Jaguar
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Post by Jaguar on Mar 6, 2017 3:38:30 GMT
Where's the quote from HvK claiming SJ was a better singer than all those I mentioned? You're such a literal pussy. His quotes about her.... “God-given voice” "a voice from above" "a soprano who comes only once a century" Now show me what he said about the others so we can compare them.
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Post by Deleted on Mar 6, 2017 11:25:01 GMT
Where's the quote from HvK claiming SJ was a better singer than all those I mentioned? You're such a literal pussy. His quotes about her.... “God-given voice” "a voice from above" "a soprano who comes only once a century" Now show me what he said about the others so we can compare them. Sometimes a conductor will be quite in love so to speak (or maybe, literally) with a singer and will say stuff like that, like James Levine said of Kathleen Battle, Valery Gergiev of Anna Netrebko, Simon Rattle of Barbara Hannigan, and so on and so forth. It doesn't necessarily mean that the opinion is accurate. Certainly regardless of the feelings involved I doubt they'd say it of truly talentless people, but hyperbolic claims of greatest ever or "once a century" and the such, I'd definitely take with a grain of salt.
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Post by Carl LaFong on Mar 6, 2017 12:40:22 GMT
Sometimes a conductor will be quite in love so to speak (or maybe, literally) with a singer and will say stuff like that, like James Levine said of Kathleen Battle, Valery Gergiev of Anna Netrebko, Simon Rattle of Barbara Hannigan, and so on and so forth. It doesn't necessarily mean that the opinion is accurate. Certainly regardless of the feelings involved I doubt they'd say it of truly talentless people, but hyperbolic claims of greatest ever or "once a century" and the such, I'd definitely take with a grain of salt. Absa-bloody-exactly! +1 I notice jaguar didn't comment on your analysis of Sumi Jo's singing.
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Jaguar
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Just a regular guy in an irregular world
@jaguar
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Post by Jaguar on Mar 6, 2017 12:40:30 GMT
You're such a literal pussy. His quotes about her.... “God-given voice” "a voice from above" "a soprano who comes only once a century" Now show me what he said about the others so we can compare them. Sometimes a conductor will be quite in love so to speak (or maybe, literally) with a singer and will say stuff like that, like James Levine said of Kathleen Battle, Valery Gergiev of Anna Netrebko, Simon Rattle of Barbara Hannigan, and so on and so forth. It doesn't necessarily mean that the opinion is accurate. Certainly regardless of the feelings involved I doubt they'd say it of truly talentless people, but hyperbolic claims of greatest ever or "once a century" and the such, I'd definitely take with a grain of salt. That's quite the feat of rationalization. They said it...but don't believe it because they said it and it can't be believed. Right.
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Post by Eva Yojimbo on Mar 6, 2017 23:06:41 GMT
She's not on the same planet as Joan Sutherland, Birgit Nilsson, Kirsten Flagstad, Lucia Popp, Mirella Freni, Montserrat Caballe, Maria Callas, Jessye Norman, Elisabeth Schwarzkopf. QFT. You shamefully left off Renata Tebaldi, though.
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Post by Carl LaFong on Mar 6, 2017 23:16:13 GMT
QFT. You shamefully left off Renata Tebaldi, though. I'm not kidding here, but I was searching my brain for ages trying to recall her name before I finally created my post, but it wouldn't come!
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Post by Deleted on Mar 6, 2017 23:29:27 GMT
Sometimes a conductor will be quite in love so to speak (or maybe, literally) with a singer and will say stuff like that, like James Levine said of Kathleen Battle, Valery Gergiev of Anna Netrebko, Simon Rattle of Barbara Hannigan, and so on and so forth. It doesn't necessarily mean that the opinion is accurate. Certainly regardless of the feelings involved I doubt they'd say it of truly talentless people, but hyperbolic claims of greatest ever or "once a century" and the such, I'd definitely take with a grain of salt. That's quite the feat of rationalization. They said it...but don't believe it because they said it and it can't be believed. Right. I didn't say it can't be believed. I said I'd take it with a grain of salt, especially given that such hyperboles have been said of a lot of singers. But if you feel validated in your opinion by what HvK said, more power to you. Certainly her singing can be enjoyed and if you really love it, de gustibus non est disputandum.
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Jaguar
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Post by Jaguar on Mar 7, 2017 0:24:19 GMT
That's quite the feat of rationalization. They said it...but don't believe it because they said it and it can't be believed. Right. I didn't say it can't be believed. I said I'd take it with a grain of salt, especially given that such hyperboles have been said of a lot of singers. But if you feel validated in your opinion by what HvK said, more power to you. Certainly her singing can be enjoyed and if you really love it, de gustibus non est disputandum. HvK was not known for his sweet musings. All that matterred to him was the music. It demanded everything and nothing stood before it. I have real trouble imagining him being sweet. That said, I think he was very enamoured with her. There is a video of her first "audition" with him and you can see it. I'll also let you in on a little not so secret tidbit; Sumi is a personal friend of mine and so I will happily admit, my bias is HUGE!
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Post by Deleted on Mar 7, 2017 0:34:16 GMT
That said, I think he was very enamoured with her. There you go. That's what I said.
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Post by Eva Yojimbo on Mar 7, 2017 2:23:52 GMT
QFT. You shamefully left off Renata Tebaldi, though. I'm not kidding here, but I was searching my brain for ages trying to recall her name before I finally created my post, but it wouldn't come! I went through most of THIS BOX SET last year, so I won't be forgetting her name anytime soon. Incredible voice. It's very close between her, Flagstad, Sutherland, and Callas for my favorite. They're all such different talents, though: Flagstad for the incomparable power, Sutherland for impeccable technique, Callas for depth of interpretation, and Tebaldi for unmatched beauty.
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Jaguar
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Post by Jaguar on Mar 7, 2017 3:06:45 GMT
That said, I think he was very enamoured with her. There you go. That's what I said. watch his face as she does Queen of the Night for him. I swear the old guy fell for her right then and there. lol
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Post by Eva Yojimbo on Mar 7, 2017 3:14:22 GMT
Karajan was certainly one of the great conductors of the century, but his opinion on opera singers was just one among many. Solti declared Renee Fleming and Renata Tebaldi the finest he'd heard; Pavarotti called Sutherland's the "voice of the century." IIRC, Sutherland herself said the only voice that ever awed her was Flagstad's. We all know what opinions are like.
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Post by Deleted on Mar 7, 2017 4:08:46 GMT
Karajan was certainly one of the great conductors of the century, but his opinion on opera singers was just one among many. Solti declared Renee Fleming and Renata Tebaldi the finest he'd heard; Pavarotti called Sutherland's the "voice of the century." IIRC, Sutherland herself said the only voice that ever awed her was Flagstad's. We all know what opinions are like. Agreed.
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Jaguar
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Post by Jaguar on Mar 7, 2017 4:38:43 GMT
Karajan was certainly one of the great conductors of the century, but his opinion on opera singers was just one among many. Solti declared Renee Fleming and Renata Tebaldi the finest he'd heard; Pavarotti called Sutherland's the "voice of the century." IIRC, Sutherland herself said the only voice that ever awed her was Flagstad's. We all know what opinions are like. Except he was rght about Sumi. Greatest. Voice. Ever.
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Post by Eva Yojimbo on Mar 7, 2017 16:12:58 GMT
Karajan was certainly one of the great conductors of the century, but his opinion on opera singers was just one among many. Solti declared Renee Fleming and Renata Tebaldi the finest he'd heard; Pavarotti called Sutherland's the "voice of the century." IIRC, Sutherland herself said the only voice that ever awed her was Flagstad's. We all know what opinions are like. Except he was rght about Sumi. And yours is just another opinion. One that not very many opera fans happen to agree with.
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Jaguar
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Just a regular guy in an irregular world
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Post by Jaguar on Mar 7, 2017 17:55:43 GMT
Except he was rght about Sumi. And yours is just another opinion. One that not very many opera fans happen to agree with. didn't realize you'd done an extensive survey of all opera fans. But it is clear there isn't much joy in your life. sad really. Bottom line is even if every last person alive picked someone else, Sumi is the best, the greatest, the most wonderful of all and the world is just wrong as wrong can be.
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Post by Eva Yojimbo on Mar 7, 2017 18:15:07 GMT
And yours is just another opinion. One that not very many opera fans happen to agree with. didn't realize you'd done an extensive survey of all opera fans. Let me rephrase: it's not an opinion most opera fans I've encountered hold. Even a quick google search of "greatest opera sopranos" will show you that Sumi's is not a common name you'll find listed. Where the hell did you get THAT from? And you're basing this on WHAT, exactly, besides your opinion?
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Jaguar
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Just a regular guy in an irregular world
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Posts: 471
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Post by Jaguar on Mar 7, 2017 19:20:47 GMT
didn't realize you'd done an extensive survey of all opera fans. Let me rephrase: it's not an opinion most opera fans I've encountered hold. Even a quick google search of "greatest opera sopranos" will show you that Sumi's is not a common name you'll find listed. Where the hell did you get THAT from? And you're basing this on WHAT, exactly, besides your opinion? It is due to overt racism that some lists leave her name off. She. Is. The. Best. Period. Clearly you are a joyless person because you listen to her angelic voice and are not moved to the only inescapable conclusion that She. Is. The. Best. Period.
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Post by general313 on Mar 7, 2017 20:00:11 GMT
She. Is. The. Best. Period. Well, the capitalization of each word combined with the full stops has me convinced.
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Post by Carl LaFong on Mar 7, 2017 23:31:14 GMT
I went through most of THIS BOX SET last year, so I won't be forgetting her name anytime soon. Incredible voice. It's very close between her, Flagstad, Sutherland, and Callas for my favorite. They're all such different talents, though: Flagstad for the incomparable power, Sutherland for impeccable technique, Callas for depth of interpretation, and Tebaldi for unmatched beauty. Cheers for the box set rec. 66 discs!!! :-) Sadly (or maybe luckily) it's not available to stream on Spotify or Qobuz. The latter do have a 2 disc highlights package though: play.qobuz.com/album/0002894782200
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