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Post by DC-Fan on Jul 26, 2017 20:30:05 GMT
I don't have a problem with that. But don't pretend that MCU movies are masterpieces. For example, if WB made the Wonder Woman movie with Wonder Woman fighting the German soldiers using Batarangs or fighting Ares using a Green Lantern ring, DCEU fans would complain and say that's an awful movie. But MCU makes a Spider-Man movie with Spider-Man using an AI-type suit given to him by Iron Man and MCU fans say "Best Spider-Man movie evah!".
It's like if MCU fans like to eat dog shit, I don't have a problem with that. But don't call it a piece of steak. Call it the dogshit that it is. And if MCU fans like SMH, that's OK too. But don't call it a masterpiece. Call it the piece of shit that it is.
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Post by mcufan on Jul 26, 2017 20:58:30 GMT
I don't have a problem with that. But don't pretend that MCU movies are masterpieces. For example, if WB made the Wonder Woman movie with Wonder Woman fighting the German soldiers using Batarangs or fighting Ares using a Green Lantern ring, DCEU fans would complain and say that's an awful movie. But MCU makes a Spider-Man movie with Spider-Man using an AI-type suit given to him by Iron Man and MCU fans say "Best Spider-Man movie evah!". It's like if MCU fans like to eat dog shit, I don't have a problem with that. But don't call it a piece of steak. Call it the dogshit that it is. And if MCU fans like SMH, that's OK too. But don't call it a masterpiece. Call it the piece of shit that it is. Be the bigger man and admit first that bvs was a piece of shit. Then we'll talk.
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Post by JudgeJuryDredd on Jul 26, 2017 21:09:41 GMT
So its okay to like Marvel movies and appreciate Kevin Feige but it is absolutely wrong to call the movies good or great? Who made you the supreme authority on what people should call good or not, Mr. Tyrant?
I'm curious, what do you make of lifelong DC fans who haven't liked the DCEU thus far and voice valid criticism? Because from where I'm sitting Wonder Woman is the only generally embraced entry to date while the rest are divisive at best.
Spider-Man: Homecoming takes liberties from the source material like any other adaptation Marvel Studios has made but its designed in a way that is neither ashamed of its roots, insulting to its audience, and is legitimately entertaining movie when all is said and done - as general consensus suggests. Oh, and for the hundredth time now, Spidey has had AI suits before in the source material.
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Post by Grabthar's Hammer on Jul 26, 2017 21:19:31 GMT
I don't have a problem with that. But don't pretend that MCU movies are masterpieces. For example, if WB made the Wonder Woman movie with Wonder Woman fighting the German soldiers using Batarangs or fighting Ares using a Green Lantern ring, DCEU fans would complain and say that's an awful movie. But MCU makes a Spider-Man movie with Spider-Man using an AI-type suit given to him by Iron Man and MCU fans say "Best Spider-Man movie evah!". It's like if MCU fans like to eat dog shit, I don't have a problem with that. But don't call it a piece of steak. Call it the dogshit that it is. And if MCU fans like SMH, that's OK too. But don't call it a masterpiece. Call it the piece of shit that it is. I think the only DC / Marvel movies that could be considered masterpieces are.. Batman Begins The Dark Knight Watchmen Wonder Woman Spider-Man 2 The Winter Soldier Logan Possibly Iron Man. I think it actually took war, and being a prisoner of war, seriously. I also liked the internal struggle Stark felt basically realizing that he'd become a "merchant of death" and war profiteer within a corrupt system that had "zero accountability". He lost a friend ( Ho Yinsen), who sacrificed himself so Stark could escape and live. And he lost a mentor and father figure (Obadiah Stane), not only by having to defeat him in the end, but by realizing he had taken advantage of him his entire life and selling the weapons he created to the enemy. But I might have a personal bias because it's the last movie I saw with my dad before he passed away, so it holds a special place in my heart.
EDIT: I should mention I didn't grow up with the original Superman films, and I don't remember them too well.
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Post by mcufan on Jul 26, 2017 21:24:27 GMT
So its okay to like Marvel movies and appreciate Kevin Feige but it is absolutely wrong to call the movies good or great? Who made you the supreme authority on what people should call good or not, Mr. Tyrant? I'm curious, what do you make of lifelong DC fans who haven't liked the DCEU thus far and voice valid criticism? Because from where I'm sitting Wonder Woman is the only generally embraced entry to date while the rest are divisive at best. Spider-Man: Homecoming takes liberties from the source material like any other adaptation Marvel Studios has made but its designed in a way that is neither ashamed of its roots, insulting to its audience, and is legitimately entertaining movie when all is said and done - as general consensus suggests. Oh, and for the hundredth time now, Spidey has had AI suits before in the source material. Yes, almost everything we see on this movie has been used prior to it. Even Karen is a smart way to ear his inner voice. The miriad of web shooting variants has been used for ages in the comics for instance. I was really worried about the enhancements but after seeing them I was like, this is really well done.
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Post by mcufan on Jul 26, 2017 21:31:30 GMT
I don't have a problem with that. But don't pretend that MCU movies are masterpieces. For example, if WB made the Wonder Woman movie with Wonder Woman fighting the German soldiers using Batarangs or fighting Ares using a Green Lantern ring, DCEU fans would complain and say that's an awful movie. But MCU makes a Spider-Man movie with Spider-Man using an AI-type suit given to him by Iron Man and MCU fans say "Best Spider-Man movie evah!". It's like if MCU fans like to eat dog shit, I don't have a problem with that. But don't call it a piece of steak. Call it the dogshit that it is. And if MCU fans like SMH, that's OK too. But don't call it a masterpiece. Call it the piece of shit that it is. I think the only DC / Marvel movies that could be considered masterpieces are.. Batman Begins The Dark Knight Watchmen Wonder Woman Spider-Man 2 The Winter Soldier Logan Possibly Iron Man. I think it actually took war, and being a prisoner of war, seriously. I also liked the internal struggle Stark felt basically realizing that he'd become a "merchant of death" and war profiteer within a corrupt system that had "zero accountability". He lost a friend ( Ho Yinsen), who sacrificed himself so Stark could escape and live. And he lost a mentor and father figure (Obadiah Stane), not only by having to defeat him in the end, but by realizing he had taken advantage of him his entire life and selling the weapons he created to the enemy. But I might have a personal bias because it's the last movie I saw with my dad before he passed away, so it holds a special place in my heart.
EDIT: I should mention I didn't grow up with the original Superman films, and I don't remember them too well.
sorry about your father. I like your list except Logan and wonder woman. Personal opinion of course. Both these movies lost the way in the third act, wich is a shame. Ares was a disappointment as was clone wolverine. Imo.
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Post by DC-Fan on Jul 26, 2017 21:32:54 GMT
So its okay to like Marvel movies and appreciate Kevin Feige but it is absolutely wrong to call the movies good or great? Like I said in my OP, it's OK if MCU fans like to eat dogshit, but it's absolutely wrong to call it a steak.
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Post by DC-Fan on Jul 26, 2017 21:38:04 GMT
I don't have a problem with that. But don't pretend that MCU movies are masterpieces. For example, if WB made the Wonder Woman movie with Wonder Woman fighting the German soldiers using Batarangs or fighting Ares using a Green Lantern ring, DCEU fans would complain and say that's an awful movie. But MCU makes a Spider-Man movie with Spider-Man using an AI-type suit given to him by Iron Man and MCU fans say "Best Spider-Man movie evah!". It's like if MCU fans like to eat dog shit, I don't have a problem with that. But don't call it a piece of steak. Call it the dogshit that it is. And if MCU fans like SMH, that's OK too. But don't call it a masterpiece. Call it the piece of shit that it is. I think the only DC / Marvel movies that could be considered masterpieces are.. Batman Begins The Dark Knight Watchmen Wonder Woman Spider-Man 2 The Winter Soldier Logan Possibly Iron Man. I think it actually took war, and being a prisoner of war, seriously. I also liked the internal struggle Stark felt basically realizing that he'd become a "merchant of death" and war profiteer within a corrupt system that had "zero accountability". He lost a friend ( Ho Yinsen), who sacrificed himself so Stark could escape and live. And he lost a mentor and father figure (Obadiah Stane), not only by having to defeat him in the end, but by realizing he had taken advantage of him his entire life and selling the weapons he created to the enemy. But I might have a personal bias because it's the last movie I saw with my dad before he passed away, so it holds a special place in my heart.
EDIT: I should mention I didn't grow up with the original Superman films, and I don't remember them too well.
I would include Superman: The Movie in any list of superhero movies that are epic, iconic, or masterpieces because Superman: The Movie established the template that many superhero movies are following. Even MCU dictator Kevin Feige has admitted that MCU copies the template established by Superman: The Movie for most of their movies.
I agree with The Dark Knight, Wonder Woman, and Spider-Man 2 being masterpieces. I actually have Batman Begins ranked lower than these. Batman Begins is good but not the masterpiece that these are. I've never seen Watchmen. And I wouldn't include Winter Soldier or Logan as masterpieces either.
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Post by Deleted on Jul 26, 2017 21:39:46 GMT
So its okay to like Marvel movies and appreciate Kevin Feige but it is absolutely wrong to call the movies good or great? Like I said in my OP, it's OK if MCU fans like to eat dogshit, but it's absolutely wrong to call it a steak. You understand that the same can be applied to you and DCEU movies right?
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Post by Grabthar's Hammer on Jul 26, 2017 21:39:59 GMT
I think the only DC / Marvel movies that could be considered masterpieces are.. Batman Begins The Dark Knight Watchmen Wonder Woman Spider-Man 2 The Winter Soldier Logan Possibly Iron Man. I think it actually took war, and being a prisoner of war, seriously. I also liked the internal struggle Stark felt basically realizing that he'd become a "merchant of death" and war profiteer within a corrupt system that had "zero accountability". He lost a friend ( Ho Yinsen), who sacrificed himself so Stark could escape and live. And he lost a mentor and father figure (Obadiah Stane), not only by having to defeat him in the end, but by realizing he had taken advantage of him his entire life and selling the weapons he created to the enemy. But I might have a personal bias because it's the last movie I saw with my dad before he passed away, so it holds a special place in my heart.
EDIT: I should mention I didn't grow up with the original Superman films, and I don't remember them too well.
sorry about your father. I like your list except Logan and wonder woman. Personal opinion of course. Both these movies lost the way in the third act, wich is a shame. Ares was a disappointment as was clone wolverine. Imo. Very kind of you. He would've loved the MCU! I think Ares was a terrible individual villain. But I like to think the true villain of Wonder Woman was war in general, and the darkness of humanity. I just loved the Western influences of Logan. I enjoy Deadpool more, but Logan just sort of blew me away that I didn't expect from the X-Men Universe, of which I've never been a huge fan of.
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Post by Grabthar's Hammer on Jul 26, 2017 21:42:51 GMT
I think the only DC / Marvel movies that could be considered masterpieces are.. Batman Begins The Dark Knight Watchmen Wonder Woman Spider-Man 2 The Winter Soldier Logan Possibly Iron Man. I think it actually took war, and being a prisoner of war, seriously. I also liked the internal struggle Stark felt basically realizing that he'd become a "merchant of death" and war profiteer within a corrupt system that had "zero accountability". He lost a friend ( Ho Yinsen), who sacrificed himself so Stark could escape and live. And he lost a mentor and father figure (Obadiah Stane), not only by having to defeat him in the end, but by realizing he had taken advantage of him his entire life and selling the weapons he created to the enemy. But I might have a personal bias because it's the last movie I saw with my dad before he passed away, so it holds a special place in my heart.
EDIT: I should mention I didn't grow up with the original Superman films, and I don't remember them too well.
I would include Superman: The Movie in any list of superhero movies that are epic, iconic, or masterpieces because Superman: The Movie established the template that many superhero movies are following. Even MCU dictator Kevin Feige has admitted that MCU copies the template established by Superman: The Movie for most of their movies.
I agree with The Dark Knight, Wonder Woman, and Spider-Man 2 being masterpieces. I actually have Batman Begins ranked lower than these. Batman Begins is good but not the masterpiece that these are. I've never seen Watchmen. And I wouldn't include Winter Soldier or Logan as masterpieces either.
Yeah I truly need to re-watch the Superman movies. I can't even remember what they were like. Oh yeah I didn't have them ranked. Ranked it's like ... TDK, WW, SM2, BB, TWS, Watchmen, Logan. IM is my favorite out of these though, but I don't know if that means it's the "best". I think of TWS as a masterpiece, and I think even if it's not truly one, it's the masterpiece of the MCU, if that makes sense.
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Post by mcufan on Jul 26, 2017 21:54:10 GMT
Like I said in my OP, it's OK if MCU fans like to eat dogshit, but it's absolutely wrong to call it a steak. You understand that the same can be applied to you and DCEU movies right? He doesn't lol
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Post by Deleted on Jul 26, 2017 22:16:36 GMT
Funny story. I was a DC fan long before I was a Marvel fan. I've long since jumped ship because DC doesn't do it for me anymore when it comes to movies.
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Post by Skaathar on Jul 26, 2017 22:29:42 GMT
None of the MCU movies are masterpieces, but the MCU as a whole is a masterpiece. And some of their movies are so ridiculously hard to pull off that it's a miracle they ended up being so good.
Make no mistake, though DC has made some exceptional movies in the last few decades, none of those have been as difficult to pull off as movies like Avengers, Civil War or even GotG. And though DC has had some great movies, by and large the average MCU movie is a lot better than the average DC movie.
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Post by mcufan on Jul 26, 2017 22:44:21 GMT
None of the MCU movies are masterpieces, but the MCU as a whole is a masterpiece. And some of their movies are so ridiculously hard to pull off that it's a miracle they ended up being so good. Make no mistake, though DC has made some exceptional movies in the last few decades, none of those have been as difficult to pull off as movies like Avengers, Civil War or even GotG. And though DC has had some great movies, by and large the average MCU movie is a lot better than the average DC movie. True that.
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Post by JudgeJuryDredd on Jul 27, 2017 0:40:16 GMT
So its okay to like Marvel movies and appreciate Kevin Feige but it is absolutely wrong to call the movies good or great? Like I said in my OP, it's OK if MCU fans like to eat dogshit, but it's absolutely wrong to call it a steak. Like I said in my response, who made you the supreme authority on what people should call good or bad?
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Post by JudgeJuryDredd on Jul 27, 2017 0:42:30 GMT
I think the only DC / Marvel movies that could be considered masterpieces are.. Batman Begins The Dark Knight Watchmen Wonder Woman Spider-Man 2 The Winter Soldier Logan Possibly Iron Man. I think it actually took war, and being a prisoner of war, seriously. I also liked the internal struggle Stark felt basically realizing that he'd become a "merchant of death" and war profiteer within a corrupt system that had "zero accountability". He lost a friend ( Ho Yinsen), who sacrificed himself so Stark could escape and live. And he lost a mentor and father figure (Obadiah Stane), not only by having to defeat him in the end, but by realizing he had taken advantage of him his entire life and selling the weapons he created to the enemy. But I might have a personal bias because it's the last movie I saw with my dad before he passed away, so it holds a special place in my heart.
EDIT: I should mention I didn't grow up with the original Superman films, and I don't remember them too well.
I would include Superman: The Movie in any list of superhero movies that are epic, iconic, or masterpieces because Superman: The Movie established the template that many superhero movies are following. Even MCU dictator Kevin Feige has admitted that MCU copies the template established by Superman: The Movie for most of their movies.
I agree with The Dark Knight, Wonder Woman, and Spider-Man 2 being masterpieces. I actually have Batman Begins ranked lower than these. Batman Begins is good but not the masterpiece that these are. I've never seen Watchmen. And I wouldn't include Winter Soldier or Logan as masterpieces either.
Its nothing short of ironic that you label Kevin Feige as being a "dictator" when you are the one acting like that here, telling people what they can and cannot call a good movie.
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Post by mcufan on Jul 27, 2017 0:43:24 GMT
So its okay to like Marvel movies and appreciate Kevin Feige but it is absolutely wrong to call the movies good or great? Like I said in my OP, it's OK if MCU fans like to eat dogshit, but it's absolutely wrong to call it a steak. Nobody wants to eat you and nobody will call you a steak.
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Post by Deleted on Jul 27, 2017 4:35:49 GMT
I don't have a problem with that. But don't pretend that MCU movies are masterpieces. For example, if WB made the Wonder Woman movie with Wonder Woman fighting the German soldiers using Batarangs or fighting Ares using a Green Lantern ring, DCEU fans would complain and say that's an awful movie. But MCU makes a Spider-Man movie with Spider-Man using an AI-type suit given to him by Iron Man and MCU fans say "Best Spider-Man movie evah!". It's like if MCU fans like to eat dog shit, I don't have a problem with that. But don't call it a piece of steak. Call it the dogshit that it is. And if MCU fans like SMH, that's OK too. But don't call it a masterpiece. Call it the piece of shit that it is. Yeah, they certainly aren't masterpiece but they aren't 1/10s either.
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Post by sostie on Jul 27, 2017 10:03:06 GMT
I don't have a problem with that. You seem to think fans of Marvel films somehow worship Kevin Feige. Based on what? I can recall few if any posts that mention the man, unless of course it's in response to post where he is mentioned. How many threads in praise of him has there been? He is not seen in the same way a say Lucas was for Star Wars. You use him as a target because he oversees a franchise you don't like. Yet doesn't DC have a similar figure? Jon Berg? Geoff Johns? Yet we don't see them as much, maybe because they actually have no planned "vision" they feel confident enough to stand up and discuss, or feel responsible for what has until only recently, produced badly received films. You criticise Marvel's top man, despite what he has achieved - whether you like the product personally or not, yet DCs top man is never mentioned despite overseeing what has generally been seen as a mostly disappointing output, by what was once a brand leader, but now seen as a less successful franchise. This is a company that gave us the Dark Knight trilogy...yet now runs a franchise that seems to suffer from comparison to DK and the MCU. You focus your derision on the wrong executive.
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