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Dec 31, 2020 7:53:00 GMT
Post by goz on Dec 31, 2020 7:53:00 GMT
Asking someone to imagine a set of beliefs is not a demand that they believe in God. The set of beliefs exists. Anti-religion freaks try to chase down thoughts like rabid dogs. Um. No. I can imagine anything, just NOT the fact of natural creation without the assitance of a 'god' becaue the facts and law of science, are what they are, and imagination is just that...irrational and delusion and a fantasy.
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Dec 31, 2020 7:54:15 GMT
via mobile
Post by SciFive on Dec 31, 2020 7:54:15 GMT
My claim is that the beliefs exist.
Read Dr. Shroeder’s books to see them.
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Dec 31, 2020 7:55:23 GMT
via mobile
Post by SciFive on Dec 31, 2020 7:55:23 GMT
Believe whatever you want, rabid dog.
Others will do the same.
Live and let live.
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Dec 31, 2020 14:25:13 GMT
Post by FilmFlaneur on Dec 31, 2020 14:25:13 GMT
Obviously. There are atheists who believe in ghosts and stuff like that. I am first and foremost a skeptic, my atheism is a result of that. The problem comes in when theists are using their belief in God to enforce rules and laws based on that belief. Churches, etc, are under attack far more than they can possibly attack these days. Churches had to go all the way to the U.S. Supreme Court to get the right not to be treated worse than other kinds of entities. In other words, subways and Walmarts and passenger airplanes can't give you the virus, but praying in a church can (even if you follow all the rules of distancing, masks, etc.) In NYC, the police were chasing Jews down in Jewish neighborhoods because they were gathering a bit. They don't worry about rioters and looters, though. After all the yelling in NYC about how these Jewish neighborhoods were causing most of the illness in NYC, their neighborhoods were passed over by 27 other neighborhoods for vaccine priorities. One of the Jewish leaders complained by saying that if they were supposedly causing the most illness, why couldn't they make it into the top 27 neighborhoods needing vaccine the most. In Israel, the ultra-religious neighborhoods were hit the hardest with the virus - but they had exceptionally low deaths from it. Why? The virus goes after old people. These families have 10 kids or so. Their average age of people in these communities is very low. So they got sick but didn't die. Still, believe whatever you want and live and let, eh?
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Dec 31, 2020 14:54:12 GMT
Post by SciFive on Dec 31, 2020 14:54:12 GMT
Truly, no one needs to get hysterical over this, but it has been Judaism's position for 800 years that it is impossible for Judaism to conflict with science.
The most respected Jewish philosopher was a doctor and a rabbi. He is the one who explained why they couldn't conflict.
Essentially, it boils down to believing that God created the universe and science explains what God did.
This is Judaism.
No one is asking anyone else to believe anything.
This belief is why the Jewish people have had an unusually high number of scientists and doctors (considering the tiny size of our world wide population).
Education is huge in Jewish culture. My mother could wallpaper her kitchen with her children's college degrees (four of which are mine).
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Dec 31, 2020 15:59:04 GMT
goz likes this
Post by FilmFlaneur on Dec 31, 2020 15:59:04 GMT
Truly, no one needs to get hysterical over this, but it has been Judaism's position for 800 years that it is impossible for Judaism to conflict with science. Essentially, it boils down to believing that God created the universe and science explains what God did. Science does not say that the universe was deliberately created, let alone by a supernatural being, instead it has other ideas. Nor for that matter do the soft sciences like anthropology or sociology recognise supposed 'chosen peoples'.
But it is not science.
Responses to the question also depend, as it does with Christians, a lot on how much one takes the Torah as literal truth. Some, like Schroeder, evidently feel that special pleading and creative exegesis will accommodate any mismatching. To sceptics this just sounds desperate. It is significant though how he feels obliged to re interpret scripture to fit the science, rather than the other way round.
Then why keep repeating yourself with the same insistent messages only about the same 'interesting religion' while criticising anyone who disagrees with you?
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Dec 31, 2020 16:07:08 GMT
goz likes this
Post by lowtacks86 on Dec 31, 2020 16:07:08 GMT
Truly, no one needs to get hysterical over this, but it has been Judaism's position for 800 years that it is impossible for Judaism to conflict with science.
The most respected Jewish philosopher was a doctor and a rabbi. He is the one who explained why they couldn't conflict.
Essentially, it boils down to believing that God created the universe and science explains what God did.
This is Judaism.
No one is asking anyone else to believe anything.
This belief is why the Jewish people have had an unusually high number of scientists and doctors (considering the tiny size of our world wide population).
Education is huge in Jewish culture. My mother could wallpaper her kitchen with her children's college degrees (four of which are mine).
"Essentially, it boils down to believing that God created the universe and science explains what God did." That's just motivated reasoning, you can do that with just about any belief if you try hard enough to connect the dots. I could probably use science to "prove" that the universe was created by outer space leprechauns ("hey ever notice how this constellation looks like a pot of gold?") "This belief is why the Jewish people have had an unusually high number of scientists and doctors (considering the tiny size of our world wide population)." Well no it doesn't considering jews as a demographic tend to be more atheistic/irreligious than the general population. I would imagine it has more to do with certain historical and socioeconomic conditions (jews for instance have been historically involved with banking/financing). And you can actually even see this amongst jewish demographics (devoutly religious jews are more likely to reject evolution and global warming than non religious ones)
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Dec 31, 2020 23:40:44 GMT
Post by moviemouth on Dec 31, 2020 23:40:44 GMT
Obviously. There are atheists who believe in ghosts and stuff like that. I am first and foremost a skeptic, my atheism is a result of that. The problem comes in when theists are using their belief in God to enforce rules and laws based on that belief. Churches, etc, are under attack far more than they can possibly attack these days. Churches had to go all the way to the U.S. Supreme Court to get the right not to be treated worse than other kinds of entities. In other words, subways and Walmarts and passenger airplanes can't give you the virus, but praying in a church can (even if you follow all the rules of distancing, masks, etc.) In NYC, the police were chasing Jews down in Jewish neighborhoods because they were gathering a bit. They don't worry about rioters and looters, though. After all the yelling in NYC about how these Jewish neighborhoods were causing most of the illness in NYC, their neighborhoods were passed over by 27 other neighborhoods for vaccine priorities. One of the Jewish leaders complained by saying that if they were supposedly causing the most illness, why couldn't they make it into the top 27 neighborhoods needing vaccine the most. In Israel, the ultra-religious neighborhoods were hit the hardest with the virus - but they had exceptionally low deaths from it. Why? The virus goes after old people. These families have 10 kids or so. Their average age of people in these communities is very low. So they got sick but didn't die. Yeah, much of that is messed up too. I'll just assume that all of what you said is true. I have no reason to believe you are lying and it makes sense based on what I have seen on the news etc. It is harder to control rioters though, because they are in mass numbers outdoors. Rioting is illegal, so it would be a bit pointless to tell people not to riot. That is the difference buildings of gathering and rioting. The other distinction is that churches aren't a necessity. Places for shopping are a necessity. I am a bit disturbed by how many people seemed okay with protesting during a pandemic though. I think you'll find that we have a lot we will agree about.
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