|
Post by twothousandonemark on Feb 11, 2020 2:32:12 GMT
DC is a fcuking mess & no one cares is why.
|
|
csale
New Member
@csale
Posts: 33
Likes: 14
|
Post by csale on Feb 11, 2020 4:41:31 GMT
Mixture of reasons to me.
Bad marketing - check!
Swinging for the rated R crowd without really bringing a mature story (marketing adjacent perhaps?)
Comic book accuracy? I never really read the books, but I know that Harley Quinn wasn’t part of the team - sooo screams that this is an executive borne movie (capitalizing on Harleys popularity) rather than good storytelling.
All that said - it doesn’t really have the urgency that some of the others had. Maybe because the biggest name is Harley and that is diminishing returns? Never really cared about black mask - never really liked Black Canary and we’ve had three of them on Arrow the past few years. I like Huntress, but not that much...
I’ve heard really positive reviews, but if I don’t see it before it is gone... I guess I’ll catch it on streaming?
|
|
|
Post by hi224 on Feb 11, 2020 4:58:53 GMT
Bad marketing, R rating, January release, lack of interest due to Suicide Squad, Harleys only such an interesting character. I still say Black Canary should've been lead.
|
|
|
Post by Skaathar on Feb 11, 2020 17:59:17 GMT
I'm going to add one more reason to the list: Batman-fatigue.
How many Batman movies and TV shows have we had now? How many Batman-related spinoffs have we had, both in movies and shows?
I just think the average moviegoer is saturated with Batman-related shows and his dark, gritty Gotham atmosphere. I think that's part of the reason why movies like Shazam, Aquaman, Ragnarok or GOTG are such big hits.
|
|
|
Post by thisguy4000 on Feb 11, 2020 18:05:51 GMT
I'm going to add one more reason to the list: Batman-fatigue. How many Batman movies and TV shows have we had now? How many Batman-related spinoffs have we had, both in movies and shows? I just think the average moviegoer is saturated with Batman-related shows and his dark, gritty Gotham atmosphere. I think that's part of the reason why movies like Shazam, Aquaman, Ragnarok or GOTG are such big hits. Joker made a billion dollars.
|
|
|
Post by Skaathar on Feb 11, 2020 18:12:06 GMT
I'm going to add one more reason to the list: Batman-fatigue. How many Batman movies and TV shows have we had now? How many Batman-related spinoffs have we had, both in movies and shows? I just think the average moviegoer is saturated with Batman-related shows and his dark, gritty Gotham atmosphere. I think that's part of the reason why movies like Shazam, Aquaman, Ragnarok or GOTG are such big hits. Joker made a billion dollars. True, but that movie wasn't exactly a superhero movie and appealed to a different type of crowd.
|
|
|
Post by thisguy4000 on Feb 11, 2020 18:14:53 GMT
Joker made a billion dollars. True, but that movie wasn't exactly a superhero movie and appealed to a different type of crowd. There’s no way the movie would’ve earned even a fraction of what it ended up making if it hadn’t been for the Batman connections.
|
|
|
Post by Skaathar on Feb 11, 2020 19:27:26 GMT
True, but that movie wasn't exactly a superhero movie and appealed to a different type of crowd. There’s no way the movie would’ve earned even a fraction of what it ended up making if it hadn’t been for the Batman connections. I disagree. You do realize that there are movies that can earn that much without needing to be connected to Batman right?
|
|
|
Post by thisguy4000 on Feb 11, 2020 19:35:08 GMT
There’s no way the movie would’ve earned even a fraction of what it ended up making if it hadn’t been for the Batman connections. I disagree. You do realize that there are movies that can earn that much without needing to be connected to Batman right? But what are the odds that a movie that pays homage to a couple of old Martin Scorsese films, directed by the guy who made the Hangover movies, and starring an actor who hadn’t had a hit film in over a decade, would’ve been able to make a ton of money in today’s environment? It’s painfully obvious that the film wouldn’t have generated so much attention if it wasn’t connected to the Batman mythos. Before Joker came out, I myself was inclined to believe that people were sick of Batman, but the movie seemed to prove me wrong.
|
|
|
Post by Skaathar on Feb 11, 2020 20:21:48 GMT
I disagree. You do realize that there are movies that can earn that much without needing to be connected to Batman right? But what are the odds that a movie that pays homage to a couple of old Martin Scorsese films, directed by the guy who made the Hangover movies, and starring an actor who hadn’t had a hit film in over a decade, would’ve been able to make a ton of money in today’s environment? It’s painfully obvious that the film wouldn’t have generated so much attention if it wasn’t connected to the Batman mythos. Before Joker came out, I myself was inclined to believe that people were sick of Batman, but the movie seemed to prove me wrong. Or maybe it was simply because it was a good movie and generated good word of mouth?
|
|
|
Post by thisguy4000 on Feb 11, 2020 20:29:26 GMT
But what are the odds that a movie that pays homage to a couple of old Martin Scorsese films, directed by the guy who made the Hangover movies, and starring an actor who hadn’t had a hit film in over a decade, would’ve been able to make a ton of money in today’s environment? It’s painfully obvious that the film wouldn’t have generated so much attention if it wasn’t connected to the Batman mythos. Before Joker came out, I myself was inclined to believe that people were sick of Batman, but the movie seemed to prove me wrong. Or maybe it was simply because it was a good movie and generated good word of mouth? The fact that a lot of people liked the movie was definitely a factor in its success, but it most certainly wouldn’t have made anywhere near a billion dollars without the Batman connection.
|
|
|
Post by JudgeJuryDredd on Feb 13, 2020 0:05:33 GMT
Very ineffective marketing for starters, having seen it for myself not too long ago I feel they missed out highlighting the better moments and went with highlighting the more 'meh' and eyebrow raising parts. From a purely 'word of the mouth' perspective I can't see this being universally seen as an all across the board crowd pleasing experience. The movie is too scatterbrained and inconsistent, that mostly works in regards to Harley but when focused on other characters like Black Canady, Huntress, Montoya, and Black Mask it's a pretty dull and pretty mean spirited viewing experience - Black Mask is so awful a human being you really do wish Batfleck would break into his club and brand him in several places, after breaking several bones of course. It's also hard to imagine leaving the theater that this version of Black Canary and Huntress could ever become honest to good and aspirational heroes primed to join the Justice League. It's not really a 'fun' flick outside of most of the Harley stuff. The storytelling is also nothing to write home about, either. It's not particularly clever and the Black Mask stuff is really poorly handled - its implied that he wants to avoid wearing the mask because it brings out the worst of him, yet he's an absolute monster all throughout without any restraint, and when he puts it its so uninteresting.
|
|
|
Post by Skaathar on Feb 13, 2020 0:32:20 GMT
Or maybe it was simply because it was a good movie and generated good word of mouth? The fact that a lot of people liked the movie was definitely a factor in its success, but it most certainly wouldn’t have made anywhere near a billion dollars without the Batman connection. That's an assumption though. No proof to back it up. Many movies have been able to hit a billion dollars without a Batman connection.
|
|
|
Post by thisguy4000 on Feb 13, 2020 1:37:59 GMT
The fact that a lot of people liked the movie was definitely a factor in its success, but it most certainly wouldn’t have made anywhere near a billion dollars without the Batman connection. That's an assumption though. No proof to back it up. Many movies have been able to hit a billion dollars without a Batman connection. None of those movies were R-rated characters studies.
|
|
|
Post by Skaathar on Feb 13, 2020 2:42:44 GMT
That's an assumption though. No proof to back it up. Many movies have been able to hit a billion dollars without a Batman connection. None of those movies were R-rated characters studies. True, but then how many R-rated character studies are marketed like blockbusters?
|
|
|
Post by thisguy4000 on Feb 13, 2020 3:17:55 GMT
None of those movies were R-rated characters studies. True, but then how many R-rated character studies are marketed like blockbusters? Joker wasn’t really marketed like a blockbuster either. It premiered at a film festival. Besides, even if it were marketed like a blockbuster, that wouldn’t have been the case if it were an original IP. There is no way the film would’ve generated so much attention if it didn’t have the Batman connections. A movie like that never would’ve made a billion dollars if it wasn’t based on a pre-existing IP.
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
@Deleted
Posts: 0
Likes:
|
Post by Deleted on Feb 13, 2020 13:13:55 GMT
the r-rating im guessing. A lot of Harley fans are under 18, especially girls
|
|
|
Post by Skaathar on Feb 13, 2020 15:28:11 GMT
True, but then how many R-rated character studies are marketed like blockbusters? Joker wasn’t really marketed like a blockbuster either. It premiered at a film festival. Besides, even if it were marketed like a blockbuster, that wouldn’t have been the case if it were an original IP. There is no way the film would’ve generated so much attention if it didn’t have the Batman connections. A movie like that never would’ve made a billion dollars if it wasn’t based on a pre-existing IP. I'm not saying its Batman connection didn't help, I'm saying it's not that connection that got it to a billion dollars. If BvS, SS and Justice League couldn't get to a billion dollars despite having Batman in the film, it's kinda silly to think that Joker's main reason for a billion dollars is its Batman connection. I disagree about the marketing as well. I don't recall any R-rated character movies getting as much marketing as this movie did.
|
|
|
Post by thisguy4000 on Feb 13, 2020 16:32:00 GMT
Joker wasn’t really marketed like a blockbuster either. It premiered at a film festival. Besides, even if it were marketed like a blockbuster, that wouldn’t have been the case if it were an original IP. There is no way the film would’ve generated so much attention if it didn’t have the Batman connections. A movie like that never would’ve made a billion dollars if it wasn’t based on a pre-existing IP. I'm not saying its Batman connection didn't help, I'm saying it's not that connection that got it to a billion dollars. If BvS, SS and Justice League couldn't get to a billion dollars despite having Batman in the film, it's kinda silly to think that Joker's main reason for a billion dollars is its Batman connection. I disagree about the marketing as well. I don't recall any R-rated character movies getting as much marketing as this movie did. It would not have made a billion dollars without that connection. No one ever said that every movie involving Batman can make a billion dollars, but it’s ridiculous to suggest that Joker would’ve made nearly as much money as it did without the Batman connections. A bunch of the people who saw the movie are mainstream audience members who don’t normally care for character studies. The movie proved that people are still hungry for more Batman stories.
|
|
|
Post by Skaathar on Feb 13, 2020 20:02:49 GMT
I'm not saying its Batman connection didn't help, I'm saying it's not that connection that got it to a billion dollars. If BvS, SS and Justice League couldn't get to a billion dollars despite having Batman in the film, it's kinda silly to think that Joker's main reason for a billion dollars is its Batman connection. I disagree about the marketing as well. I don't recall any R-rated character movies getting as much marketing as this movie did. It would not have made a billion dollars without that connection. No one ever said that every movie involving Batman can make a billion dollars, but it’s ridiculous to suggest that Joker would’ve made nearly as much money as it did without the Batman connections. A bunch of the people who saw the movie are mainstream audience members who don’t normally care for character studies. The movie proved that people are still hungry for more Batman stories. And, again, I disagree. It's not that I don't respect your opinion, it's just that it's only based on an assumption. The Joker made a million bucks not because "people are still hungry for more Batman stories" but because it was a good movie that ended up with a lot of good word of mouth. Because if it was true that people are still hungry for more Batman stories then Birds of Prey should be making more than it is. The Batwoman TV show shouldn't be getting such low viewership. A lot more hype should be surrounding the new Batman movie with Robert Pattinson. Gotham wouldn't have ended after only 5 seasons. I'm not saying Joker's connection to Batman didn't help, of course it did. Of course it put some more butts in seats in the theater. But that would have only resulted in a very small percentage of it's income. By and large it was as successful as it was because it was a good movie, and the novelty that it wasn't a superhero movie but something else entirely probably helped as well.
|
|