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Post by Deleted on Aug 16, 2018 0:10:15 GMT
Because it minimises the subjective feeling of harm to the animal. Although the animal's life and the way that it has been treated up to that point is still very harmful to it. I also had the impression cutting a carotid artery was a preferred method of suicide, faster and less painful than wrist slashing. Perhaps it's obvious I am no expert on killing. The existence of the animal, and the fact that it was created for the purpose of being used by humans is the most problematic fact. But we should at least stun it before killing, so that it does not experience the sensation of having its throat cut. |
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Post by progressiveelement on Aug 16, 2018 3:10:06 GMT
I don't think I ever ate kosher.
But I've had halal meat. 👍
So long as its not cat or dog or hamster or goldfish, I am OK with savage butchery for the sake of feeding myself. 👍
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Post by rachelcarson1953 on Aug 16, 2018 3:42:13 GMT
I don't think I ever ate kosher. But I've had halal meat. 👍 So long as its not cat or dog or hamster or goldfish, I am OK with savage butchery for the sake of feeding myself. 👍
I don't force my view on others; this is just my personal decision, I don't chastise them for eating meat, or even eating it around me. I happily combine the amino acids to make complete protein from plant sources. My doctor is still mystified; I'm healthy, my hair and nails are strong, I'm not overweight - but how do I live without eating meat? I'm his only vegetarian patient.
But animals are still killed for human consumption, I can't change that, and if it has to go on, I would prefer that the animal be stunned before being butchered. It's not much to ask for, a less painful way to die. It would be cruel to deny them that. |
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Post by progressiveelement on Aug 16, 2018 7:39:13 GMT
I don't think I ever ate kosher. But I've had halal meat. 👍 So long as its not cat or dog or hamster or goldfish, I am OK with savage butchery for the sake of feeding myself. 👍
I don't force my view on others; this is just my personal decision, I don't chastise them for eating meat, or even eating it around me. I happily combine the amino acids to make complete protein from plant sources. My doctor is still mystified; I'm healthy, my hair and nails are strong, I'm not overweight - but how do I live without eating meat? I'm his only vegetarian patient.
But animals are still killed for human consumption, I can't change that, and if it has to go on, I would prefer that the animal be stunned before being butchered. It's not much to ask for, a less painful way to die. It would be cruel to deny them that.I named animals that were pets. 👍 |
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Post by Deleted on Aug 16, 2018 7:49:28 GMT
I don't think I ever ate kosher. But I've had halal meat. 👍 So long as its not cat or dog or hamster or goldfish, I am OK with savage butchery for the sake of feeding myself. 👍
I don't force my view on others; this is just my personal decision, I don't chastise them for eating meat, or even eating it around me. I happily combine the amino acids to make complete protein from plant sources. My doctor is still mystified; I'm healthy, my hair and nails are strong, I'm not overweight - but how do I live without eating meat? I'm his only vegetarian patient.
But animals are still killed for human consumption, I can't change that, and if it has to go on, I would prefer that the animal be stunned before being butchered. It's not much to ask for, a less painful way to die. It would be cruel to deny them that.You should be vegan. Dairy is at least as cruel and barbaric as the meat industry, often far worse. |
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Post by Primemovermithrax Pejorative on Aug 16, 2018 8:01:18 GMT
If you are going to have animal welfare then it absolutely positively cannot be justified. Especially when the corporate media devotes so much time to the horrors of factory farmed meat. So torturing an animal alive is ok if it is designated holy by superstition from the Middle East? That is not consistent.
Kosher and Halal is just asshole behavior with a religious stamp on it.
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Post by Deleted on Aug 16, 2018 8:13:45 GMT
THE RESULTS ARE IN AND OVERWHELMING...
This board believes Jews should be legally prohibited from the practices of kosher meat, and male genital mutilation.
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Post by Arlon10 on Aug 16, 2018 9:40:42 GMT
I don't think I ever ate kosher. But I've had halal meat. 👍 So long as its not cat or dog or hamster or goldfish, I am OK with savage butchery for the sake of feeding myself. 👍
I don't force my view on others; this is just my personal decision, I don't chastise them for eating meat, or even eating it around me. I happily combine the amino acids to make complete protein from plant sources. My doctor is still mystified; I'm healthy, my hair and nails are strong, I'm not overweight - but how do I live without eating meat? I'm his only vegetarian patient.
But animals are still killed for human consumption, I can't change that, and if it has to go on, I would prefer that the animal be stunned before being butchered. It's not much to ask for, a less painful way to die. It would be cruel to deny them that. I do not tell people what they should or shouldn't eat. I suspect that different people have different dietary needs and I do not have enough information to be much help deciding what is best for what purposes for each type of person. I believe that humans should eat whatever is necessary for their health, barring cannibalism. I do not know that anyone needs meat, but if people believe that meat is necessary for their health, I would not prevent them securing their health as they think necessary. This is going to sound bizarre, but although plants do not have eyes or ears, neither do worms. Plants are living things by most definitions of living things. Since humans cannot photosynthesize their own nutrition it appears necessary to eat living things. I do understand people wanting their food to be as little like themselves as possible. I can understand them not wanting to count fish as "meat" if that makes them feel better about eating fish. I can understand them not wanting to count plants as sensate, and indeed it is not apparent they are sensate. In Virginia it is illegal to serve food that died of its own. Therefore it is necessary to kill animals if they are to be used as food (unless they are eaten alive as some sea creatures are). I believe that minimizing the suffering of animals used as food is very sensible. It also happens to be expedient, duh. I suspect the method for doing that is not as important as the skill of the person using whatever method. Any of the methods might be botched and result is unnecessary suffering. |
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Post by Deleted on Aug 16, 2018 9:54:30 GMT
Here is my bottom line on the issue: if I, myself, cannot bring myself to kill an animal to eat it, then why should I thinks it's okay to eat meat if someone else did the killing?
I don't force my view on others; this is just my personal decision, I don't chastise them for eating meat, or even eating it around me. I happily combine the amino acids to make complete protein from plant sources. My doctor is still mystified; I'm healthy, my hair and nails are strong, I'm not overweight - but how do I live without eating meat? I'm his only vegetarian patient.
But animals are still killed for human consumption, I can't change that, and if it has to go on, I would prefer that the animal be stunned before being butchered. It's not much to ask for, a less painful way to die. It would be cruel to deny them that. I do not tell people what they should or shouldn't eat. I suspect that different people have different dietary needs and I do not have enough information to be much help deciding what is best for what purposes for each type of person. I believe that humans should eat whatever is necessary for their health, barring cannibalism. I do not know that anyone needs meat, but if people believe that meat is necessary for their health, I would not prevent them securing their health as they think necessary. This is going to sound bizarre, but although plants do not have eyes or ears, neither do worms. Plants are living things by most definitions of living things. Since humans cannot photosynthesize their own nutrition it appears necessary to eat living things. I do understand people wanting their food to be as little like themselves as possible. I can understand them not wanting to count fish as "meat" if that makes them feel better about eating fish. I can understand them not wanting to count plants as sensate, and indeed it is not apparent they are sensate. In Virginia it is illegal to serve food that died of its own. Therefore it is necessary to kill animals if they are to be used as food (unless they are eaten alive as some sea creatures are). I believe that minimizing the suffering of animals used as food is very sensible. It also happens to be expedient, duh. I suspect the method for doing that is not as important as the skill of the person using whatever method. Any of the methods might be botched and result is unnecessary suffering. What's wrong with cannibalism? No difference between human flesh and say a pig's flesh... Very similar structure, and taste. More intelligent and emotional than chimps, same arrangement of organs and fat distribution as humans. Same nervous system, pain receptors, etc. 98% same DNA as a human. When you're eating a pig, there is no significant difference than if you were eating a human. Cannibalism is natural. Tuck in why not. |
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Post by rachelcarson1953 on Aug 16, 2018 10:15:35 GMT
Here is my bottom line on the issue: if I, myself, cannot bring myself to kill an animal to eat it, then why should I thinks it's okay to eat meat if someone else did the killing?
I don't force my view on others; this is just my personal decision, I don't chastise them for eating meat, or even eating it around me. I happily combine the amino acids to make complete protein from plant sources. My doctor is still mystified; I'm healthy, my hair and nails are strong, I'm not overweight - but how do I live without eating meat? I'm his only vegetarian patient.
But animals are still killed for human consumption, I can't change that, and if it has to go on, I would prefer that the animal be stunned before being butchered. It's not much to ask for, a less painful way to die. It would be cruel to deny them that. You should be vegan. Dairy is at least as cruel and barbaric as the meat industry, often far worse.
Vegans are a whole different 'species' in that they don't wear leather, they won't wear clothing that contains any animal fiber like wool, they check food labels to make certain that there are no animal by-products, no hidden butter, no hidden chicken broth, no gelatin, and they are cranky and aggressive and do get in people's faces. I can only control what I eat; I don't have time for an obsessional cause.
I spend a great deal of my time already on humane rescue, I volunteer for a no-kill cat rescue group, which means I foster animals in my home until they can be adopted. My whole life is about lessening the suffering of other sentient beings, but being vegan is beyond my abilities.
Are you a vegan? |
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Post by Deleted on Aug 16, 2018 10:17:01 GMT
You should be vegan. Dairy is at least as cruel and barbaric as the meat industry, often far worse.
Vegans are a whole different 'species' in that they don't wear leather, they won't wear clothing that contains any animal fiber like wool, they check food labels to make certain that there are no animal by-products, no hidden butter, no hidden chicken broth, no gelatin, and they are cranky and aggressive and do get in people's faces. I can only control what I eat; I don't have time for an obsessional cause.
I spend a great deal of my time already on humane rescue, I volunteer for a no-kill cat rescue group, which means I foster animals in my home until they can be adopted. My whole life is about lessening the suffering of other sentient beings, but being vegan is beyond my abilities.
Are you a vegan?Yes, I am. |
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Post by rachelcarson1953 on Aug 16, 2018 10:25:20 GMT
Vegetarians don't consume dairy products or eggs. People that do consume dairy products are called lacto-ovo vegetarians.
Vegans are a whole different 'species' in that they don't wear leather, they won't wear clothing that contains any animal fiber like wool, they check food labels to make certain that there are no animal by-products, no hidden butter, no hidden chicken broth, no gelatin, and they are cranky and aggressive and do get in people's faces. I can only control what I eat; I don't have time for an obsessional cause.
I spend a great deal of my time already on humane rescue, I volunteer for a no-kill cat rescue group, which means I foster animals in my home until they can be adopted. My whole life is about lessening the suffering of other sentient beings, but being vegan is beyond my abilities.
Are you a vegan? Yes, I am. Good for you. And do you volunteer to foster animals in your home waiting for adoption? |
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Post by Deleted on Aug 16, 2018 10:28:51 GMT
Good for you. And do you volunteer to foster animals in your home waiting for adoption? I always have space for rescue animals in my home and heart... Currently home to: A lab/husky mongrel. A beagle rescued from a laboratory. A cat. A rabbit. Two bearded dragons. A cali king snake. |
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Post by Arlon10 on Aug 16, 2018 10:31:29 GMT
I do not tell people what they should or shouldn't eat. I suspect that different people have different dietary needs and I do not have enough information to be much help deciding what is best for what purposes for each type of person. I believe that humans should eat whatever is necessary for their health, barring cannibalism. I do not know that anyone needs meat, but if people believe that meat is necessary for their health, I would not prevent them securing their health as they think necessary. This is going to sound bizarre, but although plants do not have eyes or ears, neither do worms. Plants are living things by most definitions of living things. Since humans cannot photosynthesize their own nutrition it appears necessary to eat living things. I do understand people wanting their food to be as little like themselves as possible. I can understand them not wanting to count fish as "meat" if that makes them feel better about eating fish. I can understand them not wanting to count plants as sensate, and indeed it is not apparent they are sensate. In Virginia it is illegal to serve food that died of its own. Therefore it is necessary to kill animals if they are to be used as food (unless they are eaten alive as some sea creatures are). I believe that minimizing the suffering of animals used as food is very sensible. It also happens to be expedient, duh. I suspect the method for doing that is not as important as the skill of the person using whatever method. Any of the methods might be botched and result is unnecessary suffering. What's wrong with cannibalism? No difference between human flesh and say a pig's flesh... Very similar structure, and taste. More intelligent and emotional than chimps, same arrangement of organs and fat distribution as humans. Same nervous system, pain receptors, etc. 98% same DNA as a human. When you're eating a pig, there is no significant difference than if you were eating a human. Cannibalism is natural. Tuck in why not. The problem with cannibalism is the same problem with selling organs. If there is a profit to be made there is a reason to hasten a person's death. Brilliant and effective as our laws and system of enforcement truly are, it could get very difficult to ensure that people are not being killed for their meat if trade in it were legal. |
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Post by Deleted on Aug 16, 2018 10:36:35 GMT
What's wrong with cannibalism? No difference between human flesh and say a pig's flesh... Very similar structure, and taste. More intelligent and emotional than chimps, same arrangement of organs and fat distribution as humans. Same nervous system, pain receptors, etc. 98% same DNA as a human. When you're eating a pig, there is no significant difference than if you were eating a human. Cannibalism is natural. Tuck in why not. The problem with cannibalism is the same problem with selling organs. If there is a profit to be made there is a reason to hasten a person's death. Brilliant and effective as our laws and system of enforcement truly are, it could get very difficult to ensure that people are not being killed for their meat if trade in it were legal. What's the difference between trading in humans for meat or pigs? |
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Post by rachelcarson1953 on Aug 16, 2018 10:45:12 GMT
Good for you. And do you volunteer to foster animals in your home waiting for adoption? I always have space for rescue animals in my home and heart... Currently home to: A lab/husky mongrel. A beagle rescued from a laboratory. A cat. A rabbit. Two bearded dragons. A cali king snake. My house is currently home to: 12 cats, one of which is a four-week old kitten that is bottle fed every four hours 1 mongrel dog 1 puppy 1 rabbit 2 goats At one time I had 40 foster animals in my home; I had to scale back for space, time and financial reasons; this rescue group is funded out of the volunteer's pockets, adoption fees don't even begin to cover veterinary care, food, litter, special needs animals, etc. It seems we are very alike, except that I am not vegan. Nobody's perfect, but I'm doing the best I can. |
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Post by Arlon10 on Aug 16, 2018 11:18:41 GMT
The problem with cannibalism is the same problem with selling organs. If there is a profit to be made there is a reason to hasten a person's death. Brilliant and effective as our laws and system of enforcement truly are, it could get very difficult to ensure that people are not being killed for their meat if trade in it were legal. What's the difference between trading in humans for meat or pigs? It is okay to kill pigs for profit, not humans |
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Post by Deleted on Aug 16, 2018 11:20:08 GMT
What's the difference between trading in humans for meat or pigs? It is okay to kill pigs for profit, not humans How so? The moral equivalence is identical. That's just how you've been conditioned, to avoid the obvious cognitive dissonance involved. |
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Post by Arlon10 on Aug 16, 2018 11:51:41 GMT
It is okay to kill pigs for profit, not humans How so? The moral equivalence is identical. That's just how you've been conditioned, to avoid the obvious cognitive dissonance involved. Pigs are property and can be owned. If you own a pig it is not illegal to kill it. Whether you eat pork is a matter between you and your doctors and spiritual advisors. Humans are not property and cannot be owned. No right to kill them can derive from owning them. These are the laws as they stand. If you would like to change them you're going need a whole lot more tricks than you have shown so far. |
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