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Post by kevin on Feb 7, 2017 10:51:31 GMT
Game of Thrones
Discuss anything related to Game of Thrones (TV show) down below. By the way, wouldn't it be nice to have individual boards (or subboards) for the most popular TV shows (GoT, The Walking Dead, Breaking Bad etc.) so we can discuss individual episodes or characters in different threads?
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OmegaWolf747
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A lonely wanderer, jettisoned from my cozy den.
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Post by OmegaWolf747 on Feb 7, 2017 13:32:36 GMT
I want Dany and her dragons to burn King's Landing to ash!
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Post by Leo of Red Keep on Feb 9, 2017 3:39:49 GMT
I want Dany and her dragons to burn King's Landing to ash! I want her to fall off her stupid beast
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Feb 10, 2017 6:46:16 GMT
I want more seasons
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Post by Leo of Red Keep on Feb 10, 2017 7:12:34 GMT
There will be a sequel.
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Post by Leo of Red Keep on Feb 11, 2017 18:51:18 GMT
I want Dany and her dragons to burn King's Landing to ash! Daenerys is the enemy coming to take what never was hers, as was her brother before her.
She can wrap it in well-meaning propaganda all she likes, she is an invader coming with a foreign army, a people of savages and three monsters, surrounding herself with all the scum she can find: regicides, turncloaks, murderers, usurpers, pirates…
She is a silver-haired herring bound to fail. She will die north of the Wall.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Feb 11, 2017 23:04:08 GMT
Tyrion ain't no regicider
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Post by Leo of Red Keep on Feb 12, 2017 5:57:38 GMT
Tyrion ain't no regicider He was convicted. Are you doubting the Gods?
Besides:
Or do you think someone else did it?
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Post by Deleted on Feb 12, 2017 9:50:10 GMT
I thought the Tyrells conspired with Littlefinger, Olenna pretty much admitted it. I don't believe Sansa had a clue what was going on.
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Post by Leo of Red Keep on Feb 12, 2017 9:58:43 GMT
I thought the Tyrells conspired with Littlefinger, Olenna pretty much admitted it. I don't believe Sansa had a clue what was going on. Tyrion conspired with Olenna. Sansa knew about it. Olenna used Littlefinger, never said a thing about Tyrion or Sansa being involved, so Sansa could play the innocent with him. Tyrion was framed as a casualty from the start, his being right in the middle of it when it happened just accelerated things. Olenna lied to Margaery about it, of course
Shae wasn't lying at the trial. No one was. Tyrion made it look like a farce, pretended to be accused of being a dwarf so he would put a plausible alternative into the room in case he won the trial by combat. He knew he couldn't withstand a closer investigation and hoped to manipulate his brother into fighting for him.
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Post by Deleted on Feb 12, 2017 10:29:13 GMT
Interesting theory, I'm not sure I go along with it all but it's possible I missed something. When you said Shae didn't lie, do you mean when she said Tyrion told her about the plot? Because the rest of the stuff she said, although not lies as such, were misrepresentations of what actually occurred. We saw all of what she claimed up until that point and saw that she was twisting the meaning of what actually happened. We only have her word about the confession, and her word at that point doesn't mean much.
Unless I've missed something, your theory hangs on a lot of stuff happening off camera that will come out later on.
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Post by Leo of Red Keep on Feb 12, 2017 10:46:00 GMT
When you said Shae didn't lie, do you mean when she said Tyrion told her about the plot? Because the rest of the stuff she said, although not lies as such, were misrepresentations of what actually occurred. We saw all of what she claimed up until that point and saw that she was twisting the meaning of what actually happened. We only have her word about the confession, and her word at that point doesn't mean much. Unless I've missed something, your theory hangs on a lot of stuff happening off camera that will come out later on. Shae didn't say Tyrion told her anything, only that she knew. She explained it by saying she was his whore. She didn't twist anything, as far as I can remember. We saw her wait in his chambers in S2, we saw her call him "my lion", we saw the "I'm yours and you're mine". We didn't see any of the more intimate intercourse for good reason but have no reason to doubt it.
She might have misunderstood his motives but he did tell her Sansa was fit to bear her children and she wasn't so she was justified in believing he wanted the Stark girl.
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Post by Deleted on Feb 12, 2017 16:19:05 GMT
OK, maybe I'm mistaken about the trial, I thought she said he'd told her but it's a while since I saw that episode so I can't be certain. It doesn't change things though, her evidence was highly twisted, while not lies, certainly not an accurate account of what happened. She might have mistaken his motives (she may have believed he preferred Sansa, personally I don't think she was that stupid but that's all conjecture) but her understanding of him is irrelevant. She twisted the facts in court, she portrayed both him and herself differently than how they actually were together.
As for Tyrion, I'm really not seeing this version of Tyrion that you're seeing. Is your theory based on things we've already seen or things you think will come out later in the series? I'm no expert and I don't recall every detail from the show, but I can't think of anything that suggests Tyrion is anything other than what we see of him. He's always come across as fairly decent, honest and transparent.
Why do you think Olenna would lie to Margaery about Tyrion's involvement? She tells her she's certain Tyrion didn't do it and hints very strongly that she did it. It doesn't make sense to me that she would lie about that, what would be the point?
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Post by Leo of Red Keep on Feb 12, 2017 16:31:21 GMT
I'm no expert and I don't recall every detail from the show, but I can't think of anything that suggests Tyrion is anything other than what we see of him. He's always come across as fairly decent, honest and transparent. Why do you think Olenna would lie to Margaery about Tyrion's involvement? She tells her she's certain Tyrion didn't do it and hints very strongly that she did it. It doesn't make sense to me that she would lie about that, what would be the point? Does killing your own father out of pure vengeance qualify as "fairly decent" to you. It doesn't to me. He also knew exactly how much of a disaster Tywin's death would be. Olenna did murder Joffrey, this is not a lie. She wanted Margaery to be fully innocent of a matter she would otherwise carry with her for life. She wanted her to be able not to have to lie about things, especially since she didn't know what would happen to Tyrion. If he came out of it she wanted Margaery to be able to live with him around.
The next question if why she acknowledged her own involvement. I suppose she wanted both to teach her grandaughter and also make sure that she stayed quiet about the whole matter. She told her just as much as she had to and no more. Margaery never learned about Littlefinger either.
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Post by Deleted on Feb 12, 2017 17:07:25 GMT
Does killing your own father out of pure vengeance qualify as "fairly decent" to you. It doesn't to me.
No, but understandable, which is why I describe him as a 'fairly decent' person rather than a 'thoroughly decent' person. 'Fairly decent' in that most of the time he acts with decency and compassion towards others, particularly those who deserve it. I find your interpretation interesting. That's what I love about GoT, the characters are multi-faceted and open to interpretation. Few of them are wholly good / bad. It's what makes the show great IMO. I'm still not seeing the same Tyrion as you but I enjoy hearing your reasoning and it's giving me a good excuse for a re-watch
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Post by Leo of Red Keep on Feb 12, 2017 18:16:22 GMT
Does killing your own father out of pure vengeance qualify as "fairly decent" to you. It doesn't to me.
No, but understandable, which is why I describe him as a 'fairly decent' person rather than a 'thoroughly decent' person. 'Fairly decent' in that most of the time he acts with decency and compassion towards others, particularly those who deserve it. I find your interpretation interesting. That's what I love about GoT, the characters are multi-faceted and open to interpretation. Few of them are wholly good / bad. It's what makes the show great IMO. I'm still not seeing the same Tyrion as you but I enjoy hearing your reasoning and it's giving me a good excuse for a re-watch People's values and choices clash together about GoT characters and they end up discussing themselves without admitting it. We may end up seeing the same Tyrion if we look at him closely enough, which already implies willingness and time to do so, but we would still judge him differently. This is what makes the show so important to viewers. They find things to identify with and things to reject. They can get pretty passionate about it.
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Post by Rey Kahuka on Feb 22, 2017 15:37:07 GMT
They should retitle this thread 'GOT fan fiction.'
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Post by Leo of Red Keep on Feb 22, 2017 16:07:26 GMT
They should retitle this thread 'GOT fan fiction.' This is no fiction. Tyrion's guilt was proven by the Gods but here is something for the unbelievers:
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Post by Rey Kahuka on Feb 22, 2017 16:29:39 GMT
He had no idea it was poisoned, and he has no reason at all to lie about it at this point. You either can't understand the narrative or you're just writing fan fiction because you're bored. Either way I'm out.
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Post by Deleted on Feb 22, 2017 22:57:36 GMT
Its pretty obvious that its the story about how the Targaryens takes back the Iron throne.
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