Deleted
Deleted Member
@Deleted
Posts: 0
Likes:
|
Post by Deleted on Jul 16, 2018 8:09:06 GMT
Which go to show. Despite how great and powerful they say the love between Oliver and Felicity, they don't really believe that. They know it's a fragile thing because it has no firm foundation and can easily fall apart. Yeah no. You are right. I don't think even the extreme Olicity fans truly believe the love between Oliver and Felicity is that great and powerful 'cause they would always get very angry over the slightest suggestion of including other female characters in the show that were Oliver's love interests in the comic books 'cause they assumed it meant they were going to replace Felicity and for a lot of them on the old 'Arrow' board their main concern was always Oliver ending up with Felicity at the end and they didn't care about anything else apart from that. It was always endgame is going to be Oliver and Felicity and not what other challenges the Green Arrow was going to face.
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
@Deleted
Posts: 0
Likes:
|
Post by Deleted on Jul 16, 2018 8:15:31 GMT
Well its because their not Olicity fans even, if they were the fandom would be divided when the couple quarrels, but look at them their 99.99% on Felicity's side no matter what, they for some reason have an unstable attachment to this secondary character played by a one note actress and they only support Olicity because that puts that character in the forefront, fuck those people. Yeah. I agree but at the same time I think by getting what they wanted (having Felicity as Oliver's main love interest) they destroyed the Felicity character in many ways and they are only just starting to see that now and it is all their fault. As fans of the character they should have been pushing for Felicity to have more better storylines on her own and not just to be a love interest for Oliver and they knew they couldn't defend how awful Season 4 was after Stephen Amell publicly put it down and what I will always remember about them is how they went on and on about how great Season 4 was and how it was everything the show should have been from day one. ShellySmiles and another member I can't remember the name of but was frequent on there (not Almira) were telling everybody the show had matured and was what it was meant to be but then when Stephen and Marc said how bad it was they had a total change of heart and were all saying how bad it was and blamed the magic.
|
|
|
Post by dazz on Jul 16, 2018 8:30:00 GMT
I think what destroyed the character was Marc not having a fucking clue what to do with the character, that and appealing to the idiot fans, I said this so many times but I mean it Felicity being the character she was in S3 & 4 was not what hurt the show, it was every other character kowtowing to her and the writers kowtowing to the Felicity fans making her out to be perfect that hurt, it took away the spark that made "Olicity" more fun to watch than "Lauriver" because Oliver would snap back at Felicity or she would recognise by a look when she's getting close to pushing him, the one time we saw that in S2 with Oliver & Laurel was my favourite moment when Oliver put Laurel in her place for her shit, and then to have it mean something where Oliver stopped being a punching bag for her made her take note of her own issues was great, but then Marc went and downgraded the character for S3 making her whole S2 arc meaningless really.
If Felicity being a bitch had been a plot point they noted in the show it could have worked, if she had ever lost it on Oliver for how he treated her after he admitted his feelings for her it would have imo justified some of the bullshit, but instead they make out that Oliver bending over backwards for Felicity, her being a hypocrite with double standards for their acceptable behaviour, her abusive treatment towards him and general lack of regard for him whenever it gets in the way of what she wants is normal and that Oliver accepting all of this makes them a perfect couple...it's fucking insane to me, stupid thing even after S4 they didn't fix any of this really they just reduced how often we see it, instead of every segment between the 2 we get it maybe every one or two episodes, she's still a cow she just has less focus put on her.
Heres hoping the next season doesn't revert back to being Felicity heavy.
|
|
|
Post by General Kenobi on Jul 17, 2018 14:14:29 GMT
Spent the weekend watching The IT Crowd and have finally found a Felicity I can support.
Richmond Felicity Avernal.
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
@Deleted
Posts: 0
Likes:
|
Post by Deleted on Jul 24, 2018 11:43:40 GMT
I think what destroyed the character was Marc not having a fucking clue what to do with the character, that and appealing to the idiot fans, I said this so many times but I mean it Felicity being the character she was in S3 & 4 was not what hurt the show, it was every other character kowtowing to her and the writers kowtowing to the Felicity fans making her out to be perfect that hurt, it took away the spark that made "Olicity" more fun to watch than "Lauriver" because Oliver would snap back at Felicity or she would recognise by a look when she's getting close to pushing him, the one time we saw that in S2 with Oliver & Laurel was my favourite moment when Oliver put Laurel in her place for her shit, and then to have it mean something where Oliver stopped being a punching bag for her made her take note of her own issues was great, but then Marc went and downgraded the character for S3 making her whole S2 arc meaningless really. If Felicity being a bitch had been a plot point they noted in the show it could have worked, if she had ever lost it on Oliver for how he treated her after he admitted his feelings for her it would have imo justified some of the bullshit, but instead they make out that Oliver bending over backwards for Felicity, her being a hypocrite with double standards for their acceptable behaviour, her abusive treatment towards him and general lack of regard for him whenever it gets in the way of what she wants is normal and that Oliver accepting all of this makes them a perfect couple...it's fucking insane to me, stupid thing even after S4 they didn't fix any of this really they just reduced how often we see it, instead of every segment between the 2 we get it maybe every one or two episodes, she's still a cow she just has less focus put on her. Heres hoping the next season doesn't revert back to being Felicity heavy. I think you are right Dazz but at the same time I don’t think Marc has a clue what he is doing half the time with the characters on ‘Arrow’ and ‘DC’s Legends of Tomorrow.’ ‘DC’s Legends of Tomorrow’ is all over the place most of the time and we have talked about how they wasted Firestorm before and in the case of Felicity Smoak she might have ended up being a far better character if they had better writers handling her and not giving her some of the worst storylines possible on the show but I think one of the main problems was they jumped in overboard with her when they upgraded her to one of the Season Regulars due to her popularity and the Olicity fans kept praising them up so they thought they were doing the right thing with her and her role increased as the show went on.
Felicity getting ownership of ‘Palmer Tech’ and being paralysed only to be able to walk again in next to no time are the two Felicity storylines I have seen criticised the most along with Donna (but as we know that is another story altogether as we have discussed) but Olicity fans praised them like they were the best story-lines we have had on TV and I have said on other threads I think those fans were partly to blame but the journalists who praised them just the same are even worse ‘cause they get paid to write articles like that and the writers are more likely to listen to them than fans just extreme Olicity fans. It will be interesting to see how they handle Felicity going forward especially with the new showrunner and new writers and we might see her role continue to diminish until she is only in it for a few minutes every episode or they might bring her back to the front and make it Felicity heavy. Like you I am hoping they don't but there is no telling what they have planned. I mean for all we know one of them might think Season 4 was brilliant since Rotten Tomatoes gave it such a high score and bring Donna back full time.
|
|
|
Post by General Kenobi on Jul 24, 2018 17:01:19 GMT
Yeah, the show started out good but then they began to listen to Felicity fans and making decisions that crippled the show. Then they stretched themselves thin by developing more shows then they're capable of handling.
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
@Deleted
Posts: 0
Likes:
|
Post by Deleted on Jul 31, 2018 13:50:52 GMT
Yeah, the show started out good but then they began to listen to Felicity fans and making decisions that crippled the show. Then they stretched themselves thin by developing more shows then they're capable of handling. I wonder what a good 'Arrow' show would have been like if the show had stayed as good as it was in the earlier seasons and hadn't dropped off so early thanks to the monstrosity of Season 4. I know you are no longer watching the show but you and some other members might be interested in this. New ‘Arrow’ Showrunner Promises Darker Season 7heroichollywood.com/arrow-showrunner-season-7-darker/
|
|
|
Post by General Kenobi on Jul 31, 2018 14:27:29 GMT
I doubt they'll go very dark and whatever they do will pale in comparison to what Luke Cage did last season.
|
|
|
Post by dazz on Aug 1, 2018 20:19:11 GMT
You never know they could introduce yet ANOTHER vigilante only this one doesn't kill but targets rapist and child molesters by blow torching their genitalia, and you wanna go real dark on that shit don't make every deviant be a dude...something so much more unsettling doing that shit to a woman than a man.
But like fuck the CW is going to be able to get away with that shit, but it could technically be done, I say Arrows final episode goes super dark just for the shits and giggles to say "fuck you advertisers Arrows dead, now what you gonna do not sponsor the next episode? ahahahaha" like fucking mad men .
|
|
|
Post by General Kenobi on Aug 2, 2018 16:48:08 GMT
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
@Deleted
Posts: 0
Likes:
|
Post by Deleted on Aug 13, 2018 13:30:59 GMT
I doubt they'll go very dark and whatever they do will pale in comparison to what Luke Cage did last season. No. I don't think they will go too dark either. According to most of the articles I have read the show is just going to go back to being as dark as it was in Season One and they are calling it a light reboot that will take 'Arrow' back to its roots and see some changes like characters written off and others brought back - one of which we know will be Roy Harper who I think will take Oliver's spot while he is in prison and then choose to stay on when Oliver gets out 'cause of the threat of the Longbow Hunters. Season 5 was a return to form n some ways with it being darker than Season 4 which started to venture more into Comedy so I could see them doing that again.
|
|
|
Post by General Kenobi on Aug 13, 2018 14:48:23 GMT
If they're going to go back to Season One and write some characters out I have a suggestion that will help. But I seriously doubt they have the brains and the guts to do it.
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
@Deleted
Posts: 0
Likes:
|
Post by Deleted on Aug 20, 2018 7:29:30 GMT
If they're going to go back to Season One and write some characters out I have a suggestion that will help. But I seriously doubt they have the brains and the guts to do it. If it was up to me I would reboot the show and get rid of Felicity, Diggle, Renee, Curtis, Dinah and William and just have it with Oliver Queen, Mia Dearden, Roy Harper and a Dinah Laurel Lance who is already the Black Canary 'cause I think they strayed too far away from the comic books and I have said it before but I think it was stupid not having Roy in a bigger role from the start as Oliver's best friend 'cause the Green Arrow and Speedy debuted together in the comic books and Roy Harper as Speedy and Arsenal is a big part of the Green Arrow's history but I never felt like they emphasised his importance enough. I am glad they are bringing him back now though and it will be interesting to see what they do with him going forward. It appears Green Arrow is one of the superheroes who is going to get a movie in the DCEU so we might very well see that on screen and with 'Birds of Prey' having Black Canary in it the 'Green Arrow' movie will most likely connect on to it and Oliver might even appear in 'Birds of Prey.' With Oliver and Diggle being distant now and the actor saying that is going to continue in the next season Roy might become his new best friend.
|
|
|
Post by General Kenobi on Aug 20, 2018 18:09:59 GMT
I don't want to do a reboot, unless we scrap this show completely and start over with a new cast and crew and call the show Green Arrow. What I want is them to get rid of Felicity, keep Diggle, and make Roy a full-time cast member. Reveal that Laurel wasn't killed but ARGUS or Checkmate faked her death so she could undertake a mission for them. Have her come back, reminding everyone of the fighter she was in Season One, deciding to go by her first name of Dinah and operating as the Black Canary.
Heck, reveal that Felicity is a villain. An agent of Count Vertigo (the Peter Stormare version) and has been using mind-control to keep Oliver wrapped around her finger. She's been undermining him all this time, making him more aggressive and stubborn to push away everybody from him. Then have Black Canary kill her.
|
|
|
Post by stargazer1682 on Aug 21, 2018 3:48:28 GMT
I don't want to do a reboot, unless we scrap this show completely and start over with a new cast and crew and call the show Green Arrow. What I want is them to get rid of Felicity, keep Diggle, and make Roy a full-time cast member. Reveal that Laurel wasn't killed but ARGUS or Checkmate faked her death so she could undertake a mission for them. Have her come back, reminding everyone of the fighter she was in Season One, deciding to go by her first name of Dinah and operating as the Black Canary. Heck, reveal that Felicity is a villain. An agent of Count Vertigo (the Peter Stormare version) and has been using mind-control to keep Oliver wrapped around her finger. She's been undermining him all this time, making him more aggressive and stubborn to push away everybody from him. Then have Black Canary kill her. I'm on board with the Felicity story; I've had a similar thought for a storyline myself, but it would be more that she's unwittingly a metahuman who subconsciously bends people's wills, or some such thing; something that might involve her hacking skills, which turn out not be as profound as everyone thinks. She would ultimately come to realize Oliver never developed the reciprocal feelings she thought he had, but was basically unknowingly under the influence of her powers. She then has to decide to continue living the lie, knowing that Oliver isn't truly a consensual participant in their relationship; or give up the man she adores and admit the truth, even though she hadn't done it intentionally. As for Laurel.... She was fine in season 1, and while I was never so extreme as some as some detractors, by season 2 and beyond I found her to become an increasingly obnoxious character; and though I would have preferred it if it had been Felicity who died in season 5, Laurel was the next best thing and I would just as soon prefer it if they had kept her dead. I wish Katie Cassidy all the best in other acting endeavors, but even with this whole thing with Black Siren, the writers have made it more and more of a cluster fuck. It really goes all the way back to the very beginning when they dithered on even calling her Dinah; regardless of any indication of any combat training, or the technical reality of her full name, they couldn't have made her less likely to eventually, believably become Black Canary if they tried. As time went on they even made her less physically prepared for that to be in her future. Their next fuck up wasn't even so much a fuck up itself, so much as it was how they handled things afterwards; which was bringing in Caity Lotz as "Canary". The costume was perfect, the backstory on her training was perfect, everything about her, down to dynamic with Oliver was fucking perfect. The only way they could have made it better is if they had planned it well enough from the start and say that Laurel wasn't "Dinah Laurel," but just "Laurel," and her presumed dead sister was Dinah, or takes the name Dinah when she comes back from the dead or whatever. In my opinion Sara has been the only character I thought had real chemistry with Oliver to date. The only possible point of contention was that she wasn't "Dinah", yet Dinah wasn't really Dinah, not even in name; so what the fuck, let's split the difference and go with what worked? But no, they decided to fix what wasn't broke and what have seen instead? Sarah relegated to the good ship Lollipop and put in charge of the Keystone Time Cops; while they make Laurel look like a low-rent dominatrix. Then they kill her off and try to course correct by finding "Dinah" who conveniently has the meta abilities Laurel and Sara had to fake, but she didn't pan out, so rather than even getting rid of her or recast the part or try to make it better, they keep her around, but still make her a general pain in the ass; and then bring in an alternate Laurel who also conveniently has the same powers that Laurel didn't actually have. And just when you think they're going to bother redeeming her, they just keep dicking around with the character, creating more and more reasons not to trust or redeem her, but now we're supposed to believe that because her sort of father died, she's going to become one of the good guys.....maybe..... It's just too much at this point. They've buried Laurel and alternate Laurel and Dinah Drake under so much shit at this point, and squandered the one good shot they had at a proper Black Canary with Sara, that it's next to impossible to want to give them the benefit of the doubt on anything they still have planned for any Black/Canary/Siren/Whatever; because their record says they're going to screw that up too. I'd suggest some sort of temporal catastrophe that somehow merges Sara, Laurel and Dinah Drake in such a way as to make them a single, fully integrated entity with minimum necessary memories and abilities, and arguably who looks like Caity Lotz, but no doubt they'd probably fuck that up somehow by having the amalgamated character be played by Lori Laughlin, revealing that the Arrowverse has been nothing more than a prequel to the Fucking Birds of Prey.
|
|
|
Post by General Kenobi on Aug 21, 2018 14:19:20 GMT
Knowingly or unknowingly, either way we both have Felicity raping Oliver for several years. If we go down that route there will be no coming back and the character will have to be offed. Because where do you go from there?
|
|
|
Post by taylorfirst1 on Aug 21, 2018 16:03:44 GMT
How can things get more difficult? Oliver and his totally incompetent team have been getting their arses kicked non-stop for at least the last 2 seasons.
OT - who the hell was the idiot who decided to bring Oliver's kid into the show?
|
|
|
Post by General Kenobi on Aug 22, 2018 11:39:04 GMT
Bringing a kid onto a show is the last act of a desperate man. I don't know why they continue to do it since it always angers viewers and they end up writing the kid out.
|
|
|
Post by BexxyJ on Sept 2, 2018 12:43:44 GMT
I don't want to do a reboot, unless we scrap this show completely and start over with a new cast and crew and call the show Green Arrow. What I want is them to get rid of Felicity, keep Diggle, and make Roy a full-time cast member. Reveal that Laurel wasn't killed but ARGUS or Checkmate faked her death so she could undertake a mission for them. Have her come back, reminding everyone of the fighter she was in Season One, deciding to go by her first name of Dinah and operating as the Black Canary. Heck, reveal that Felicity is a villain. An agent of Count Vertigo (the Peter Stormare version) and has been using mind-control to keep Oliver wrapped around her finger. She's been undermining him all this time, making him more aggressive and stubborn to push away everybody from him. Then have Black Canary kill her. I'm down with a reboot if it means getting rid of Felicity. Anything would be better than those insufferable Olicity scenes and Bob and Terry telling Felicity she walks on water. You wanna know where that monster sized ego of Felicity's came from? Diggle. He caused the whole thing. We've been watching some of the older episodes and Diggle could never keep his mouth shut about how good Felicity was saying she was the smartest person in the world and the strongest and the greatest and telling Oliver the same thing. It makes me sick rewatching those scenes. Now we're all stuck with the monster they created and we have nobody but Diggle to blame.
|
|
|
Post by BexxyJ on Sept 2, 2018 12:51:10 GMT
|
|