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Post by ArArArchStanton on Dec 12, 2017 15:20:37 GMT
Hes right, Disney will make the Xmen a kid friendly universe where no serious mature themes are conveyed with any rigor. You realize serious mature themes come up in kid friendly movies right? Kid friendly isn't the same thing as saying, it's for kids. |
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Post by miike80 on Dec 12, 2017 15:21:55 GMT
That's not what people want out of an R rated MCU though. Deadpool has explicit sex, so I'm giving an example of explicit MCU sex. Hell, instead of Vision trying to bond emotionally with Wanda in Civil War we should have him trying to get into her pants too. And? I remember back after Spider-Man 3 came out how people were complaining that we should've get a Carnage movie where he eats people. Eh, Dark Knight got away with a PG rating and it was just as violent. yeah, but the violence was only implied, not like you see blood or anything, it just cuts away at the right moment |
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Post by formersamhmd on Dec 12, 2017 15:25:21 GMT
Nobody was asking for a R rated Spider-man movie where the teenagers have sex though. People are asking for an R-Rated MCU, though. As in, the entire MCU being R-rated from start to finish. That entails EVERYTHING that you can do with an R-Rating, like Spidey having sex. Still happened. You could show Kingpin killing a guy with the door without showing the blood either and it'd be the same as the Pencil. Hell, Joker electrocuted a man into a burning corpse in Batman 1989. Ragnarok gave us Hela slaughtering the Asgardian army, so you can do it without going crazy. Would showing us every step of the way have added anything to that scene though? Might as well go all the way and have Ronan get an erection from killing someone. Hey, if the entire MCU is to get an R rating they may as well show us Quill having sex with a tentacled alien squid woman too. Or carnivorous aliens who eat people. |
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Post by formersamhmd on Dec 12, 2017 15:29:40 GMT
Deadpool has explicit sex, so I'm giving an example of explicit MCU sex. Hell, instead of Vision trying to bond emotionally with Wanda in Civil War we should have him trying to get into her pants too. And? I remember back after Spider-Man 3 came out how people were complaining that we should've get a Carnage movie where he eats people. Eh, Dark Knight got away with a PG rating and it was just as violent. yeah, but the violence was only implied, not like you see blood or anything, it just cuts away at the right moment Would showing Joker slowly using a power drill to rip a guy's eye apart before it goes into his brain and we slowly hear him moan as he dies have added anything to the movie? |
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Riddick
Sophomore
@riddick
Posts: 160
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Post by Riddick on Dec 12, 2017 15:33:31 GMT
In my opinion, the consequences of violence shouldn't never taken away. Doesn't matter if PG-13 or Rated-R. If people get's shot, let them bleed. If people get's stabbed with sharp tools like knifes and swords, let them bleed. If people get's hitting hard in their faces, let them bleed.
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Post by scabab on Dec 12, 2017 15:37:58 GMT
People are asking for an R-Rated MCU, though. That entails EVERYTHING that you can do with an R-Rating, like Spidey having sex. Which is not want people want. People aren't asking for a R rated MCU movie so we can see a sex scene between minors. It'd be for a possible R rated Blade or Ghost Rider movie or other dark or violent property. It's never the same. That's why the fanbase has a complete meltdown when movies like Die Hard 4, Aliens vs Predator, RoboCop 2014, The Expendables 3 and Terminator Genisys are downgraded from the usual R rating to a PG-13 because it's just not the same and it limits it. It doesn't have the same impact. Yes, it would have been a lot more memorable for one thing because you'd actually see it. Also seeing the brutality of it just adds to the characters image. |
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Post by charzhino on Dec 12, 2017 15:40:48 GMT
Hes right, Disney will make the Xmen a kid friendly universe where no serious mature themes are conveyed with any rigor. You realize serious mature themes come up in kid friendly movies right? Kid friendly isn't the same thing as saying, it's for kids. Yeah but they quickly move on from it or gloss it over really lightly with no depth. Depression, suicidal thoughts, addiction, isolation, loss of family all feature profoundly in the Xmen films and I cant say the same for MCU version of them. Not to say these films should be all doom and glooml like Man of Steel, which Xmen are not, but presenting darker themes with vigor is something MCU shys away from generally speaking. |
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Post by ArArArchStanton on Dec 12, 2017 15:42:31 GMT
You realize serious mature themes come up in kid friendly movies right? Kid friendly isn't the same thing as saying, it's for kids. Yeah but they quickly move on from it or gloss it over really lightly with no depth. Depression, suicidal thoughts, addiction, isolation, loss of family all feature profoundly in the Xmen films and I cant say the same for MCU version of them. Not to say these films should be all doom and glooml like Man of Steel, which Xmen are not, but presenting darker themes with vigor is something MCU shys away from generally speaking. Annnnnnnnnnnnnnnd? |
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Post by ThatGuy on Dec 12, 2017 15:43:17 GMT
So he thinks that the only way a film can be "for adults" is if they kill everyone and be loaded with blood and cursing. That's some adolescents' idea of "Maturity". That definitely describes some of the trolls on this board, but that isn't what he's saying here. He's saying you have more creative freedom when you aren't worried about selling toys. There are certain guidelines you have to follow if you want to market the film to children. It all goes back to McDonalds getting angry about Batman Returns because they thought Happy Meal toys shouldn't feature creepy characters who kill and sexually assault people (Penguin). It's odd, because they made a Friday the 13th NES game in the 80s which was definitely marketed to kids, but I have to say that would never happen today. The Winter Soldier is an example of a CBM for adults, so it can be done and done very well. But there's no way Disney makes Logan or Deadpool, and that's the real issue. Those films simply would not exist if every film had to follow some studio mandate regarding marketing to the widest possible audience. But they don't need the movies to sell toys. They have the comics for that. Most of the toys that come out of Marvel is based on the comics' look. Not really how they look in the movies. The only reason Fox stop selling toys based on their movies was because no one wanted the drab all black look of them. Hell, I want some of those QFigs. From Marvel and DC (that Wonder Woman tho). |
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Post by charzhino on Dec 12, 2017 15:44:49 GMT
Yeah but they quickly move on from it or gloss it over really lightly with no depth. Depression, suicidal thoughts, addiction, isolation, loss of family all feature profoundly in the Xmen films and I cant say the same for MCU version of them. Not to say these films should be all doom and glooml like Man of Steel, which Xmen are not, but presenting darker themes with vigor is something MCU shys away from generally speaking. Annnnnnnnnnnnnnnd? And thats what James Mangold is concerened about. |
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Post by ThatGuy on Dec 12, 2017 15:45:40 GMT
You realize serious mature themes come up in kid friendly movies right? Kid friendly isn't the same thing as saying, it's for kids. Yeah but they quickly move on from it or gloss it over really lightly with no depth. Depression, suicidal thoughts, addiction, isolation, loss of family all feature profoundly in the Xmen films and I cant say the same for MCU version of them. Not to say these films should be all doom and glooml like Man of Steel, which Xmen are not, but presenting darker themes with vigor is something MCU shys away from generally speaking. At the same time you shouldn't [edit] make the entire movie about that. Or, like the X-men movies, every movie about that. We get it, move along. Singer has one theme in his head and he keeps revisiting it. Also, if you really need that in your movies then there is something wrong with you and you need to get help. Seriously. |
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Post by miike80 on Dec 12, 2017 15:47:20 GMT
yeah, but the violence was only implied, not like you see blood or anything, it just cuts away at the right moment Would showing Joker slowly using a power drill to rip a guy's eye apart before it goes into his brain and we slowly hear him moan as he dies have added anything to the movie? No,but having Deadpool using Pg13 language would not ring true.and it never felt right seeing Wolverine using his knife like claws and not seeing a drop of blood. |
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Post by formersamhmd on Dec 12, 2017 15:48:47 GMT
Which is not want people want. People aren't asking for a R rated MCU movie so we can see a sex scene between minors. Hey, if they're asking for an R Rating they should be prepared for everything you can get with a R Rating. No point in being a prude. Yes, but if the MCU is to be rated R and be what Mangold wants, which is to absolutely not be something that can be merchandised or shown to anyone under 18, then you might as well apply that to every single movie and every character. Die Hard 4, AvP and Genesys were just plain bad movies with or without their ratings. I never saw the Expendables movies (except the first and I barely remember it) and I LIKED Robocop 2014. And him twisting the Others' head around 180 degrees wasn't enough? Showing the guys' blood dripping down wasn't enough? |
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Post by formersamhmd on Dec 12, 2017 15:50:38 GMT
Yeah but they quickly move on from it or gloss it over really lightly with no depth. No, they just don't have the characters stand around and give an operatic monologue on their emotional state because they trust their audience enough to pick up on things. Get lip service in the XCU. |
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Post by formersamhmd on Dec 12, 2017 15:51:55 GMT
Would showing Joker slowly using a power drill to rip a guy's eye apart before it goes into his brain and we slowly hear him moan as he dies have added anything to the movie? No,but having Deadpool using Pg13 language would not ring true.and it never felt right seeing Wolverine using his knife like claws and not seeing a drop of blood. No one cared when he did so in X1, X2, X3, DOFP and the Wolverine. As for DP and language, we could get a good gag where Dr Strange gets annoyed with him so he turns off DP's voice and his words only show up as censored subtitles. |
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Post by charzhino on Dec 12, 2017 15:53:12 GMT
Yeah but they quickly move on from it or gloss it over really lightly with no depth. Depression, suicidal thoughts, addiction, isolation, loss of family all feature profoundly in the Xmen films and I cant say the same for MCU version of them. Not to say these films should be all doom and glooml like Man of Steel, which Xmen are not, but presenting darker themes with vigor is something MCU shys away from generally speaking. At the same time you should make the entire movie about that. Or, like the X-men movies, every movie about that. We get it, move along. Singer has one theme in his head and he keeps revisiting it. Also, if you really need that in your movies then there is something wrong with you and you need to get help. Seriously. No that's not what I meant. Im saying when MCU try to go into more adult themes they gloss over them or lighten them down. Tony in IM3. Not keeping dead characters dead purposefuly. Cap and Peggys reunion really short. Rhodeys injury in civil war downplayed. Thats just off top of my head. Other superhero movies go deeper. Spiderman 2, Nolans Bat films, Man of Steel. They feel much more commited to the superheros troubles just as much as the action and display each more balanced. Cant say the same for MCU, they tend to feel more restrained. |
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Post by miike80 on Dec 12, 2017 15:55:58 GMT
No,but having Deadpool using Pg13 language would not ring true.and it never felt right seeing Wolverine using his knife like claws and not seeing a drop of blood. No one cared when he did so in X1, X2, X3, DOFP and the Wolverine. As for DP and language, we could get a good gag where Dr Strange gets annoyed with him so he turns off DP's voice and his words only show up as censored subtitles. Don't know how you know I didn't care. As for the Deadpool gag,it might work for 2 minutes |
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Post by formersamhmd on Dec 12, 2017 15:56:56 GMT
Im saying when MCU try to go into more adult themes they gloss over them or lighten them down. Tony in IM3. He dealt with his PTSD better than Xavier did with his alcoholism. Killing characters willy nilly is lazy. Did we need to see what happened to the X-Men in Logan? Or exactly how Logan came to care for Xavier after that? So he refuses to let his injury define him, wow how awful. No, they have them giver operatic monologues or mope around instead of trying to do something. They're reactive people, not proactive. |
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Post by ThatGuy on Dec 12, 2017 15:57:16 GMT
Reading what he says, I can't agree. You can only do a movie like that once. He can't make a Logan 2. He can't try to replicate what he did in Logan in an X-23 movie. And then he'd have to wait until Daphne is older to make that X-23 if he wants it to be Rated R and about her. It would just have her in it like Logan and have someone else as the star. He'd have to move on. Anything he tries to do will be seen as him rehashing what he did in Logan. Also, killing characters just to kill them when you can tell more stories with them is what got the X-men movies in the continuity trouble they are in now. |
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Post by formersamhmd on Dec 12, 2017 15:58:36 GMT
No one cared when he did so in X1, X2, X3, DOFP and the Wolverine. As for DP and language, we could get a good gag where Dr Strange gets annoyed with him so he turns off DP's voice and his words only show up as censored subtitles. Don't know how you know I didn't care. As for the Deadpool gag,it might work for 2 minutes If Logan's inability to hack someone up took away from those movies, you sure don't see it. If DP's own gags could fill a movie, so could him being frustrated that he could only talk in censored language. It's not like him cursing is all he can do. |
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