|
Post by BATouttaheck on Jan 15, 2019 5:21:18 GMT
I've lost track … whatcha watching Nalkarj ?
|
|
|
Post by Nalkarj on Jan 15, 2019 5:23:43 GMT
I've lost track … whatcha watching Nalkarj ? Not Robinson Crusoe, for better or worse… Seriously, superhero flick with Josh Brolin as a gigantic purple alien. It’s kinda fun—some scenes better than others, kinda all-over-the-place. Editing too fast, as with many modern movies. Poor Spider-Man has nothing to do. But Brolin plays a conflicted villain well.
|
|
|
Post by Nalkarj on Jan 15, 2019 5:27:00 GMT
Pratt’s a moron in this.
|
|
|
Post by Nalkarj on Jan 15, 2019 5:29:28 GMT
Gah! It’s annoying how they spent a whole movie with them splitting up, and now they’re all back together like pretty much nothing happened. Not that I wanted them split up, but why spend a whole movie on it if there are no lasting consequences?
|
|
|
Post by Nalkarj on Jan 15, 2019 5:38:24 GMT
No way, Doc! Endgame’s the next movie!
|
|
|
Post by Nalkarj on Jan 15, 2019 5:38:45 GMT
Cap has even less to do than Spidey.
|
|
|
Post by Nalkarj on Jan 15, 2019 5:44:32 GMT
I’d thought the Red Alien, who’s now about to be killed, had nigh-limitless power, but now he’s gone in a flash. And Thanos is the one with godlike powers, including remaking the cosmos in his image.
Wait, was the alien a robot?
|
|
|
Post by Nalkarj on Jan 15, 2019 5:45:47 GMT
Is he now in heaven? Hell? I don’t get this.
|
|
|
Post by Nalkarj on Jan 15, 2019 5:47:40 GMT
I don’t get it.
|
|
|
Post by Nalkarj on Jan 15, 2019 5:50:18 GMT
Spidey’s performance (I don’t remember the actor’s name offhand) is pretty powerful here. I guess they’re all—what, turning into dust? Like Luke Skywalker at the end of the last Star Wars?
|
|
|
Post by Nalkarj on Jan 15, 2019 5:53:47 GMT
Weird ending, but OK. I’m sorta-kinda caught up now.
Better than Civil War, not as good as Winter Soldier (or Iron Man and First Avenger). Beginning and end work, middle not as dramatic as I think they want. End also not as dramatic—characters, of course, coming back, but they also don’t feel all that dramatic except for Spidey’s “death.” Middling—but a good performance from Josh Brolin under (I suppose) makeup and computer effects.
|
|
|
Post by Primemovermithrax Pejorative on Jan 15, 2019 8:17:54 GMT
I think they should have went with a stronger voice actor for Thanos since he is all FX anyway. Someone more like Michael Ironside in sound.
Like his father, Brolin is the standard leading man romantic lead type than the character actor. Only someone like Gregory Peck had the voice to be both the leading man romantic lead and also a bad guy with convincing presence (Ahab, Mengele).
That's also my criticism of Hiddleston. David Thewlis or Malcolm McDowell would have been a much stronger presence. They opted for an emo type. He's like Brent Spiner but with less charisma.
What really hampers these movies (and DC has the same problem and Star Wars) is they cannot show a classical hero presentation. This is why you have Pratt acting like he wants to be in drag, Downey Jr in standup monologue mode at all times, Captain America shackled by various hang ups.
What really hampers these films is that they simply refuse to do an old fashioned hero story. The hero must either lose or be compromised by some emotional or personal problem or be dependent on help, usually from someone who looks like they stepped out of a DNC fundraiser. They get further and further from a successful hero's tale with each film from what I see. The ensemble mode is being used not to allow every character to do heroic things, but to sell the message that anyone but a traditional pale hero will save the day--especially if it comes to a fight and going it alone.
I can probably guess the entire plot to the next Avengers movie by this formula.
Captain Marvel will save everyone with a critical help from Wakanda scientists.
|
|
|
Post by No Morpho, Only Bánh mì on Jan 15, 2019 15:16:58 GMT
Gah! It’s annoying how they spent a whole movie with them splitting up, and now they’re all back together like pretty much nothing happened. Not that I wanted them split up, but why spend a whole movie on it if there are no lasting consequences? IW is pretty consistent with what we were left with at the end of CW. Tony is reluctant to call Steve. They seemingly haven’t talked or made up, but he holds onto that burner phone. Sam was always with Steve. Natasha played the system in CW, but remains a Steve loyalist. Wanda came back to Steve’s side and is still a Secret Avenger with him, as at the beginning of CW. T’Challa was on his own side, and understood the nature of Bucky’s victimization before taking him in for Steve. Vision was on the Accords side, but is loyal to Wanda and beyond this human recklessness- I think hitting Rhodes really shook him. Rhodes was with Tony, but more for his career’s sake. He realized since being hurt that these people are more important than the trouble coming from it and need to be there to help, rather than in prison. Banner, Strange and Thor were absent for CW. Peter was loyal to Tony, ignorant and doing what was asked of him. It’s all Tony pushing everyone apart. The Atom(!) and Hawkeye helped Steve in CW, but are not in IW. The rift remains with Tony and Bucky/Steve. They still haven’t come back together. It almost happened, but Space. 🤷♂️ Everyone that Tony is with in IW was not a part of CW (guardians, Strange), except for Peter, who’s his boy, and a minute with Bruce(no CW) to get him to trust the Wizard. Cap has his loyalists and new allies. Sound about right?
|
|
|
Post by Nalkarj on Jan 15, 2019 16:35:03 GMT
IW is pretty consistent with what we were left with at the end of CW. Tony is reluctant to call Steve. They seemingly haven’t talked or made up, but he holds onto that burner phone. Sam was always with Steve. Natasha played the system in CW, but remains a Steve loyalist. Wanda came back to Steve’s side and is still a Secret Avenger with him, as at the beginning of CW. T’Challa was on his own side, and understood the nature of Bucky’s victimization before taking him in for Steve. Vision was on the Accords side, but is loyal to Wanda and beyond this human recklessness- I think hitting Rhodes really shook him. Rhodes was with Tony, but more for his career’s sake. He realized since being hurt that these people are more important than the trouble coming from it and need to be there to help, rather than in prison. Banner, Strange and Thor were absent for CW. Peter was loyal to Tony, ignorant and doing what was asked of him. It’s all Tony pushing everyone apart. The Atom(!) and Hawkeye helped Steve in CW, but are not in IW. The rift remains with Tony and Bucky/Steve. They still haven’t come back together. It almost happened, but Space. 🤷♂️ Everyone that Tony is with in IW was not a part of CW (guardians, Strange), except for Peter, who’s his boy, and a minute with Bruce(no CW) to get him to trust the Wizard. Cap has his loyalists and new allies. Sound about right? I don’t really disagree with any of this. But what I mean is, Cap and IM are the only two who are still divided, but everyone else joins together and fights like nothing happened. We’re back to joking around and buddy-buddy—which is fine, but, I mean, heck, you guys were all just clobbering each other at an airport. It’s not that much of a civil war if everyone’s all friends again moments afterwards (but, perhaps, that’s more a criticism of Civil War than of Infinity War). As for Cap and IM’s conflict, we don’t get a single scene between the two here—indeed, it seems to me that Cap is hardly even in the movie (it certainly wouldn’t have lost anything had he not been there). They haven’t come back together, but they also haven’t even had a chance to do so. They’re on different sides of the universe (literally, I think). I liked Infinity War far more than Civil War: the directors were for the most part very able at juggling more than a dozen characters, and Brolin’s villain was excellent, the best Marvel villain since Redford. But I just don’t think it’s quite as dramatic or well-done as Iron Man, The First Avenger, or The Winter Soldier.
|
|
|
Post by Nalkarj on Jan 15, 2019 16:48:07 GMT
I think they should have went with a stronger voice actor for Thanos since he is all FX anyway. Someone more like Michael Ironside in sound. Like his father, Brolin is the standard leading man romantic lead type than the character actor. Only someone like Gregory Peck had the voice to be both the leading man romantic lead and also a bad guy with convincing presence (Ahab, Mengele). I liked his voice; it fits the character, doesn’t make him a senseless brute (as he easily could have been in other hands). He’s much less like DC’s Darkseid character than I thought—one can easily imagine Thanos waxing (or brooding) philosophical about a flower, even if his philosophy isn’t particularly deep. To that end, the “standard leading man romantic lead” type, if superficially counterintuitive, works for me. I’m no great fan of the Loki character here, but I like what Hiddleston does with the part. He’s the god of mischief, which implies more of the wheedling, less charismatic but more intelligent, Machiavellian sort—like an Iago. I’m not sure about that. Classical heroes have the hangups galore (“tragic flaw” and all), and both IM and Cap get plenty of opportunities to be heroic—if fewer, because of the nature of the beast, in the movies where they all have to get together.
|
|
|
Post by No Morpho, Only Bánh mì on Jan 15, 2019 18:18:51 GMT
IW is pretty consistent with what we were left with at the end of CW. Tony is reluctant to call Steve. They seemingly haven’t talked or made up, but he holds onto that burner phone. Sam was always with Steve. Natasha played the system in CW, but remains a Steve loyalist. Wanda came back to Steve’s side and is still a Secret Avenger with him, as at the beginning of CW. T’Challa was on his own side, and understood the nature of Bucky’s victimization before taking him in for Steve. Vision was on the Accords side, but is loyal to Wanda and beyond this human recklessness- I think hitting Rhodes really shook him. Rhodes was with Tony, but more for his career’s sake. He realized since being hurt that these people are more important than the trouble coming from it and need to be there to help, rather than in prison. Banner, Strange and Thor were absent for CW. Peter was loyal to Tony, ignorant and doing what was asked of him. It’s all Tony pushing everyone apart. The Atom(!) and Hawkeye helped Steve in CW, but are not in IW. The rift remains with Tony and Bucky/Steve. They still haven’t come back together. It almost happened, but Space. 🤷♂️ Everyone that Tony is with in IW was not a part of CW (guardians, Strange), except for Peter, who’s his boy, and a minute with Bruce(no CW) to get him to trust the Wizard. Cap has his loyalists and new allies. Sound about right? I don’t really disagree with any of this. But what I mean is, Cap and IM are the only two who are still divided, but everyone else joins together and fights like nothing happened. We’re back to joking around and buddy-buddy—which is fine, but, I mean, heck, you guys were all just clobbering each other at an airport. It’s not that much of a civil war if everyone’s all friends again moments afterwards (but, perhaps, that’s more a criticism of Civil War than of Infinity War). As for Cap and IM’s conflict, we don’t get a single scene between the two here—indeed, it seems to me that Cap is hardly even in the movie (it certainly wouldn’t have lost anything had he not been there). They haven’t come back together, but they also haven’t even had a chance to do so. They’re on different sides of the universe (literally, I think). I liked Infinity War far more than Civil War: the directors were for the most part very able at juggling more than a dozen characters, and Brolin’s villain was excellent, the best Marvel villain since Redford. But I just don’t think it’s quite as dramatic or well-done as Iron Man, The First Avenger, or The Winter Soldier. True. You lose the personal emotional feel with such a large ensemble. Those moments were mostly associated with Thanos and Thor here, with a side of Spidey and Vision/Wanda, depending on who you are drawn to. Everyone shows up, has a moment of several, and some are naturally more necessitated rather than gifted contributions. The point about Tony and Steve, and everyone else just going along, was actually a criticism of CW. It wasn’t a war. There was essentially a line drawn, some side-choosing between friends, a yard-scuffle, things went too far and one of the friends got real-hurt, followed by an emotion-fueled, smaller level, hair-pulling punch-out between the besties at the center of it all. The friends are still friends, but the one who’s emotionally driven doesn’t spring back to Before. And IWwasnt the movie to deal with that, because it’s so big. They toyed with the idea, but then pulled away immediately because this is really about Thanos. His pursuit. His mission. His emotional hang ups ranging from his mixed feelings relating to his initially kidnapped protégée, to the reception received from his concerns for the state of things, acting really as a mentally unstable Jor-El with a messiah complex, to power and ego struggles. We just got to see a bunch of the others react and take part in that whole struggle. It’s better that Steve and Tony didn’t get to meet up now, because we get to save that for the real finale. IW is the penultimate battle. It’s the big action piece after 19(?) movies of buildup. I thought the Russo’s handled the directorial duties really well, as they’ve had bigger ensembles with each effort. (TWS was a mini ensemble, more of a trio flick with Cap/Widow/Falcon, while CW was part solo, part team, part ensemble, part cluster depending on which piece of it you look at, and IW is just our heroes playing their parts in Thanos’ masterpiece). Sorry these last two didn’t resonate with you as well. How much is left to get you fully caught up?
|
|
|
Post by Nalkarj on Jan 15, 2019 18:29:49 GMT
I don’t really disagree with any of this. But what I mean is, Cap and IM are the only two who are still divided, but everyone else joins together and fights like nothing happened. We’re back to joking around and buddy-buddy—which is fine, but, I mean, heck, you guys were all just clobbering each other at an airport. It’s not that much of a civil war if everyone’s all friends again moments afterwards (but, perhaps, that’s more a criticism of Civil War than of Infinity War). As for Cap and IM’s conflict, we don’t get a single scene between the two here—indeed, it seems to me that Cap is hardly even in the movie (it certainly wouldn’t have lost anything had he not been there). They haven’t come back together, but they also haven’t even had a chance to do so. They’re on different sides of the universe (literally, I think). I liked Infinity War far more than Civil War: the directors were for the most part very able at juggling more than a dozen characters, and Brolin’s villain was excellent, the best Marvel villain since Redford. But I just don’t think it’s quite as dramatic or well-done as Iron Man, The First Avenger, or The Winter Soldier. True. You lose the personal emotional feel with such a large ensemble. Those moments were mostly associated with Thanos and Thor here, with a side of Spidey and Vision/Wanda, depending on who you are drawn to. Everyone shows up, has a moment of several, and some are naturally more necessitated rather than gifted contributions. The point about Tony and Steve, and everyone else just going along, was actually a criticism of CW. It wasn’t a war. There was essentially a line drawn, some side-choosing between friends, a yard-scuffle, things went too far and one of the friends got real-hurt, followed by an emotion-fueled, smaller level, hair-pulling punch-out between the besties at the center of it all. The friends are still friends, but the one who’s emotionally driven doesn’t spring back to Before. And IWwasnt the movie to deal with that, because it’s so big. They toyed with the idea, but then pulled away immediately because this is really about Thanos. His pursuit. His mission. His emotional hang ups ranging from his mixed feelings relating to his initially kidnapped protégée, to the reception received from his concerns for the state of things, acting really as a mentally unstable Jor-El with a messiah complex, to power and ego struggles. We just got to see a bunch of the others react and take part in that whole struggle. It’s better that Steve and Tony didn’t get to meet up now, because we get to save that for the real finale. IW is the penultimate battle. It’s the big action piece after 19(?) movies of buildup. I thought the Russo’s handled the directorial duties really well, as they’ve had bigger ensembles with each effort. (TWS was a mini ensemble, more of a trio flick with Cap/Widow/Falcon, while CW was part solo, part team, part ensemble, part cluster depending on which piece of it you look at, and IW is just our heroes playing their parts in Thanos’ masterpiece). Sorry these last two didn’t resonate with you as well. How much is left to get you fully caught up? Completely agree. I should note I liked the movie, and I felt the emotion in parts even if not the whole thing.
|
|
|
Post by Primemovermithrax Pejorative on Jan 15, 2019 20:10:30 GMT
I’m not sure about that. Classical heroes have the hangups galore (“tragic flaw” and all), and both IM and Cap get plenty of opportunities to be heroic—if fewer, because of the nature of the beast, in the movies where they all have to get together. There's a much better balance. What neurosis did Robin Hood have in the 1938 film? I cannot remember an ounce-and yet it is still considered a good film--not dated (because classical story elements do not age). No one usually complains about the portrayal.
Granted, I don't remember any neurosis at all in Doug McClure's character in THE LAND THAT TIME FORGOT either from decades later--he had to make a partnership with the German submarine captain but he's pro active. And he's totally mortal and without superpowers. He does get stranded at the end but if the sequel had not killed him off (strange decision) he would have been rescued and it ending with a wedding. Even the Iliad ends with a truce.
The modern hero cannot really succeed in the classic sense. The original idea of a super hero was to be capable of daring feats that others could not do. And yet, in the movies, increasingly, this is sidelined.
In Winter Soldier, Captain America refuses to fight Bucky at the end, and ends up having to be rescued by him.
In Black Panther on the other hand, he fights the bad guy and mortally wounds him.
This pattern goes back a long time. In Predator-at the end, Arnie looks completely fucked up--maybe even traumatized as he sits in the helicopter and his general and the girl look at him with grave concern.
In Predator 2 on the other hand, not only does he kill the predator, but the aliens respect him and give him a gift , and he walks away standing and speaks defiantly to the military guy who criticizes him for interfering.
If there was a disruption in the pattern that would be one thing, but it does appear consistent.
|
|
|
Post by Nalkarj on Jan 15, 2019 22:54:49 GMT
The never-ending Salzmankian laptop saga continues! But this time it does look like Apple’s fault: problem with the speakers (but not with headphones), apparently caused by when they opened it up last time! Such fun! Luckily still covered, but quelle joie!
|
|
|
Post by No Morpho, Only Bánh mì on Jan 15, 2019 23:05:29 GMT
The never-ending Salzmankian laptop saga continues! But this time it does look like Apple’s fault: problem with the speakers (but not with headphones), apparently caused by when they opened it up last time! Such fun! Luckily still covered, but quelle joie! Those rascals!
|
|