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Post by formersamhmd on Oct 10, 2017 10:50:04 GMT
Marvel doesn't throw in humor, non-stop. Show me one joke at the end of Civil War while Ironman is on the rampage and trying to murder Bucky. Show me. BW in the middle of fighting Hawkeye: "We're still friends right?" Stan Lee: "Are you Tony Stank?" Hawkeyes and Widow didn't want to fight and certainly didn't want to kill or seriously harm the other, their joking about it was their way of trying to ignore the circumstances they were in. That last bit was a guy getting someone's name wrong.
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Post by formersamhmd on Oct 10, 2017 10:50:59 GMT
And I'm finding it painfully difficult to take you seriously with your assertion that the MCU has humor going on 24/7. So where were the jokes when Gamora and Nebula found a cave full of dead children in Guardians of the Galaxy Vol. 2? Drax: "I have sensitive nipples." "I make humongous turds." "Taserface." Drax's whole schtick of being overly literal if from the first movie, and the second part is the movie being self aware over how silly some names from comics are. After all, the first X-Men movie had Wolverine make dun of the X-Men codenames.
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Post by formersamhmd on Oct 10, 2017 10:51:50 GMT
I don't see anything bad. I can see it now. The newly wisecracking Thor while riffing one liners defeats perma Hulk who acts like a wacky bratty lethal toddler just in time to team up with Loki (seriously? Loki? Again?!!!!) to stop Ragnarok (How often does the world end in Asgard anyway? weekly? more often?) with a pie fight. Perma Hulk shows up and stomps his foot like a spoiled brat and eats the remaining pies. Arf arf lurks around just in case there are some solo kids straggling behind after the movie ends, then wipes the nacho cheese from his neck beard, the popcorn from his ever expanding gargantuan tub of guts and declares Thor 3 the most super nifty mcu movie EVER!!!!!!!!! So when the X-Men team up with Magneto, it's good...but when Thor does it with Loki, it's bad?
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Post by formersamhmd on Oct 10, 2017 10:53:09 GMT
Marvel doesn't throw in humor, non-stop. Show me one joke at the end of Civil War while Ironman is on the rampage and trying to murder Bucky. Show me. Your arguments get increasingly desperate and straw man-like. What about that: "I don't care, he killed my MOM!" says middle aged IM thereby coming to blows with Cap during a world crisis over a guy who was a brainwashed victim himself. One of the worst written jokes next to Martha - everybody got mommy issues. But if adult Magneto decides on personal vengeance against the guy who killed his mom during a world crisis, it's okay?
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Post by charzhino on Oct 10, 2017 11:10:06 GMT
Your arguments get increasingly desperate and straw man-like. What about that: "I don't care, he killed my MOM!" says middle aged IM thereby coming to blows with Cap during a world crisis over a guy who was a brainwashed victim himself. One of the worst written jokes next to Martha - everybody got mommy issues. But if adult Magneto decides on personal vengeance against the guy who killed his mom during a world crisis, it's okay? Erik killing Shaw was a much better finale than IMs illogical confession given the fact hes in the weapons business and knows that weapons dont kill people, its the men who push the button do. Bucky is clearly shown to be a brainwashed slave to Hydra. Shaw is a cold blooded mericless killer.
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Post by miike80 on Oct 10, 2017 11:11:08 GMT
That last bit was a guy getting someone's name wrong. Which is still used for comedic effect
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Post by formersamhmd on Oct 10, 2017 11:21:11 GMT
That last bit was a guy getting someone's name wrong. Which is still used for comedic effect And? What's wrong with that? Elderly Delivery Men getting names wrong happens. If this happened in an X-Men film and someone got Xavier's name wrong you wouldn't care.
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Post by miike80 on Oct 10, 2017 11:23:29 GMT
Which is still used for comedic effect And? What's wrong with that? Elderly Delivery Men getting names wrong happens. If this happened in an X-Men film and someone got Xavier's name wrong you wouldn't care. You sure are obsessed with X-Men
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Post by formersamhmd on Oct 10, 2017 11:23:34 GMT
But if adult Magneto decides on personal vengeance against the guy who killed his mom during a world crisis, it's okay? Erik killing Shaw was a much better finale than IMs illogical confession given the fact hes in the weapons business and knows that weapons dont kill people, its the men who push the button do. Bucky is clearly shown to be a brainwashed slave to Hydra. Shaw is a cold blooded mericless killer. IE, X-Men once again took the lazy way out by invoking Nazis instead of something like IM being worn down by all the stuff he's been through, pushed to the Razor's Edge, and then Zemo takes advantage of his mental state to kick him over the edge. They make Magneto blameless instead of something deeper.
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Post by formersamhmd on Oct 10, 2017 11:24:24 GMT
And? What's wrong with that? Elderly Delivery Men getting names wrong happens. If this happened in an X-Men film and someone got Xavier's name wrong you wouldn't care. You sure are obsessed with X-Men It's what MCU-poo-pooers keep bringing up since DCEU isn't a viable alternative anymore.
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Post by charzhino on Oct 10, 2017 11:31:26 GMT
Erik killing Shaw was a much better finale than IMs illogical confession given the fact hes in the weapons business and knows that weapons dont kill people, its the men who push the button do. Bucky is clearly shown to be a brainwashed slave to Hydra. Shaw is a cold blooded mericless killer. IE, X-Men once again took the lazy way out by invoking Nazis instead of something like IM being worn down by all the stuff he's been through, pushed to the Razor's Edge, and then Zemo takes advantage of his mental state to kick him over the edge. They make Magneto blameless instead of something deeper. Shaw wasn't a Nazi. Erik has gone through more trauma than billionaire Tony Stark. Magneto actually has a open conversation with Xavier about whether killing Shaw will justify his vengeance and is constantly trying to pull him into the serene side of his personality to make him good wheras in Apocalypse, En Saba Nur exploits his rage. Eriks mental state is more fragile and Tony is fickle minded in comparison, he just ignores Cap instead of hearing him out like the loose cannon, egocentric off the cuff character hes written to be in the MCU. You can say thats flawed, but in every film hes commiting the same mistakes and never learns.
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Post by formersamhmd on Oct 10, 2017 11:42:11 GMT
IE, X-Men once again took the lazy way out by invoking Nazis instead of something like IM being worn down by all the stuff he's been through, pushed to the Razor's Edge, and then Zemo takes advantage of his mental state to kick him over the edge. They make Magneto blameless instead of something deeper. Shaw wasn't a Nazi. Erik has gone through more trauma than billionaire Tony Stark. Magneto actually has a open conversation with Xavier about whether killing Shaw will justify his vengeance and is constantly trying to pull him into the serene side of his personality to make him good wheras in Apocalypse, En Saba Nur exploits his rage. Eriks mental state is more fragile and Tony is fickle minded in comparison, he just ignores Cap instead of hearing him out like the loose cannon, egocentric off the cuff character hes written to be in the MCU. You can say thats flawed, but in every film hes commiting the same mistakes and never learns. Shaw was a Nazi. He helped them and was A-Okay with what they were doing, they took Mr Sinister's Nazi connections and gave them to their version of Shaw. Gamora and Nebula have been through more trauma than Magneto too, you don't see them becoming like him. And yes, Tony's character is more 3-D and flawed because he doesn't need a lazy crutch like the Holocaust to fall back on like Magneto does. And it's hardly worse than how Xavier lets Magneto get away with everything and never punishing him or letting him suffer consequences for his acts. He really should've let the Government kill him at the end of DOFP. And no, he's not the same character he was when he started otherwise he'd never have tried to own up to Ultron and side with the Government on trying to protect people from unchecked superhumans. You can say he "never learns", but he's grown and changed more than Xavier has.
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Peter B. Parker
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Watch the hands, not the mouth
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Post by Peter B. Parker on Oct 10, 2017 11:53:35 GMT
This film is going to be fucking amazing. Come at me MCU haters.
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Post by Tristan's Journal on Oct 10, 2017 12:14:54 GMT
Your arguments get increasingly desperate and straw man-like. What about that: "I don't care, he killed my MOM!" says middle aged IM thereby coming to blows with Cap during a world crisis over a guy who was a brainwashed victim himself. One of the worst written jokes next to Martha - everybody got mommy issues. But if adult Magneto decides on personal vengeance against the guy who killed his mom during a world crisis, it's okay? Mommy issues as motivation to create action is usually lazy writing.
I had forgotten about that X-Men subplot, this was in First Class right?
Ok, let's brainstorm this: first tu quoque defenses are fallacies, that does not make "he killed my mom" any better. But apart from this:
- Magneto is the villain, not the hero protagonist who wants to create peace and order, taking revenge is in line with his background and character,
- Did not young Eric witness the brutal murder of his mom as a child and felt guilty because he failed to save her (Anakin-arc) - this is incredilby more traumatic than only hearing about a killing 40 years later
- the mutant murderer did it for sadistic pleasure and cruel extortion/demonstration purposes on Eric, the Winter Soldier murdered because he was a brainwashed, mindless drone (a victim),
- Magneto did not threaten world peace and started brawling during a critical crisis situation because of mommy issues, Iron Man did despite his intention of making amends and peace between Avengers,
In the end, "I don't care, he killed my mom" made me wince as hard as "Martha" did, The X-Men thing I just forgot as being a standard mommy-issues writing.So, in a nutshell the Civil War mommy issues writing is worse, more forced and unplausible than the one in X-Men First Class.
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Post by formersamhmd on Oct 10, 2017 12:41:13 GMT
But if adult Magneto decides on personal vengeance against the guy who killed his mom during a world crisis, it's okay? Mommy issues as motivation to create action is usually lazy writing.
I had forgotten about that X-Men subplot, this was in First Class right?
Ok, let's brainstorm this: first tu quoque defenses are fallacies, that does not make "he killed my mom" any better. But apart from this:
- Magneto is the villain, not the hero protagonist who wants to create peace and order, taking revenge is in line with his background and character,
- Did not young Eric witness the brutal murder of his mom as a child and felt guilty because he failed to save her (Anakin-arc) - this is incredilby more traumatic than only hearing about a killing 40 years later
- the mutant murderer did it for sadistic pleasure and cruel extortion/demonstration purposes on Eric, the Winter Soldier murdered because he was a brainwashed, mindless drone (a victim),
- Magneto did not threaten world peace and started brawling during a critical crisis situation because of mommy issues, Iron Man did despite his intention of making amends and peace between Avengers,
In the end, "I don't care, he killed my mom" made me wince as hard as "Martha" did, The X-Men thing I just forgot as being a standard mommy-issues writing.So, in a nutshell the Civil War mommy issues writing is worse, more forced and unplausible than the one in X-Men First Class.
Magneto was portrayed as a conflicted anti-hero in FC, though. Tony's unresolved issues with his parents since he was a kid had been long established as part of his character since the first Iron Man movie. Shaw did it because he thought an emotional reaction would get more out of Erik's powers. The Winter Soldier was a scapegoat, but people aren't always rational and WILL go after the scapegoat. Magneto did, his quest for vengeance took precedence over stopping the Hellfire Club's attempt to trigger a Nuclear War. Iron Man showed up to help stop Zemo from unleashing the other Winter Soldiers, but once it was clear they were already dead there was no longer any crisis and they'd all played into Zemo's hands. IM wasn't really there to "make amends", he still was hunting Cap. He was there to stop Zemo's scheme...not realizing what Zemo's real plan was. It's overall better than the FC one, mainly because I always hated X-Men trying to exploit the Holocaust for its storylines.
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Post by coldenhaulfield on Oct 10, 2017 14:09:46 GMT
Mommy issues as motivation to create action is usually lazy writing.
I had forgotten about that X-Men subplot, this was in First Class right?
Ok, let's brainstorm this: first tu quoque defenses are fallacies, that does not make "he killed my mom" any better. But apart from this:
- Magneto is the villain, not the hero protagonist who wants to create peace and order, taking revenge is in line with his background and character,
- Did not young Eric witness the brutal murder of his mom as a child and felt guilty because he failed to save her (Anakin-arc) - this is incredilby more traumatic than only hearing about a killing 40 years later
- the mutant murderer did it for sadistic pleasure and cruel extortion/demonstration purposes on Eric, the Winter Soldier murdered because he was a brainwashed, mindless drone (a victim),
- Magneto did not threaten world peace and started brawling during a critical crisis situation because of mommy issues, Iron Man did despite his intention of making amends and peace between Avengers,
In the end, "I don't care, he killed my mom" made me wince as hard as "Martha" did, The X-Men thing I just forgot as being a standard mommy-issues writing.So, in a nutshell the Civil War mommy issues writing is worse, more forced and unplausible than the one in X-Men First Class.
Magneto was portrayed as a conflicted anti-hero in FC, though. Tony's unresolved issues with his parents since he was a kid had been long established as part of his character since the first Iron Man movie. Shaw did it because he thought an emotional reaction would get more out of Erik's powers. The Winter Soldier was a scapegoat, but people aren't always rational and WILL go after the scapegoat. Magneto did, his quest for vengeance took precedence over stopping the Hellfire Club's attempt to trigger a Nuclear War. Iron Man showed up to help stop Zemo from unleashing the other Winter Soldiers, but once it was clear they were already dead there was no longer any crisis and they'd all played into Zemo's hands. IM wasn't really there to "make amends", he still was hunting Cap. He was there to stop Zemo's scheme...not realizing what Zemo's real plan was. It's overall better than the FC one, mainly because I always hated X-Men trying to exploit the Holocaust for its storylines. Nah, you just need to complete your word search.
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Post by charzhino on Oct 10, 2017 14:48:54 GMT
because I always hated X-Men trying to exploit the Holocaust for its storylines. You're the only one who keeps complaining about this. No one is offended by X-Men using the Holocaust. There was no outrage over Magneto destroying Auschwitz in Apocalypse. Its your personal agenda and hatred for Fox.
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Post by formersamhmd on Oct 10, 2017 14:50:09 GMT
because I always hated X-Men trying to exploit the Holocaust for its storylines. You're the only one who keeps complaining about this. No one is offended by X-Men using the Holocaust. There was no outrage over Magneto destroying Auschwitz in Apocalypse. Except for people who think using the Holocaust is a tasteless spineless plot device. The ones who don't watch the X-Movies enough to bother complaining.
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Post by charzhino on Oct 10, 2017 14:54:47 GMT
You're the only one who keeps complaining about this. No one is offended by X-Men using the Holocaust. There was no outrage over Magneto destroying Auschwitz in Apocalypse. Except for people who think using the Holocaust is a tasteless spineless plot device. The ones who don't watch the X-Movies enough to bother complaining. Its embedded into Eriks history, its the main reason why hes a conflicted anti hero. You want them to ignore that?
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Post by Deleted on Oct 10, 2017 16:09:33 GMT
And? What's wrong with that? Elderly Delivery Men getting names wrong happens. If this happened in an X-Men film and someone got Xavier's name wrong you wouldn't care. You sure are obsessed with X-Men No, he's just pointing out what huge fucking hypocrite you are. By the way, you never answered my questions. You didn't because you know I'm right.
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