you made the statement, prove that there isn't a God. This is what happens, you can't accept someone else's beliefs. And yes, it is very personal, what do you care what someone else believes? Why or how does that effect you? What makes you think your reality is right? Maybe what you believe is imaginary? Why are you so defensive about your belief system being challenged? I didn't say there wasn't one, so why would I need to prove that? I said there is no evidence for one, and that is because you asked for a good reason not to believe it. No evidence is a good reason not to accept something as true.
I'm not defensive, you can question anything you like about what I believe, because it is all based on evidence.
Why do I care about someone elses beliefs? Because people act on their beliefs. And a world full of delusional people is something to be concerned about.
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Post by ArArArchStanton on Mar 6, 2017 3:25:55 GMT
No, you're a parasite. I'm 50+ years old now, and I've known many atheists, and I've never seen any of them try to validate their nonbelief by talking people out of their beliefs. I never saw that until I came to this board. What is wrong with trying to talk people out of their belief? If you can't defend it as being true, why would you even want to keep believing it? Don't you care if your beliefs are true?
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Post by Deleted on Mar 6, 2017 3:27:09 GMT
Well you made the statement, prove that there isn't a God. This is what happens, you can't accept someone else's beliefs. And yes, it is very personal, what do you care what someone else believes? Why or how does that effect you? What makes you think your reality is right? Maybe what you believe is imaginary? Why are you so defensive about your belief system being challenged? I didn't say there wasn't one, so why would I need to prove that? I said there is no evidence for one, and that is because you asked for a good reason not to believe it. No evidence is a good reason not to accept something as true.
I'm not defensive, you can question anything you like about what I believe, because it is all based on evidence.
Why do I care about someone elses beliefs? Because people act on their beliefs. And a world full of delusional people is something to be concerned about.
According to you there isn't evidence. Many would say otherwise but again it is personal. What evidence do you have? I am curious to know more about your perceptions. Belief in a God can vary, there are some who will carry out acts in the name of their God, or for that matter in the name of their politics or anything else. There are also many who believe what they believe in quietly and unless you asked them you would never know what they believe in.
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Post by Deleted on Mar 6, 2017 3:28:15 GMT
God is responsible for MIRACLES, if you don't know what a miracle is, google it. Such as miracle plane crash survivors etc, etc. This will be my only response, not a preacher and don't give a shit what anyone thinks.
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Post by CoolJGS☺ on Mar 6, 2017 3:37:50 GMT
I think it comes down to each person's definition of God. To each person, God represents something different. Part of Faith is not the "proof" (that's Science not Faith), but Faith is about believing. A good example came from the movie Contact. "Do you love your father? Prove it!" How do you prove to someone else that you love, or how you love, or what that love looks like to you. People always want proof of existence, or proof of non-existence. Some of us believe God refers to Source Energy, creator of whatever that initial force was the started the universe as we know it, in ways we cannot yet understand. As time goes on, that definition may evolve. To others, God is a floating old man in the sky. Although I don;t necessarily disagree, faith is not as described. Faith IS confidence and confidence always requires a measure of proof. It is belief that requires no foundation which is why it, by itself, is fleeting. That is why religious people, rightly so I might add, say a person who believe life got here without God is basing that on faith in science not proven. They are so confident in it as to accept it as fact when there are none. And many of them get bent out of shape when it's such a simple and true statement. So regarding the origins of life, it's all faith until proven otherwise. Now the more people research the religion (Or non-religion) they are skeptical about, there becomes plenty of evidence regarding what kind of person/belief they have faith in and if there isn't then it should be dismissed by all but the devout, but obviously that's not the case with the Judeo-Christian God and thus there's no reason for that one to evolve beyond what we know. God is pretty easy to know and one thing we know is there's no reason to view him as an old man in the sky.
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Post by ArArArchStanton on Mar 6, 2017 3:40:11 GMT
According to you there isn't evidence. Many would say otherwise but again it is personal. What evidence do you have? I am curious to know more about your perceptions. Belief in a God can vary, there are some who will carry out acts in the name of their God, or for that matter in the name of their politics or anything else. There are also many who believe what they believe in quietly and unless you asked them you would never know what they believe in. It's not personal, there simply isn't any demonstrated evidence. You might notice that gravity isn't personal, evolution isn't personal, the speed of light isn't personal, etc. It's weird you think that somehow a fact of reality is just personal. Of course it isn't.
Evidence I have for what? I'll gladly share if you're curious about anything in particular.
I'm not sure why you're defending delusion honestly.
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Post by Deleted on Mar 6, 2017 3:44:46 GMT
Religion and spirituality is personal.
Evidence for there not being a God.
You seem to be avoiding the questions now. Maybe you are just trolling.
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Post by The Herald Erjen on Mar 6, 2017 4:43:39 GMT
No, you're a parasite. I'm 50+ years old now, and I've known many atheists, and I've never seen any of them try to validate their nonbelief by talking people out of their beliefs. I never saw that until I came to this board. What is wrong with trying to talk people out of their belief? If you can't defend it as being true, why would you even want to keep believing it? Don't you care if your beliefs are true? Are you still here? It doesn't need a defense. If you don't want to believe it, you don't have to.
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Post by awhina on Mar 6, 2017 5:15:16 GMT
My reasons satisfy me but I know from experience that even if God rearranged the constellations to spell out 'God is real' you would not believe but would say that "fundy hucksters' had faked it somehow. If your reasons don't demonstrate a god is required, then why do they satisfy you?
And why are you dismissing that I wouldn't accept a god was real? I accept that there is no edge to the universe, but you think I couldn't accept that there was a god?
Have you ever considered that there isn't one?
Have I ever considered that there isn't a God? Yes maybe for 5 minutes here and there. Experience has shown the futility of argument on the subject with you.
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