Farside
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@alienwerewolf
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Post by Farside on Mar 24, 2020 2:33:30 GMT
Michael Crichton wrote the novel for Jurassic Park.
Phillip K. Dick wrote Minority Report.
Peter Benchley wrote Jaws.
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Post by moviemouth on Mar 24, 2020 2:37:33 GMT
Not sure what you are getting at.
The sources are credited.
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Post by lowtacks86 on Mar 24, 2020 2:41:39 GMT
Not sure what you are getting at. The sources are credited. I'm a little confused by were he's going with this as well. Is he saying Spielberg didn't come up with the plots and characters for these movies? If were gonna play that game, most movie scripts aren't written by the directors themselves either.
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Farside
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@alienwerewolf
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Post by Farside on Mar 24, 2020 2:43:31 GMT
Not sure what you are getting at. The sources are credited. I'm a little confused by were he's going with this as well. Is he saying Spielberg didn't come up with the plots and characters for these movies? If were gonna play that game, most movie scripts aren't written by the directors themselves either.
Credit the writers! Prioritizing director over writer is like prioritizing conductor over composer!
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Post by moviemouth on Mar 24, 2020 2:45:50 GMT
I'm a little confused by were he's going with this as well. Is he saying Spielberg didn't come up with the plots and characters for these movies? If were gonna play that game, most movie scripts aren't written by the directors themselves either.
Credit the writers! Prioritizing director over writer is like prioritizing conductor over composer!
Movies are a different medium and it isn't as if he has been trying to hide the fact that these are based on books. Jurassic Park is a very well known novel that probably got even more attention after the movie was released. The writer of Jaws is even in the movie.
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Farside
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@alienwerewolf
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Post by Farside on Mar 24, 2020 2:48:45 GMT
Credit the writers! Prioritizing director over writer is like prioritizing conductor over composer!
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Post by lowtacks86 on Mar 24, 2020 2:50:46 GMT
I'm a little confused by were he's going with this as well. Is he saying Spielberg didn't come up with the plots and characters for these movies? If were gonna play that game, most movie scripts aren't written by the directors themselves either.
Credit the writers! Prioritizing director over writer is like prioritizing conductor over composer!
Well no, not really. Novels and movies are two entirely different mediums. Movies are a lot more visual, so they require people with visual talent to make a great artistic vision out of a story. A good example of this is the original Shining movie and the miniseries direct by Stephen King. Both are based on the same source material, but one is highly regarded over the other. That's because Kubrick is much better at the visual medium. King, while a good writer, doesn't have anywhere near the same visual talent, so the miniseries is no where near held in the same regard as Kubrick's film/
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Post by Prime etc. on Mar 24, 2020 2:51:43 GMT
In fact, the editor Verna Fields got a lot of credit for Jaws which upset Spielberg. I don't believe he got an Oscar nomination for Jaws.
Benchley had already got a lot of attention for the book.
Crichton did get a lot of attention for the book (even though the idea of JP should be credited to Donald Pleasence for mentioning it in THE MUTATIONS 1974. There was also a BBC April fools day joke from around 1980 that said dinosaurs had been re-created through science and let loose in a London park.
The spfx team got a lot of attention for JP. I do think Spielberg got more credit for JP than he deserved. If not for the innovations with fx, it would have probably been far less noteworthy.
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Post by moviemouth on Mar 24, 2020 2:55:06 GMT
Prioritizing director over writer is appropriate in the case of movies. The filmmaker is the one who is bringing this to life. Without him it would just be a screenplay on a shelf somewhere. You didn't even mention the screenwriters, you mentioned the authors of the books and that is a separate issue. Paying the novel writers is also a different issue. I was under the impression that the rights to their material have to be bought. I'm sure there are many cases where they get screwed out of money, but that is different than not being credited as the one who first wrote the story. Novels is where writers get the credit. I'm not saying everything is fair, but come on now. Directors are in many cases taking mediocre screenplays and elevating them with their technical skill, especially these days. It's greed, and the guy in the video you posted is 100% right. That is a separate issue though. Getting paid and getting credited are 2 different things.
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Post by moviemouth on Mar 24, 2020 3:26:24 GMT
Credit the writers! Prioritizing director over writer is like prioritizing conductor over composer!
Well no, not really. Novels and movies are two entirely different mediums. Movies are a lot more visual, so they require people with visual talent to make a great artistic vision out of a story. A good example of this is the original Shining movie and the miniseries direct by Stephen King. Both are based on the same source material, but one is highly regarded over the other. That's because Kubrick is much better at the visual medium. King, while a good writer, doesn't have anywhere near the same visual talent, so the miniseries is no where near held in the same regard as Kubrick's film/ It is called Stanley Kubrick's The Shining for a reason, but he still credits Stephen King in the opening of the movie and he is the first person credited after the cast. Stephen King didn't direct the mini-series, he wrote the teleplay.
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Post by moviemouth on Mar 24, 2020 3:36:46 GMT
In fact, the editor Verna Fields got a lot of credit for Jaws which upset Spielberg. I don't believe he got an Oscar nomination for Jaws. Benchley had already got a lot of attention for the book. Crichton did get a lot of attention for the book (even though the idea of JP should be credited to Donald Pleasence for mentioning it in THE MUTATIONS 1974. There was also a BBC April fools day joke from around 1980 that said dinosaurs had been re-created through science and let loose in a London park. The spfx team got a lot of attention for JP. I do think Spielberg got more credit for JP than he deserved. If not for the innovations with fx, it would have probably been far less noteworthy. Isn't the director the one who is telling the visual effects team what he wants to see though? I'd say every aspect combined is what makes Jurassic Park as good as it is and that is the director bringing all of these things together. Without good performances, good cinematography and good editing it wouldn't matter how good the vfx are. "cough" Jurassic World "cough."
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Post by moviebuffbrad on Mar 24, 2020 3:37:02 GMT
Next thing you're gonna tell me is that there really was a president named Abe Lincoln and Steve didn't just make one up.
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Post by moviemouth on Mar 24, 2020 3:39:13 GMT
Next thing you're gonna tell me is that there really was a president named Abe Lincoln and Steve didn't just make one up. I legit laughed out loud when I read that.
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Post by twothousandonemark on Mar 24, 2020 3:55:42 GMT
With all due respect, Crichton didn't bring CGI dinosaurs into the world. Everyone knows JP was his baby.
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Post by ck100 on Mar 24, 2020 5:03:59 GMT
This reminds me how when a movie is a box office success the press gives a lot of credit to the lead actor/actress as if it's their film completely.
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Post by Prime etc. on Mar 24, 2020 5:24:02 GMT
Isn't the director the one who is telling the visual effects team what he wants to see though? I'd say every aspect combined is what makes Jurassic Park as good as it is and that is the director bringing all of these things together. Without good performances, good cinematography and good editing it wouldn't matter how good the vfx are. "cough" Jurassic World "cough." Spielberg had to be convinced by Dennis Muren not to fire Phil Tippett after the CGI dinosaur experiments were shown to him. If not for that, the FX would probably have had a video game look in the motion. Spielberg did not want to use stop motion at all and grudgingly used it for some things but sparingly.
A number of directors could have made Jurassic Park, but only Muren, Tippett, Winston, and the CGI animators Steve Williams and Mark Dippe could have done the FX which was the selling point of the film more than anything else. In fact, the animatronic t-rex is so controlled in movement in the film--the behind the scenes of it are much more impressive since it moves freely and in eccentric ways and looks more alive.
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Post by moviemouth on Mar 24, 2020 5:28:52 GMT
Isn't the director the one who is telling the visual effects team what he wants to see though? I'd say every aspect combined is what makes Jurassic Park as good as it is and that is the director bringing all of these things together. Without good performances, good cinematography and good editing it wouldn't matter how good the vfx are. "cough" Jurassic World "cough." Spielberg had to be convinced by Dennis Muren not to fire Phil Tippett after the CGI dinosaur experiments were shown to him. If not for that, the FX would probably have had a video game look in the motion. Spielberg did not want to use stop motion at all and grudgingly used it for some things but sparingly.
A number of directors could have made Jurassic Park, but only Muren, Tippett, Winston, and the CGI animators Steve Williams and Mark Dippe could have done the FX which was the selling point of the film more than anything else. In fact, the animatronic t-rex is so controlled in movement in the film--the behind the scenes of it are much more impressive since it moves freely and in eccentric ways and looks more alive.
I don't buy that anyone else could have made JP as good because his style is what makes it so good. The movie has his signature all over it and THAT is why I love the movie. If you disagree then fine. We just aren't going to agree then. Fair enough in regards to the stuff concerning the vfx.
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Post by Prime etc. on Mar 24, 2020 5:51:14 GMT
I don't buy that anyone else could have made JP as good because his style is what makes it so good. The movie has his signature all over it and THAT is why I love the movie. If you disagree then fine. We just aren't going to agree then. Fair enough in regards to the stuff concerning the vfx. I certainly don't agree. The movie's success was due to the dinosaur FX.
Spielberg could have directed the movie the exact same way with hand puppets for the FX and it would have bombed. People went to see the FX scenes, not Spielberg's staging of the actors or kids eating jello. In fact, if not for the CGI members doing experiments on their own, the film might have ended with Hammond killing the velociraptors with a gun and a falling T-rex fossil. This was the ending they had storyboarded. A HORRIBLE ending (which may have been inspired by the stuffed crocodile scene in HOOK). Spielberg, while making the film, tried to sell the idea to the press that the raptors were scarier than a t-rex, so he was happy not to show the t-rex again after the stampede scene.
It was changed when (supposedly Spielberg) realized that they had to show the CGI T-rex again (so somehow, despite defying physics, the t-rex gets into the rotunda and sneaks up on the raptors). A better ending (thanks to the groundbreaking fx) but beyond the realm of known physics. The legend is that Spielberg hates stop motion and did not want to use it at all-only full scale animatronics--but was forced to (thanks to Muren), and thus some stop motion was planned sparingly. Once CGI came along they switched the stop motion scenes to CGI. With the second one he allowed for more but said at the time he considered it irresponsible money-wise to use more CGI than he absolutely had to.
I think the second one had better FX sequences (more, and better dinosaur characterization) and the third one had the best human characterization.
The Valley of Gwangi has something like 19 minutes of dinosaur animation for a 90 minute film while Jurassic Park only has 6 minutes for a 2 hour movie (excluding the puppet scenes) and JP 2 has 14 for a 2 hour movie.
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Post by politicidal on Mar 24, 2020 12:57:26 GMT
Not sure what you are getting at. The sources are credited. Well the OP made a super thread on the politics board that went a horrible direction about the Jews right away. But I’m sure his criticisms of Spielberg are legitimate. |
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thenolan
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Post by thenolan on Mar 24, 2020 18:24:04 GMT
steven is not really known as a screen writer is he?
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