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Post by thisguy4000 on Nov 14, 2018 15:50:41 GMT
I can’t believe people are still commenting on this thread.
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Post by Nalkarj on Nov 14, 2018 16:04:31 GMT
Batman and Spider-Man are by far the easiest superheroes to write, as characters. They’ve got compelling stories, genuine character traits, and distinct “worlds.”
For all that I love the character, Superman is incredibly difficult to write: how on earth do you make a god interesting? (And a “god” is what he is.) I’ve never read the comic book that inspired it, but on the animated Justice League show there was this episode, “For the Man who Has Everything,” that did a perfect Superman story–so did the ’78 movie. But when you’re done with those, what have you got? After the Christ-paralleling origin story, how do you make a god interesting? (Loeb and Sale pulled it off in Superman for All Seasons, by having everyone else tell the story.) I’m not sure.
I greatly respect writers who can pull off Superman stories, but the point I’m making is that there’s so much to do with Batman (and Spidey) and so many stories to tell. So, no to the OP’s question statement assertion. (I think I’ve already written “no” in this thread. Consider this an explanation.)
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Post by Nalkarj on Nov 14, 2018 16:13:47 GMT
As for other superheroes, by the way…
Captain America might be fun to write. The problem for me is that I only know him from the films, for the most part, so the Evans characterization has become my conception of the character. (And I like Evans’s characterization a great deal–I’m not sure how else such a flag-waving character could have been done.) Same with Iron Man. And I find Thor a total bore (but that just makes writing the character a challenge). If I were to write an Avengers project (based on the movies), I’d probably put the focus on Hawkeye. Weird, right? But imagine this poor schlub, who can shoot an arrow well while everyone around him has superpowers. Seeing everything through his eyes would find the humanity in it, I think.
I have no idea what’s up with Wonder Woman–I don’t find her interesting as a character (and her powers are basically the same as Superman’s), though the Gadot characterization managed to find the humanity, which was nice. She’s gorgeous and curiously maternal (in a good way!). Miss Gadot is, if I’m remembering correctly, a mother, which makes sense.
Hulk’s fun. I think he’s the easiest Marvel hero to write other than Spidey. Oh! and the Fantastic Four, but then I’ve had a long-time plan for doing the Fantastic Four.
I don’t know about Flash, Green Lantern, and that crew. Martian Manhunter’s a character I’d scrap in a moment; he’s Superman with green skin. The Justice League show never quite figured out what to do with him, and understandably.
Any other big heroes I missed?
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Post by Nalkarj on Nov 14, 2018 16:43:48 GMT
Just a few more superhero comments (sorry, folks): The character I’ve grown to dislike the most in superhero stories is Robin. I just don’t think the character works; I can’t see Batman putting this kid in danger like this. (Ironically, The Lego Batman Movie, which I hated, was spot-on in making fun of the Robin situation.) Alfred, Gordon, even pre-Two Face Harvey Dent are Bats’s “Watsons”; adding Robin dilutes the man-seeking-revenge theme, makes Batman a goofier character in the mold of the West or Schumacher characterization. Nolan cleverly managed to bring Robin in without making him “Robin,” which I appreciated (even if it’s illogical that Batman would put so much trust in this one cop he doesn’t know that well). OK. Loeb and Sale, whom I keep praising, managed a decent Robin in Batman: Dark Victory. Still silly, but OK. With all that said: I think if they were to do a new Batman movie now (the Matt Reeves one we keep hearing about, for example), they should include Robin. Mostly to differentiate itself from the Nolan, which has captured the popular conception of Batman, and from any other Batman movie before. (The last time the character appeared on the big screen [other than Lego Batman]? The much-despised Batman and Robin.) I’m not the first person to come up with this, but make it almost Dickensian: have the story play out through Robin’s eyes, as he comes to terms with this huge mansion and its occupant with a strange secret. You’d have to retool that stupid costume, of course–make it darker, for a start. Have the kid discover the Batcave by accident, something like that; have Batman not want him along, try anything to keep him from going along with him–but, in adopting the kid as his son, he rediscovers the humanity he lost when his parents died (I’m stealing from Dark Victory). Have Batman as the main hero, not Robin, but at the end allow Robin to save the day–I’m thinking of Temple of Doom and how Shorty rescues Indy to allow Indy to rescue him. In fact, keeping it as dark as ToD in mood would assuage the fact that we’re adding a kid sidekick, a bane of many series. (It was neat when Iron Man 3 made fun of this trope.) That’s my Batman movie plan. Who’s with me?  |
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Post by Skaathar on Nov 14, 2018 19:08:37 GMT
Batman and Spider-Man are by far the easiest superheroes to write, as characters. They’ve got compelling stories, genuine character traits, and distinct “worlds.” For all that I love the character, Superman is incredibly difficult to write: how on earth do you make a god interesting? (And a “god” is what he is.) I’ve never read the comic book that inspired it, but on the animated Justice League show there was this episode, “For the Man who Has Everything,” that did a perfect Superman story–so did the ’78 movie. But when you’re done with those, what have you got? After the Christ-paralleling origin story, how do you make a god interesting? (Loeb and Sale pulled it off in Superman for All Seasons, by having everyone else tell the story.) I’m not sure. I greatly respect writers who can pull off Superman stories, but the point I’m making is that there’s so much to do with Batman (and Spidey) and so many stories to tell. So, no to the OP’s question statement assertion. (I think I’ve already written “no” in this thread. Consider this an explanation.) The biggest problem I have with Batman movies is that they start to get repetitive after a while. The idea of Batman being jaded and angry at the world due to Robin's death (BvS) appealed to me because it was different... but now they'll probably scrap that idea. Because Batman is easy to write, the writers don't normally get creative with him. So we end up with the same emotionally disturbed but stoic vigilante in pretty much every movie with slightly different variations. Spiderman falls into the same pit. We liked the first 2 Spidermen movies but after that they just kept feeling like a rehash of the same thing, especially the ASM movies. I believe part of what made SMHC successful was because they tried a newer, different take on the character. |
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Post by Nalkarj on Nov 14, 2018 19:19:52 GMT
The biggest problem I have with Batman movies is that they start to get repetitive after a while. The idea of Batman being jaded and angry at the world due to Robin’s death (BvS) appealed to me because it was different… but now they’ll probably scrap that idea. Because Batman is easy to write, the writers don’t normally get creative with him. So we end up with the same emotionally disturbed but stoic vigilante in pretty much every movie with slightly different variations. Spiderman falls into the same pit. We liked the first 2 Spidermen movies but after that they just kept feeling like a rehash of the same thing, especially the ASM movies. I believe part of what made SMHC successful was because they tried a newer, different take on the character. Admittedly, if I were writing it I wouldn’t change the character all that much, but I would change him around in story: a mob tale, a mystery, a horror, a more traditional superhero story with the other heroes. Entirely fair point, though–but to some degree you can’t change any character too much, or else it’s not that character anymore. A great thing about the Nolan trilogy (and this I wouldn’t have praised a few years ago) is that it allows Batman to change over the course of the series. He’s that more traditional characterization in the first, a darkened vigilante because of the Joker in the second, and broken and eventually redeemed in the third. It’s one of the reasons I actually think Robin would work in a new Batman movie. Spidey was much the same way in the Raimis, I thought–until the third one messed the schema up–but the problem you mention remains: how about the movies after that? I’m not sure. |
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Post by Skaathar on Nov 14, 2018 19:37:24 GMT
The biggest problem I have with Batman movies is that they start to get repetitive after a while. The idea of Batman being jaded and angry at the world due to Robin’s death (BvS) appealed to me because it was different… but now they’ll probably scrap that idea. Because Batman is easy to write, the writers don’t normally get creative with him. So we end up with the same emotionally disturbed but stoic vigilante in pretty much every movie with slightly different variations. Spiderman falls into the same pit. We liked the first 2 Spidermen movies but after that they just kept feeling like a rehash of the same thing, especially the ASM movies. I believe part of what made SMHC successful was because they tried a newer, different take on the character. Admittedly, if I were writing it I wouldn’t change the character all that much, but I would change him around in story: a mob tale, a mystery, a horror, a more traditional superhero story with the other heroes. Entirely fair point, though–but to some degree you can’t change any character too much, or else it’s not that character anymore. A great thing about the Nolan trilogy (and this I wouldn’t have praised a few years ago) is that it allows Batman to change over the course of the series. He’s that more traditional characterization in the first, a darkened vigilante because of the Joker in the second, and broken and eventually redeemed in the third. It’s one of the reasons I actually think Robin would work in a new Batman movie. Spidey was much the same way in the Raimis, I thought–until the third one messed the schema up–but the problem you mention remains: how about the movies after that? I’m not sure. agree you can't change the character too much, otherwise it becomes a different character. But this is where creative writing comes in: how can you make another movie for that character seem different without having to change too much of the character. Part of what made Batman Begins one of my favorite Batman movies is because they broke down a lot of Batman's stereotypes. Like his gadgets weren't these extremely high-tech deus ex machina mcguffins anymore, his fighting (though skilled) was not invincible, we saw him getting bruised up from his nightly forays, unable to wake up early, etc. Basically it humanized him and gave us a different Batman who was a newb. Of course, since that's already been done then it probably won't work out well if they do another Batman like that. So at this point I'm not sure which direction they can take him to make him feel fresh and interesting again. |
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Post by politicidal on Nov 14, 2018 19:51:30 GMT
I can’t believe people are still commenting on this thread. Clearly people feel strongly on the matter, judging by the OP. |
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Post by thisguy4000 on Nov 14, 2018 20:11:25 GMT
I can’t believe people are still commenting on this thread. Clearly people feel strongly on the matter, judging by the OP. But I made this thread an entire year ago. I don’t even care about whether or not they they continue using Batman anymore. |
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Post by politicidal on Nov 14, 2018 20:14:33 GMT
Clearly people feel strongly on the matter, judging by the OP. But I made this thread an entire year ago. I don’t even care about whether or not they they continue using Batman anymore.  , edit and place a disclaimer about that perhaps. It's an eye catching title. |
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